Arlene, Edwin, her replacement and his replacement as leader of the DUP

Strazdas

Ardillaun wrote: »

But they have nowhere to go. If they form their own mad biblical party, they’ll just be helping SF across the line. Longer term, the big challenge will be a border poll and Unionists need a leader who won’t make people vote against their own financial interests. A Daniel O’Donnell lookalike with an eclectic taste in movies might just do the trick.

Yes, which is why Donaldson will try and bring the whole party with him. A split would mean both versions of the DUP would be a busted flush (the 'moderate' half would be too small to have any impact).

Strazdas

breezy1985 wrote: »

The act was passed in 2011 when Welsh speakers were 20% and has risen to 30% since helped greatly by a boom in Welsh language schools post act.
Which all bodes well for the ILA

It shows that Irish language could see a revival in all of Ireland. There is no particular reason for any language just to die out - the Welsh example shows you can actually increase the numbers of people speaking a minority language.

breezy1985

Ardillaun wrote: »

Let’s hope so. The Welsh record on speaking their own language is very different from ours. They’ve done a much better job than we have.

Far less restrictions on it from the English than we had over the years

ArthurDayne

downcow wrote: »

There is nothing we need. Unionists and nationalists are both exceptionally well of. We are fairly free to practice our culture, identity, pastimes, etc.
I think what you are talking about is an act that states that you can have you language on all communications that arrive through my door from government.
I have no problem if you have irish tattooed on your head, but don't force it on me - and I equally agree that my culture and pastimes should not be forced on you with your own taxes

It is really simple equity that i want

Even if this was the case, why would that bother you so much? Just don’t read the Irish bit and focus on the bit you understand — just like anyone does when they get any kind of multilingual document.

The fact that you see this as the language being “forced” on you says more about you than it does about the Irish language.

ohnonotgmail

breezy1985 wrote: »

Far less restrictions on it from the English than we had over the years

what years would they be? it has been compulsory in irish schools for all of my life.

athlone573

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

what years would they be? it has been compulsory in irish schools for all of my life.

They are probably thinking of the penal laws and the potato famine and before that to the days of cromwell

FrancieBrady

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Even if this was the case, why would that bother you so much? Just don’t read the Irish bit and focus on the bit you understand — just like anyone does when they get any kind of multilingual document.

The fact that you see this as the language being “forced” on you says more about you than it does about the Irish language.

Unionists in places like Fermanagh and Tyrone have had multi-lingual signage for years now and the world hasn't ended there as far as I know.

ohnonotgmail

athlone573 wrote: »

They are probably thinking of the penal laws and the potato famine and before that to the days of cromwell

i would imagine the effects of that on the irish language have long passed.

breezy1985

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

what years would they be? it has been compulsory in irish schools for all of my life.

Well the years we were ruled by the English obviously. Very hard for them to restrict it after independence.

There is a reason why we started from such a low base of Irish speakers in 1921

ohnonotgmail

breezy1985 wrote: »

Well the years we were ruled by the English obviously. Very hard for them to restrict it after independence

so we have had 100 years and failed miserably

breezy1985

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

so we have had 100 years and failed miserably

I agree its no reason not to let Northern Ireland give it a go though. As a part of the UK they will be able to call on the experience of their Welsh countrymen and hopefully do a better job than we did

ohnonotgmail

breezy1985 wrote: »

I agree its no reason not to let Northern Ireland give it a go though. As a part of the UK they will be able to call on the experience of their Welsh countrymen and hopefully do a better job than we did

i completely agree.

FrancieBrady

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

so we have had 100 years and failed miserably

The residue of inferiority left behind by the attempt to wipe out the language (a familiar colonial stunt) has been difficult to overcome.
The bitterness of some Irish people about the language is a sight to behold at times such is the legacy. This inferiority manifests itself in partitionism as well.

We have done quite well riding that out if you look at the burgeoning Gael Scoil sector that is going to change things for the language in a very vibrant grassroots way. I'd be very upbeat about it if it also attains protection and promotion in the north.

BonnieSituation

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The residue of inferiority left behind by the attempt to wipe out the language (a familiar colonial stunt) has been difficult to overcome.
The bitterness of some Irish people about the language is a sight to behold at times such is the legacy. This inferiority manifests itself in partitionism as well.

We have done quite well riding that out if you look at the burgeoning Gael Scoil sector that is going to change things for the language in a very vibrant grassroots way. I'd be very upbeat about it if it also attains protection and promotion in the north.

It's weird.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The residue of inferiority left behind by the attempt to wipe out the language (a familiar colonial stunt) has been difficult to overcome.
The bitterness of some Irish people about the language is a sight to behold at times such is the legacy. This inferiority manifests itself in partitionism as well.

We have done quite well riding that out if you look at the burgeoning Gael Scoil sector that is going to change things for the language in a very vibrant grassroots way. I'd be very upbeat about it if it also attains protection and promotion in the north.

It was the people of the North who stopped speaking the language, nobody wiped it out.

Penfailed

blanch152 wrote: »

It was the people of the North who stopped speaking the language, nobody wiped it out.

You cannot be serious.

circadian

blanch152 wrote: »

It was the people of the North who stopped speaking the language, nobody wiped it out.

Lol.

FrancieBrady

Penfailed wrote: »

You cannot be serious.

QED - 'The bitterness of some Irish people'.

McMurphy

Penfailed wrote: »

You cannot be serious.

He's got nothing else left in his armoury.

Resorted to flat out denial, it's gas to see.

circadian

It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it pays off for him.

bilbot79

blanch152 wrote: »

Irish died out in Northern Ireland as a native language during the 1970s and 1980s.

It was artificially revived thereafter.

No, no. It was artificially suppressed by invaders. Then some natives sought to support their language

Fionn1952

blanch152 wrote: »

It was the people of the North who stopped speaking the language, nobody wiped it out.

Aye, and they just decided the library fines were getting too much to deal with in Alexandria and decided to close it and all, Blanch.


Catch yourself on, the numpty act has to have a limit if you expect to be taken even slightly seriously. Your credibility is in absolute tatters.

Fann Linn

Penfailed wrote: »

You cannot be serious.

Little Irelanders according to Justine McCarthy. Afraid to upset the DUP.

jimmycrackcorm

downcow wrote: »

There is nothing we need. Unionists and nationalists are both exceptionally well of. We are fairly free to practice our culture, identity, pastimes, etc.
I think what you are talking about is an act that states that you can have you language on all communications that arrive through my door from government.
It is really simple equity that i want

Most electronics, tools, etc come with manuals in multiple languages. If you walk into Currys to buy a new TV, do you ask the sales assistant to only show you TVs with English-only manuals?

FrancieBrady

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Most electronics, tools, etc come with manuals in multiple languages. If you walk into Currys to buy a new TV, do you ask the sales assistant to only show you TVs with English-only manuals?

There are people who can't go into IKEA because of this syndrome, brings them out in a rash.

blanch152

Penfailed wrote: »

You cannot be serious.

circadian wrote: »

Lol.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

QED - 'The bitterness of some Irish people'.

bilbot79 wrote: »

No, no. It was artificially suppressed by invaders. Then some natives sought to support their language

Fionn1952 wrote: »

Aye, and they just decided the library fines were getting too much to deal with in Alexandria and decided to close it and all, Blanch.


Catch yourself on, the numpty act has to have a limit if you expect to be taken even slightly seriously. Your credibility is in absolute tatters.

Lads, let's get real here. Native speakers of Irish died out in the North during the 1970s.

The language was subsequently artificially revived. Only difference with Ulster-Scots is that Irish got a headstart on revival.

There are no Gaeltacht regions in Northern Ireland because they all stopped speaking the language.

dinorebel

blanch152 wrote: »

Lads, let's get real here. Native speakers of Irish died out in the North during the 1970s.

The language was subsequently artificially revived. Only difference with Ulster-Scots is that Irish got a headstart on revival.

There are no Gaeltacht regions in Northern Ireland because they all stopped speaking the language.

Nope only difference is one is a language the other is an artificial construct designed to give small minded bigots a sense of equivalence.

Strazdas

blanch152 wrote: »

Lads, let's get real here. Native speakers of Irish died out in the North during the 1970s.

The language was subsequently artificially revived. Only difference with Ulster-Scots is that Irish got a headstart on revival.

There are no Gaeltacht regions in Northern Ireland because they all stopped speaking the language.

Any sort of a revival of a minority language would be deemed "artificial" though. People learn to speak languages through all sorts of mediums, not just in the family home from their parents.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Lads, let's get real here. Native speakers of Irish died out in the North during the 1970s.

The language was subsequently artificially revived. Only difference with Ulster-Scots is that Irish got a headstart on revival.

There are no Gaeltacht regions in Northern Ireland because they all stopped speaking the language.

The lengths you will go to 'reach out' to belligerent Unionism. Sad way to be tbh.

ArthurDayne

blanch152 wrote: »

Lads, let's get real here. Native speakers of Irish died out in the North during the 1970s.

The language was subsequently artificially revived. Only difference with Ulster-Scots is that Irish got a headstart on revival.

There are no Gaeltacht regions in Northern Ireland because they all stopped speaking the language.

Irish has never stopped being spoken in the North, it simply has been replaced by English as a first language. There is marked difference between that and a bald statement that the language ceased to be spoken and was “artificially revived”.

In any case, it seems quite significantly incomplete to ignore the historical context. The Irish language was subject to cultural attack by the English, and in an impoverished society its uses from a commercial perspective were diminished — and thus over time Irish society just did not have the luxury to avoid the practical necessity of speaking English. Eventually, on the creation of Northern Ireland, the State was hostile to Irish people and Irishness in general, while Catholics struggled to get jobs. Overall, a mixture of cultural genocide and poverty were key drivers of the decline of Irish — and simply made the language a kind of unnecessary luxury.