Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

Widdensushi

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Well after being an advocate of the best vaccine is the one offered first I am now slightly miffed that the 60-69 all got Astra Zeneca . To get a decent efficy against the Indian variant we need to have a second dose and that is 12 weeks instead of 4 with Pfizer . I feel a bit peed off today that we got absolutely no choice whatsoever at the time
Glad to be vaccinated of course but it seems the spiel with consider yourself fully vaccinated 4 weeks after dose 1 was not strictly true .

The Indian variant probably didn't exist when you got vaccinated and astra still has efficy, just not as high.

hmmm

wadacrack wrote: »

Many scientists share a similar view . Its the pattern that is worrying not the numbers atm.

Going on just anecdotal reports from the UK this variant is spreading rapidly within a community which perhaps left its guard down over social distancing. There's a high secondary attack rate in the stats which to me (a non expert) suggests heavy spread in poorer areas with more people living in close confines.

I think we'll need to wait & see what the statistics are when this starts spreading in the wider population to really get an idea of transmission dynamics.

iamwhoiam

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Well after being an advocate of the best vaccine is the one offered first I am now slightly miffed that the 60-69 all got Astra Zeneca . To get a decent efficy against the Indian variant we need to have a second dose and that is 12 weeks instead of 4 with Pfizer . I feel a bit peed off today that we got absolutely no choice whatsoever at the time
Glad to be vaccinated of course but it seems the spiel with consider yourself fully vaccinated 4 weeks after dose 1 was not strictly true .

Do you mean that it's a 12 week wait before you are fully protected?

brickster69

Widdensushi wrote: »

The Indian variant probably didn't exist when you got vaccinated and astra still has efficy, just not as high.

They will be going to court next wanting money back for AZ not making a vaccine that was 100% effective against something that never existed at the time.

Fann Linn

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Do you mean that it's a 12 week wait before you are fully protected?

3 weeks effective after your second dose so either 15 weeks or 19 weeks in total for AZ.

Ger Roe

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Well after being an advocate of the best vaccine is the one offered first I am now slightly miffed that the 60-69 all got Astra Zeneca . To get a decent efficy against the Indian variant we need to have a second dose and that is 12 weeks instead of 4 with Pfizer . I feel a bit peed off today that we got absolutely no choice whatsoever at the time
Glad to be vaccinated of course but it seems the spiel with consider yourself fully vaccinated 4 weeks after dose 1 was not strictly true .

It wasn't true at all, and that's why it wasn't actually said. Where did you hear that?

Lumen

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Well after being an advocate of the best vaccine is the one offered first I am now slightly miffed that the 60-69 all got Astra Zeneca . To get a decent efficy against the Indian variant we need to have a second dose and that is 12 weeks instead of 4 with Pfizer . I feel a bit peed off today that we got absolutely no choice whatsoever at the time

Source?

The PHE study doesn't show that. It shows 33% effectiveness after three weeks of the first AZ dose. Previous UK studies show AZ effectiveness increasing until at least 5 weeks, from recollection. It may well continue climbing after that.

iamwhoiam

podgeandrodge wrote: »

It certainly seems for less serious symptomtic illness that Pfizer is better, but for serious it may be more similar. Some have said that after a period further down the road, the 2 vaccines may be more similar in efficacy.

I do wonder whether there are implications for HCW's if they are all working and not as protected against variants.

Yes I understand that when 2 nd dose of AZ is given it has the same efficy as Pfizer after 2nd dose
The issue is the wait for second dose is 12 weeks with only 33% cover on the Indian variant . Or am I reading that wrong ?

hmmm

hmmm wrote: »

Going on just anecdotal reports from the UK this variant is spreading rapidly within a community which perhaps left its guard down over social distancing. There's a high secondary attack rate in the stats which to me (a non expert) suggests heavy spread in poorer areas with more people living in close confines.

I think we'll need to wait & see what the statistics are when this starts spreading in the wider population to really get an idea of transmission dynamics.

There's also the issue of such areas having lower vaccine uptake.

iamwhoiam

Ger Roe wrote: »

It wasn't true at all, and that's why it wasn't actually said. Where did you hear that?

https://www2.hse.ie/screening-and-vaccinations/covid-19-vaccine/get-the-vaccine/when-you-have-been-vaccinated/

The time you need to wait depends on which vaccine you’ve had.

You can follow the vaccine bonus advice:

7 days after your 2nd Pfizer-BioNTech dose
14 days after your 2nd Moderna dose
14 days after the Janssen vaccine - this is a single dose vaccine
28 days after your 1st AstraZeneca dose - you still need to get your 2nd dose to make sure that your vaccine protection lasts

Ger Roe

iamwhoiam wrote: »

https://www2.hse.ie/screening-and-vaccinations/covid-19-vaccine/get-the-vaccine/when-you-have-been-vaccinated/

The time you need to wait depends on which vaccine you’ve had.

You can follow the vaccine bonus advice:

7 days after your 2nd Pfizer-BioNTech dose
14 days after your 2nd Moderna dose
14 days after the Janssen vaccine - this is a single dose vaccine
28 days after your 1st AstraZeneca dose - you still need to get your 2nd dose to make sure that your vaccine protection lasts

They never said fully vaccinated after one shot of AZ. That is why it is a two shot shot vaccine as your above table says. Your first statement that I replied to is incorrect. The full line on about 'vaccine bonus' on the HSE website reads :

"When your vaccine has had time to work, you can do some things that were not recommended before you were vaccinated. This is called a ‘vaccine bonus’." That is not a statement that you are fully vaccinated after a first shot.

iamwhoiam

Ger Roe wrote: »

They never said fully vaccinated after one shot of AZ. That is why it is a two shot shot vaccine as your above table says. Your first statement that I replied to is incorrect.

They said you can consider yourself fully vaccinated for the vaccine bonus 28 days after 1 dose of AZ . I heard Tony Holohan confirm what is written below





Some more detail on the ‘vaccine bonus’, with indoor visits permitted – without masks or social distancing – for those who are vaccinated:

From 10 May

fully vaccinated people can meet indoors with other fully vaccinated people as long as there are no more than three households present;
fully vaccinated people can meet indoors with unvaccinated people from a single household, provided that they are not at risk of severe illness.
This applies to:

persons who have received AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria) – four weeks after dose 1;
persons who have received Janssen/Johnson & Johnson – two weeks after dose 1 (only dose);
persons who have received Pfizer – one week after dose 2;
persons who have received Moderna – two weeks after dose 2;
persons who have had a confirmed Covid-19 infection in the previous six months.
It will be welcome news for the 50-69-year-olds that they will not have to wait until after their second AstraZeneca dose – 12 weeks after the first dose – until they can meet indoors with loved ones.

Ger Roe

iamwhoiam wrote: »

They said you can consider yourself fully vaccinated for the vaccine bonus . I heard Tony Holohan say it


https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/health/healthy-under-50s-who-had-covid-to-be-considered-fully-vaccinated-after-one-jab-1.4548886%3fmode=amp

"People aged under 50 years and who are not immunocompromised and who have had a Covid-19 infection in the last six months should receive just one dose of a vaccine, at which point they should be considered fully vaccinated, the Cabinet agreed on Tuesday."

OK we are going around in circles now.... if you were pointing out the above specific age group, with the applicable health status and having already contracted covid, then you are correct. They did say it for those limited circumstances.

Goldengirl

iamwhoiam wrote: »

https://www2.hse.ie/screening-and-vaccinations/covid-19-vaccine/get-the-vaccine/when-you-have-been-vaccinated/

The time you need to wait depends on which vaccine you’ve had.

You can follow the vaccine bonus advice:

7 days after your 2nd Pfizer-BioNTech dose
14 days after your 2nd Moderna dose
14 days after the Janssen vaccine - this is a single dose vaccine
28 days after your 1st AstraZeneca dose - you still need to get your 2nd dose to make sure that your vaccine protection lasts

That was just a vaccine bonus though based on data available at the time . It was not intended to mean that one could be considered fully vaccinated anywhere in the world there were variants of concern
Tbh it did appear from the previous data that AZ antibodies continue rising and that they then level off from 11 weeks , but Pfizer dipped after 9 to 10 weeks , which is why the company had specified the second dose be given sooner , 3 to 4 weeks to ensure full protection.
That was published and someone posted it on the thread here ages ago , wolf3f maybe ?

UK now bringing their 2nd doses back to 8 weeks to get everyone covered asap.

It's a bit of a mess really , and why I was talking about how variants can fvck things up a few weeks ago , unless the population fully vaxxed ... Sorry for jinxing it ;/

In reality here , the numbers are low and if they can prevent them spreading any further outside of the communities that are involved, we should be ok.
I wonder will we see calls to bring AZ second doses back to 6 or 8 weeks now ? It seems only fair but will they have enough with 2nd doses due ?
Or maybe people should get a J& J or mRNA shot to cover?
Meantime I think the vaccine bonus should be rejigged for safety .

Renjit

podgeandrodge wrote: »

It certainly seems for less serious symptomtic illness that Pfizer is better, but for serious it may be more similar. Some have said that after a period further down the road, the 2 vaccines may be more similar in efficacy.

I do wonder whether there are implications for HCW's if they are all working and not as protected against variants.

Efficacy can be compared if same test subjects were present and all other variables were constant.

iamwhoiam

Goldengirl wrote: »

That was just a vaccine bonus though based on data available at the time . It was not intended to mean that one could be considered fully vaccinated anywhere in the world there were variants of concern
Tbh it did appear from the previous data that AZ antibodies continue rising and that they then level off from 11 weeks , but Pfizer dipped after 9 to 10 weeks , which is why the company had specified the second dose be given sooner , 3 to 4 weeks to ensure full protection.
That was published and someone posted it on the thread here ages ago , wolf3f maybe ?

UK now bringing their 2nd doses back to 8 weeks to get everyone covered asap.

It's a bit of a mess really , and why I was talking about how variants can fvck things up a few weeks ago , unless the population fully vaxxed ... Sorry for jinxing it ;/

In reality here , the numbers are low and if they can prevent them spreading any further outside of the communities that are involved, we should be ok.
I wonder will we see calls to bring AZ second doses back to 6 or 8 weeks now ? It seems only fair but will they have enough with 2nd doses due ?
Or maybe people should get a J& J or mRNA shot to cover?
Meantime I think the vaccine bonus should be rejigged for safety .

I was talking about the vaccine bonus all along !! My post said “ considered fully vaccinated “

Thank you for explaining it better

ClosedAccountFuzzy

Are there enough mRNA jabs to get through the 40s?

Goldengirl

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I was talking about the vaccine bonus all along !! My post said “ considered fully vaccinated “

Thank you for explaining it better

I knew what you meant all along! .

iamwhoiam

Goldengirl wrote: »

I knew what you meant all along! .

I am just a bit peed off today because 60-69 year old got no choice at all and were assured it was the very best for us
Don’t get me wrong , I am glad to be vaccinated but a bit miffed to be honest at the 12 week wait

Goldengirl

podgeandrodge wrote: »

It certainly seems for less serious symptomtic illness that Pfizer is better, but for serious it may be more similar. Some have said that after a period further down the road, the 2 vaccines may be more similar in efficacy.

I do wonder whether there are implications for HCW's if they are all working and not as protected against variants.

I do think the fact that the bloods were taken at a particular point is just a snap shot in time and serial bloods weekly , might have shown a better picture , but would have been way more labour intensive.
Also these antibody bloods do not take into account the main powerhouses of any individual's arsenal against infection- T Cell production and immunity .
As regards healthcare workers ,so far infections are practically eliminated in those vaccinated even just with one dose ,and one can only hope that that continues, that is good indicator of protection.

Goldengirl

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I am just a bit peed off today because 60-69 year old got no choice at all and were assured it was the very best for us
Don’t get me wrong , I am glad to be vaccinated but a bit miffed to be honest at the 12 week wait

Yep ,with you on that. Have some friends and relatives in the same boat.
It would be good if they brought the second doses back to 8 weeks as the Brits are doing .
If they have enough supplies.
I am not good on the numbers as some are , so I have no idea if they would have the where with all to do that .
Would make more sense to ensure over 60s , any vulnerable and health care workers are fully protected , but there would be uproar I think if it delayed the rollout further!

funnydoggy

Deeper Blue wrote: »

Would people ever stop posting Eric Feigl Ding tweets FFS

Seriously. Would be a fantastic rule lol

Goldengirl

funnydoggy wrote: »

Seriously. Would be a fantastic rule lol

Not on twitter..what was he saying , or is that only giving him coverage?

Jim_Hodge

Goldengirl wrote: »

Not on twitter..what was he saying , or is that only giving him coverage?

Post #1964.

I wouldn't give him the credit of quoting it.

He's an off the wall doom merchant and I don't get why people insist on posting his rubbish.

Happydays2020

FuzzyThinking wrote: »

Are there enough mRNA jabs to get through the 40s?

Probably enough to age 42.

Goldengirl

Jim_Hodge wrote: »

Post #1964.

I wouldn't give him the credit of quoting it.

He's an off the wall doom merchant and I don't get why people insist on posting his rubbish.

Yes see it now . Thanks , I think?

JTMan

https://twitter.com/WSJ/status/1396545972503777283

Three researchers from China’s Wuhan Institute of Virology became sick enough in November 2019 that they sought hospital care, according to a previously undisclosed U.S. intelligence report that could add weight to growing calls for a fuller probe of whether the Covid-19 virus may have escaped from the laboratory.

The details of the reporting go beyond a State Department fact sheet, issued during the final days of the Trump administration, which said that several researchers at the lab, a center for the study of coronaviruses and other pathogens, became sick in autumn 2019 “with symptoms consistent with both Covid-19 and common seasonal illness.”

Goldengirl

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Probably enough to age 42.

Show me how you worked that out

Happydays2020

Goldengirl wrote: »

Show me how you worked that out

I have no idea. Random question, random answer. Plus I am covered…

Goldengirl

Apologies if already posted ..
Concentrating on 2nd doses only now with AZ .

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-438-new-cases-reported-as-hse-indicates-people-in-40s-will-not-get-astrazeneca-or-janssen-vaccines-1.4572836?localLinksEnabled=false&utm_source=Newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Coronavirus%3A+438+new+cases+reported+as+HSE+indicates+people+in+40s+will+not+get+AstraZeneca+or+Janssen+vaccines&utm_campaign=evening_update_digest&mode=amp