Israeli - Palestinian Conflict *Threadbans in OP*

I see sheep

Israel are being incredibly short sighted, and I mean this seriously.
The US isn't going to be top dog forever, it could slide now fairly rapidly, or even slowy.
In 100 years time we all know China will probably run the world, is Israel doing deals with China now?
Because if the US isn't backing up Israel it's all over for them, and really they should be trying for a 2 state solution that's accepted by everyone, so that when the US isn't top dog Israel will still be respected as a country.
The politicians in Israel (and there's only one in control at the moment) are sadly like everywhere else, they are thinking short term for their own glory.
Israel's history is thousands of years old and it is really being jepordised now by this madness since WW2.

Montage of Feck

Samsonsmasher wrote: »

The Irish left in its current form became a political orphan after the collapse of their beloved Soviet Union. They remained anti American and anti Israel and the Russians who pulled the strings back in the days of the KGB kept in contact.
The Irish Left never protests against China or Russia or regimes and despots that are pro Russian or Chinese allies such as Iran or North Korea or Burma.
The only reason that the Irish Left cares about Israel is because they hate America.
For the same reason they are apologists for Islamic terrorists and why they opposed the overthrow of Saddam Hussein.

Overthrowing Saddam was a disaster, almost twenty years of savagery because a US president had daddy issues.

Mimon

tom1ie wrote: »

Hamas are currently firing the rockets and using human shields.
Get rid of Hamas and there's a chance Israel will have to give some sort of change towards free movement.

Israel don't want any solution as they are slowly gaining more land and the conflict keeps Netanyahu in power. Hamas is a convenient bogeyman for the likes of him.

votecounts

https://twitter.com/sineadmercier/status/1393606780916310022

I presume some will call her a anti semite for telling her friends story, not everyone hates Israel or its people, some just cannot condone actions like these.

UDAWINNER

I really don't understand how people can defend a terrorist state like Israel who takes joy in murdering children, families, etc. All so that benji could go in to govt, hope he rots in hell.
I honestly thought there would be a change when Biden got in, big mistake same old rhetoric of licking to the war mongers and the usual suspects defending them

UDAWINNER

https://twitter.com/PalBint/status/1393749297208995840


To think some will call the young girl a legitimate target, anyone defending this massacre really needs to have a look in the mirror.

Das Reich

UDAWINNER wrote: »

https://twitter.com/PalBint/status/1393749297208995840


To think some will call the young girl a legitimate target, anyone defending this massacre really needs to have a look in the mirror.

Joe Bidet a devout Catholic is really the funniest thing I ever read on this topic.

Arturo Delgado

No rocket launches since that barrage last evening. The continued bombardment by Israel is bound to be taking effect now. My guess is that Israel will continue the unrelenting strikes for another day or two and then we will see a ceasefire. The cycle will then start again for another round of this in a few years time. The fact that Hezbollah do not get involved is self preservation. They are waiting for Israel to attack Irans nuclear threat. That may or may not happen soon. So the status quo continues. The US support financially and otherwise for Israels bloated military will ensure this. No negotiations can take place with genuine intent because Israel knows it can continue to strike at any threat at will. It's quite depressing really. There are no genuine peacemakers on either side. Meshal the ex Hamas leader has said in the past he would never recognize an Israeli state, but that an Israeli state, an entity, is something they would have to deal with, to accept the reality.. If something could be constructed around that from their leaders and a drawing back militarily by Israel and a possible recognition of a future Palestine state, withdrawal of the 1967 lines of occupation etc etc,maybe it can happen. But not for decades I'd say.

Danzy

tom1ie wrote: »

Hamas are currently firing the rockets and using human shields.
Get rid of Hamas and there's a chance Israel will have to give some sort of change towards free movement.

The day the give free movement or right of return is the Day Israel dies, that they die.

Regardless of who is in charge the Israelis do not want a settlement. They are coming from a position if strength, a 2 State solution is now impossible given the Jewish settlements built, the control of infrastructure etc.

Long term the Israeli goal remains the expulsion of Arabs from Gaza and the West Bank.

Given the reality of the situation, that is probably the only long term solution to peace there. Not that that makes it just.

StevenToast

The attrocity carried out by the british army in ballymurphy caused incredible hurt, anger and resentment for 50 years and counting.... Rightfully so.

I dont know how the Palestinian people will ever forgive the crimes that are being committed against their people.

It will take decades or maybe even centuries but history will judge Israel and their enablers the U.S.A as the true terrorists of this story.

Joe Biden is a disgrace. Watch the Irish government fall over themselves when he gets here and the embarrassing Mayo paddywhackery that follows. Sickening.

jackboy

Das Reich wrote: »

Joe Bidet a devout Catholic is really the funniest thing I ever read on this topic.

Biden is just Trump without Twitter and rallies. No significant difference in foreign policy.

Danzy

jackboy wrote: »

Biden is just Trump without Twitter and rallies. No significant difference in foreign policy.

It's no coincidence that this has all kicked off under Biden.

He is a foreign interventionist, a strong believer in America out in the global field militarily.

Trump, for all his faults,was the least militarily adventurous President in decades.

Israel waited.

namloc1980

Deleted User wrote: »

What are the solutions that could end the conflict in the long term? Otherwise there'll be another thread in x years with pages more of similar circular arguments.

I'd love to see potential solutions, a 1 state solution? 2 state? Reparations for land taken?

At least if there were good solutions proposed you could get onto politicians to forward them, however much use that would be.....beats doing nothing and circular arguments. Be better to debate that

A 1 state solution is not going to happen. Israel has a law that says only Jews have the right to national self determination in Israel. Israel does not believe non-Jews have the same rights as Jews. Also the demographics as they stand in a 1 state solution works out at a 50/50 population split, Israel would never agree to the possibility that Jews could become a minority in a single state. A single state would also require a massive mindset change among both populations, not going to happen for a long time - could take generations, if ever.

The idea of a 2 state solution is dying with every passing year as Israel builds more and more settlements in the West Bank, removing Palestinians from their homes in the West Bank and East Jerusalem and remains an occupying military force making the lives of Palestinians a misery.

It's hard to see any path to a resolution. This conflict is about as intractable as it gets.

StevenToast

Some great propaganda for Israel from RTE...

Disgusting headline when innocent people and children are being bombed with such indiscrimination.....

branie2

Terrible that it's happening

Montage of Feck

StevenToast wrote: »

Some great propaganda for Israel from RTE...

Disgusting headline when innocent people and children are being bombed with such indiscrimination.....

Stating facts is propaganda now?

Odhinn

tom1ie wrote: »

Hamas are currently firing the rockets and using human shields.
Get rid of Hamas and there's a chance Israel will have to give some sort of change towards free movement.

Hamas only existed from the early 1980's, yet the settlements started in the late 1960's.


Theres no Hamas governing the West Bank, for all the good that does them.

I see sheep

I see sheep wrote: »

Israel are being incredibly short sighted, and I mean this seriously.
The US isn't going to be top dog forever, it could slide now fairly rapidly, or even slowy.
In 100 years time we all know China will probably run the world, is Israel doing deals with China now?

Good post. The U.S. is being short-sighted too.

Israel has had close ties with the Chinese military for decades and has been one of China's main weapons suppliers (2nd only to Russia according to a quick glance at wikipedia).

Israel has also leased land at the Haifa Port to a Chinese 'company' (i.e. government entity) and recently refused access to U.S. inspectors:

Israel has refused an American request to inspect the new Chinese-built Haifa port that will be operated for the next 25 years by SIPG, a Chinese company. This is being seen in both countries as a test case of Israel’s relationship with China and with the United States.

Gatling

votecounts wrote: »

https://twitter.com/sineadmercier/status/1393606780916310022

I presume some will call her a anti semite for telling her friends story, not everyone hates Israel or its people, some just cannot condone actions like these.

Unverified claims on twitter doee nobody any good some will say oh look what this person says is happening others will say is this actually happening or is people trying to get a little noticed in the conversation ,

Hearing from a friend of a friend is never a great measuring stick

Gatling

Is it even possible to have the two state solution anymore at this point the Palestinians have or can hold territory against an Israeli onslought ,Hamas launches rockets and what looked like new medium range missiles last night ,and Israel hit back with something like 150 airstrikes in 40 + mins ,
Anything flying towards Israel is taken out by the iron Dome system .it's a no win situation

cheezums

what about something like this. a compromise on both sides, and a single contiguous state for palestine with east jerusalem as the capital. israel gains the north of the west bank and palestine gets large area of land in negev (yes it's desert but it allows gaza to expand and join up with south west bank.

Biker79

Hamas's strategy has always relied heavily ( if not completely ) on civilian casualties. They launch attacks from populated areas knowing well Israel has to fire back. Or, they send martyrs to their death at the border, knowing full well there is a shoot to kill policy, but it makes an effective photo for the front cover of Time magazine.

Israel has to maintain overwhelming military superiority because it is almost completely surrounded by enemies.

People who criticize Israel don't seem to recognize what a precarious position they are in. If they let their guard down there are 5 countries that could overwhelm them in a matter of weeks.

The only way a two state solution will be possible, is when Iran, Iraq, Syria, Hamas & Lebanon reach peace agreements and begin trade relationships with Israel. Just like the UAE and Saudi have.

Galwayguy35

Who is supplying Hamas with the missiles?

Biker79

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Who is supplying Hamas with the missiles?

Iran.

Odhinn

Israel has no interest in a two state solution. It will carve up the West Bank, leaving "free" palestinian areas scattered amidst Israeli settlements like the Bantustans of Apartheid South Africa.

Mimon

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Who is supplying Hamas with the missiles?

Mostly home made.

Odhinn

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Who is supplying Hamas with the missiles?

They're homemade. Hezbollah have the technically advanced gear, not Hamas.

namloc1980

Montage of Feck wrote: »

Stating facts is propaganda now?

Stating some facts that reflect well on one side is very much propaganda. They killed 26 people in those strikes.

namloc1980

Odhinn wrote: »

They're homemade. Hezbollah have the technically advanced gear, not Hamas.

Which we saw in 2006 when Hezbollah gave the IDF a serious fight in southern Lebanon and took out numerous Israeli tanks and vehicles. Hezbollah are a much more capable outfit than Hamas.

cloudatlas

Why haven't we implemented the boycott yet?