Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

Gortanna

Gortanna wrote: »

And ISAG are never challenged. Emails of theirs were leaked and nothing about it, apart from on Gript. Look at the difference in the US: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScFVUyVMp4M

Again, the point isn't whether one likes Tucker Carlson or not, but that he gives a voice to possibly half the country, the US being more or less split down the middle in terms of Republicans and Democrats, although obviously not all Republicans dislike Fauci. More accurate to say that he gives a voice to a lot of people, not all Republicans.

If ISAG were in the US they would be challenged by the Republican Party, Fox News, Breitbart, Ben Shapiro. Dave Rubin et al. Their emails would possibly have been a national scandal. Similarly NPHET would be challenged non-stop and criticised heavily.

ISAG's proposals are not being followed.

And Tucker Carlsson may give a voice to half the country, but that is though feeding inherent biases, misinformation, and outright lies.

Gortanna

Gortanna wrote: »

Do you think the entire Republican Party, which represents around half the country, is made up of conspiracy theorists and morons?

Do you think ISAG's emails would've been a national scandal in the US?

The republican party agenda is been driven by conspiracy theorists and morons. More than half of republican voters believe the election was stolen.

And again - ISAG are not the policy makers here, and their proposals have not been implemented.

seamus

seamus wrote: »

Yes and no, to answer both of your questions. But don't forget the con artists. ISAG are a fringe group who despite the airtime they've gotten, have had exactly zero influence on public policy. Their emails are irrelevant, because they are irrelevant.

I still think their emails would've been a national scandal in other countries because of the positions their members hold. But in Ireland it passed by like a momentary gust of cold wind on a warm day.

Marty Bird

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Why is the health service so limited? You paint a picture of the HSE funded on a shoestring budget in our proud little country

Ireland spends about €4500 per person on healthcare, Germany about €4900

Germany does have 18 million citizens over 65 though so has higher demand on its healthcare

My concern for Ireland is that it will take investment to reform the health service, but with spiralling debt levels due to such long plentiful covid lockdowns here, we now won’t be able to make improvements to the already costly health service

200% agree with this. Our health service is a mess and it’s not for the amount of money we spend on it just the massive massive inefficiency’s like every other government dept. Our health system is always beyond capacity every winter.

They have moved heaven and earth for the virus, no repossessions /evictions, private capacity used no issue all done with the stroke of a pen and massive amounts of money, when the dust settles not a chance the health system will be anyway different than before all this.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

The republican party agenda is been driven by conspiracy theorists and morons. More than half of republican voters believe the election was stolen.

And again - ISAG are not the policy makers here, and their proposals have not been implemented.

I just find it amazing that a group that discussed ways to deceive the public are never off the airwaves. What should have been a national scandal wasn't even reported on. Was in Gript, but Gript isn't widely read.

And their proposals do appear to be implemented. Ireland appears to be pursuing a zero covid strategy. There hasn't been an emergency in Ireland for a long time and yet life continues to be restricted and emergency powers extended. I read that Donnelly wanted to extend them indefinitely.

Marty Bird

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

https://www.worldobesityday.org/assets/downloads/COVID-19_and_Obesity-The_2021_Atlas.pdf

The world obesity day report found that if obesity wasn’t so prevalent, covid would be much much less of an issue



The best prevention for covid is to stop eating to many calories

And look at the people who advise on these topics and so many HCW are in those categories it’s crazy.

Gortanna

Gortanna wrote: »

I just find it amazing that a group that discussed ways to deceive the public are never off the airwaves. What should have been a national scandal wasn't even reported on. Was in Gript, but Gript isn't widely read.

And their proposals do appear to be implemented. Ireland appears to be pursuing a zero covid strategy. There hasn't been an emergency in Ireland for a long time and yet life continues to be restricted and emergency powers extended. I read that Donnelly wanted to extend them indefinitely.

Private comms on a private email from private citizens who have no input to policy and who's proposals have not made into policy is a national scandal now?

cheezums

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I just find it amazing that a group that discussed ways to deceive the public are never off the airwaves. What should have been a national scandal wasn't even reported on. Was in Gript, but Gript isn't widely read.

And their proposals do appear to be implemented. Ireland appears to be pursuing a zero covid strategy. There hasn't been an emergency in Ireland for a long time and yet life continues to be restricted and emergency powers extended. I read that Donnelly wanted to extend them indefinitely.

Ireland is not pursuing a zero covid strategy ffs.

And give us a source\link about donnelly as that sounds like a complete lie.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Private comms on a private email from private citizens who have no input to policy and who's proposals have not made into policy is a national scandal now?

When those private citizens include the president of the section of epidemiology and public health of the Royal Society of Medicine (Gabriel Scally), the AXA Research Chair in Applied Pathogen Ecology at the School of Biological, Earth and Environmental Sciences at UCC (Gerry Killeen), and numerous other individuals in prominent positions at prestigious positions, then I think it would at least have been mentioned in the US. In Ireland it wasn't even mentioned apart from in Gript.

cheezums

cheezums wrote: »

Ireland is not pursuing a zero covid strategy ffs.

And give us a source\link about donnelly as that sounds like a complete lie.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40299260.html%3ftype=amp

"The health minister, speaking in the Dáil today, made clear that a previous provision to allow the “draconian powers” to be extended for an indefinite number of times has been set aside."

The original plan was for there to be a provision to allow the powers to be extended an indefinite number of times.

TefalBrain

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The age group who will also pay the most and suffer the greatest economic ramifications from such a lengthy lockdown in Ireland

The best opportunity for those under 30 to return to normality any time soon is to emigrate.

I'm afraid i completely agree with you Fintan. If i was in that age cohort i'd be gone.

seamus

Emigrate...because the pandemic is only in Ireland?

Hilarious.

Sweet.Science

seamus wrote: »

Emigrate...because the pandemic is only in Ireland?

Hilarious.

People mostly emigrate to America / Australia

Life is fine over there

corkie

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Please do share the numbers if you see them

53 in Hospital with 15 in ICU

https://covid19ireland-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/pages/0814b13a2f2b4458a36105502c8e92e8

Contradicts what Paul Reid tweeted this morning.
https://twitter.com/paulreiddublin/status/1405783781991145482



Edit: Number in hospital was reduced by one.

Gortanna

Gortanna wrote: »

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40299260.html%3ftype=amp

"The health minister, speaking in the Dáil today, made clear that a previous provision to allow the “draconian powers” to be extended for an indefinite number of times has been set aside."

The original plan was for there to be a provision to allow the powers to be extended an indefinite number of times.

So the evidence that Donnelly wanted to extend them indefinitely is him actually wanting to put an end date on them?

TefalBrain

seamus wrote: »

Emigrate...because the pandemic is only in Ireland?

Hilarious.

I'm guessing you are missing the point on purpose. Here's a clue, it's not just Covid that that age cohort are getting screwed over. They will the one's left holding the bag.

seamus

corkie wrote: »

* Reason I don't like posting the numbers before announcements, they maybe subject to correction or edits.

I'd be inclined to take the figures online as gospel tbf. Reid posted that quite early this morning. There were probably 2 admissions recorded after he tweeted, and the ICU report probably hadn't been done yet.

15 in ICU is great news for the weekend.

seamus

TefalBrain wrote: »

I'm guessing you are missing the point on purpose. Here's a clue, it's not just Covid that that age cohort are getting screwed over. They will the one's left holding the bag.

Right...so they're going to go another country that hasn't been affected, is that it?

I'm on the edge of my seat here waiting for an answer. Where are they all going to go? Where is this marvel of a country where the economy has taken no economic hit, where covid restrictions are not in force, and where they're just crying out with no immigration controls for cantankerous young Irish monoglots to enter the workforce?

Gortanna

Gortanna wrote: »

When those private citizens include the president of the section of epidemiology and public health of the Royal Society of Medicine (Gabriel Scally), the AXA Research Chair in Applied Pathogen Ecology at the School of Biological, Earth and Environmental Sciences at UCC (Gerry Killeen), and numerous other individuals in prominent positions at prestigious positions, then I think it would at least have been mentioned in the US. In Ireland it wasn't even mentioned apart from in Gript.

Well it must have been given ISAG is part of the Zero covid Alliance, which includes the US group ZeroCovid US, members of whom have worked closely with ISAG and are prominent US academics?

Or maybe even in the US, despite its problems, they stop short of witch-hunts on scientists who express an opinion on what to do in their field of expertise when they are outside the decision making process

Ficheall

seamus wrote: »

Where is this marvel of a country where the economy has taken no economic hit, where covid restrictions are not in force, and where they're just crying out with no immigration controls for cantankerous young Irish monoglots to enter the workforce?

Cloud Cuckoo Land.

FintanMcluskey

seamus wrote: »

Right...so they're going to go another country that hasn't been affected, is that it?

I'm on the edge of my seat here waiting for an answer. Where are they all going to go? Where is this marvel of a country where the economy has taken no economic hit, where covid restrictions are not in force, and where they're just crying out with no immigration controls for cantankerous young Irish monoglots to enter the workforce?

Most of European countries haven’t had such long severe lockdowns as Ireland has

They didn’t shut construction for months either

Or impose MHQ at the expense of their airline industries and subsequently haven’t added as much to their debt levels as Ireland has done

So as per my original point, if your young consider moving abroad for a faster return to normality

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/ireland-to-have-highest-debt-per-head-in-europe-this-year-1.4503652%3fmode=amp

It means that, per capita, the Irish will shoulder a debt burden of almost €20,000 more than the EU average.

seamus

seamus wrote: »

This is a prime example of having one's head in the sand and believing the nonsense that Ireland has the strictest restrictions in the world and that NPHET are trying to keep everything locked down for no reason.

We are currently at or near the top of the list in terms of vaccine rollout and planning a complete or almost complete lifting all restrictions in the Autumn.

And yet somehow in your head you've convinced yourself that we're so far behind that gigs won't be happening next summer.

I have absolute confidence in the situation over here, because the only time we were lied to was when Michael Martin told us that the 3rd wave happened due to a new variant.

Outside of that, everything which has been said and done has been completely transparent. Where we're going, why we're doing what we're doing. We don't necessarily have to have agreed with some of the decisions, but you can't claim that they haven't been perfectly clear and upfront.

I haven't heard anybody from Government or NPHET saying anything at all like that.

When will nightclubs be back? Are there any scheduled shows in the three arena that look likely to go ahead? Will croker be sold out for the All Ireland?
When can I stop wearing a mask in shops?

I'm certainly not confident that the above will be gone by Autumn.

FintanMcluskey

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

That’s why happens when decision making is handed to middle aged affluent men and women

Those who are making the decisions and giving advice are likely to have been vaccinated themselves

There’ll likely be those on here who sneer are this, but it’s spot on. 50 year olds who’ve been vaccinated against a virus that could impact them badly telling 20-40 year olds how to live

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So the evidence that Donnelly wanted to extend them indefinitely is him actually wanting to put an end date on them?

That the government wanted to extend them indefinitely in the first place is alarming in itself.

A rare example of opposition, but only because the idea of an indefinite extension was alarming.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Well it must have been given ISAG is part of the Zero covid Alliance, which includes the US group ZeroCovid US, members of whom have worked closely with ISAG and are prominent US academics?

Or maybe even in the US, despite its problems, they stop short of witch-hunts on scientists who express an opinion on what to do in their field of expertise when they are outside the decision making process

But look at what they were saying. They were suggesting ways to deliberately deceive the public. I'll have to reread the emails, but I was horrified when I read them.

seamus

Deleted User wrote: »

I haven't heard anybody from Government or NPHET saying anything at all like that.

That's cos I'm pretty sure you're not listening.

https://www.newstalk.com/news/varadkar-hopeful-majority-of-restrictions-will-be-gone-by-august-1190033

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/pandemic-welfare-supports-to-be-phased-out-from-october-onwards-varadkar-confirms-1.4576130

For the avoidance of doubt: August is the last month of Summer, not the first month of Autumn.

seamus

seamus wrote: »

Right...so they're going to go another country that hasn't been affected, is that it?

I'm on the edge of my seat here waiting for an answer. Where are they all going to go? Where is this marvel of a country where the economy has taken no economic hit, where covid restrictions are not in force, and where they're just crying out with no immigration controls for cantankerous young Irish monoglots to enter the workforce?

Sweden, Norway, Iceland, Finland, Denmark, most of the US, Australia and New Zealand (if it were possible to go to those two countries), the Cayman Islands, Russia.

It's not a question of whether or not they've been hit economically, but rather that life is either normal or close to normal in those countries.

seamus

seamus wrote: »

That's cos I'm pretty sure you're not listening.

https://www.newstalk.com/news/varadkar-hopeful-majority-of-restrictions-will-be-gone-by-august-1190033

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/pandemic-welfare-supports-to-be-phased-out-from-october-onwards-varadkar-confirms-1.4576130

For the avoidance of doubt: August is the last month of Summer, not the first month of Autumn.

No mention of masks. For many masks aren't a restriction. I think they're a huge restriction, but they are very popular in Ireland.

Ficheall

Gortanna wrote: »

That the government wanted to extend them indefinitely in the first place is alarming in itself.

They wanted to have the option to extend restrictions where deemed necessary, no, rather than wanting to extend restrictions indefinitely?


Like the divorce referendum let you file for divorce, rather than forcing you to do so?

seamus

Gortanna wrote: »

Sweden, Norway, Iceland, Finland, Denmark, most of the US, Australia and New Zealand (if it were possible to go to those two countries), the Cayman Islands, Russia.

It's not a question of whether or not they've been hit economically, but rather that life is either normal or close to normal in those countries.

Australia & New Zealand? Are they taking many Irish 20-somethings on speculatory visas at the moment?

Also...Russia, lol. Yes, I'm sure all those young people are champing at the bit to leave Ireland and go to a bastion of freedom, wealth & tolerance like Russia.

Fantasy land.