Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

Doctor Jimbob

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I could be mistaken but did this not happen last year around hay fever season too? Is it possible these additional symptoms are actually just people who have hay fever and COVID?

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57467051
Decent data there from their app, seems to be the cold symptoms are the most prominent and the classic loss of smell has gone down.

"This variant seems to be working slightly differently, People might think they've just got some sort of seasonal cold".

JRant

JRant wrote: »

Well, that's not entirely true. Science draws conclusions from data that must be repeatable and falsifiable. The last 2 being the key components to prevent misleading correlation=/=causation findings.

To date, very little of the COVID response stands up to any scientific scrutiny. Sure, you can say there is a correlation between locking down and cases but there is nothing to suggest it's a scientific fact.

Same with the different variants. The UK one was supposed to be 60/80% more transmissible the previous one but that turned out to just not be true.

I wish more people would question things like this. I hate how it has just become accepted that lockdown is the only answer.

The illness tends to peak and drop off by itself regardless of restrictions. Its easy to look at cases dropping and just assume that its lockdown. But how much of it is actually just the disease burning itself out? People taking responsibility themselves etc.

As you say, Ireland was still severely restricted in December. We only had 7 days of inter county travel. The illness was going to hit anyways.

I've seen so many people claiming that the death toll would be multiples higher without lockdown but I just don't think that its true. I think the death toll would actually be much lower if we had focused less on lockdown and much more in areas like nursing homes/hospitals etc.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57467051
Decent data there from their app, seems to be the cold symptoms are the most prominent and the classic loss of smell has gone down.

"This variant seems to be working slightly differently, People might think they've just got some sort of seasonal cold".

Is further support to the full release of restrictions in the UK, including masks and social distancing requirements, on the 19th July

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57467051
Decent data there from their app, seems to be the cold symptoms are the most prominent and the classic loss of smell has gone down.

"This variant seems to be working slightly differently, People might think they've just got some sort of seasonal cold".

Now that the elderly are vaccinated, does it even matter whether the young have a cold or Covid? Sure it seems like it is very hard to distinguish either way.

I certainly hope no business will have to remain closed because some young people have headaches or sniffles.

Wibbs

Deleted User wrote: »

I've seen so many people claiming that the death toll would be multiples higher without lockdown but I just don't think that its true. I think the death toll would actually be much lower if we had focused less on lockdown and much more in areas like nursing homes/hospitals etc.

That's easy to say in retrospect Jac, though how we handled care homes here was a bloody disgrace, though compared to the sh1tshow that was Spain... We needed the lockdowns when we didn't know what we were dealing with, when we saw other health services being overwhelmed in short order by a massive influx of seriously ill patients and when we had few enough treatment protocols for this new pathogen.

Think back to say March last year and the scenes coming out of China and especially Italy. It would have been extremely irresponsible to not take as many precautions as possible. Imagine if this pox had turned out to be as dangerous as smallpox(30-90% mortality) or even the "original" SARS that had mortality rates of between 6 and 15% and affected people of all ages. If Covid 19 had been a 10% mortality pox that was killing people in the prime of life, we'd be sitting here complaining we didn't lockdown enough and the death tolls would have been multiples higher.

I still firmly believe that even though Covid 19 was far more "mild" as it turned out, we still needed lockdowns to "flatten the curve" for medical services. Even with lockdowns that was touch and go. Do we need them now? IMHO not nearly so much. Personally I'd open up the country fully by August. The vast majority of the at risk groups will be vaccinated, we have more medical protocols for treatment and more and more of the much lower risk groups are being vaccinated too.

I can see the mental illness support services being far more overwhelmed by the aftermath of this pox than the frontline folks were by the actual virus last year and that was as I say touch and go.

shinzon

India declares the Delta Plus variant a variant of concern, unclear if this is just a rename of an existing variant or if this is a more virulent strain of Delta at the moment

https://pib.gov.in/PressReleseDetail.aspx?PRID=1729467&fbclid=IwAR3geQGn9zFxwewT0nKruZdYJ0NPgw1-UkYS0Q4lAGuRquYsc7ltNeAnC7M

Shin

eastie17

Wibbs wrote: »

That's easy to say in retrospect Jac, though how we handled care homes here was a bloody disgrace, though compared to the sh1tshow that was Spain... We needed the lockdowns when we didn't know what we were dealing with, when we saw other health services being overwhelmed in short order by a massive influx of seriously ill patients and when we had few enough treatment protocols for this new pathogen.

Think back to say March last year and the scenes coming out of China and especially Italy. It would have been extremely irresponsible to not take as many precautions as possible. Imagine if this pox had turned out to be as dangerous as smallpox(30-90% mortality) or even the "original" SARS that had mortality rates of between 6 and 15% and affected people of all ages. If Covid 19 had been a 10% mortality pox that was killing people in the prime of life, we'd be sitting here complaining we didn't lockdown enough and the death tolls would have been multiples higher.

I still firmly believe that even though Covid 19 was far more "mild" as it turned out, we still needed lockdowns to "flatten the curve" for medical services. Even with lockdowns that was touch and go. Do we need them now? IMHO not nearly so much. Personally I'd open up the country fully by August. The vast majority of the at risk groups will be vaccinated, we have more medical protocols for treatment and more and more of the much lower risk groups are being vaccinated too.

I can see the mental illness support services being far more overwhelmed by the aftermath of this pox than the frontline folks were by the actual virus last year and that was as I say touch and go.

We protected the health service with teh actions, however I dont think any steps have been taken to increase our capacity should we end up in a similar situation in the next 12 months. You cant increase capacity by enough to prevent some of the Jan/Feb type numbers but you would hope they have done something.
Meanwhile people are still struggling to get routine things such as bloodtests from their GPs due to the HSE hack - why is the media saying nothing about that? It really is Pravda, I dont believe in screaming about it if its not going to help the problem but in a democracy you cant just pretend something as serious as that is not happening which is what you would think from the media

Keyzer

I don't understand why such a lax approach is taken to these new variants. Seems to be "we're looking at it...", "it's a concern, we're monitoring the situation"....

Any sniff of a new variant from whatever country and the Government should either:

1. Immediately ban inbound travel from that country or
2. Enforce mandatory 2 week quarantine for anyone coming from that country

We have made great progress in our vaccination program, our numbers are better than they've been for months. Its time to protect our own country first and forget about the political BS.

Perhaps I'm out of touch with all that's going on, I haven't been paying much attention of late, but this makes perfect sense to me.

Renjit

shinzon wrote: »

India declares the Delta Plus variant a variant of concern, unclear if this is just a rename of an existing variant or if this is a more virulent strain of Delta at the moment

https://pib.gov.in/PressReleseDetail.aspx?PRID=1729467&fbclid=IwAR3geQGn9zFxwewT0nKruZdYJ0NPgw1-UkYS0Q4lAGuRquYsc7ltNeAnC7M

Shin

Unfortunately India will see 3rd wave irrespective of variants.

munchkin_utd

Keyzer wrote: »

We have made great progress in our vaccination program, our numbers are better than they've been for months. Its time to protect our own country first and forget about the political BS.

btw, irelands numbers are utter cr@p - just have a look at Poland, Bulgaria, Italy, Germany etc

I think Irelands incidence rate is 800% higher than Poland, but the gap keeps growing so its hard to keep count.

So youre right, and if anything travel should be banned from Ireland to keep the Covid in Ireland and avoid polluting the continent with it !

munchkin_utd

munchkin_utd wrote: »

btw, irelands numbers are utter cr@p - just have a look at Poland, Bulgaria, Italy, Germany etc

I think Irelands incidence rate is 800% higher than Poland, but the gap keeps growing so its hard to keep count.

So youre right, and if anything travel should be banned from Ireland to keep the Covid in Ireland and avoid polluting the continent with it !

Poland - 1981 deaths per million
Bulgaria - 2611 deaths per million
Italy - 2109 deaths per million
Germany - 1084 deaths per million
Ireland - 998 deaths per million

Klonker

Deleted User wrote: »

Poland - 1981 deaths per million
Bulgaria - 2611 deaths per million
Italy - 2109 deaths per million
Germany - 1084 deaths per million
Ireland - 998 deaths per million

Now can you please adjust for age demographics please, otherwise its a pointless comparison.

Silentcorner

Klonker wrote: »

Now can you please adjust for age demographics please, otherwise its a pointless comparison.

I think that is too much for them....they don't have the capacity to understand that if every country had done nothing, no restrictions, we still would have had one of the lowest Covid related death rates....

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Poland - 1981 deaths per million
Bulgaria - 2611 deaths per million
Italy - 2109 deaths per million
Germany - 1084 deaths per million
Ireland - 998 deaths per million

I doubt this table will be of much comfort to many of us when we have much higher levels of debt, bigger housing crisis, worse economic conditions etc

Klonker

Klonker wrote: »

Now can you please adjust for age demographics please, otherwise its a pointless comparison.

Sure:

Assuming Ireland is the base line at 998

Poland 1584
Bulgaria 1700
Italy 1295
Germany 709

munchkin_utd

Deleted User wrote: »

Sure:

Assuming Ireland is the base line at 998

Poland 1584
Bulgaria 1700
Italy 1295
Germany 709

so, travel should be stopped to Poland now because people died at Christmas ?

Theres logic there all right !!!

Silentcorner

Silentcorner wrote: »

I think that is too much for them....they don't have the capacity to understand that if every country had done nothing, no restrictions, we still would have had one of the lowest Covid related death rates....

They them those their. It feels big to dismiss the "other"

Silentcorner

Deleted User wrote: »

They them those their. It feels big to dismiss the "other"

A pathetic attempt to dismiss me....but I am right.

eviltimeban

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57467051
Decent data there from their app, seems to be the cold symptoms are the most prominent and the classic loss of smell has gone down.

"This variant seems to be working slightly differently, People might think they've just got some sort of seasonal cold".

My primary school aged kid had a cold around a month ago, which I then caught. It lasted about a week and was like every other single cold I've ever had. No cough, and no loss of taste or smell. Was that Covid? Or just a cold? Who knows. Did it matter? Not really.

Keyzer

munchkin_utd wrote: »

btw, irelands numbers are utter cr@p - just have a look at Poland, Bulgaria, Italy, Germany etc

What numbers are you looking at?

munchkin_utd wrote: »

I think Irelands incidence rate is 800% higher than Poland, but the gap keeps growing so its hard to keep count.

That's false and complete nonsense - provide evidence to backup your claim.

munchkin_utd wrote: »

So youre right, and if anything travel should be banned from Ireland to keep the Covid in Ireland and avoid polluting the continent with it !

Couldn't give a toss what other countries do, its their decision but you're basing this comment on false information presented beforehand.

munchkin_utd wrote: »

so, travel should be stopped to Poland now because people died at Christmas ?

Theres logic there all right !!!

Who said anything about stopping travel to Poland?

Renjit

Silentcorner wrote: »

I think that is too much for them....they don't have the capacity to understand that if every country had done nothing, no restrictions, we still would have had one of the lowest Covid related death rates....

One death is a tragedy, many is just statistics

hmmm

Wibbs wrote: »

Personally I'd open up the country fully by August. The vast majority of the at risk groups will be vaccinated, we have more medical protocols for treatment and more and more of the much lower risk groups are being vaccinated too.

I imagine reopening decisions will be based on modelling and numbers. Everyone is watching the UK at the moment to see how many in the younger and unvaccinated group are ending up in hospital as a consequence of Delta. It'll be a simple mathematical calculation after that based on our current numbers, how fast it is increasing, and the proportion of our population which is vaccinated.

Either way we're in a good place. If we have to delay reopening some of the areas where the risk of spread is greater (indoors) for a few weeks it's not the end of the world. I'm expecting pretty much normality after this.

munchkin_utd

Keyzer wrote: »

What numbers are you looking at?

That's false and complete nonsense - provide evidence to backup your claim.

Couldn't give a toss what other countries do, its their decision but you're basing this comment on false information presented beforehand.

Who said anything about stopping travel to Poland?

Re Poland, the government is looking to put back any relaxation in travel regulations, even to places which are incredibly safe. Theres too much back patting in Ireland for the progress made. Ireland still has plenty of Covid in the country and it hasnt budged much since March - hovering at the 300-400 cases per day the whole time whereas Europes rates are dropping like a stone.

heres the 7 day incidence rate for a range of countries where travel is MUCH safer than a trip to Dublin or Athlone or Limerick where the 7 day incidence rate is in the 100s .

Ireland= 44.7

Romania= 2.3
Poland= 3.2
Slovakia= 5.5
Hungary= 6.0
Germany= 7.1
Czech= 8.1
Bulgaria= 8.5
Slovenia= 23.3
France= 23.8
Belgium= 25
Denmark= 28.2
Netherlands= 33

etc etc -
source https://oscovida.github.io/countries-incidence-rate.html

giveitholly

Wasn't the pandemic declared over last December by a poster here because of Ivermectin?

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1407657385225822208?s=19

FintanMcluskey

Silentcorner wrote: »

I think that is too much for them....they don't have the capacity to understand that if every country had done nothing, no restrictions, we still would have had one of the lowest Covid related death rates....

Our vulnerable died in the uk and U.S.A.

The huge proportion of older Irish people living in England is a function of the massive emigration to England in the 1950s and 1960s. In the 1950s, half a million people left for England and in the 1960s another 300,000 followed them

Ironically emigration will yet again become a huge part of Irish society due to the prolonged destruction of the economy from multiple lengthy lockdowns

CalamariFritti

eagle eye wrote: »

I didn't quote you, and asking a question as a response is ridiculous.

You mean like you did in the post I quoted? Also this is a public forum not a 1:1.

Silentcorner

Silentcorner wrote: »

A pathetic attempt to dismiss me....but I am right.

course you are

Silentcorner

Deleted User wrote: »

course you are

It's a virus that causes death disproportionately in the elderly.

We have one of the youngest populations in Europe.

We were always going to fare well regarding Covid related deaths.

It's not that hard to understand.

TefalBrain

Work colleague had covid last month. She had a sore throat and sniffles for 3 days and that was that. Her whole family had to get tested and two people she works closely with and out of the 7 of them 4 where positive with zero symptoms. Honestly i'd say there is literally hundreds of thousands who've had it and knew no better tbh.

Despite what we are been told and the scare tactics from certain special interest groupings with the vulnerable now vaccinated this really isn't that big an issue.

rob316

TefalBrain wrote: »

Work colleague had covid last month. She had a sore throat and sniffles for 3 days and that was that. Her whole family had to get tested and two people she works closely with and out of the 7 of them 4 where positive with zero symptoms. Honestly i'd say there is literally hundreds of thousands who've had it and knew no better tbh.

Despite what we are been told and the scare tactics from certain special interest groupings with the vulnerable now vaccinated this really isn't that big an issue.

But the Variants! :rolleyes: