Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

For a risk averse country like Ireland we sure have no problem frivolously spending money that we don’t have

Slow and cautious but no problem turning into the wolf of Wall Street when it comes to money

Risk - Reward.

I'll just post this again, just in case you missed it.

Income and excise tax haul point to 'quick rebound' from Covid-19 slump

April exchequer returns show the Government collected €16.1bn overall tax revenues during the first four months of the year – up by more than €650m from a year ago

Income tax receipts were again a star performer, with receipts up by €470m in the year to almost €8bn. Excise duties, which rose by €100m to almost €1.7bn over the same period, also helped the revenue haul

With the economy gradually reopening, we can expect income tax receipts to remain resilient for the rest of the year. Indeed, income tax looks set to provide an unexpected surplus by year-end.

The April exchequer figures were "spectacular" given the large sections of the economy that are still locked down, said Fergal O'Brien, director of policy and public affairs at business group Ibec. "They bode well for a quick rebound once all the restrictions are lifted," he said

I've been led to believe it's time to get off the island, because if the potato fails we are doomed?

Something not right here.

facehugger99

Boggles wrote: »

So how much would you have borrowed?

Why don't you work it out?

Add up what we borrowed then deduct all the lost VAT, PAYE and PRSI from keeping industries like non-essential retail, construction, hospitality, barbers etc closed down unnecessarily for months on end.

Then add in all the bribes, sorry I mean PUP payments and 'business supports' you had to pay these people not to work and pay taxes.

See what figure you come up with and get back to us.

Then you can tell us how much you would have borrowed - wait, I think I already know this one - is it exactly how much the Government did borrow?

I'm right aren't I?

Boggles

facehugger99 wrote: »

Why don't you work it out?

Add up what we borrowed then deduct all the lost VAT, PAYE and PRSI from keeping industries like non-essential retail, construction, hospitality, barbers etc closed down unnecessarily for months on end.

Then add in all the bribes, sorry I mean PUP payments and 'business supports' you had to pay these people not to work and pay taxes.

See what figure you come up with and get back to us.

Then you can tell us how much you would have borrowed - wait, I think I already know this one - is it exactly how much the Government did borrow?

I'm right aren't I?

So you wouldn't have borrowed anything, and balanced the books?

Please do explain how.

Let me get a pencil.

OwenM

Boggles wrote: »

Nope. Can't see how you garnered that from anything I said.

I garnered it by simple inference, I stated that you couldn't predict it wouldn't happen and you didn't disagree, maybe if you give a yes or no answer to this question it will be clearer for everyone:

Do you think the ECB will never put interest rates at or above 3.5% ever again?

facehugger99

Boggles wrote: »

So you wouldn't have borrowed anything, and balanced the books?

Please do explain how.

Let me get a pencil.

Try re-reading what was wrote and avoid paraphrasing - you don't seem to be any good at it.

the kelt

niallo27 wrote: »

Lads its over, we need to move on.

All the people "following the science" and reaching their own conclusions on that science cant move on until the man on the telly tells them its ok!

Boggles

facehugger99 wrote: »

Try re-reading what was wrote and avoid paraphrasing - you don't seem to be any good at it.

Oh right, I was just giving you another chance of reasonable discussion.

So your plan was basically this.

Ignore it, it's just a flu brah economics I'm guessing

Fair enough.

Penfailed

OwenM wrote: »

That's when the billions spent on PUP and other reliefs won't seem like such a great idea.

Do you think they should have closed businesses and not gave money to them and their employees who couldn't work through no fault of their own?

Boggles

OwenM wrote: »

I garnered it by simple inference, I stated that you couldn't predict it wouldn't happen and you didn't disagree, maybe if you give a yes or no answer to this question it will be clearer for everyone:

Do you think the ECB will never put interest rates at or above 3.5% ever again?

I couldn't tell you.

I can't see it happening anytime soon like you seem to be inferring to make us regret the financial supports to keep parts of the economy afloat.

If anything common sense and reality is pointing towards those businesses hitting the ground running into a fast paced economy.

Probably one of the policies our government got spot on TBH.

FintanMcluskey

Penfailed wrote: »

Do you think they should have closed businesses and not gave money to them and their employees who couldn't work through no fault of their own?

If only their was another option other than shutting unnecessarily and subsidising at an astronomical cost

Mmmh

Boggles

Penfailed wrote: »

Do you think they should have closed businesses and not gave money to them and their employees who couldn't work through no fault of their own?

The "wisdom" seems to be that all businesses should have remained open during the pandemic and they would have operated as normal.

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

If only their was another option other than shutting unnecessarily and subsidising at an astronomical cost

Mmmh

Ignore the pandemic?


Mmmh.

FintanMcluskey

Boggles wrote: »

If anything common sense and reality is pointing towards those businesses hitting the ground running into a fast paced economy.

Probably one of the policies our government got spot on TBH.

Haha

Didn’t Bertie say something like this round about late 2006 when he was ignoring the warnings about Ireland’s credit based economic boom?

History does repeat itself

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Haha

Didn’t Bertie say something like this round about late 2006 when he was ignoring the warnings about Ireland’s credit based economic boom?

History does repeat itself

16 billion cash on deposit Fintan.

No credit boom here.

Any chance you could address the questions I have asked you multiple times, or will we put in the "no" pile?

Penfailed

facehugger99 wrote: »

l wonder where all the lockdown-cheerleaders will be when that happens?

We'll all be in it together.

Penfailed

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The rest of Europe were reopening business this time last year that we are reopening next month

Really? Oh, you're only referring to construction again? Right.

FintanMcluskey

Penfailed wrote: »

Really? Oh, you're only referring to construction again? Right.

No

timmyntc

Boggles wrote: »

So you wouldn't have borrowed anything, and balanced the books?

Please do explain how.

Let me get a pencil.

Denmark actually reduced their debt burden last year fwiw.

cnocbui

Boggles wrote: »

Ignore the pandemic?


Mmmh.

We have to learn to accept there is a pandemic, and just live with it, because it isn't going away. Vaccines will be great, up until the point the next vaccine resistant strain pops up and we're off again. Whack a mole. We are not going to eradicate it and there is no stuffing this Chinese genie back in the bottle.

We have to learn to live with it and it's consequences, just as we did previously for influenza.

W123-80's

My own humble opinion is that this thread is pretty much redundant now!

All the signs are pointing towards easing of restrictions in line with countries who are ahead of us in the vaccination programme.
Which has been stated here repeatedly since the UK and Israel jumped ahead.

Looks like it has moved to a retrospective philosophical debate about the economic approach to the entire pandemic now.
An interesting debate for sure, but surely worthy of a thread of its own as opposed to discussing in a largely defunct thread about the relaxing of restrictions now that restrictions are relaxing!

Boggles

timmyntc wrote: »

Denmark actually reduced their debt burden last year fwiw.

Really?

Danish national debt reaches highest level since 2013

Boggles

W123-80's wrote: »

My own humble opinion is that this thread is pretty much redundant now!

TBF now and for the next few months is when this thread is (should be) at peak relevance.

"Relaxation of Restrictions".

Obviously it morphed into something else entirely.

timmyntc

Boggles wrote: »

Really?

Danish national debt reaches highest level since 2013

Pardon me, its actually this year.
https://corporate.nordea.com/article/63377/denmark-government-gross-debt-has-already-peaked

Boggles

timmyntc wrote: »

Pardon me, its actually this year.
https://corporate.nordea.com/article/63377/denmark-government-gross-debt-has-already-peaked

Where does it say they have reduced their debt burden?

It states they increased the burden last year by 10% (almost a third in real terms) and they hope to reduce that by 2.3% next year.

zebastein

The topic is more than ever relevant.
There are plenty of restrictions that still need to be relaxed. Maybe I missed something but here is my list of things that have no date yet:

- End of quarantine for people coming to the country (there are dedicated topics though)
- International travel for non essential reasons
- Outdoor events > 15 people
- Retail / gym with no restriction on numbers (I guess gym will start with 50people max in June and retail has a max number based on the size of the shop)
- Restrictions on religious events / funerals / wedding ceremonies (currently limited to 50)
- Wedding receptions allowed
- Other indoor events and organized mass gatherings
- Unrestricted social and family gatherings (indoor + no max number of households)
- Public transport capacity back to 100%
- Indoor restaurants
- Masks not mandatory
- WFH not recommended

KanyeSouthEast

zebastein wrote: »

The topic is more than ever relevant.
There are plenty of restrictions that still need to be relaxed. Maybe I missed something but here is my list of things that have no date yet:

- End of quarantine for people coming to the country (there are dedicated topics though)
- International travel for non essential reasons
- Outdoor events > 15 people
- Retail / gym with no restriction on numbers (I guess gym will start with 50people max in June and retail has a max number based on the size of the shop)
- Restrictions on religious events / funerals / wedding ceremonies (currently limited to 50)
- Wedding receptions allowed
- Other indoor events and organized mass gatherings
- Unrestricted social and family gatherings (indoor + no max number of households)
- Public transport capacity back to 100%
- Indoor restaurants
- Masks not mandatory
- WFH not recommended

All of these things actually are the main things that I would like to see gone ASAP.

ArthurDayne

zebastein wrote: »

The topic is more than ever relevant.
There are plenty of restrictions that still need to be relaxed. Maybe I missed something but here is my list of things that have no date yet:

- End of quarantine for people coming to the country (there are dedicated topics though)
- International travel for non essential reasons
- Outdoor events > 15 people
- Retail / gym with no restriction on numbers (I guess gym will start with 50people max in June and retail has a max number based on the size of the shop)
- Restrictions on religious events / funerals / wedding ceremonies (currently limited to 50)
- Wedding receptions allowed
- Other indoor events and organized mass gatherings
- Unrestricted social and family gatherings (indoor + no max number of households)
- Public transport capacity back to 100%
- Indoor restaurants
- Masks not mandatory
- WFH not recommended

Regardless of what side of the debate you fall on, it is truly incredible just how accustomed society has become to restrictions — to the point where (for the purposes of a relaxation of restrictions thread on a discussion forum ) people almost seem to deem some or all of the things you mention as not being restrictions at all.

charlie14

Fandymo wrote: »

Where was there any mention of banning anyone doing anything?? Facial expressions are a massive communication tool. That is a fact.

The Cathy Newman school of questioning is ridiculous. So you're saying/want masks to be stitched onto our faces??

See anyone can make up ridiculous nonsense that has nothing to do with what we were talking about, but put "so you want", "so you're saying" in front of it. It's nonsense.

I find that people make up ridiculous nonsense on something that wasn`t asked when they wish to avoid answering a question.

You appear to have a problem with people wearing masks, so what is your proposal ?

Boggles

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Regardless of what side of the debate you fall on, it is truly incredible just how accustomed society has become to restrictions — to the point where (for the purposes of a relaxation of restrictions thread on a discussion forum ) people almost seem to deem some or all of the things you mention as not being restrictions at all.

Some of us (me) regard some of them as blessings.

I'm looking at weddings.

I'd rather a bill came in the door than a wedding invitation, if anything hopefully Covid has resigned the 300 close friends and 3 day wedding nonsense to history.

FintanMcluskey

Boggles wrote: »

Some of us (me) regard some of them as blessings.

I'm looking at weddings.

I'd rather a bill came in the door than a wedding invitation, if anything hopefully Covid has resigned the 300 close friends and 3 day wedding nonsense to history.

Point proven.

“ I don’t enjoy those things, neither should anyone else”