Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

Bass Reeves

Ace2007 wrote: »

But there is literally nothing stopping it from happening and that's the whole point. I could ring up for a mate and throw in the offer even though i have no intentions of ever buying it - you seem to think there is nothing wrong with this?

In theory nothing to stop it. However it's unlikely to happen. We should make a list of what ifs

Bass Reeves

bubblypop wrote: »

The estate agent cannot get me to up my bid by 25K, unless that's an amount I was always willing to pay.
Find it hard to believe that someone who is lukewarm about a property would bid 20K, over the current bidding. Can't see it.
I'm guessing you haven't bought it sold too many houses.

You would not send some if these lads to buy a bar of chocolate

snow_bunny

bubblypop wrote: »

Because I doubt it happens, if it does it is very very rare.
And like I said, no EA is going to make me up my bid by 25K, unless I was always going to pay that much.

Prove it? There's almost a post per week on the buying thread and elsewhere about an underbidder having to bow out and the agent getting back to them saying the top bidder has all of a sudden bowed out. I know two people this has happened to recently. This isn't to suggest that the bids were made up, more that the top bidder was an absolute spoofer who can't be held accountable.

Also, it doesn't matter that you don't think it happens, it CAN happen and that's the entire point being highlighted.

snow_bunny

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You would not send some if these lads to buy a bar of chocolate

Lads, I've a few bars of chocolate I wouldn't mind selling you! Just let me know your budget and I'll let you know the price then after I speak to my friend Jimmy, he's mad into chocolate too.
:pac:

snow_bunny

snow_bunny wrote: »

more that the top bidder was an absolute spoofer who can't be held accountable.

It doesn't show anything of the sort. There are many reasons that people will pull out of bidding, .being a 'Spoofer ' I would suggest is off the end of the bottom of the list.

Ace2007

bubblypop wrote: »

It doesn't show anything of the sort. There are many reasons that people will pull out of bidding, .being a 'Spoofer ' I would suggest is off the end of the bottom of the list.

So the numerous posters who find themselves outbid only for the EA to come back to them is just pure coincidence is it?

snow_bunny

bubblypop wrote: »

It doesn't show anything of the sort. There are many reasons that people will pull out of bidding, .being a 'Spoofer ' I would suggest is off the end of the bottom of the list.

Being a spoofer, not existing, not having AIP, not having the finances, change of circumstances, change of mind etc. It doesn't matter. The current system of bidding is flawed and results in a lot of distrust, time wasting and headache for the auctioneer, vendor and buyers. It's simply too much money to be so lax with the process and the possibilities for abuse are too great.

I've said my piece now and I won't be posting again. I mean no ill will towards anyone in disagreement here, I appreciate your point of view and the fact you were willing to engage in a discussion at least.

Bass Reeves

Ace2007 wrote: »

So the numerous posters who find themselves outbid only for the EA to come back to them is just pure coincidence is it?

If you are sure about that you drop your bid back by 15-20k or more and see the auctioneer's attitude. There risks attached but if you think you have been puffed up 20-30 k then you will be in a buying position still......if you're wrong someone else gets the house at less than your final bid

mcsean2163

Bass Reeves wrote: »

But you are assuming that people are bidding or auctioneer are puffing. There may be a myriad of reasons you leave the bidding process.

Of course I know nothing about the process, I have only bought a farm, another piece of land, two other houses, one at auction and and build a house and completely done up an old farm house. So ya You are right




All trading skills are transferable. All skills at auction are exactly the same. If I got an auction I no longer get the heebie jeebies I did when I first started.
Do you really think an auctioneer would use the same bidder even if he was doing it. Loads of people use auctioneers to bid for them. On one house I bought I was the only bidder I had 46k on it. Seller wanted 50k or he keep it on the market should I have refused to deal.......today the house is worth 80-85k with a rent roll of over 7.5k.

As you say most people are inexperienced however the reality is supply is very low with 5-10 buyers for each property.

All trading skills are transferable.

Yep definitely not trying to cast any aspirations on the skills of those in a cattle mart. My point is that lots of people buying (the majority?) will only buy 1/2 homes in their lifetime and have no skills.

That's a great market for an unscrupulous market maker. Is there a law saying an EA can't invent a bid? How could it even be proved in court. It's hearsay over a phone, estate agent apologizes and says I must have spoken unclearly etc.

As far as I'm concerned with nothing visible, recorded or validated, it's the wild west and we're talking huge sums of money that could be fraudulently added.

Cyrus

mcsean2163 wrote: »

All trading skills are transferable.

Yep definitely not trying to cast any aspirations on the skills of those in a cattle mart. My point is that lots of people buying (the majority?) will only buy 1/2 homes in their lifetime and have no skills.

That's a great market for an unscrupulous market maker. Is there a law saying an EA can't invent a bid? How could it even be proved in court. It's hearsay over a phone, estate agent apologizes and says I must have spoken unclearly etc.

As far as I'm concerned with nothing visible, recorded or validated, it's the wild west and we're talking huge sums of money that could be fraudulently added.

There is a very simple way of ensuring you aren't 'duped' then.

Decide on the value of a property and make a bid at that level, if there is no other real counter bidder involved you should be the front runner.

If there is then......

mcsean2163

snow_bunny wrote: »

Being a spoofer, not existing, not having AIP, not having the finances, change of circumstances, change of mind etc. It doesn't matter. The current system of bidding is flawed and results in a lot of distrust, time wasting and headache for the auctioneer, vendor and buyers. It's simply too much money to be so lax with the process and the possibilities for abuse are too great.

I've said my piece now and I won't be posting again. I mean no ill will towards anyone in disagreement here, I appreciate your point of view and the fact you were willing to engage in a discussion at least.

Agree. There's a lot seem to be posting from an EA pov.

no EA is going to make me up my bid by 25K, unless I was always going to pay that much.

That's not the voice of someone looking to buy a family home. People looking to buy a family home are very vulnerable and by the sound of some of the comments are being defrauded in the process by 'professionals'.

It's scandalous, shouldn't be allowed but Ireland.

Also, I've said enough. I assume if the market tanks the eas will simply switch profession and start selling inappropriate banking products to vulnerable elderly people and give the same defense. Wild west Ireland.

sanfranbest

Need some advice please,
I moved to USA in 1987, so 34 years away from Ireland.
Am thinking of moving back and buying a house in Dublin,
I love Portobello,, but the prices are horrendous,
Saw this house on Daft today,

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-62-parnell-road-harolds-cross-dublin-6/3237411

The EA is saying its in Harold's Cross, Dublin 6,
But its clearly in Dublin 12, there is even a Dublin 12 sign on the garden wall.
It seems like a great Price at 398k,
I know its an old Corporation house, but has potential to add a garage to the side?

Please let me know your thoughts,
good area???,, Bad area???
any other problems it may have ???

Many Thanks

Bass Reeves

mcsean2163 wrote: »

All trading skills are transferable.

Yep definitely not trying to cast any aspirations on the skills of those in a cattle mart. My point is that lots of people buying (the majority?) will only buy 1/2 homes in their lifetime and have no skills.

That's a great market for an unscrupulous market maker. Is there a law saying an EA can't invent a bid? How could it even be proved in court. It's hearsay over a phone, estate agent apologizes and says I must have spoken unclearly etc.

As far as I'm concerned with nothing visible, recorded or validated, it's the wild west and we're talking huge sums of money that could be fraudulently added.

I not sure what Dublin auctioneer fees are but if they are 2 % let's look at it in detail. Day an average house sale us 500-550k so fees are 10-11k. Puff it by 15-20k adds 3-400 euro onto the fees. Would you risk a 10-11k for an extra 3-400 euro. You might if the house was a relation or a good friend. But for an average Joe who is selling I doubt it. It's easier to let the market run.

alias no.9

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I not sure what Dublin auctioneer fees are but if they are 2 % let's look at it in detail. Day an average house sale us 500-550k so fees are 10-11k. Puff it by 15-20k adds 3-400 euro onto the fees. Would you risk a 10-11k for an extra 3-400 euro. You might if the house was a relation or a good friend. But for an average Joe who is selling I doubt it. It's easier to let the market run.

It's not even about risking the sale, any competent auctioneer will spend their time on bringing in the next €10-11k than trying to squeeze an extra €3-400 from an almost closed sale.

Bass Reeves

sanfranbest wrote: »

Need some advice please,
I moved to USA in 1987, so 34 years away from Ireland.
Am thinking of moving back and buying a house in Dublin,
I love Portobello,, but the prices are horrendous,
Saw this house on Daft today,

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-62-parnell-road-harolds-cross-dublin-6/3237411

The EA is saying its in Harold's Cross, Dublin 6,
But its clearly in Dublin 12, there is even a Dublin 12 sign on the garden wall.
It seems like a great Price at 398k,
I know its an old Corporation house, but has potential to add a garage to the side?

Please let me know your thoughts,
good area???,, Bad area???
any other problems it may have ???

Many Thanks

House is very small 900sq feet. It's BER is G rated which suggests a big insulation job. Required. If you do this on the outside you will lose the brick work however because of how small the house is you cannot really do it inside.

It's not a house that will be capable of extending because off its shape. However rear garden seems to be south facing. Might seem a cheap asking price but if you go 8-12%( 30-40k) above asking and 70-100k in upgrade costs and it's heading for a 550 k house. Somebody else may give you answers about location

mcsean2163

alias no.9 wrote: »

It's not even about risking the sale, any competent auctioneer will spend their time on bringing in the next €10-11k than trying to squeeze an extra €3-400 from an almost closed sale.

It's already been said. A sale at a mad price will help get the next customer.

mcsean2163

Bass Reeves wrote: »

House is very small 900sq feet. It's BER is G rated which suggests a big insulation job. Required. If you do this on the outside you will lose the brick work however because of how small the house is you cannot really do it inside.

It's not a house that will be capable of extending because off its shape. However rear garden seems to be south facing. Might seem a cheap asking price but if you go 8-12%( 30-40k) above asking and 70-100k in upgrade costs and it's heading for a 550 k house. Somebody else may give you answers about location

It's on a main road, so might be worth asking the Gardai if there's been many break-ins

am_zarathustra

Bass Reeves wrote: »

House is very small 900sq feet. It's BER is G rated which suggests a big insulation job. Required. If you do this on the outside you will lose the brick work however because of how small the house is you cannot really do it inside.

It's not a house that will be capable of extending because off its shape. However rear garden seems to be south facing. Might seem a cheap asking price but if you go 8-12%( 30-40k) above asking and 70-100k in upgrade costs and it's heading for a 550 k house. Somebody else may give you answers about location

EDIT sorry I was looking at the map again. It's on the Northside of the canal so it actually might be HX. I thought it was on Clogher on the corner, itust be the one vertically opposite, I'll keep an eye out tomorrow, hadn't noticed the for sale sign

The area is ok, one of the better areas around there actually. It's a fairly quiet road, shops a comfortable walk....I'd echo above though, it'll be Baltic without external insulation and that might be tricky with the houses at angles. I guess it mostly matters what you want it for? Retirement, a base for partying, to be closer to family?

Bass Reeves

am_zarathustra wrote: »

EDIT sorry I was looking at the map again. It's on the Northside of the canal so it actually might be HX. I thought it was on Clogher on the corner, itust be the one vertically opposite, I'll keep an eye out tomorrow, hadn't noticed the for sale sign

The area is ok, one of the better areas around there actually. It's a fairly quiet road, shops a comfortable walk....I'd echo above though, it'll be Baltic without external insulation and that might be tricky with the houses at angles. I guess it mostly matters what you want it for? Retirement, a base for partying, to be closer to family?

The angle would not really create an issue with putting on external insulation, the issue is with an angled site like that if you wanted to put an extension on you gave limited options. House is only 900 sq feet. The main bedroom is not huge and the other two are really only box rooms. The sitting room is not bad but the dining room is tiny. It's really a three bedroom house squeezed into a two bed footprint

Mic 1972

bubblypop wrote: »

It doesn't show anything of the sort. There are many reasons that people will pull out of bidding, .being a 'Spoofer ' I would suggest is off the end of the bottom of the list.

Given the current system of bidding without having to proof funds and the lack of supply, It's not unlikely that people bid on a number of properties without being "too serious" about it and then, only if they win the bidding, they decide what to do. I have done it myself

Amadan Dubh

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/property-prices-how-far-off-boom-era-highs-are-they-and-will-they-climb-all-the-way-back-1.4571692?mode=amp

Property prices: How far off boom-era highs are they, and will they climb all the way back?

Prices in Dublin 6W are just 12% off their peaks. Other urban areas have a long way to go

A historic shortage of properties, combined with heightened demand, is putting pressure on prices. But as they inch ever upwards, some might wonder how far off their boom peak are prices now.

First, recent price growth in Ireland should be seen in a global context; the pandemic has appeared to set off a multitude of markets around the world. Second, although prices are back on an upwards trajectory, they still dwarf the peaks of the years 2006-08.

Indeed, as of March 2021, prices in Dublin are 20.1 per cent lower than in the 2007 peak; outside the capital, prices are 17.3 per cent below the peak of May 2007.

In general, as Lyons notes, urban areas tend to be closer to peak prices than the overall market figures might suggest. Within Dublin, for example, it’s the 6W postcode, incorporating Terenure, Kimmage and Harold’s Cross, where prices have recovered faster than anywhere else in Ireland, as they are now only 12.3 per cent off their peak; this is the smallest margin of any location.

At peak, this postcode had average house prices of €673,008, according to Lyons’s figures, before they dropped to a low of €321,359. Since then, however, they have risen by 83.6 per cent, to €589,951.

As well as regional variations, there is also a distinction when it comes to the particular properties being sold. “Up to €1 million it’s very busy, and that’s where we’re seeing most of the increases,” says Peter Kenny, director of prime residential with Knight Frank. Indeed, he recently opened bidding on a home in Killiney at €460,000, and within 24 hours it had risen to €521,000.

“But as you move up to prime and superprime houses, in the €1 million to €5 million range, there are a lot less transactions going on, and the distance from the peak is much greater,” he says.

Two points;

One - the article is in such poor taste as it flies in the face of the uproar against the property market. "way off" their peaks and "recovery" of prices to Celtic Tiger levels are ridiculous ways to describe how prices have shot up since 2013. Truly ignorant but I know that author is int he pocket of those who make profits from the State of the market, in terms of always talking it up. However, I nearly expected her to write "this time it's different"; is it just me but surely the fact we are only 15-20% off Celtic Tiger prices means something is up? Surely we should be wary of current prices as the market crashed down something like 80% in only 5 years from these inflated levels, leading to a massive crisis in the State. This time it is certainly not different in my view, we have never dealt with the fallout properly.

Two - the different markets at different price levels is something we are familiar with, arguably €1m is the ceiling for all but a tiny portion of buyers. However, I noted the quote above that there are a lot less transactions at €1m to €5m despite this price range being much further off their Celtic Tiger levels. A bit strange, no? If there is apparently room for these prices to climb then they would be decent value according to the article. I think, and maybe this is a bit from experience with parents and friends with parents, but those with houses above €1m are going to be waiting for Godot if they expect to see Celtic Tiger prices return anytime soon. I've already seen more restrained prices being advertised and the places struggling to sell so being taken off market. It is irresponsible of the IT to nearly make it seem like the we older people should hold on longer in order to sell as there is room for prices to move closer to Celtic Tiger levels.

M_Murphy57

sanfranbest wrote: »

Need some advice please,
I moved to USA in 1987, so 34 years away from Ireland.
Am thinking of moving back and buying a house in Dublin,
I love Portobello,, but the prices are horrendous,
Saw this house on Daft today,

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-62-parnell-road-harolds-cross-dublin-6/3237411

The EA is saying its in Harold's Cross, Dublin 6,
But its clearly in Dublin 12, there is even a Dublin 12 sign on the garden wall.
It seems like a great Price at 398k,
I know its an old Corporation house, but has potential to add a garage to the side?

Please let me know your thoughts,
good area???,, Bad area???
any other problems it may have ???

Many Thanks

Its between clogher road and aughavanagh road - that's straight up in the heart of crumlin (and the knock down price reflects)

It's a lovely setting on the canal and close to town but it's also close to dolphins barn so I'd expect some anti social behaviour.

Overall though, I'd say it's a beautiful house in an only ok area. Probably a grand place to live but if you can stretch to actual Harold's cross I would.

ebayissues

On another note, It would be great having a meet up with some of the posters here to have lovely chats about the property market. I think it'll be unreal tbh.

neutral guy, propqueries, cnoubci, awec, the_sheriff, and many more

Apologies if I missed anyone.

ðŸ˜႒ðŸ˜႒ðŸ˜႒

Villa05

ebayissues wrote:

On another note, It would be great having a meet up with some of the posters here to have lovely chats about the property market. I think it'll be unreal tbh.

Should have a citizens assembly to be honest as politicians have little interest in sorting out the issues.

They had one on childcare lately with some interesting outcomes

Wanderer78

Villa05 wrote:

Should have a citizens assembly to be honest as politicians have little interest in sorting out the issues.

I'd agree with this, it's disturbing to see the lack of understanding of what's even going on in the markets, and its important to remember, this goes much deeper than just our politicians, as they have many advisors, disturbing stuff!

Villa05

Wanderer78 wrote:

I'd agree with this, it's disturbing to see the lack of understanding of what's even going on in the markets, and its important to remember, this goes much deeper than just our politicians, as they have many advisors, disturbing stuff!

The thing with housing is the loudest and wealthiest get heard the rest of us are too busy working and commuting as a result of high priced housing to have a voice

Cyrus

Amadan Dubh wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/property-prices-how-far-off-boom-era-highs-are-they-and-will-they-climb-all-the-way-back-1.4571692?mode=amp





Two - the different markets at different price levels is something we are familiar with, arguably €1m is the ceiling for all but a tiny portion of buyers. However, I noted the quote above that there are a lot less transactions at €1m to €5m despite this price range being much further off their Celtic Tiger levels. A bit strange, no? If there is apparently room for these prices to climb then they would be decent value according to the article. I think, and maybe this is a bit from experience with parents and friends with parents, but those with houses above €1m are going to be waiting for Godot if they expect to see Celtic Tiger prices return anytime soon. I've already seen more restrained prices being advertised and the places struggling to sell so being taken off market. It is irresponsible of the IT to nearly make it seem like the we older people should hold on longer in order to sell as there is room for prices to move closer to Celtic Tiger levels.

firstly we need to forget about the obsession with 2008 prices, it was 13 years ago and at some point id imagine we will exceed those prices, it isnt automatically a bad thing.

secondly, what the market at 1m and slightly above is showing you is the CB limits kicking in. People buying at 1m-1.5m are in the main salaried couples like everyone else, they just have higher salaries. They are still bound by the 3.5x rule and there is also the fear that if something happens to a very well paid job will you get the same again somewher else so a lot of people wont borrow their absolute maximum as once you get to mortgage levels over 600k the monthly repayments are eye opening.

That is the part of the market that hasnt inflated as much as lower ends as there are less people in it and the CB rules is stopping them from going beyond what they can afford. which is a good thing.

tigger123

sanfranbest wrote: »

Need some advice please,
I moved to USA in 1987, so 34 years away from Ireland.
Am thinking of moving back and buying a house in Dublin,
I love Portobello,, but the prices are horrendous,
Saw this house on Daft today,

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-62-parnell-road-harolds-cross-dublin-6/3237411

The EA is saying its in Harold's Cross, Dublin 6,
But its clearly in Dublin 12, there is even a Dublin 12 sign on the garden wall.
It seems like a great Price at 398k,
I know its an old Corporation house, but has potential to add a garage to the side?

Please let me know your thoughts,
good area???,, Bad area???
any other problems it may have ???

Many Thanks

PM Sent.

combat14

well if this is true first time buyers, the housing market and ff/fg government are well and truly..............


'Havoc in the housing market': Thousands of homes snapped up by investors


With up to €1bn worth of housing sold to institutional investors before a brick is laid, it could be years before the non-retrospective extra stamp duty on cuckoo funds would take effect.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40296650.html

Cyrus

combat14 wrote: »

well if this is true first time buyers, the housing market and ff/fg government are well and truly..............


'Havoc in the housing market': Thousands of homes snapped up by investors


With up to €1bn worth of housing sold to institutional investors before a brick is laid, it could be years before the non-retrospective extra stamp duty on cuckoo funds would take effect.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40296650.html

would they have been built otherwise? they were pre sold, never on the open market and will increase our rental stock with family sized a rated homes, is this not what people wanted?

combat14

Cyrus wrote: »

would they have been built otherwise? they were pre sold, never on the open market and will increase our rental stock with family sized a rated homes, is this not what people wanted?

pre-sold

never on open market

is that not what people wanted...



no i think most irish people at this stage want to see some sense of fairness when it comes to housing ..

how will first time buyers ever have any sort of opportunity of owning their own basic home if everything is already "pre-sold" and "not on open market" .... ?

Balluba

Bass Reeves wrote: »

If you are sure about that you drop your bid back by 15-20k or more and see the auctioneer's attitude. There risks attached but if you think you have been puffed up 20-30 k then you will be in a buying position still......if you're wrong someone else gets the house at less than your final bid

It amazes me how many posters seem to trust auctioneers even though there is no transparency or accountability in the bidding process

timmyntc

Cyrus wrote: »

would they have been built otherwise? they were pre sold, never on the open market and will increase our rental stock with family sized a rated homes, is this not what people wanted?

The houses more than likely would have sold given the high demand.
The apartments dont get built if not pre-sold, from the article.

Balluba

Perhaps some posters are auctioneers

Cyrus

combat14 wrote: »

pre-sold

never on open market

is that not what people wanted...



no i think most irish people at this stage want to see some sense of fairness when it comes to housing ..

how will first time buyers ever have any sort of opportunity of owning their own basic home if everything is already "pre-sold" and "not on open market" .... ?

perhaps they wouldnt have been built if they werent pre sold, so they wouldnt have been available to buy anyway, at least this way we get an improvement in rental stock which was a huge issue.

and dont be sensationalist, everything isnt pre sold, we just now have some property that is built to rent, thats a good thing ultimately.

Wanderer78

Villa05 wrote: »

The thing with housing is the loudest and wealthiest get heard the rest of us are too busy working and commuting as a result of high priced housing to have a voice

enough is enough, this is endangering us all now

combat14

Cyrus wrote: »

perhaps they wouldnt have been built if they werent pre sold, so they wouldnt have been available to buy anyway, at least this way we get an improvement in rental stock which was a huge issue.

and dont be sensationalist, everything isnt pre sold, we just now have some property that is built to rent, thats a good thing ultimately.

and at what price

Cyrus

combat14 wrote: »

and at what price

sorry you will have to elaborate. at what price to who or what?

SmokyMo

Cyrus wrote: »

perhaps they wouldnt have been built if they werent pre sold, so they wouldnt have been available to buy anyway, at least this way we get an improvement in rental stock which was a huge issue.

and dont be sensationalist, everything isnt pre sold, we just now have some property that is built to rent, thats a good thing ultimately.

yes they would.
there was only 1 forward payed build to rent development in Ireland.

Villa05

combat14 wrote:

With up to €1bn worth of housing sold to institutional investors before a brick is laid, it could be years before the non-retrospective extra stamp duty on cuckoo funds would take effect.

Does anyone here know how the system works?

Are the funds actually providing the finance for the development of these homes or are they guaranteeing to buy them and then the developer goes to the bank to source the funding with the guarantee in their pockets

Just trying to figure out how many profit takers there are and consequently how that affects price?

Cyrus

SmokyMo wrote: »

yes they would.
there was only 1 forward payed build to rent development in Ireland.

Michael Stanley appears to contradict you

Mr Stanley said: "There is nobody building speculative apartments where they don’t yet have a buyer or a forward buyer."

Cyrus

Villa05 wrote: »

Does anyone here know how the system works?

Are the funds actually providing the finance for the development of these homes or are they guaranteeing to buy them and then the developer goes to the bank to source the funding with the guarantee in their pockets

Just trying to figure out how many profit takers there are and consequently how that affects price?

generally the latter.

Wanderer78

Villa05 wrote: »

Does anyone here know how the system works?

Are the funds actually providing the finance for the development of these homes or are they guaranteeing to buy them and then the developer goes to the bank to source the funding with the guarantee in their pockets

Just trying to figure out how many profit takers there are and consequently how that affects price?

my suspicions are, the funding is ultimately coming from banks in the form of credit in some way, but i dont have proof of this, as this is how our monetary systems work, particularly in the eu, we still have a largely fire sector lead economy

Zenify

G7 set to seal a deal on corporation tax by Friday. This will pave the way for G20 and OECD talks. First 3 to click link get a free read of the FT article.

G7 is close to deal on taxation of world’s largest companies - https://on.ft.com/2TcMEWy via @FT

Cyrus

Zenify wrote: »

G7 set to seal a deal on corporation tax by Friday. This will pave the way for G20 and OECD talks. First 3 to click link get a free read of the FT article.

G7 is close to deal on taxation of world’s largest companies - https://on.ft.com/2TcMEWy via @FT

i see biden has softened his cough somewhat

The US last week scaled back its ambitions on a global minimum corporate tax rate, lowering it from 21 per cent to an effective rate of 15 per cent to increase its appeal internationally.

Wanderer78

Zenify wrote: »

G7 set to seal a deal on corporation tax by Friday. This will pave the way for G20 and OECD talks. First 3 to click link get a free read of the FT article.

G7 is close to deal on taxation of world’s largest companies - https://on.ft.com/2TcMEWy via @FT

im glad to see this finally happen, but it may have negative consequences for us, i think we should move towards 15% asap, the target on our backs has become too serious

Wanderer78

Cyrus wrote: »

i see biden has softened his cough somewhat

....but but the deficit, the deficit!

combat14

Cyrus wrote: »

perhaps they wouldnt have been built if they werent pre sold, so they wouldnt have been available to buy anyway, at least this way we get an improvement in rental stock which was a huge issue.

and dont be sensationalist, everything isnt pre sold, we just now have some property that is built to rent, thats a good thing ultimately.

we just now have some property that is built to rent....


so these properties have all been pre sold for years - not on the open the market - we are agreed on that ..

they are now going to be rented ..

what price are these pre-sold non open market rentals which have not been made available to irish first time buyers under what is starting to look like state sponsored monopolistic/cartel like conditions?

what exorbitant price will these rentals rent for?

what is the long term price for this economy, society, culture, national competitiveness, families, mental health, etc when irish people cant buy a basic necessity such as a starter home

Ace2007

Villa05 wrote: »

Does anyone here know how the system works?

Are the funds actually providing the finance for the development of these homes or are they guaranteeing to buy them and then the developer goes to the bank to source the funding with the guarantee in their pockets

Just trying to figure out how many profit takers there are and consequently how that affects price?

Used to be the latter, but now some funds are funding the entire project - which makes it a no-brainer for the developer as he doesn't have to secure finance

Villa05

Cyrus wrote:

and dont be sensationalist, everything isnt pre sold, we just now have some property that is built to rent, thats a good thing ultimately.

Is it? The state is purchasing/leasing the majority of these properties at sky high rents/prices for social affordable

So we are building homes that the industry openly admits that nobody can afford with the state underwriting the whole show

This practice is even worse than the subprime crisis that collapsed the US financial system

It makes no sense