Darina Allen objects to piggery

Alun

Jeremy Sproket wrote: »

Excuse the ignorance. How else are pigs farmed in Ireland?

It's something I never really considered when eating my rashers Do pigs normally roam in the open like cows do here eating grass?

Not much, it does happen but is rare. Much more free range pig production in the UK than here.

gormdubhgorm

meeeeh wrote: »

Do you have any more frustrations or did you list them all in one post?

Anyway free range pork is not only more humane, it tastes better. Probably not something you'd notice. And that's coming from non hairy, country woman with two kids and no cats.

There are always a few that don't fit the stereotypes - exceptions to the rule.

To be honest I don't even notice any difference with free range eggs to be honest. Unless they are literally gathered up fresh from the Hen/Goose.

I don't get the humane thing at all. The animals are going to be slaughtered one way or the other. The word 'human-e' is an oxymoron on many levels they are animals for a start.

Gael23

Gael23 wrote: »

Darins should be promoting vegetarian cooking if she objects to this

Well she opposes intensive farming, so it's entirely consistent.

Either way, that's not how it works. Just because someone doesn't wish to live beside a piggery, doesn't mean they must necessarily dislike the industry itself. I'm not opposed to airports, or electrical pylons, but I wouldn't like to look put the window at one when I'm eating my coco pops.

It's one thing moving into an area where a pig farm is already in existence, but it's natural to want intensive pig farms restrained in their current locations, not creeping out and wafting their nauseating hum across the clean countryside.

The whole industry should be gradually wound-down. There was no shortage of pigs in this country before a very small number of industrial farmers essentially took it over. A process of fragmentation is long overdue.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I don't get the humane thing at all. The animals are going to be slaughtered one way or the other. The word 'human-e' is an oxymoron on many levels they are animals for a start.

when piglets are very small, their teeth are pulled out with calipers, without anaesthetic. Around the same time, their tails are cauterised, without anaesthetic. I havent just seen the latter, I've done it as a teenager, to my terrible shame. They have behavioural problems like you wouldn't believe – the trauma you will see in any mistreated animal, like injuring themselves or other pigs (that's partly why their teeth are pulled).

This happens in factory-sized sheds, divided into miserable inner sheds, where pigs never see daylight. They have no bedding, usually a concrete floor or metal slats. Sores are common, as are various other conditions. There are hundreds, if not thousands of them, so individual veterinary care is not normal.

When they are sent to the slaughterhouse, they are put in a crate and dipped into a "bath" of odorless, tasteless, carbon dioxide, and fall into a coma before they are killed. There is no distress at that bit, it is the only bit of mercy they ever get.

I am not an animal rights activist or anything like that — grew up on a farm, live on a farm, no problem. But pigs on those farms are treated abysmally, it would sicken most people.

hamburgham

Government buildings wrote: »

A piggery is a disgraceful way to farm pigs. They should be totally banned. Absolute cruelty

Absoultely. Have stopped eating pork. I often saw herds of pigs in fields in England but I've never seen it here. Free range pig rearing seems to be almost non existant in Ireland. I don't think food, pork or ham here shoud be dirt cheap. If it was a bit more expensive, it would be valued more and there would be less waste.

Intensive pig farming shoud be banned.

Calahonda52

To those of you bashing the Allen name, look in the mirror, do you see perfection?
No I didn't think so.

Swaine

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

when piglets are very small, their teeth are pulled out with calipers, without anaesthetic. Around the same time, their tails are cauterised, without anaesthetic. I havent just seen the latter, I've done it as a teenager, to my terrible shame. They have behavioural problems like you wouldn't believe – the trauma you will see in any mistreated animal, like injuring themselves or other pigs (that's partly why their teeth are pulled).

This happens in factory-sized sheds, divided into miserable inner sheds, where pigs never see daylight. They have no bedding, usually a concrete floor or metal slats. Sores are common, as are various other conditions. There are hundreds, if not thousands of them, so individual veterinary care is not normal.

When they are sent to the slaughterhouse, they are put in a crate and dipped into a "bath" of odorless, tasteless, carbon dioxide, and fall into a coma before they are killed. There is no distress at that bit, it is the only bit of mercy they ever get.

I am not an animal rights activist or anything like that — grew up on a farm, live on a farm, no problem. But pigs on those farms are treated abysmally, it would sicken most people.

I work on a site attached to one and everything you say is correct. Worst thing I've witnessed is a small pig struggling to walk, he was dying by all accounts and was picked up by the hind legs and his head smashed against a wall to put it out of its misery. Vets actually say that's the thing to do as the animal is suffering.

When being loaded onto lorries they are given the electric prodders treatment to move them.

The only time these animals see the light of day is when they're on their way to their deaths.

I'm no shrinking violet but I refuse to step inside the piggery any longer. It's all very upsetting.

I love bacon but I hate how it's produced.

We are all hypocrites.

Thelonious Monk

Swaine wrote: »

We are all hypocrites.

You don't have to be if you don't support that kind of brutal sickening industry

gormdubhgorm

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

when piglets are very small, their teeth are pulled out with calipers, without anaesthetic. Around the same time, their tails are cauterised, without anaesthetic. I havent just seen the latter, I've done it as a teenager, to my terrible shame. They have behavioural problems like you wouldn't believe – the trauma you will see in any mistreated animal, like injuring themselves or other pigs (that's partly why their teeth are pulled).

This happens in factory-sized sheds, divided into miserable inner sheds, where pigs never see daylight. They have no bedding, usually a concrete floor or metal slats. Sores are common, as are various other conditions. There are hundreds, if not thousands of them, so individual veterinary care is not normal.

When they are sent to the slaughterhouse, they are put in a crate and dipped into a "bath" of odorless, tasteless, carbon dioxide, and fall into a coma before they are killed. There is no distress at that bit, it is the only bit of mercy they ever get.

I am not an animal rights activist or anything like that — grew up on a farm, live on a farm, no problem. But pigs on those farms are treated abysmally, it would sicken most people.

Fair enough. But I would be of the view that people all around the world should be fed the cheapest way possible. So people don't go hungry.
Mass production is the best way to do this.
If animals 'suffer' a bit for the benefit of humans so be it.
Sure they will be on plates anyway when all is said and done

The other side of the coin is people attributing human emotions to an animal as if they are acting human. I think it is called 'anthropomorphism' or something like that.
Which I think is part of the problem these days. The humane line is not really to alleviate animal cruelty it is to alleviate some 'human guilt'. That is just my opinion on it.

mojesius

People looking for free range/higher welfare pork products, I order off this place every Christmas (and they deliver). Top notch food: https://crowefarm.ie/

Government buildings

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Fair enough. But I would be of the view that people all around the world should be fed the cheapest way possible. So people don't go hungry.
Mass production is the best way to do this.
If animals 'suffer' a bit for the benefit of humans so be it.
Sure they will be on plates anyway when all is said and done

The other side of the coin is people attributing human emotions to an animal as if they are acting human. I think it is called 'anthropomorphism' or something like that.
Which I think is part of the problem these days. The humane line is not really to alleviate animal cruelty it is to alleviate some 'human guilt'. That is just my opinion on it.

You are not fully human if you' have no problem with the way pigs are being treated.

Donald Trump

Calahonda52 wrote: »

To those of you bashing the Allen name, look in the mirror, do you see perfection?
No I didn't think so.

Well I might not have managed to shed the few extra covid pounds yet I suppose. And I could do with a haircut.



I am probably a little biased but I wouldn't have considered those on the same scale as the oul' child porn or dealing drugs.

hamburgham

Swaine wrote: »

I work on a site attached to one and everything you say is correct. Worst thing I've witnessed is a small pig struggling to walk, he was dying by all accounts and was picked up by the hind legs and his head smashed against a wall to put it out of its misery. Vets actually say that's the thing to do as the animal is suffering.

When being loaded onto lorries they are given the electric prodders treatment to move them.

The only time these animals see the light of day is when they're on their way to their deaths.

I'm no shrinking violet but I refuse to step inside the piggery any longer. It's all very upsetting.

I love bacon but I hate how it's produced.

We are all hypocrites.

I don't think most people have any idea of the cruel existence the pigs endure. I hope publicity around this planning app and Darina's objection brings it into the wider domain. Can everyone try to publicise this in any way they can. We should all be objecting to this, it's cruel and immmoral.

Donald Trump

hamburgham wrote: »

I don't think most people have any idea of the cruel existence the pigs endure. I hope publicity around this planning app and Darina's objection brings it into the wider domain. Can everyone try to publicise this in any way they can. We should all be objecting to this, it's cruel and immmoral.

Says the poster with two hams in their name!

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

The other side of the coin is people attributing human emotions to an animal as if they are acting human. I think it is called 'anthropomorphism' or something like that.
Which I think is part of the problem these days. The humane line is not really to alleviate animal cruelty it is to alleviate some 'human guilt'. That is just my opinion on it.

anthropomorphism is when you dress your piglet in a bonnet and call it Oliver or Judy.

Not when you hoist it by the tail and cut through itnwith a hot blade, clean through the bone, with no pain relief and think "is this a bit much?"

I would have some sympathy for this approach if it were happening in the developing world, where veterinary care and medicines were unavailable or expensive.

You mention feeding the world. Irish pigmeat mostly goes to the UK and the EU. A smaller fraction goes to China and Japan. We have no intention of feeding the developing world with it.

There are strong environmental reasons for not wanting to live near a pig farm, but there are even better reasons to want those farms gone altogether. This isn't preciousness, or anthropomorphism. It's recognising the need for basic minimum welfare standards, as well as maintaining public health: bad practices in pig farming have come close to costing this country our reputation for clean, safe meat.


I notice as I come back to this post, this thread has a new home. I think I will make for the door, goodluck

Vestiapx

Stovepipe wrote: »

The Allens, unfortunately for their detractors, are clever at what they do and waste nothing and run a tight ship and consequently make money,when many others in the food business have not. You don't have to like any of them but they are successful and in many ways, were ahead of their time.

This may be true but it's not what we think of currently when the name is mentioned.

Burt Renaults

Calahonda52 wrote: »

To those of you bashing the Allen name, look in the mirror, do you see perfection?
No I didn't think so.

I don't see a paedophile, so, you know, that's something anyway.

hamburgham

Donald Trump wrote: »

Says the poster with two hams in their name!

Was originally going to be Hamburg man, the ham was a typo which I left.

Donald Trump

hamburgham wrote: »

Was originally going to be Hamburg man, the ham was a typo which I left.

We will defer to your knowledge and opinion on all things pig-related!

hamburgham

Donald Trump wrote: »

We will defer to your knowledge and opinion on all things pig-related!

Lol. I hadn’t even realised until you pointed it out.

jmayo

Turbohymac wrote: »

Yes ..unfortunately it's a bit more in size than a pig farm..absolutely huge operation with slurry being spread over a large pre agreed area..but nobody living near any of the designated spreading areas were consulted..

Farmers don't need permission to spread slurry on their land so long as it done during the prescribed times by Dept. of Marine and Agriculture which usually depends on the zone in which you live.

And yes it is being neighbourly if they let people know when they are doing it, but they don't need your permission.

Turbohymac wrote: »

Hi della 2005.. I'm living in the countryside all my life..but theres a big difference between cattle slurry compared to pig slurry..also much less cattle slurry being spread compared to this factory operation. With artic 6000gallon old milk tankers being used to transport the slurry..
Also compared to cattle or dairy farms this will be a year round constant event
At least cattle are usually in from November to April only..
So much less per animal needing to be stored and spread

Ehh for someone living in the country you should know that for a number of years the times when farmers can spread slurry is now controlled so they can't do it year round. :rolleyes:
Slurry spreading in winter (the closed period) is banned as part of the nitrates directive.
Also there are rules as to the application of slurry to take into account weather.

KevRossi wrote: »

I would have thought the pigs would be objecting to being within 12 km of Ballymaloe?

There is a joke there, but I am not risking it.

Calahonda52 wrote: »

To those of you bashing the Allen name, look in the mirror, do you see perfection?
No I didn't think so.

Well I might look the worst for ware, but thankfully don't see any peados or drug pushers in my immediate family.
A few eejits alright.

Viscount Aggro

Fern Allen and husband get huge debt write off.
In indo paper today.

Sheep breeder

A Lamb Named Miltiades! wrote: »

when piglets are very small, their teeth are pulled out with calipers, without anaesthetic. Around the same time, their tails are cauterised, without anaesthetic. I havent just seen the latter, I've done it as a teenager, to my terrible shame. They have behavioural problems like you wouldn't believe – the trauma you will see in any mistreated animal, like injuring themselves or other pigs (that's partly why their teeth are pulled).

This happens in factory-sized sheds, divided into miserable inner sheds, where pigs never see daylight. They have no bedding, usually a concrete floor or metal slats. Sores are common, as are various other conditions. There are hundreds, if not thousands of them, so individual veterinary care is not normal.

When they are sent to the slaughterhouse, they are put in a crate and dipped into a "bath" of odorless, tasteless, carbon dioxide, and fall into a coma before they are killed. There is no distress at that bit, it is the only bit of mercy they ever get.

I am not an animal rights activist or anything like that — grew up on a farm, live on a farm, no problem. But pigs on those farms are treated abysmally, it would sicken most people.

Sorry your first points are totally inaccurate, bons teeth sharp edges are clipped off and teeth not pulled out as stated to avoid damaging the mother and cause mastitis and then hunger for the piglets. the end of the tail is clipped the same as your nail with no nerves to stop tail biting and cause stress and fighting.
Pig housing in the last ten year has changed hugely in line with animal welfare standards to make pigs more comfortable and is state of the art and mostly computerised. Also pigs are one the most cleanest animals by their nature.
As for objecting to something 12km away, how many houses and developments could be stopped building by Darina and to benefit her business.

Gael23

Is this carbon dioxide bath like a gas chamber?

magicbastarder

well, it's a chamber filled with a gas which induces unconsciousness/death, so in a literal sense, yes.

Gael23

magicbastarder wrote: »

well, it's a chamber filled with a gas which induces unconsciousness/death, so in a literal sense, yes.

Are they dead before their troath is slit?

BattleCorp

Government buildings wrote: »

How farming associations and the Green Party can allow these things to be built are beyond me. They are a disgrace.

They are allowed to be built because most people want a pack of rashers or sausages to cost a couple of quid rather than a tenner.

beertons

Imagine the bang of pork scratchings all over the place. Class.

Big Ears

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I can't think of anything worse to have near me, disgusting what goes on in those places

Is Ballymaloe really that bad ?

beachhead

A Lamb Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I can't think of many.

There are lots of reasons to raise the eyebrows at the Allens. I'm sure we'd all object to a pig farm near us. The smell is indescribably, gag-inducingly rancid.

Edit: 12km away, so not really close-by. Still a filthy, cruel method of industrial farming, though.

12km away.I cannot smell that far.I need help or a rasher option.Yes,a sandwich will do it.Oh,yes don't mention state holidays for attention seeking