Murder at the Cottage | Sky

EdHoven

I was watching some of the French doco on YouTube and two things. They say there was a lot of Sophie's blood on the ground near the back door, that the violent attack had begun up there.

Then they say she was hit on the head with a round object and show what looks like a bottle lying in the cut back scrub.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720198#Comment_117720198

So assuming this new lead is pointing to Bailey, (the French welcoming it seems to imply that), who would Bailey have enough influence and intimidation over to get them to do this and keep quiet about it?

Unless it's some heretofore unheard of character I think it must be Jules they are talking about?

MoonUnit75

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720249#Comment_117720249

It does sound like that. I think there’s a general understanding that a married partner can’t be forced to testify against their spouse under most circumstances but I wonder does this apply to civil partners? You would wonder though if a person was in fear for themselves or their children would they still be considered an accomplice rather than another victim?

There’s one person that comes to mind who lives in Europe who has an interest in the case.

Kelvinyook

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720211#Comment_117720211

I noticed your first point too, confusing as I thought the new doc showed the inside of the front door with her keys still inside from unlocking it. But that once outside then attacked, she tried to escape to the rear, but then ended up running down the grass slope at the front?

MoonUnit75

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117719596#Comment_117719596

That depends on how many times they have already been arrested for the same crime too. You only get three goes.

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720172#Comment_117720172

What a load of absolute bull.

EdHoven

I can't get English subtitles up on that French documentary.

Alfie Lyons says he looked around the house with Sophie when she bought it advised her about repairs and told her names of local workmen.

But she bought in 1993 and according to the Land Registry he bought his house 31 March 1995.

And he seems to say he got a "good guard dog" a few weeks before. What did he need a guard dog for up that boreen?

bossdrum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720172#Comment_117720172

What a load of nonsense.

I live about 10 miles from Sophies House. There are always people from other areas visiting the area, especially around Xmas, Easter etc.

The area is a very long peninsula, people in the schull area would not take any notice of a car they didn't recognise as it could have from 15 miles further out the peninsula. Also there are others roads leading from the murder scene away that don't go near Schull without even using back roads.

I've heard theories from fellow locals about who did it and Bailey doesn't feature in plenty.

Bantry is only 16 miles away and has a large Garda station. The reason they show Bandon is because its the regional headquarters.

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720249#Comment_117720249

I didnt get that from it all. I think the French at this stage would welcome any new developments in the case whether they implicate Bailey or not. They want justice for their citizen/mother/daughter/sister more than anything else.

It being Jules Thomas, I dont agree, she was very supportive of Bailey in the decent documentaries, not the propaganda netflix piece. And believes him to be innocent 100%. Only reason why she left him was to see her daughters and grandchildren more. She has made this clear, she loves Bailey but loves her children more.

CowgirlBoots

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720324#Comment_117720324

Care to elaborate? It's good to get all sides of a story.

happyoutscan

In no way should anything that MF says be used in this case, irregardless of what 'side' you are on.

Absolutely zero credibility.

A spoofer of the highest order.

The new statement was given by an elderly local man who knew Sophie and had previously given statements to the Gaurds about the case.

Maybe the chap who owned the coffee shop and spoke French to her?

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720387#Comment_117720387

Its a nonsense piece from some individual making up as they go along without bringing anything new to the table. Full of hearsay and gossip. Sounds like a bit of a young attention seeking dope too with a chip on their shoulder. The fact that you think its interesting says a lot about your understanding of the murder.

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720456#Comment_117720456

Well, if it is, after engaging in the three documentaries about the murder and making out he didnt know anything. He should be charged with perverting the course of justice and will hopefully looking at a lengthy prison stint.

MoonUnit75

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720382#Comment_117720382

After Jules was arrested and retracted IB’s alibi during questioning, she apparently seems to have believed he did it. When they were both released IB did not return to her house, he had to find a ‘safe house’ near Skibbereen and it was while he was away from Jules that he met Martin Graham. One of the accounts, not sure which book, says the gardai said to Ian before he was released that Jules had reluctantly accepted he was probably responsible for the murder and he was not welcome back to her house. She says in the West Cork podcast she did have ‘a moment of doubt’ but that it didn’t last long.

2001 was the year he beat her with the crutches and kicked her in the head with the plaster cast on his foot. He was prosecuted for this and tried to escape to England but was arrested at the airport and sent for trial. He was barred from the area around Jule’s house for three months and got just a suspended sentence.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720387#Comment_117720387

The locals 'know' who did it despite none of them seeing it happen for starters... unless you count the fantasist Marie Farrell.

This isn't repeated low level crime that could be expected to be observed by locals.

They have no idea who was in the area that night, no idea who has visited previously and may have returned. Lots of holiday homes for example.

Houses are broken into in remote areas all the time. Non locals somehow find them.

Do they know who was breaking into holiday homes to steal alcohol etc? Do they know who was using Sophie's house when she wasn't there? Do they know all the people who ever visited Sophie's hosue or indeed Alfie's?

Do they know who was in the car with Marie Farrell, or indeed if Marie Farrell was out at 3am that night?

ShamNNspace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720172#Comment_117720172

Ah now bit of a rant that brings nothing to the discussion... The kind of person that wants to throw dog s*** at someone because they are certain on account of hearsay that that person committed a murder when they were a child, and then she claims to have had girls in her class who were born in the magdalene laundries cmon like, shes mid to late twenties

CowgirlBoots

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720468#Comment_117720468

Thanks for that. FYI: My understanding amounts to having watched the 2 latest docs plus more shorter ones on Youtube, listened to the West Cork podcast, read 4 books, read the DPP report, read numerous press articles from 1996 forward, + more. So yeah, there's that.

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720480#Comment_117720480

Yah only believed momentarily that he might have done it because she had a bunch of bogger gards around her continously saying he did it, he did it!! She wasnt long in supporting Bailey again though. Also, for an elderly woman being arrested for the first time for a crime as serious as this, do you not expect the gards to hold a certain amount of intimidation over her. On top of this, none of the interrogations were recorded, only written down by the gards and can we really expect them to give an honest picture of events considering their blatant corruption and bias in this case.

He had to find a safe house because the gards leaked everything to the press. It would have been impossible for him to stay where he was.

Yah, is this is the same Martin Graham, ex con on multiple accounts who was subsequently bribed by the gards on numerous occasions with money & drugs that they actually stole from the evidence room. Wtf!!!

Because he was involved in a domestic assault matter with his partner, it has nothing to do with this murder investigation. Try and make it relatable all you want but its not. You can try and argue that it shows a pattern of behavior of violence against women but its not consistent with someone who would rock up to an isolated house in the middle of the night and beat someone they didnt even know to death. Its not relevant.

champchamp

The article says the elderly person is a local who Sophie knew well. That narrows it down.

My guess is that it's the publican and Jules told him this info in confidence around the time that IB beat her in 2001.

Are any of her daughters in Europe?

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720589#Comment_117720589

Just because you've looked at a lot and that's debatable considering what you've already posted on this thread, doesnt make you some sort of expert on this case. Its clear you have an obvious bias considering you have posted a ridiculous piece of gossip from someone is must likely full of nonsense. The fact you find it interesting says a lot.

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720639#Comment_117720639

First off, its in the independent. They are about as credible as the sun or mirror these days. I would find it extremely bizzare that this old fella would give multiple interviews to the sky doc, netflix & then west cork podcast while withholding vital information in relation to this crime. I guess stranger things have happened but still extremely odd.

solasGael

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117715779#Comment_117715779

Sophie's boots were lace up, hiking style boots that can't be slipped on. She had a number of slip-on type Wellies by the back door to choose from.

solasGael

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117717928#Comment_117717928

The first thing I thought was the person in question is Jules as she's already publicly admitted to cleaning Ian's bloodied shorts, supposedly from the turkeys.

solasGael

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117717931#Comment_117717931

Do we know that forensics were carried out on the car.

Kelvinyook

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720509#Comment_117720509

Do they know who was using Sophie's house when she wasn't there?

I saw a random comment somewhere claiming to name the person, saying the guards gave him a really hard time for doing it.

The housekeeper says it was through a porch window but that it seemed to have stopped after changing the locks.

(edited extra bit cos not sure if she means walked into the house or into the grounds? So to just quote

"Ms Hellen told detectives: "I knew Sophie in all probability was up on the Sunday night because, number one, Sophie never went upstairs with her boots on. To me her boots would never have been tied in bed and her dressing gown was on, as far as I know. I think Sophie was sitting where the wine glass was by the open fire, as she loved the open fire, when someone could have walked in, so she came out. Maybe she thought it was me but we had an agreement for Monday morning."

CowgirlBoots

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720700#Comment_117720700

Yes, you're right. But the Wellies were not at the bottom of the stairs. So this make me think she possibly hadn't gone upstairs yet and was already wearing the boots. And for that matter, what is so unbelievable about a person slipping their foot into those kind of boots and tying them. It doesn't take that long.

Andrea B.

Is MF "sighting" the only reason that puts her time of death as being during the night and not the morning?

champchamp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720835#Comment_117720835

Presumably so.

Surely to God one of the Guards or people who found her would have touched her skin with the back of their fingers to see if she was warm or not?

CowgirlBoots

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117720835#Comment_117720835

Plus the farmers who heard some type of wailing between 2-3am.