Murder at the Cottage | Sky

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117989228#Comment_117989228

The likes of Fitzgerald and others mentioned in the DPP report will never give up any information but the lower ranking Gaurds, the ones on duty over Christmas that year and who observed and wondered about the case, might have something to say. Not all Gaurds were corrupt although I would say almost all would follow the instutionalised rule of never grass up one of your own.

However one thing I do know about Gaurds, they spend a lot of time sitting in the car or at the station and they like to talk and they like to gossip so you can be certain that any Gaurd working within a large radius of that murder has heard every detail and every whispered rumour about that case.

jimwallace197

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117989655#Comment_117989655

Yah I definitely agree about the not grassing up one of their own angle, we only have to look at the ones who did that previously and what happened to them.

And no doubt about it, more than a few in the locality know more than they are letting on. The very same type of people who would proclaim to be upstanding citizens & going to mass every week. I grew up in a similar area to this so I know full well. Country is full of these types unfortunately. Happy to let an innocent man be painted as the murderer for 25 years, may they rot in hell.

flanna01

I have to agree.. There are people in the local community who know, or at the very least suspect a family member, neighbour or friend.

They don't have to see a bloodied bloke stumbling into his home on the morning of the murder, nor do they have to see a bloodied garment crumpled up in a bag.

This was the most brutal of murders, this was violence on steroids.

Whoever committed this barbaric act, it left a mark on them.

There is no way they carried on as normal afterwards, no way they functioned in society without being indifferent. The sleep deprivation on its own would make the individual stand out.

Somebody knew..

A Mother knows when her Son is acting differently, she won't be fooled by a facade.. But would she turn him in, bring shame on her family whilst sentencing her lad to life imprisonment? Think the knicker sniffer here....?

Would a Wife turn in her Husband? She would see the change in him straight away, where was he on the night of the murder? Wouldn't take long to join the dots up...

Your work buddy suddenly becomes withdrawn, your best pal has suddenly hit the bottle, the bloke over the road just got a job in England, didn't know he was looking for work over there.. Gerry rang in sick, be out for months with the back apparently.. Looked grand yesterday??

Somebody knows.

Somebody's personality changed that week. One or, more likely several people noticed it. The following days, weeks and months would have seeded suspicions in the people nearest to the killer - Some, if not all, will have made the connection.

Bailey being hunted / set up, was a God send to them.

Of course the Gards know more than they are letting on.. If Bailey really was the killer 100% - Why go to the extreme measures that they did to set him up?

Did the Gards need a patsy straight away to prevent a deeper investigation taking place?

Bailey was their man, no other suspect need be followed up on.. Why not?

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117989948#Comment_117989948

Im sure Bailey was a pain in the arse to the guards poking his nose in as a journalist - god knows what he could have uncovered. That along with having to pin the murder on somebody given that Sophie was well connected in France. Pinning it on Bailey was the perfect way to get him off their back.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117989948#Comment_117989948

There's tons of people that know, you only have to look at IBs friend list on FB to see half of them are from bantry. People there support him for the sole reason that they know who actually did it. It's an open secret there and it's a crime in itself that 25 years have passed and no one is speaking out still.

There's definitely people that know enough to help. The Gard confessed on his deathbed ffs.

If people don't do the right thing this will drag on till France have their way and honestly, I don't know how they can live with themselves

thecretinhop

if anything in a court is entered into evidence that does not have "clean hands" it can and will be inadmisable.

this would normally lead to no trial going forward or mistrial.

the DPP if they put the case forward would have the damage from mistrial to enjoy..

second i think the guards misconduct ensures everything needs to be rechecked.

i would not trust anything they said at this stage..

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117989948#Comment_117989948

The situation you're describing is sadly well known to me, but from different countries. The core of the matter is interestingly very much the same.

It's also the reason, why I would never ever buy a property in that area and what I meant with "overpriced houses" irrespective of what one can afford. One doesn't only buy the house, one buys the neighbours, the people the society and the police around it with it.

Sophie was naïve about that as well, even though her intentions were honest about wanting to get away from the big city and liking the Irish countryside and taking hikes in the wilderness. Yes it's beautiful out there on that peninsula, but the rest sadly doesn't fit.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990131#Comment_117990131

I know nothing of a deathbed confession of a Guard. If this particular Guard from Bantry was the murderer, it was either something sexual and Sophie resisting his advances or something drug related as in Sophie seen something she shouldn't have and a couple of corrupt Guards were in it, - that's my speculation.

mamboozle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117989948#Comment_117989948

I think you can't discount the obvious simple explanation of what COULD have happened(capital letters in case anyone thinks I'm saying I've got it).

Alfie and Shirley are driving out, open the gate and for whatever reason go and look at the pump, causing Sophie, already freaked out with repairs in her house to come raging down the field poker in hand. It's grabbed out of her hand and with one smack of it is seriously hurt. The rest is easy to work out. Burn the clothes and call the Guards. Keep your mouth shut and it's near impossible to prove.

The Guards then are seriously under pressure to find a maniac. Happened in Birmingham and Guildford.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990170#Comment_117990170

Sadly I do think your right. West Cork seems to attract a large number of strange people - lots of sinister goings on there.

Polly701

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990131#Comment_117990131

Did he really confess though? This sounds like a rumour. Is there any sort of documentary evidence to support this?

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990193#Comment_117990193

I know about that one in Guildford and also seen the film "In the Name of the Father".

Regardless of Alfie's health and Shirley being just nice, the one thing that simply doesn't add up here, is they didn't hear anything that night. Sure it's possible that Sophie was hit in the head unexpectedly from behind, went down, was unconscious, an later on was hit with that cavity block. Sure there could have been wind that night, or Alfie and Shirley sleeping with earplugs, foxes screaming, or other animals, etc... Despite Alfie's age or health, I'd say, he could theoretically have done it, same as Shirley or both of them. Both of them or one of them could also have cleaned up the house, or any other evidence outside in the morning. With the Richardsons absent, they could also be certain, they were completely alone in the neighbourhood. is there evidence? Clearly not, not a shred, nothing, same as there is nothing on Bailey or the Guard from Bantry.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990197#Comment_117990197

An ex British soldier, even with an honorable discharge, not being able to integrate into civilian life, guards offering "rewards" in form of drugs, a divorced British journalist beating up his partner, a whiteness who lies and walks out of the courtroom... back in the 80ies I recall hippie colonies in the area as well. The behaviour of the Guards in this case sadly stinks to high heaven.

If I would have been Sophie, I wouldn't have gone further west than Skibereen to buy a house, places like Clonakilty or as a top choice Kinsale would have been real value for whatever money she or her husband would have spent, and if one loves the peninsula one could have driven out there as well.....

Also estate agents are very much aware that they can achieve higher prices if they sell to a foreigner who is looking for something very specific in countryside, scenery, etc... and pay prices the locals wouldn't pay, even if they had the money.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990225#Comment_117990225

Yes he did, to his nurse. Documented? No, or we wouldn't be here 25 years bloody later. She's deceased too but her family certainly know and have told people.

Polly701

Wouldn't the family (of the Nurse) go to the Guards with this information? Surely they would want Baileys name cleared? Even Guards in Cork City if they don't trust ones in local areas.. It just seems too... convenient.

mamboozle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990254#Comment_117990254

The British 'establishment' were forced to intervene in Guildford especially. I don't see any of our own hobnobs coming clean about this and giving Ian Bailey a break. It's shameful. The fact that they won't allow extradition is an admission they are aware of his innocence. They have to step in before the poor fuc*er dies and hand him a few quid for 'Irish ways'.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990131#Comment_117990131

Well I suppose it's helpful to ask why aren't they speaking out? A few examples might be - I'm not saying anything because :

1) Bailey is only a Bollocks anyway so let him suffer

2) I'll be hung out to dry, the Gaurds are still powerful here.

3) My family will suffer, the media attention will cause problems and the Gaurds are still powerful here.

4) The community will close ranks, call me a liar and I'll have done it all for nothing.

The more I think of it the more it becomes apparent that if someone like Jim Sheridan can't get a local to talk, (that's presuming he didn't get information. He did say he couldn't report everything on Sky because of legal issues), then no one can.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990316#Comment_117990316

All four, for sure.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117988277#Comment_117988277

Good point, I don't know .

Thinking about it, it was more likely the previous owners of Alfie's house.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990301#Comment_117990301

And get blamed for “causing trouble”, “speaking ill of the dead”, “airing dirty laundry” and all the other shite that gets spewed in these parts?

I remember a paragraph in the DPP report where it said when Bailey and Jules would leave a pub, the patrons and bar staff would give a round of applause because they were gone.

Imagine the actual killer, or someone who knew who the killer was, sitting there and clapping along.

Why would anyone poke the wasps nest when everyone was happy to believe Bailey did it?

saabsaab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990282#Comment_117990282

Not dismissing what you have said but what legal standing would something said by a now dead person to another now dead person who relayed this to others have? Not much I'd say unless some aspect of the confession could be corroborated somehow.

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990316#Comment_117990316

They could speak out here, it's anonymous. Also the theories are already known, it's more about somebody confirming it.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117987008#Comment_117987008

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117988141#Comment_117988141

The black rectangle is part of Alfie's property,

the triangle under review is immediately to the right of this space and is not part of any of the 3 properties as far as I can see.

The yellow square is Sophie's space and is not under review.

The red triangle is part of the 3rd property where Sophie parked her car.

Ok, it looks like she could have driven down by the back of the house and parked at the western gable -the yellow square,

but that doesn't look like a hardstanding and would be a tight squeeze to either turn around or reverse out of.

Alfie's property has changed hands so all the property in that folio is under review.

Wombatman

The killer may have hidden the bloody clothes in an obvious place, did a bad job of cleaning their car and may have been behaving odd after the murder.

All irrelevant if they aren't investigated because of the inappropriate and unprofessional fixation with Bailey.

The odd behavior could easily have been masked by a standard Christmas booze bender.

People really are overestimating the capacity of forensics at the time. It was most likely an outdoor murder in the middle of winter. The limited and inexperienced forensics teams didn't get there until days after the murder. Bog hopping guards, rubberneckers and the wind and rain would have destroyed the scene by then. The killer may have left a slew of evidence that would have been detectable by today standards, but not back then.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117987978#Comment_117987978

I don't know what evidence was found of, for instance the doctor, the priest, Alfie and Shirley or anyone else who may have had reason to be at the crime scene.

flanna01

People really are overestimating the capacity of forensics at the time. 

I agree with the above statement. Can't mask mental anguish though.. Not from everybody. You're nearest and dearest would cop it.

crackcrack30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990531#Comment_117990531

Wrong , this couldn't be any clearer on landdirect ....the black square which should be a triangle has an application pending on it..

Polly701

There are cases though such as Graham Dywer where a terrible act was committed and the person has gone on with 'normal life'.

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990282#Comment_117990282

It would only be second hand hearsay at this stage. Dúirt bean liom go ndúirt bean léi....

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990681#Comment_117990681

You could be right, but it's far from clear.

The black square is to point out the parking/turning space on the ground.

It looked like it did not align with the triangle on the map.

triangle.jpg

I wonder if Sophie was in the process of buying this space from Alfie?

mamboozle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117990548#Comment_117990548

?? there had been an investigation into the 1974 Dublin bombing where forensics budgets to the Gardai were brought up to requirements. In 1992 there was a massive bomb that tried to take out what was the state of the art forensics laboratory up North, who were happy enough to help out law enforcement down south. Let's not be stupid about this.