Employers struggling to fill positions with hundreds of thousands unemployed

Eric Cartman

AbusesToilets wrote: »

If your business plan is dependent on exploiting workers by paying a poor wage, then you don't have a viable product. Society is built on suppressing wages and the prices we pay reflect that.

10 euro an hour is not exploitation, lets not pretend we’re on borderline slave wages like china etc..

Somebody working full time minimum wage in dublin can still afford to rent a room in a shared house in a suburb, buy food and pay a monthly bus ticket. When you find people ‘unable to survive’ you often find a desire to live alone / in the city centre, frivolous spending in other regards or just poor budgeting. Its not a glamorous life but 400 euro a week and paying basically nothing in tax. Not ‘opressive’

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

Employers struggling to fill many positions with hundreds of thousands unemployed. E350 a week for many to sit on their ass or work for slightly more, if full time on minimum wage... More genius from FG, who could have foreseen such issues? Any way, take the system for all its worth lads, if you are on PUP, you have at least worked and it wont last forever. There are tens of thousands here, who live off you and I from cradle to grave! luxury apartments, medical card, welfare bonuses, few hundred euro a week cash etc... the more you take, the less that is wasted on wasters! remember that!

there needs to be a proper pay related social insurance scheme introduced, time limited, based on what you paid in and possibly, that you start paying some of it back, when re-employed...

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/you-cant-blame-them-for-taking-other-jobs-hope-of-long-retail-hours-under-threat-as-employers-struggle-to-recruit-staff-40400535.html

I am very happy about it
The first thing my employer will do pay rise for me because nobody want take my job and I getting more choices looking for another job
The less competition searching for jobs the better chances for those who looking
The time of peanuts for work are gone and government will get more taxes from those who are working and pay VAT spending more what will help economy accelerate
And finally if employer can not find anybody might be better ask him for who hi looking for ? For monkey searching for peanuts or for worker looking for wage !?
Or you preffer government stop pay social welfare and you will happy get job for plate of soup !?


And dont forget that paying social welfare government support jobs trough the consuming.Because if nobody will get social welfare nobody will will have money buy food.Not those who sitting and scratching arses and not those who will bake bread.

RandomViewer

Eric Cartman wrote: »

10 euro an hour is not exploitation, lets not pretend we’re on borderline slave wages like china etc..

Somebody working full time minimum wage in dublin can still afford to rent a room in a shared house in a suburb, buy food and pay a monthly bus ticket. When you find people ‘unable to survive’ you often find a desire to live alone / in the city centre, frivolous spending in other regards or just poor budgeting. Its not a glamorous life but 400 euro a week and paying basically nothing in tax. Not ‘opressive’

Wouldn't hitting someone over the head and getting a 3 year stretch be a better life than that?

Shoelaces

Why haven't restaurant staff ever unionised?

Eric Cartman

Shoelaces wrote: »

Why haven't restaurant staff ever unionised?

Because they dont feel like giving money to the grifter unions and getting nothing in return ?

SnuggyBear

6 wrote: »

That's the problem. Some people will get a shock when they have no job when PUP dries up.

And they have to pay the pup tax. Only a lazy idiot would choose to stay on pup.

punisher5112

SnuggyBear wrote: »

And they have to pay the pup tax. Only a lazy idiot would choose to stay on pup.

Or a very smart person, that plans on leaving or going back home....

Might be problem small wages not the PUP ?
Or might be those who on PUP still work for them employers for cash and Revenue must start doing some job ?
There is no problem start to stop vans on mornings as it happened before and check those who inside PPS nrs ! There is no problem to start walk trough the bussy carpentry workshops and check who is inside and why people there on Wage subsidies starting work at 6 on morning and finish at 8 on evening time.
If only restaraunts cant find anybody then is them wages problem not the PUP!

flexcon

SnuggyBear wrote: »

And they have to pay the pup tax. Only a lazy idiot would choose to stay on pup.

What pup tax?

350 a week by 52 weeks is 18200 a year.
20% tax is €3640

3650 Paye credit towards tax.
Means 0 tax if you spent a year on pup.

Obviously each figure is different for each individual but that’s broadly in line

Eric Cartman

Eric Cartman wrote: »

10 euro an hour is not exploitation, lets not pretend we’re on borderline slave wages like china etc..

Somebody working full time minimum wage in dublin can still afford to rent a room in a shared house in a suburb, buy food and pay a monthly bus ticket. When you find people ‘unable to survive’ you often find a desire to live alone / in the city centre, frivolous spending in other regards or just poor budgeting. Its not a glamorous life but 400 euro a week and paying basically nothing in tax. Not ‘opressive’

Plenty of Chinese people do much better than that.

Don’t you live on a passive income?

Eric Cartman

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Plenty of Chinese people do much better than that.

Don’t you live on a passive income?

Plenty do, but people on here act like 3/4 of irish jobs are for the oppressive amount of 10 euro an hour when in reality a tiny percentage of people here are on minimum wage, a much greater percentage of Chinese manufacturing and farming jobs would be for sub 10 euro a day.

I run a business in which there is a small passive element but theres a lot of hours at the coalface to be put in.

ypres5

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Plenty do, but people on here act like 3/4 of irish jobs are for the oppressive amount of 10 euro an hour when in reality a tiny percentage of people here are on minimum wage, a much greater percentage of Chinese manufacturing and farming jobs would be for sub 10 euro a day.

I run a business in which there is a small passive element but theres a lot of hours at the coalface to be put in.

I'm starting to see why you're so dead set against the pup. Not enough minimum wage slaves to hop into the organ grinder for you these days?

SnuggyBear

flexcon wrote: »

What pup tax?

350 a week by 52 weeks is 18200 a year.
20% tax is €3640

3650 Paye credit towards tax.
Means 0 tax if you spent a year on pup.

Obviously each figure is different for each individual but that’s broadly in line

I owe 1800

I don't know how people still don't know this

enricoh

ypres5 wrote: »

I'm starting to see why you're so dead set against the pup. Not enough minimum wage slaves to hop into the organ grinder for you these days?

Minimum wage slaves! let me guess - you never employed anyone and never will!
go take over a hotel and give all the staff the pay you reckon they deserve. Report back if you survive for a year!

ypres5

ypres5 wrote: »

I'm starting to see why you're so dead set against the pup. Not enough minimum wage slaves to hop into the organ grinder for you these days?

Minimum wage jobs suit some people. I retired last December and the job I had for the previous 5 years was minimum wage. It was one of the most enjoyable jobs I’ve had in my 50 years as a worker. I was at a stage where I didn’t have a mortgage or any other loans and my children were finished college and earning their own livings.
I never felt like a slave. I worked alongside some lovely people, many of them students. It suited them because it was a means to an end and the common comment from them was that it gave them a break from studies.
We were all happy in our employment. We were not abused in any way. We all knew the wage rates before we started.

Dempo1

SnuggyBear wrote: »

I owe 1800

I don't know how people still don't know about this tax.

That's a fair amount even allowing for full €350 weekly rate, have you looked into this, have you a single or Married TFA, have you checked your statement of arrears etc, whatever amount owed can be discharged over 4 years by way of your TFA being reduced etc.

bog master

flexcon wrote: »

What pup tax?

350 a week by 52 weeks is 18200 a year.
20% tax is €3640

3650 Paye credit towards tax.
Means 0 tax if you spent a year on pup.

Obviously each figure is different for each individual but that’s broadly in line

That include PAYE credit. If one is self-employed he receives only half of that plus a small self employed credit.

Dempo1

There's a feature on Pat Kenny Radio show coming up shortly

flexcon

bog master wrote: »

That include PAYE credit. If one is self-employed he receives only half of that plus a small self employed credit.

But even that, that's 1650 a year, or €31 a week tax. It's still not big tax bill

mohawk

enricoh wrote: »

Minimum wage slaves! let me guess - you never employed anyone and never will!
go take over a hotel and give all the staff the pay you reckon they deserve. Report back if you survive for a year!

I know people like this in real life. They go on about raising minimum wage, but complain about the price of everything. Pubs are too dear, restaurants and hotels are a rip off. Wages are one of the biggest costs to a business. Hospitality gets a mixture of staff from young to those who went back to work after raising their families. The young staff are gaining skills they can apply to other jobs in the future. The extra staff hotels etc take on in the summer are typically students earning enough to help them through college.
Also I do believe the majority of those on minimum wage are younger workers. I know personally I was on sh1te money the first couple jobs after I finished college. With experience and sometimes changing jobs came more money. This is the case for many people starting off their working life’s.
I do draw the line though with the employers that treat staff badly and expect unpaid work. This happens in all industries but I think more often in lower paid roles. I admire anyone who walks out of those jobs. You treat you staff with respect.

seamus

Dempo1 wrote: »

There's a feature on Pat Kenny Radio show coming up shortly

I predict a lot of weatherspoons-esque moments where employers reveal themselves to miserly asshats who call people lazy for not wanting a horrible job that pays the absolute minimum possible.

Purpletoes

BuboBubo wrote: »

And abolishment of zero hours contracts.

This has already been made illegal in most cases…also the reason why the banded hours statements were introduced.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/contracts_of_employment/contracts_without_specific_working_hours_zero_hours_contracts.html#

flexcon

mohawk wrote: »

I know people like this in real life. They go on about raising minimum wage, but complain about the price of everything. Pubs are too dear, restaurants and hotels are a rip off. Wages are one of the biggest costs to a business. Hospitality gets a mixture of staff from young to those who went back to work after raising their families. The young staff are gaining skills they can apply to other jobs in the future. The extra staff hotels etc take on in the summer are typically students earning enough to help them through college.
Also I do believe the majority of those on minimum wage are younger workers. I know personally I was on sh1te money the first couple jobs after I finished college. With experience and sometimes changing jobs came more money. This is the case for many people starting off their working life’s.
I do draw the line though with the employers that treat staff badly and expect unpaid work. This happens in all industries but I think more often in lower paid roles. I admire anyone who walks out of those jobs. You treat you staff with respect.

here is a thought.

A pub sells 20 pints an hour on a Sunday evening at 5euro a pint.
It has 2 staff members on at 10euro an hour. That's 20 euro an hour.
Increase their wage to 14 an hour and that's an extra 8 euro an hour to the pub in costs.
To recoup the cost that is an extra 40c per pint.

40c on a pint to give a socialist living wage is not the worst result in the world.

I personally don't have a fixed position on this, and of course this is an arbitrary simplistic example but I do like to test the waters.

Dempo1

Purpletoes wrote: »

This has already been made illegal

In theory, certainly not in practice

zom

seamus wrote: »

I predict a lot of weatherspoons-esque moments where employers reveal themselves to miserly asshats who call people lazy for not wanting a horrible job that pays the absolute minimum possible.

If world get Covid sorted and workforce migration comes back to pre-Covid level this position will be quickly filled by people from Asia of South America

Eric Cartman

flexcon wrote: »

here is a thought.

A pub sells 20 pints an hour on a Sunday evening at 5euro a pint.
It has 2 staff members on at 10euro an hour. That's 20 euro an hour.
Increase their wage to 14 an hour and that's an extra 8 euro an hour to the pub in costs.
To recoup the cost that is an extra 40c per pint.

40c on a pint to give a socialist living wage is not the worst result in the world.

I personally don't have a fixed position on this, and of course this is an arbitrary simplistic example but I do like to test the waters.

And what happens for the 4 hours on a monday where those staff are also paid 14 an hour and theyve only served a coffee, the hour at the end of the shift where those 2 are cleaning up that nothing is sold, the first hour every day where nothing is sold, the 3 other days of the week where atleast 2 hours of the day those staff are just looking at aul lads sipping a pint for that time.

Youd probably have to put up the price of a pint by 1.50- 2.00 to make that 14 work out and would half your customers swap pub to save 2 quid a pint - absolutely.

ypres5

enricoh wrote: »

Minimum wage slaves! let me guess - you never employed anyone and never will!
go take over a hotel and give all the staff the pay you reckon they deserve. Report back if you survive for a year!

Clearly the hotel industry doesn't pay enough considering they're currently clamouring for people to come work for them for **** pay.

is_that_so

ypres5 wrote: »

Clearly the hotel industry doesn't pay enough considering they're currently clamouring for people to come work for them for **** pay.

There was nothing wrong with the pay for all of those working in February 2020.

Eric Cartman

ypres5 wrote: »

Clearly the hotel industry doesn't pay enough considering they're currently clamouring for people to come work for them for **** pay.

When you go on holiday what is the average room rate a night you would pay ?

There are hotels that pay well above minimum wage, usually because a lot of staff are paid to be infinitely more professional. These hotels are all usually 5 star and would command 200 + per person sharing per night.

If you're the type of person that thinks thats fair value for a hotel room then you can go and make that choice, but its a bit hypocritical of most to demand hotel staff be paid more and then go stay in a travel lodge or 3 star generic hotel where most staff would be on minimum wage to deliver the low prices consumers now expect.

Eric Cartman

is_that_so wrote: »

There was nothing wrong with the pay for all of those working in February 2020.

this is it, but now that it competes with free money to do nothing suddenly its a travesty to have to work.