Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

giveitholly

CruelSummer wrote: »

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1408498765309300737?s=21

Interesting piece of science fiction here from George Lee. Where did he get the double the hospitalisation figure? The U.K. hospitalisation rates have not gone up. The incidence of Covid in the U.K. has stabilised in all regions bar one. They also had a 12 week gap for mRNA vaccines which we didn’t, as did NI & Scotland.

What is be basing the 97% more transmissible figure on?
PHE are revising down the transmissibility of Delta all the time as data comes in:

Yeah David Higgins calling him out on twitter

https://twitter.com/higginsdavidw/status/1408566608948187137?s=19

The HorsesMouth

Thing about the George Lee thing is if we saw that for eg Hungary were showing figures on their national broadcaster that were "interpreted" to show covid was not as serious as everyone else thinks we'd be shaking our heads at the backwardness of it.
We have to opposite here but it's just as dangerous. My own fully vaccinated 57 year old healthy mother believes we should delay reopening as "did you see george lee on RTE saying this that and the other".
It's infuriating and I don't know about anyone else but I'm beginning to fall out more with my older family members as they want to see stuff closed and don't care what it does to the younger generation.

eagle eye

eagle eye wrote: »

Maybe put yourself in their position and have a rethink.

We can’t have millions of lives on hold because some people are afraid.

Look at the poll on the previous page. Even a percentage of fully vaccinated don’t want life to return to normal.

It’s time we remove that option on them.

cheezums

There are people in my workplace "terrified" of the delta variant. I had to bite my lip to stop myself laughing in their face.

The hysteria is ridiculous. George lee and others need to be removed from the airwaves immediately as a risk to the country's mental health.

Silentcorner

cheezums wrote: »

There are people in my workplace "terrified" of the delta variant. I had to bite my lip to stop myself laughing in their face.

The hysteria is ridiculous. George lee and others need to be removed from the airwaves immediately as a risk to the country's mental health.

There will be a separate price to pay for all the fear and hysteria that has been pumped into the population only time will tell what that is....we are in June with a few dozen in hospital that has a nationwide stock of 11,000 beds....we shouldn't even be reporting cases...more people are in hospital from falling down stairs.

We will also see how many people pay any attention to the next wave of media hysteria that is coming down the road!!!

GeorgeBailey

cheezums wrote: »

There are people in my workplace "terrified" of the delta variant. I had to bite my lip to stop myself laughing in their face.

Why would you be given towards laughing in their face? Would you not understand their fear given everything that's been said about the big, bad variants in the news and social media? Maybe point them in the direction of more measured commentary?

TefalBrain

Deleted User wrote: »

We can’t have millions of lives on hold because some people are afraid.

Look at the poll on the previous page. Even a percentage of fully vaccinated don’t want life to return to normal.

It’s time we remove that option on them.

Once again i'll state it, Covid and the lockdowns have mentally damaged more people than we can ever imagine. I still encounter people crossing the road to avoid others when out and about like this is the black death or Ebola. Scaremongering from the likes of George Lee and others just reinforces that mental damage.

podgeandrodge

CruelSummer wrote: »

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1408498765309300737?s=21

Interesting piece of science fiction here from George Lee. Where did he get the double the hospitalisation figure? The U.K. hospitalisation rates have not gone up. The incidence of Covid in the U.K. has stabilised in all regions bar one. They also had a 12 week gap for mRNA vaccines which we didn’t, as did NI & Scotland.

What is be basing the 97% more transmissible figure on?
PHE are revising down the transmissibility of Delta all the time as data comes in:

https://twitter.com/erictopol/status/1408406649224589317?s=21

There was a lancet article (referenced below) which said "The Delta coronavirus variant doubles the risk of hospitalisation compared with the previously dominant variant in the United Kingdom". Is George saying that a doubling of the risk of hospitalisation is the same as a doubling of the actual hospitalisations? I don't think that double risk translates to double hospitalisations, does it?

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)01358-1/fulltext

FintanMcluskey

GeorgeBailey wrote: »

Why would you be given towards laughing in their face? Would you not understand their fear given everything that's been said about the big, bad variants in the news and social media? Maybe point them in the direction of more measured commentary?

You do have a point there, but where is that measured commentary in Irish media?

Remember also that many in here have said for a year now that Rte (and nPHEt) are not forcing a fear based narrative

But your point is correct, people are petrified because of what they are being told by a source of mainstream media they believe to be credible

Ficheall

podgeandrodge wrote: »

I don't think that double risk translates to double hospitalisations, does it?

All other things being equal, yes. Doubling the risk of hospitalisations doubles the number of hospitalisations on average. Could be more, could be less, but over a large sample, it will average out at double.

DebDynamite

“Two out of three people with one does of this vaccine could easily pick up the variant”. George doesn’t tell us though how likely it is that this person will get seriously ill or require hospitalisation.

According to PHE, The AstraZeneca vaccine is 71 per cent effective against hospitalisation after just one dose, increasing to 92 per cent after two doses. Is that really enough to prolong the restrictions for the small percentage ,who by the time of 5th July, will still not have their second vaccine?

For a science correspondent, he doesn’t really seem to be about the science at all.

Jinglejangle69

DebDynamite wrote: »

“Two our of three people with one does of this vaccine could easily pick up the variant”. George doesn’t tell us though how likely it is that this person will get seriously ill or require hospitalisation.

According to PHE, The AstraZeneca vaccine is 71 per cent effective against hospitalisation after just one dose, increasing to 92 per cent after two doses. Is that really enough to prolong the restrictions for the small percentage ,who by the time of 5th July, will still not have their second vaccine?

For a science correspondent, he doesn’t really seem to be about the science at all.

This is a simple fact the media won't mention and most people don't know because they won't mention it.

If you're vaccinated you can still be infected but you are now near guaranteed protection against serious illness.

Very frustrating.

DebDynamite

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

This is a simple fact the media won't mention and most people don't know because they won't mention it.

If you're vaccinated you can still be infected but you are now near guaranteed protection against serious illness.

Very frustrating.

And those stats are from Public Health England, who have more data to go on as they’ve been hit more with the variant than we have. Here in fact, the further our percentage of the Delta variant increases, the further our hospitals numbers go down. It’s almost like the vaccines are working, or something...

RTE know exactly what they are doing, whipping their viewers up into a frenzy, as they know those in their 60s make up a considerable number of their viewers. It’s absolutely irresponsible.

eagle eye

Deleted User wrote:

We can’t have millions of lives on hold because some people are afraid.

Look at the poll on the previous page. Even a percentage of fully vaccinated don’t want life to return to normal.
It’s time we remove that option on them.

You sound a bit fascist there.

DebDynamite

eagle eye wrote: »

You sound a bit fascist there.

Would you call Europe a fascist continent? Because we are the only outliers at the moment. Maybe we should seek to leave the EU like the UK did. Oh wait, they’re also fascist.

Happydays2020

DebDynamite wrote: »

“Two out of three people with one does of this vaccine could easily pick up the variant”. George doesn’t tell us though how likely it is that this person will get seriously ill or require hospitalisation.

According to PHE, The AstraZeneca vaccine is 71 per cent effective against hospitalisation after just one dose, increasing to 92 per cent after two doses. Is that really enough to prolong the restrictions for the small percentage ,who by the time of 5th July, will still not have their second vaccine?

For a science correspondent, he doesn’t really seem to be about the science at all.

What is the figure for Pfizer after one dose?

DebDynamite

Happydays2020 wrote: »

What is the figure for Pfizer after one dose?

The analysis suggests the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine is 94 per cent effective against hospital admission after just one dose, rising to 96 per cent after two doses.

Took from this article: https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/what-is-the-delta-variant-and-how-much-does-vaccination-protect-against-it-1.4600573%3fmode=amp

eagle eye

DebDynamite wrote:

Would you call Europe a fascist continent? Because we are the only outliers at the moment. Maybe we should seek to leave the EU like the UK did. Oh wait, they’re also fascist.

The guy is talking about taking options that people want away from them. I called him fascist for those comments.
How on earth do you jump from that to our EU membership?

First Up

TefalBrain wrote:

Once again i'll state it, Covid and the lockdowns have mentally damaged more people than we can ever imagine. I still encounter people crossing the road to avoid others when out and about like this is the black death or Ebola. Scaremongering from the likes of George Lee and others just reinforces that mental damage.

The only people I see mentally damaged by Covid are the ones posting nonsense in forums like this.

Medical experts telling us what the virus is and can do is not scaremongering. They are doing what they are trained and expected to do.

Being aware of the risks and being cautious is not being hysterical with fear. It is being sensible and responsible

Exaggerating how people are dealing with Covid to try to make a point just shows that you don't have much of a point.

shockframe

DebDynamite wrote: »

And those stats are from Public Health England, who have more data to go on as they’ve been hit more with the variant than we have. Here in fact, the further our percentage of the Delta variant increases, the further our hospitals numbers go down. It’s almost like the vaccines are working, or something...

RTE know exactly what they are doing, whipping their viewers up into a frenzy, as they know those in their 60s make up a considerable number of their viewers. It’s absolutely irresponsible.

RTE are going to carry out the scaremongering as long as they can.

The vulnerable are their last audience who hang on their every word and anyone under that age is looking towards twitter, instagram,tiktok etc more than them and they know it.

It's hopefully their last act before they slide further into irrelevance. I haven't watched them in regard to current affairs for well over a decade and certainly will not be doing so in the years ahead.

DebDynamite

eagle eye wrote: »

The guy is talking about taking options that people want away from them. I called him fascist for those comments.
How on earth do you jump from that to our EU membership?

Because what he suggested is exactly what the rest of the EU have done - moved on and opened up. Though I would suspect the rest of the EU are probably a bit more resilient have a bit more steel than our citizens seem to have.

normanoffside

I still can’t get over the fact that Sam McConkey said we can open indoor hospitality and yet our leaders want to take a more cautious approach than him.

eagle eye

DebDynamite wrote:

Because what he suggested is exactly what the rest of the EU have done - moved on and opened up. Though I would suspect the rest of the EU are probably a bit more resilient have a bit more steel than our citizens seem to have.

I'm specifically talking about removing options that people want. That's got nothing to do with the rest of Europe, it's the citizens of this country.

hmmm

I think it's pretty simple. If the number of hospitalisations can be kept low and manageable, we have to reopen as much as possible (hopefully everything).

The problem right now is we don't have the data to tell us how quickly Delta will (or won't) spread, and how many hospitalisations it will cause. If it infects a large number of the "non-vulnerable" population, a certain % of them will get hospitalised - and even a small percentage of a large group of people could be a big number. Proceeding with caution (but not panic) makes sense.

Both of the extreme sides of the argument are not being reasonable - the lockdown/zero-Covid group who think we can somehow eliminate this virus are not being realistic and we will have to learn to live with the risk, but equally bad are the group who would throw caution to the wind by ignoring the reality that Delta has created a bit of a temporary dilemma around the timing of indoor reopening.

DebDynamite

eagle eye wrote: »

I'm specifically talking about removing options that people want. That's got nothing to do with the rest of Europe, it's the citizens of this country.

About 65% think we should sill have to wear masks and have restrictions even after everyone is vaccinated! Should we appease these people as well?

DebDynamite

First Up wrote: »

The only people I see mentally damaged by Covid are the ones posting nonsense in forums like this.

Medical experts telling us what the virus is and can do is not scaremongering. They are doing what they are trained and expected to do.

Being aware of the risks and being cautious is not being hysterical with fear. It is being sensible and responsible

Exaggerating how people are dealing with Covid to try to make a point just shows that you don't have much of a point.

In the example I gave above, George Lee said two out of three people with only one vaccination are more likely to catch the variant. However, he never followed up to say one dose of the vaccine was 71% (AZ) or 94% (Pfizer) effective in reducing serious illness. There was no attempt there to assuage people’s concerns. That’s not what I’d call sensible or responsible. That’s cherry picking certain stats to drive your agenda.

The rest of his stats appear to be questionable as well.

iamwhoiam

DebDynamite wrote: »

About 65% think we should sill have to wear masks and have restrictions even after everyone is vaccinated! Should we appease these people as well?

I dont see why people shouldnt wear masks if they wish to ? Its surely their choice for themselves ?

DebDynamite

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I dont see why people shouldnt wear masks if they wish to ? Its surely their choice for themselves ?

Absolutely it’s their choice. So long as they don’t mandate that everyone else has to wear a mask, and others have a choice not to wear a mask once we’ve reached herd immunity.

Turtwig

DebDynamite wrote: »

About 65% think we should sill have to wear masks and have restrictions even after everyone is vaccinated! Should we appease these people as well?

This pandemic will continue on for at least another year. Masks are a very cheap effective way at reducing spread. I do think there is a case to be made for keeping masks use in certain environments such as public transport.

Arghus

First Up wrote: »

The only people I see mentally damaged by Covid are the ones posting nonsense in forums like this.

Medical experts telling us what the virus is and can do is not scaremongering. They are doing what they are trained and expected to do.

Being aware of the risks and being cautious is not being hysterical with fear. It is being sensible and responsible

Exaggerating how people are dealing with Covid to try to make a point just shows that you don't have much of a point.

Exactly.

Reading through these threads and this forum you'd be forgiven for thinking that everyone out there is catatonic with stress. In truth, most people are just getting on with it, trying to live life - and we all know this, or at least most of us do.

The posters who you see posting about the fear and the hysteria that they assume everyone is living through are projecting, in my view, what they feel themselves. And often the contributors who speak of "scaremongering" are frequently the most emotional and near apocalyptic in their predictions.

I agree that media coverage can be over the top. But people can disengage with that - and lots have. The posters who rail constantly about the media also seem to be the ones who most hang on it's every word and their mood seems to be entirely determined by what is broadcast or printed or posted. I've given out about the media here myself, but there's a limit I think too between legitimate criticism and downright obsession.

The vast, vast majority of people out there are nowhere near as consumed with all matters Covid as we are here. The proof is obvious: these forums are practically dead compared to even a few months ago. I'm including myself in this, we're the freaks lads.