Ransomware & HSE

irishgeo

irishgeo wrote: »

Name one major company in Ireland that uses Linux across the board for every end user.

That has already been asked and ignored.

kippy

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I agree with most of that, my point was the OS itself isn't as scary or challenging to understand and use as maybe believe, by day to day I wasn't referring to getting it to play nice with other things in school or work scenarios etc.

The are plenty things it needs to play nice with in home scenarios too in fairness

gameoverdude

ineedeuro wrote:

Seemingly Irish people are incapable of using a computer unless it has Windows running on it.

And installing ssd. Pathetic.
Only need to give global access to this command: rm *.*...try it.

AndrewJRenko

gameoverdude wrote: »

And? What's the problem? Google and YouTube. Simples.

Jeez, that's great - let's wipe out all paid ICT support services all over the world because 'Google and YouTube. Simples.'

Technology is supposed to help people to do stuff, not become something that people have to spend hours digging around to find solutions for.

gameoverdude

AndrewJRenko wrote:

Jeez, that's great - let's wipe out all paid ICT support services all over the world because 'Google and YouTube. Simples.'

I wasn't serious (although that's how I keep my job!)

AndrewJRenko

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Jeez, that's great - let's wipe out all paid ICT support services all over the world because 'Google and YouTube. Simples.'

Technology is supposed to help people to do stuff, not become something that people have to spend hours digging around to find solutions for.

Some of us enjoy that on occasion though and the satisfaction from finding the solution in the end

Most of the time though I do prefer it when things just work

Cordell

gameoverdude wrote: »

And installing ssd. Pathetic.
Only need to give global access to this command: rm *.*...try it.

% ls
foot.c foot.h foot.o toe.c toe.o
% rm * .o
rm: .o: No such file or directory
% ls
%

riclad

Chrome os is based on Linux , its used in 1000s of schools and its based on user logins, you login in to the laptop with a Gmail account and password
I think it's more secure than Windows and there's loads of apps for it
Or just remove the HD drives and send the laptops to a charity, to send to third world country's
I have not heard of a major hack concerning chrome os and Gmail
Every week networks using Windows 10 and ms email servers are being hacked
Chrome os is designed to be very secure and it uploads data to the cloud for extra security
Many people in country's like Cuba can't afford to buy new laptops

riclad

riclad wrote: »

Chrome os is based on Linux , its used in 1000s of schools and its based on user logins, you login in to the laptop with a Gmail account and password
I think it's more secure than Windows and there's loads of apps for it
Or just remove the HD drives and send the laptops to a charity, to send to third world country's
I have not heard of a major hack concerning chrome os and Gmail
Every week networks using Windows 10 and ms email servers are being hacked
Chrome os is designed to be very secure and it uploads data to the cloud for extra security
Many people in country's like Cuba can't afford to buy new laptops

The reason you hear about it is because Windows is used so much in business.

Chrome OS like any other OS can be infected, while chromebooks use cloud rather than local storage and no running of exes might make it more secure against ransomware for now, any larger adoption will mean more time spent making it a bigger target. But not being able to run exes also makes it less useful in a business setting like in health care where the software houses in Ireland don't write apps for it.

https://blog.malwarebytes.com/101/2018/12/yes-chromebooks-can-and-do-get-infected/

As for no major hack involving gmail, do you mean it being breached and access to people's email being achieved or it being used to send malicious links that led to an attack?
If the latter gmail and related Google products are used by various hackers and scammers

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/google-drive-spam-comments-phishing

https://us-cert.cisa.gov/ncas/current-activity/2021/06/10/google-releases-security-updates-chrome

As for the laptops and any other device not being sent to a charity and thrown in a skip instead, only one poster is claiming that will happen, but can't provide any evidence to back it up along with their other claims such as any new hardware will be purchased outside the normal tender system.

whippet

The HSE are part of the Office of Government Procurement Framework which is where new laptops will be purchased.

There was a competition run for companies to be part of the framework and as such the tender process is already complete.

riclad

You can be scammed or phished by any email service , Gmail, ms email server etc if you are careless or stupid
I, m saying it's alot easier to support chrome os
And it's designed from the start to be more secure,
It's alot more secure than Windows 10 as Windows has to support 1000s of old 32biit programs from the 90s
It's used in many schools
They say we need to get rid of 1000s of laptops
It's a shame to put em in a skip
I wonder does the civil service have any recycling
Program for old laptops or pcs
I understand they will likely destroy the laptop hardrives

crazy 88

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There are reasons why Linux isn't on most work desktops. Kids won't just need to 'pick it up', they'll need to link it up to their home HP printer and their Chromecast and their webcam and their Bluetooth speakers. They'll need to run the apps that come with their school books. They'll need to be able to benefit from the materials that their teachers have prepared in PowerPoint and other formats. They'll be asking their teachers and their parents when they run into problems.

Introducing new technology like this is not a 'pick it up' scenario.

Everything you described here works in Ubuntu which is very intuitive these days and more intuitive than windows in some areas.
Libreoffice and Google docs can run PowerPoint. Office 365 is also an option is MS is an absolute necessity. Ubuntu wine also runs MS software locally. Most learning software can be accessed via web these days e.g. Moodle

ineedeuro

crazy 88 wrote: »

Everything you described here works in Ubuntu which is very intuitive these days and more intuitive than windows in some areas.
Libreoffice and Google docs can run PowerPoint. Office 365 is also an option is MS is an absolute necessity. Ubuntu wine also runs MS software locally. Most learning software can be accessed via web these days e.g. Moodle

I wouldn’t bother, some people just haven’t a clue

ineedeuro

ineedeuro wrote: »

I wouldn’t bother, some people just haven’t a clue

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Is there anything more insufferable than a Linux fanboy with absolutely zero grasp of the reality of dishing it out to 12-year-olds?

Linux on a server is great and I love it. Linux as your OS is complete and utter garbage. It's like these people have a blindspot for how much they had to Google in order to get proficient at it. Dunning Kruger effect.

ucsie

Apologies, I haven't read the whole thread.

Has there been any update about how long it's expected to get things back to normal?

We applied for our baby's birth certificate in April, which was meant to take up to 30 days (Dublin), now unknown because of this attack. We need it to various paperwork and to get a passport to visit family at some point. It would be nice to have a rough timeline of when they are expected to be operational again so we can plan accordingly.

riclad

riclad wrote: »

You can be scammed or phished by any email service , Gmail, ms email server etc if you are careless or stupid
I, m saying it's alot easier to support chrome os
And it's designed from the start to be more secure,
It's alot more secure than Windows 10 as Windows has to support 1000s of old 32biit programs from the 90s
It's used in many schools
They say we need to get rid of 1000s of laptops
It's a shame to put em in a skip
I wonder does the civil service have any recycling
Program for old laptops or pcs
I understand they will likely destroy the laptop hardrives

Not necessarily true.

Yep they do as pointed out a few times in the thread.

ucsie

ucsie wrote: »

Apologies, I haven't read the whole thread.

Has there been any update about how long it's expected to get things back to normal?

We applied for our baby's birth certificate in April, which was meant to take up to 30 days (Dublin), now unknown because of this attack. We need it to various paperwork and to get a passport to visit family at some point. It would be nice to have a rough timeline of when they are expected to be operational again so we can plan accordingly.

First off congratulations.

I don't think anyone can answer this question unless a poster actually works for the HSE and could give you it, a phone call to them might be your best approach.

ucsie

DubInMeath wrote: »

I don't think anyone can answer this question unless a poster actually works for the HSE and could give you it, a phone call to them might be your best approach.

Their phone lines and emails are down because of the cyberattack...

But nevermind, it looks like they finally put a workaround in place and can now be ordered through the general registry office. So they must not expect the systems to be up anytime soon.

Ash.J.Williams

crazy 88 wrote: »

Everything you described here works in Ubuntu which is very intuitive these days and more intuitive than windows in some areas.
Libreoffice and Google docs can run PowerPoint. Office 365 is also an option is MS is an absolute necessity. Ubuntu wine also runs MS software locally. Most learning software can be accessed via web these days e.g. Moodle

just to add, you don't simply buy a pc and introduce it to the network, it would usually be imaged with an in house build, so for linux the desktop eng team would need to develop a new build and test it against all their systems (some very old systems)

Hadron Collider

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There are reasons why Linux isn't on most work desktops. Kids won't just need to 'pick it up', they'll need to link it up to their home HP printer and their Chromecast and their webcam and their Bluetooth speakers. They'll need to run the apps that come with their school books. They'll need to be able to benefit from the materials that their teachers have prepared in PowerPoint and other formats. They'll be asking their teachers and their parents when they run into problems.

During lockdown, I wiped an old laptop that was dog slow under Win 10, installed Ubuntu, and gave it to the kids. They made heavy use of it for school work and video chatting with friends/family. There were very few issues. Setting aside the uber-geek distros like Gentoo and Arch, most mainstream Linux distros these days are fairly user-friendly and plug-and-play.

Kids in the 80s had systems like the Atari, Commodore 64, and ZX Spectrum that were far less user-friendly than Linux in 2021, and yet figured them out and learned a lot in the process -- despite having teachers and parents who were largely clueless about tech.

Sometimes it's a useful thing if tech doesn't work perfectly out of the box. Kids can learn valuable skills that way.

ucsie

ucsie wrote: »

Their phone lines and emails are down because of the cyberattack...

But nevermind, it looks like they finally put a workaround in place and can now be ordered through the general registry office. So they must not expect the systems to be up anytime soon.

I was able to get through yesterday to them about an issue for my dad, but a completely different area.

I was under the impression that if you had already ordered one then you couldn't go through the general register, so didn't suggest it, but if they are doing it for you great.

https://www.gov.ie/en/service/124a70-apply-for-certificates/

The HSE are not in a position to process any existing orders on their system, due to the recent cyber attack.
The General Register Office can only complete new orders for certificates, and do not have any access to orders already processed by the HSE

ineedeuro

Hadron Collider wrote: »

During lockdown, I wiped an old laptop that was dog slow under Win 10, installed Ubuntu, and gave it to the kids. They made heavy use of it for school work and video chatting with friends/family. There were very few issues. Setting aside the uber-geek distros like Gentoo and Arch, most mainstream Linux distros these days are fairly user-friendly and plug-and-play.

Kids in the 80s had systems like the Atari, Commodore 64, and ZX Spectrum that were far less user-friendly than Linux in 2021, and yet figured them out and learned a lot in the process -- despite having teachers and parents who were largely clueless about tech.

Sometimes it's a useful thing if tech doesn't work perfectly out of the box. Kids can learn valuable skills that way.

I started on a ZX Spectrum. Never seen or touched a computer before when handed it. I managed to work it out myself and my parents hadn't a clue. Ended up spending days putting in code just to draw a circle on the screen to the amazement of everyone :-)

My kids are using linux on a desktop, no problem with it....and imagine they can even use a printer with it :P

Cordell

You can train a monkey to use linux these days, that's not the problem. Also, it's not the solution either.

zom

Cordell wrote: »

You can train a monkey to use linux these days,

What changed since 1999? Monkeys got more intelligent?

Hadron Collider

zom wrote: »

What changed since 1999? Monkeys got more intelligent?

Surely you'd acknowledge that Linux is a lot more user-friendly than it was 22 years ago.

plodder

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There are reasons why Linux isn't on most work desktops. Kids won't just need to 'pick it up', they'll need to link it up to their home HP printer and their Chromecast and their webcam and their Bluetooth speakers. They'll need to run the apps that come with their school books. They'll need to be able to benefit from the materials that their teachers have prepared in PowerPoint and other formats. They'll be asking their teachers and their parents when they run into problems.

Introducing new technology like this is not a 'pick it up' scenario.

Printer support is improving all the time and I think the world has been moving more and more towards the web as being the platform rather than Windows or Linux, which is good for Linux. Are school book apps not more likely to be targeted at ios or Android? I agree about external devices generally. Windows has always had far superior device driver support. Also, the hold that MS Office has on people's brains has always been a wonder to me. But, if you've grown up with it (maybe since an ECDL at school) I can understand the reluctance to change.

I think it's fair to say that Linux is improving at a faster rate than Windows. That's been my experience anyway.

By the way, the Munich city council story is not over yet. They've recently decided to switch back to Linux, it seems.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/linux-not-windows-why-munich-is-shifting-back-from-microsoft-to-open-source-again/

ineedeuro

zom wrote: »

What changed since 1999? Monkeys got more intelligent?

1999? 22 years ago?

In IT 6 months is a long time.

Cordell

zom wrote: »

What changed since 1999? Monkeys got more intelligent?

92 I think. ~94 was the first time I had my hands on one (linux, not monkey).
That's about 30 years worth of development and still it can't make any headway into desktop market.

There must be a reason for that.

zom

Hadron Collider wrote: »

Surely you'd acknowledge that Linux is a lot more user-friendly than it was 22 years ago.

Using gnome didn't change much. And terminal did not changed much too. I still suspect monkeys getting more intelligent here.