Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Boggles

is_that_so wrote: »

People go to mass and go home, supporters on the other hand ...

I'd also imagine a large portion of the mass going public will have been vaccinated.

This would certainly be true for the priests as the average age is 70.

Stormyteacup

is_that_so wrote: »

“When facts change, I change my mind"
A good number of people vaccinated by July is that change.

Was that not the plan since February? Maybe they weren’t really convinced they could pull it off until delivery was secured but that doesn’t excuse promising most people vaccinated by July and acting like we were on the cusp of a fourth wave, with no evidence.

is_that_so

Boggles wrote: »

I'd also imagine a large portion of the mass going public will have been vaccinated.

This would certainly be true for the priests as the average age is 70.

There is that as well. Sports attendance is definitely filed under too much social mixing. In the context of the months and months we've had of this, it is not that far away.

is_that_so

Stormyteacup wrote: »

Was that not the plan since February? Maybe they weren’t really convinced they could pull it off until delivery was secured but that doesn’t excuse promising most people vaccinated by July and acting like we were on the cusp of a fourth wave, with no evidence.

Yeah, but I was responding to the comment on the change of message.

paw patrol

Boggles wrote: »

There has be no evidence of an increase in suicides, here or in the UK.

Again the people tasked with running services and dealing with mental health are asking people not to spread falsehoods as it can cause harm.



Whatever about gutter tabloids trying to make money from sensationalizing lies, people doing it to score "internet points" are just as nefarious.

I like how you ignore the main point and pick on the tangent or the aside to the main point.


back to suicides.
you may be right there is no increase - we will see , but i didn't say that and for a precise nitpicker like yourself , you knew I didn't say that.
So What gives?
My quote....

many are dead from suicide

Are you saying many aren't dead?

Are you saying covid/restriction contributed to no suicides? That's a bold claim Boggles even for a "construction is closed" denier like you

We will see when the stats come out although we all know suicides are under reported. But people in my gym work for ambulance/fire brigade in Ireland and have said that there were plenty of them and in the winter was more than usual.

blowitupref

Boggles wrote: »

I'd also imagine a large portion of the mass going public will have been vaccinated.

This would certainly be true for the priests as the average age is 70.

Those vaccinated people will be wondering as much as anyone why they can attend indoor mass but not outdoor sports.

is_that_so wrote: »

People go to mass and go home, supporters on the other hand ...

Plenty that go to mass don't go straight home especially when visiting knock.

Stormyteacup

is_that_so wrote: »

Yeah, but I was responding to the comment on the change of message.

Yes ‘when facts change, I change my mind’ - I was questioning which facts had changed so dramatically in the last two weeks that led to a jubilant CMO.

Boggles

paw patrol wrote: »

We will see when the stats come out although we all know suicides are under reported. But people in my gym work for ambulance/fire brigade in Ireland and have said that there were plenty of them and in the winter was more than usual.

The preliminary data does not support you or your friends claims.

Again people tasked with dealing with mental health are asking you to stop doing what you are doing.

It's not me.

If you are eagerly awaiting suicide statistics for 2020 maybe hold off on the hearsay until then, eh?

LuckyLloyd

niallo27 wrote: »

Lads its over, we need to move on.

In some ways, it's just beginning. There will be an abundance of deep multidisciplinary analysis and academic debate over the different approaches taken around the world to the pandemic and their relative effectiveness. And these takes will be refuted and disparaged and improved and so on and so forth. I think Covid will be pored over and debated for another couple of decades yet.

With regards to this thread, the outcome was decisive. The public never revolted. Most people followed most of the restrictions most of the time. We used restriction of interaction as a blunt public health strategy until the vaccines came. Now that we are distributing the vaccines we can reduce the level of restrictions. In the west as a whole, even idealogical governments like Boris Johnson's imposed lockdowns for extended periods. And a US Presidential election was won and lost on the question of whether the pandemic was real or imagined.

Most people will move on with their lives. But some people will keep fighting these debates the rest of their lives. To each their own.

pjohnson

paw patrol wrote: »

I like how you ignore the main point and pick on the tangent or the aside to the main point.


back to suicides.
you may be right there is no increase - we will see , but i didn't say that and for a precise nitpicker like yourself , you knew I didn't say that.
So What gives?
My quote....

Are you saying many aren't dead?

Are you saying covid/restriction contributed to no suicides? That's a bold claim Boggles even for a "construction is closed" denier like you

We will see when the stats come out although we all know suicides are under reported. But people in my gym work for ambulance/fire brigade in Ireland and have said that there were plenty of them and in the winter was more than usual.

People really need to stop trying to glamourise suicide.

Definitely the most unsavoury tactic used by open uppers.

is_that_so

Stormyteacup wrote: »

Yes ‘when facts change, I change my mind’ - I was questioning which facts had changed so dramatically in the last two weeks that led to a jubilant CMO.

Increasing rates of vaccinations, looking down the road to that "80%" and how reaching that will affect how we can do things.

manofwisdom

blowitupref wrote: »

I see from next Saturday Knock Basilica can host indoor mass to the attendance of 200 people, meanwhile outdoor sports aren't allowed to have any supporters attend and it looks like July at the earliest for that to change. Where is the logic in those restrictions?

We all know outdoors activities are safer than indoors, simply no logic to it.

is_that_so

is_that_so wrote: »

People go to mass and go home, supporters on the other hand ...

You have obviously never seen the tea rooms in Knock on a busy Sunday:P

is_that_so

Deleted User wrote: »

You have obviously never seen the tea rooms in Knock on a busy Sunday:P

Need to put it on the bucket list so!

Graham

blowitupref wrote: »

I see from next Saturday Knock Basilica can host indoor mass to the attendance of 200 people

Where did you see that?

Fandymo

Boggles wrote: »

The preliminary data does not support you or your friends claims.

Again people tasked with dealing with mental health are asking you to stop doing what you are doing.

It's not me.

If you are eagerly awaiting suicide statistics for 2020 maybe hold off on the hearsay until then, eh?

They asked news outlets to stop reporting sensationally, not random people online, quite the difference. Strange how you are pedantic about other people quoting you, yet you cherrypick what others say.

There are reporting restrictions around suicide as too much detail can lead to copycat events, i've seen in groups of people where one takes their life, that more in the group will follow, which is tragic. Numbers accessing MH and suicides have sky-rocketed over the past year.

Graham

Fandymo wrote: »

They asked news outlets to stop reporting sensationally, not random people online, quite the difference.

Odd how they think it might be dangerous if media do it but you reckon it's not when randoms do it online.

Go figure

Boggles

Fandymo wrote: »

suicides have sky-rocketed over the past year.

Well then you'll have no problem backing this statement up so.

In your own good time.

Boggles

pjohnson wrote: »

People really need to stop trying to glamourise suicide.

Definitely the most unsavoury tactic used by open uppers.

Unsavory is certainly a polite adjective, I can think of more unsavory ones.

the kelt

Boggles wrote: »

There has be no evidence of an increase in suicides, here or in the UK.

Again the people tasked with running services and dealing with mental health are asking people not to spread falsehoods as it can cause harm.



Whatever about gutter tabloids trying to make money from sensationalizing lies, people doing it to score "internet points" are just as nefarious.

He didnt say there was an increase!

Graham

Fandymo wrote: »

suicides have sky-rocketed over the past year.

the kelt wrote: »

He didnt say there was an increase!

huh

Either way, the easing of restrictions over the coming days/weeks is only a good thing no?

the kelt

Graham wrote: »

huh

Either way, the easing of restrictions over the coming days/weeks is only a good thing no?

Huh is right!

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=117098826&postcount=899

He wasnt quoting the above poster you quoted.

The easing of restrictions is great..

Whats confusing?

Boggles

the kelt wrote: »

He didnt say there was an increase!

But people in my gym work for ambulance/fire brigade in Ireland and have said that there were plenty of them and in the winter was more than usual

He has made the same claims several times.

The level varies.

from the ambulance in north county dublin that suicides are through the roof

Dempo1

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I have a feeling that the scale of the financial issues ahead (which have quickly been downplayed), coupled with the increasing public anger over the slow reopening, and the fact that factions in his own party are planning to push him out, has backed Micheal into a corner insofar as his being able to defer all the decisions to Tony.

Add to that the reopening in NI and the UK, and the EU vaccine passport plan, and I think some very uncomfortable conversations have been had in the last few weeks as economic and political events have finally overtaken them.

Hence, just as they've spent a year scaring people into staying home/apart, now that need to start the process of encouraging them back to work and spending their new savings so that when the tax hikes come in a few months, they'll have a workforce to tax.

All fair points, just on the income tax receipts, quite extraordinary that with near 600k out of work and for a prolonged period, income tax receipts barely affected

I'm guessing this new approach is to get Covid supports finished ASAP.

Dempo1

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

I must say Tony’s new media manager has transformed him recently

Plan for the Summer he said, some change in a fortnight

Yep, not lost on me, what a transformation albeit Ronan Glynn still apologiser in chief

head82

Dempo1 wrote: »

All fair points, just on the income tax receipts, quite extraordinary that with near 600k out of work and for a prolonged period, income tax receipts barely affected

I'm guessing this new approach is to get Covid supports finished ASAP.

I think Micheal, Leo, Paschal etc. are in for a rude awakening if they genuinely expect all of those 600k currently in receipt of Covid support to return to work once those supports are pulled.

Those that don't return will just end up as part of the Job Seekers live register.

Shuffling the books if you will.

timmyntc

Dempo1 wrote: »

All fair points, just on the income tax receipts, quite extraordinary that with near 600k out of work and for a prolonged period, income tax receipts barely affected

I'm guessing this new approach is to get Covid supports finished ASAP.

We have one of the narrowest tax bases in Europe.
It was on of the IMFs recommendations after 08 that we should widen our tax base so everyone pays a fair share rather than most of tax burden placed on "middle earners" - still has not been addressed.

OwenM

head82 wrote: »

I think Micheal, Leo, Paschal etc. are in for a rude awakening if they genuinely expect all of those 600k currently in receipt of Covid support to return to work once those supports are pulled.

Those that don't return will just end up as part of the Job Seekers live register.

Shuffling the books if you will.

They don't expect them to IMO, a 'big number' of them won't walk back into work and the shuffling of the books is to reduce the ruinous amount of money being spent by DSP, so yes a lot of people currently on PUP will find themselves on jobseekers before the winter starts.

OwenM

timmyntc wrote: »

We have one of the narrowest tax bases in Europe.
It was on of the IMFs recommendations after 08 that we should widen our tax base so everyone pays a fair share rather than most of tax burden placed on "middle earners" - still has not been addressed.

It's actually worse than that, USC which is supposed to be 'Universal' has been tweaked over the years to exclude more and more lower earners - so less and less tax collected, a narrower tax base.

Fandymo

Graham wrote: »

Odd how they think it might be dangerous if media do it but you reckon it's not when randoms do it online.

Go figure

Media is mass read, circulation in the 100s of thousands. I think you are over estimating the reach of Boards. :rolleyes: