Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

seamus

Deleted User wrote: »

UEFA pulled out because the muppets in the government couldnt guarantee that we could hold matches with 25% capacity

And? UEFA pulled out.

They could have held the matches without crowds. They chose not to.

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

UEFA pulled out because the muppets in the government couldnt guarantee that we could hold matches with 25% capacity

UEFA couldn't give a flying fúck if we didn't let 1 person into the ground, they wanted the contract signed saying they get paid regardless.

But in this new upside down world, UEFA are the righteous heroes.

'Ya, sorry to hear about your star players heart stopping mid game - here is a list of 3 options that will punish you for that fact'.

Get up the yard with that nonsense.

AdamD

You can dislike UEFA and still thinks its incredible we were the only country who deemed having a quarter full stadiums too dangerous

I never said UEFA were heroes. My point is that we had a chance to host games from the 3rd biggest sporting event in the world after the Olympics/FIFA world cup and we couldnt guarantee 25% capacity. We had a chance to put the country on the world map for sporting events in future and we blew our chance. And dont give me this bull about public health. Anyone attending matches should have been fully vaccinated but no the clowns in government couldnt come up with a plan for the matches

robbiezero

seamus wrote: »

And? UEFA pulled out.

They could have held the matches without crowds. They chose not to.

Looks like they were absolutely right.

Boggles

AdamD wrote: »

You can dislike UEFA and still thinks its incredible we were the only country who deemed having a quarter full stadiums too dangerous

I presume you also think a country should be free to make it's own public health decisions during a once in a generation pandemic?

AdamD

Boggles wrote: »

I presume you also think a country should be free to make it's own public health decisions during a once in a generation pandemic?

Obviously, I haven't even implied otherwise in my post. Ireland had a choice and made it. Every other host country made a different choice, so naturally people will question why Ireland's was different.

Personally I couldn't care less about us hosting the euros. But its been indicative of our reluctance to open society in general, and as somebody who enjoys large events, its been particularly worrying in that regard.

Boggles

AdamD wrote: »

Obviously, I haven't even implied otherwise in my post. Ireland had a choice and made it. Every other host country made a different choice, so naturally people will question why Ireland's was different.

Personally I couldn't care less about us hosting the euros. But its been indicative of our reluctance to open society in general, and as somebody who enjoys large events, its been particularly worrying in that regard.

UEFA made the choice.

As I understand it the relevant bodies offered a compromise.

UEFA as evidenced yet at again this week don't compromise unless it's on their terms.

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

I never said UEFA were heroes. My point is that we had a chance to host games from the 3rd biggest sporting event in the world after the Olympics/FIFA world cup and we couldnt guarantee 25% capacity. We had a chance to put the country on the world map for sporting events in future and we blew our chance. And dont give me this bull about public health. Anyone attending matches should have been fully vaccinated but no the clowns in government couldnt come up with a plan for the matches

Not a popular one around here Joe.

ArthurDayne

Boggles wrote: »

I presume you also think a country should be free to make it's own public health decisions during a once in a generation pandemic?

Yeah but those decisions are still capable of being criticised. In the current context of the promotion of an outdoor summer, in the full knowledge that right now people are meeting up in large groups right now in both houses, gardens, parks, streets all over the country, in the full knowledge that travel between the North and Great Britain is fairly free and an open border between us — not to mention half the country skipping up North at weekends for a taste of something slightly closer to normal life — the decision not to allow the Aviva to host an event at 25% capacity is totally off-kilter with what is actually happening and has been happening in the country (even if the government and people on here want to kid themselves otherwise).

In that vein, despite all the whataboutery on here about UEFA being a shower, it’s hard not to take the view that the decision was taken on the basis of risk management optics — a combination of inconsistency in the approach to caution and a desire to avoid the likely media field day if cases were traced back to the event. Simply it boiled down to “there is some form of risk so why bother risking it?”. All this stuff UEFA being corrupt and the government taking a noble stand is nothing short of deflection and whataboutery.

Boggles

ArthurDayne wrote: »

not to mention half the country skipping up North at weekends for a taste of something slightly closer to normal life

You need to get out lad, the South is hopping.

AdamD

AdamD wrote: »

Obviously, I haven't even implied otherwise in my post. Ireland had a choice and made it. Every other host country made a different choice, so naturally people will question why Ireland's was different.

Personally I couldn't care less about us hosting the euros. But its been indicative of our reluctance to open society in general, and as somebody who enjoys large events, its been particularly worrying in that regard.

Bilbao made their own decision also

Chivito550

Boggles wrote: »

You need to get out lad, the South is hopping.

"Hopping"

That gave me a good chuckle.

Aim low and you'll never be disappointed I guess.

Boggles

Chivito550 wrote: »

"Hopping"

That gave me a good chuckle.

Aim low and you'll never be disappointed I guess.

Another one that needs to get out.

ArthurDayne

Boggles wrote: »

You need to get out lad, the South is hopping.

It’s probably fairly telling that this was the only objection you appear to have with my post.

But even on that objection, I don’t get what you’re on about. It is an objective fact that, right now, life in the North is closer to normality than here — with indoor dining and drinking open for a while now. I’ve been up a few times, and it’s where I’m from, and it’s been a bit more relaxed there than down here for quite some time.

So I don’t really get why you’re telling me the South is hopping...because I never said otherwise (even if the irony of someone telling me I need to get out more when they consider Ireland to be “hopping” right now hasn’t fully escaped me) ...only that the North is further along in the normality scale — and I doubt that anyone who has been up there recently would say otherwise. It’s OK to acknowledge that without whataboutery.

Chivito550

Boggles wrote: »

Another one that needs to get out.

Been out all weekend actually, but thanks for your concern.

seamus

AdamD wrote: »

But its been indicative of our reluctance to open society in general, and as somebody who enjoys large events, its been particularly worrying in that regard.

Are you worried that we won't have large events, again, ever, or something? It will come back. You'll have to wait, but it's not like you'll never see a full stadium again.

Quarter full stadiums at this point in the pandemic, would be a bad move. We are joined at the hip to a country with one of the worst pandemic responses in the world, who are currently experiencing a new wave of infection. It would have turned into a complete disaster as thousands of British made their way here to see matches*, dragging infections with them.

What other countries are doing, is irrelevant. We can only make choices for ourselves. We are not adequately vaccinated to support events of this size, and we are too openly exposed to the UK, a unique feature of our politics that has made our infection numbers bigger than they need to be and made our response more difficult.

This was a call that had to be made, and they made it on the basis that it would not be possible to say whether it would be safe to host a quarter-full stadium at the time that the matches went ahead.

And that decision has turned out to be completely justified.

*Yes, the aim was that crowds would be limited to Irish residents, but we all know that's complete bollox and half of the tickets would be sold onto brits and other foreigners

Boggles

ArthurDayne wrote: »

So I don’t really get why you’re telling me the South is hopping...because I never said otherwise (even if the irony of someone telling me I need to get out more when they consider Ireland to be “hopping” right now hasn’t fully escaped me) ...

I felt duty bound to tell you considering your claim half the South were going up the North.

I don't see why they would be, considering hospitality is open here, the weather has been good and the places I have been to have all been "normal" however you quantify that.

I used the term "hopping", because it is apt to my experience.

Also there is the added bonus of spending locally.

ArthurDayne

Boggles wrote: »

I felt duty bound to tell you considering your claim half the South were going up the North.

I don't see why they would be, considering hospitality is open here, the weather has been good and the places I have been to have all been "normal" however you quantify that.

I used the term "hopping", because it is apt to my experience.

Also there is the added bonus of spending locally.

Honestly, what in the name of God are you talking about? Why are you talking about the added bonus of spending locally? It does often seem to me that your views are utterly and inescapably bound to a lock-step mentality with the State — now to the point that you literally seem to be taking what I’m saying as some sort of challenge to holidaying or spending money South of the border and you feel the need to counter-promote. It’s bizarre behaviour.

I’m simply stating that the North is closer to normality than down here by virtue of the fact that there are more things open there and they have been for a longer time — but for whatever reason you seem to have gone into some sort of weird counter-propaganda mode.

Boggles

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Honestly, what in the name of God are you talking about? Why are you talking about the added bonus of spending locally? It does often seem to me that your views are utterly and inescapably bound to a lock-step mentality with the State — now to the point that you literally seem to be taking what I’m saying as some sort of challenge to holidaying or spending money South of the border and you feel the need to counter-promote. It’s bizarre behaviour.

I’m simply stating that the North is closer to normality than down here by virtue of the fact that there are more things open there and they have been for a longer time — but for whatever reason you seem to have gone into some sort of weird counter-propaganda mode.

You mean like hyperbolic claims of half the country gone to the North?

ArthurDayne

seamus wrote: »

Are you worried that we won't have large events, again, ever, or something? It will come back. You'll have to wait, but it's not like you'll never see a full stadium again.

Quarter full stadiums at this point in the pandemic, would be a bad move. We are joined at the hip to a country with one of the worst pandemic responses in the world, who are currently experiencing a new wave of infection. It would have turned into a complete disaster as thousands of British made their way here to see matches*, dragging infections with them.

What other countries are doing, is irrelevant. We can only make choices for ourselves. We are not adequately vaccinated to support events of this size, and we are too openly exposed to the UK, a unique feature of our politics that has made our infection numbers bigger than they need to be and made our response more difficult.

This was a call that had to be made, and they made it on the basis that it would not be possible to say whether it would be safe to host a quarter-full stadium at the time that the matches went ahead.

And that decision has turned out to be completely justified.

*Yes, the aim was that crowds would be limited to Irish residents, but we all know that's complete bollox and half of the tickets would be sold onto brits and other foreigners

Out of interest, what would this disaster have looked like in tangible terms and what is the evidence that it “would” have occurred?

gozunda

ArthurDayne wrote: »

It’s probably fairly telling that this was the only objection you appear to have with my post.

But even on that objection, I don’t get what you’re on about. It is an objective fact that, right now, life in the North is closer to normality than here — with indoor dining and drinking open for a while now. I’ve been up a few times, and it’s where I’m from, and it’s been a bit more relaxed there than down here for quite some time.

So I don’t really get why you’re telling me the South is hopping...because I never said otherwise (even if the irony of someone telling me I need to get out more when they consider Ireland to be “hopping” right now hasn’t fully escaped me) ...only that the North is further along in the normality scale — and I doubt that anyone who has been up there recently would say otherwise. It’s OK to acknowledge that without whataboutery.

Interesting that not one word regarding current high vaccination levels in the North...

Any chance the fact the North is way head with a relaxation of restrictions and is "more relaxed" is due at least in part to that teeny weeney detail?

ArthurDayne

Boggles wrote: »

You mean like hyperbolic claims of half the country gone to the North?

Yeah sorry Boggles, “half the country” being a phrase which Irish people use all the time to describe crowds of people but which you seem to approach with the literalism of a contract lawyer. I’ve seen a huge number of Southern reg cars up in Belfast, parked up outside hotels and in the car parks used by the hotels (Victoria Square, the Titanic carpark etc) — and half (oh sorry, does that also have to be an exact number?) the traffic on the M1 into the city were southern reg on the bank holiday Friday. Around the Cathedral Quarter there were loads of Southerners floating about, unless the Ballymena accent has morphed into the Cork one of late. I also know someone who works for the Hastings group who told me they were inundated with bookings from the South as I was remarking to him at how hard it was proving to get affordable rooms in even the cheap hotels.

But sorry no, I didn’t tap into British satellite surveillance or sit atop the hill at Jonesborough with binoculars counting cars. But then again, you’d probably have looked like something of a Comical Ali yourself reporting for RTÉ on the Sprucefield-Belfast M1 telling us how few Southerners were coming North as the Southern reg cars came past in procession.

But I will give you one piece of credit, you’ve done well here to take the original point and turn it into something totally different — so 10/10 for deflection skills.

ArthurDayne

gozunda wrote: »

Interesting that not one word regarding current high vaccination levels in the North...

Any chance the fact the North is way head with a relaxation of restrictions and is "more relaxed" is due at least in part to that teeny weeney detail?

Yeah, and why are you telling me this? You’re jumping in head first to the Boggles Bandwagon and seemingly arguing with me on a point I’m not making.

Again — I literally just said in my post that the North was closer to normality at present than the South. Boggles seems to take issue with this, do you ?

Boggles

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Yeah sorry Boggles, “half the country” being a phrase which Irish people use all the time to describe crowds of people

Indeed, a phrase hyperbolic in nature, like I said and which you seem to agree.

seamus

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Out of interest, what would this disaster have looked like in tangible terms and what is the evidence that it “would” have occurred?

In tangible terms? A surge in cases. Which inevitably leads to increased numbers in hospital, and delays in any further reopening. Evidence - look at the UK.

We refused to open stadiums early, so that we can open everything else sooner.

gozunda

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Yeah, and why are you telling me this? You’re jumping in head first to the Boggles Bandwagon and seemingly arguing with me on a point I’m not making.
Again — I literally just said in my post that the North was closer to normality at present than the South. Boggles seems to take issue with this, do you ?

Lol. Arthur - ever dishing out the auld wallop.
But no I didn't quote boggles - I quoted you. And It was a question btw. But no matter.

And nope. That the point. Lauding NI simply because its "more relaxed" without even an iota of reasoning why that might be the case. :rolleyes:

And yes indeed NI has less restrictions / more 'normality' as you refer to it. And that because of vaccination levels there.

Boggles

seamus wrote: »

In tangible terms? A surge in cases. Which inevitably leads to increased numbers in hospital, and delays in any further reopening. Evidence - look at the UK.

We refused to open stadiums early, so that we can open everything else sooner.

You mean we shouldn't be like where the games were transferred to? UEFA really care about fans.

Euro 2020: Saint Petersburg tightens restrictions to curb new spike in COVID-19 infections

Bloody Ireland, laughing stock. Shakes Fist!!

JRant

seamus wrote: »

In tangible terms? A surge in cases. Which inevitably leads to increased numbers in hospital, and delays in any further reopening. Evidence - look at the UK.

We refused to open stadiums early, so that we can open everything else sooner.

Was a surge in cases inevitable? Would this precieved rise in cases have translated to hospital/ICU admissions? Lots of unknowns there to say with any degree of certainty.

Also, I don't think we are opening anything sooner as a result of not allowing fans into the games. The dates for easing restrictions haven't been brought forward at any stage.

ArthurDayne

gozunda wrote: »

Lol. Arthur - ever dishing out the auld wallop.
But no I didn't quote boggles - I quoted you. And It was a question btw. But no matter.

And nope. That the point. Lauding NI simply because its "more relaxed" without even an iota of reasoning why that might be the case. :rolleyes:

And yes indeed NI has less restrictions / more 'normality' as you refer to it. And that because of vaccination levels there.

Honestly, where did I “laud” the North? I said it was closer to normality — a statement which you do not appear to disagree with. I don’t know why you seem to be suggesting that I disregard the role of vaccines in that.

The point about me saying that the North was more open was to point out that there is already a massive “hole” in variant risk mitigation in the form of relatively free movement between the North and GB, and completely free movement across the border. This combined with the reality that people are already out and about and meeting in large crowds across the Republic (I believe Boggles used the term ‘hopping’ right, and I’m also looking across the Liffey at what looks like a fairly large demonstration at the convention centre here) makes me question to what extent 25% capacity at the Aviva was ever going to be a back-breaking straw on the camel’s back.

For whatever reason, you and Boggles have dived in clumsily to what you both appear to have perceived as some form of particular-male-organ-measuring contest between North and South in respect of Covid.

p.s. any reports of southern reg cars or southern people being attacked up North yet? You were warning people about that a while ago I recall, but perhaps that is indicative of what one might cheekily call an overcautious approach to risk?

Boggles

ArthurDayne wrote: »

I believe Boggles used the term ‘hopping’ right

Indeed, I would go as far to say 83% of the country are in the West / East / South at the weekends, most of them enjoying themselves quite normally.

I even saw a few Northern Regs.

:eek:

Sobit1964

We need to be more cautious. Delta might be a bad cold bro.

Covid symptoms may be changing thanks to Delta variant
New symptoms being reported are currently headache, sore throat and runny nose

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-delta-variant-symptoms-headache-b1865531.html

Bit cynical

Sobit1964 wrote: »

We need to be more cautious. Delta might be a bad cold bro.

Covid symptoms may be changing thanks to Delta variant
New symptoms being reported are currently headache, sore throat and runny nose

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-delta-variant-symptoms-headache-b1865531.html

The danger is that if the virus evolves into a more virulent strain but with very mild symptoms that is well mitigated by vaccines and causing few or no deaths, people won't take social distancing measures serously.

ArthurDayne

Boggles wrote: »

Indeed, I would go as far to say 83% of the country are in the West / East / South at the weekends, most of them enjoying themselves quite normally.

I even saw a few Northern Regs.

:eek:

Great -- I mean -- I'm still not sure what point you're trying to make or what particular substantive point I've made you're objecting to ...but yes ...great.

Timmy O Toole

Bit cynical wrote: »

The danger is that if the virus evolves into a more virulent strain but with very mild symptoms that is well mitigated by vaccines and causing few or no deaths, people won't take social distancing measures serously.

You say it like its a bad thing.

Boggles

Sobit1964 wrote: »

We need to be more cautious. Delta might be a bad cold bro.

Covid symptoms may be changing thanks to Delta variant
New symptoms being reported are currently headache, sore throat and runny nose

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-delta-variant-symptoms-headache-b1865531.html

That's the jist of the article all right.

This variant seems to be working slightly differently,” he explained.

“People might think they’ve just got some sort of seasonal cold and they still go out to parties and they might spread it around to six other people.

“We think this is fuelling a lot of the problem.

“The message here is that if you are young, you are going to get milder symptoms anyway.

“It might just feel like a bad cold or some funny ‘off’ feeling – but do stay at home and do get a test

Bit cynical

Timmy O Toole wrote: »

You say it like its a bad thing.

Sorry I was being facetious. The media have lost the run of themselves and forgotten that social distancing is a means to an end, not an end in itself.

Sobit1964

Sobit1964 wrote: »

We need to be more cautious. Delta might be a bad cold bro.

Covid symptoms may be changing thanks to Delta variant
New symptoms being reported are currently headache, sore throat and runny nose

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-delta-variant-symptoms-headache-b1865531.html

So if i wake up in the morning with a bad headache after a night on the beer will i have to isolate

Sobit1964

Bit cynical wrote: »

Sorry I was being facetious. The media have lost the run of themselves and forgotten that social distancing is a means to an end, not an end in itself.

Your post was a little too good :cool:

gozunda

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Honestly, where did I “laud” the North? I said it was closer to normality — a statement which you do not appear to disagree with. I don’t know why you seem to be suggesting that I disregard the role of vaccines in that. The point about me saying that the North was more open was to point out that there is already a massive “hole” in variant risk mitigation in the form of relatively free movement between the North and GB, and completely free movement across the border. This combined with the reality that people are already out and about and meeting in large crowds across the Republic (I believe Boggles used the term ‘hopping’ right, and I’m also looking across the Liffey at what looks like a fairly large demonstration at the convention centre here) makes me question to what extent 25% capacity at the Aviva was ever going to be a back-breaking straw on the camel’s back.For whatever reason, you and Boggles have dived in clumsily to what you both appear to have perceived as some form of particular-male-organ-measuring contest between North and South in respect of Covid.p.s. any reports of southern reg cars or southern people being attacked up North yet? You were warning people about that a while ago I recall, but perhaps that is indicative of what one might cheekily call an overcautious approach to risk?

So no attempt to answer the question asked? Ok then...

But noted thats again resorted to taking things taken completely out of context and add things never said Arthur

But as to "Lauding" - sure loads of it - the most recent bit this "north is closer to normality than here — with indoor dining and drinking open for a while now. I’ve been up a few times, and it’s where I’m from, and it’s been a bit more relaxed there than down here for quite some time". So yeah definitely what you've referred to as some " "some form of particular-male-organ-measuring contest between North and South" in respect of Covid" there tbf.

Seriously- it's not news to anyone that the North has rolled back their restrictions - but at least most people acknowledge why ie because of their vaccination levels. But noooo they're doing so much better and something the South - large crowds - Aviva etc etc :rolleyes:

Ps. Any further ruminations on your odd beliefs that that half the South were going up the North?

Timmy O Toole

Sobit1964 wrote: »

Your post was a little too good :cool:

Its hard to tell the difference these days.

seamus

JRant wrote: »

Was a surge in cases inevitable? Would this precieved rise in cases have translated to hospital/ICU admissions? Lots of unknowns there to say with any degree of certainty.

Nobody's making calls based on certainty, just likelihood. A surge of cases is a strong possibility if we hold large stadium events at this stage.
The safer option is to just not.

Also, I don't think we are opening anything sooner as a result of not allowing fans into the games. The dates for easing restrictions haven't been brought forward at any stage.

The point is that if we held these events, reopening would likely have to be pushed back.

Just like the UK have done.

What was to be gained by holding these events? Practically nothing.

What was to be lost? Quite a bit.

ArthurDayne

seamus wrote: »

In tangible terms? A surge in cases. Which inevitably leads to increased numbers in hospital, and delays in any further reopening. Evidence - look at the UK.

We refused to open stadiums early, so that we can open everything else sooner.

OK but I’m trying to understand how you are making the jump here to “disaster”. 25% Aviva capacity is what, 12-13kish? That’s a lot of space for social distancing and steward monitoring. So where is the big risk factor here? Toilets could be monitored with a queue or additional toilet facilities set outside to space it up even more. Other argument is people thronging to bars / shops in the area — but people are thronging to bars and shops anyway all over the place (the country is ‘hopping’ as Boggles says) and if anything around the Aviva there would be Guards about. The streets in town are going to be busy anyway.

I’m not seeing how, in the context of how people are going about their lives at present, a 25% full Aviva was actually going to propel us to disaster. Seems more to me that the presence of any level of risk — even simply the risk of any cases outright — was going to be risk enough for the government, rather than there being a substantial reason to think it would precipitate disaster or even a delay in reopening.

robbiezero

seamus wrote: »

Nobody's making calls based on certainty, just likelihood. A surge of cases is a strong possibility if we hold large stadium events at this stage.
The safer option is to just not.

The point is that if we held these events, reopening would likely have to be pushed back.

Just like the UK have done.

What was to be gained by holding these events? Practically nothing.

What was to be lost? Quite a bit.

So we should expect to see this in cities that have held Euro 2020 games in about 2 weeks yes?

paw patrol

seamus wrote: »

Nobody's making calls based on certainty, just likelihood. A surge of cases is a strong possibility if we hold large stadium events at this stage.
The safer option is to just not.
.

robbiezero wrote: »

So we should expect to see this in cities that have held Euro 2020 games in about 2 weeks yes?

we should being seeing surges based on the debauchery in dublin city of late , if that logic worked?

the safer option is to never do anything again . ever,

seamus

robbiezero wrote: »

So we should expect to see this in cities that have held Euro 2020 games in about 2 weeks yes?

That depends entirely on the situation in those countries.

Hosting these games would be the wrong decision for us. The spread of infection has had its own nuances in every country.

Graham

paw patrol wrote: »

the safer option is to never do anything again . ever,

absolutely

Would be a fairly daft approach though. I'm sure there's a middle ground somewhere that makes more sense.

robbiezero

seamus wrote: »

Nobody's making calls based on certainty, just likelihood. A surge of cases is a strong possibility if we hold large stadium events at this stage.
The safer option is to just not.

The point is that if we held these events, reopening would likely have to be pushed back.

Just like the UK have done.

What was to be gained by holding these events? Practically nothing.

What was to be lost? Quite a bit.

The UK re-opening being pushed back has absolutely nothing to do with Euro 2020.
Why would we have had to push back re-opening?

ArthurDayne

gozunda wrote: »

So no attempt to answer the question asked? Ok then...

But noted thats again resorted to taking things taken completely out of context and add things never said Arthur

But as to "Lauding" - sure loads of it - the most recent bit this "north is closer to normality than here — with indoor dining and drinking open for a while now. I’ve been up a few times, and it’s where I’m from, and it’s been a bit more relaxed there than down here for quite some time". So yeah definitely what you've referred to as some " "some form of particular-male-organ-measuring contest between North and South" in respect of Covid" there tbf.

Seriously- it's not news to anyone that the North has rolled back their restrictions but at least most people acknowledge why ie because of their vaccination levels. But noooo there doing so much better and something the South - large crowds - Aviva etc etc :rolleyes:

Ps. Any further ruminations on your odd beliefs that that half the South were going up the North?

This is obtuseness and pedantry gone mad. You asked me did I think the north’s relatively advanced level of reopening was due to vaccines or something right? Yes. Yes it is. Is that OK now? At no point did I ever dispute this or suggest otherwise — but does that answer your question about the thing I never brought into question in the first place?

Right, you’re telling me that it is “lauding” the North to say that it is currently more relaxed and has been more relaxed for a while. You’ve literally agreed with this statement ...but at the same time you consider it “lauding” ...that I made a statement of fact........which you agree with? Jesus Christ — it’s on objective point. The North is more open right now, it’s not praise or lauding, it’s just the bloody reality.

I really don’t know what you want from me here — yourself and Boggles are descending into the most ludicrous levels of pedantry and picking arguments on points which you don’t seem to even dispute yourself!

Responder XY

seamus wrote: »

That depends entirely on the situation in those countries.

Hosting these games would be the wrong decision for us. The spread of infection has had its own nuances in every country.

No it doesn't. virus is the same here as in every other country.

Simple fact is that Ireland is getting this wrong.