Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118662352#Comment_118662352

Germany has some of the biggest property funds (Vonovia, Deutsche Wohnen) which absolute dwarf the Ireland based reits in size.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118662409#Comment_118662409

Yes, the more the merrier.

IamMe33

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118662569#Comment_118662569

Not to mention all those those already home owners but housing all their non yet home owner offspring.

All of whom appear to have no hope of ever moving out due to government complicity with vulture funds, councils treacherously snapping up homes and driving up prices from under FTB's noses, and incompetence on a grand scale by absolutely no basic grasp of future planning to a growing population's basic requirement for housing - even going so far as to put a halt to all construction for a good portion of a year!

Throw in all the shady NAMA deals that fire-saled so much excess property to aforementioned funds, entities now employing former high-level NAMA directors and the public generally locked out of snapping up these bargains at the time, and this FFG mob can only but appear a corrupt stain who have been long selling out this country's people.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118662689#Comment_118662689

In a large open country like Australia I would think that would be the best thing.

Is the bush land uninhabitable due to high temperatures or too far away from the cities for people to reasonably live there? I'm wondering why a partly empty continent has a housing crisis.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118662899#Comment_118662899

There is no reason to inhabit a lot of Australia, with the lack of rainfall and anywhere to store it being more an impediment than the heat. The southern coastal fringe is where most settlement has ocurred as it tends to get more rainfall, is cooler and is nicer in terms of recreation opportunities. The housing crisis is down to too much immigration and probably not enough 'tradies'. Most of the issue is just Sydney and Melbourne and the universal great attractor problem of large cities and everyone wanting to live in them and as close as possible to the harbour, in Sydney's case. While I haven't checked, I doubt there's a problem in Perth.

LJ12345

what is the possibility of cohesion in society against these institutions that seek to control the most fundamental basic human need of a home the benefit of which can be paid off before retirement. Is it feasible to imagine a situation where tenants might come together en masse to force them out through non payment of rent... would Ireland with its pro tenant laws be better placed to push these institutions out of the market.

Homeowner or not it’s concerning for the future of society and the potential fall out from preventing people from ever achieving their home owning goals. If this is the start of the ‘great reset’ there is bound to be a backlash somewhere!

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118663103#Comment_118663103

There are also EU property laws to adhere to. You can’t force out/disadvantage german/European pensioners who own these and just nationalise stuff below market rate. This would be the end of the EU. Or Ireland leave the EU (and goes back to potato farming 1848 style….)

only option is higher interest rates, bit that would obliterate the entire welfare state.

houseyhouse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660417#Comment_118660417

I saw this too. Reminds me of the couple in the IT a few months ago that ‘couldn’t afford’ a house in a Dublin on a combined €150k salary. These types of articles make it seem like the whole housing crisis is really more of an entitlement crisis when in reality there are lots of people who are genuinely struggling despite making sacrifices and compromises.

Why are we not hearing about individuals/couples/families just above the social housing limits who can’t get housing assistance and also can’t build up a deposit because so much of their income goes to rent?

Timing belt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118661336#Comment_118661336

Number of properties advertised on sale on Daft in Ireland

No of properties for sale in Dublin

No of properties for sale in Cork

handlemaster

There was a funny article this week in the indo. Couple want to live in a high cost part of Dublin bemoaning the fact they cant buy there. Thats life and will continue to be the case for everyone in a capitalist system. The say system thats paying his wages.

Caquas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118642170#Comment_118642170

This is far better value than the Culanor house. Detached, 350 sq. m. , extensive private grounds, sea views.

But there is the world of difference between €1.1M. and this house because €1.45M will become €1.6M. to get that E1 BER rating up to A. No photos of the bathroom and ensuites so I assume they need serious upgrades.

Very few buyers can go much beyond €1M. because of Central Bank rules. So there is no value to be had under a Million and prices at that level are close to peak but if you can go seriously higher (>€2M.) you can get properties at about half their Celtic Tiger peak and much better value in terms of price per sq. metre.

Anyone with €1.7M. looking for a family home with privacy and garden space would so very well here. Plus, all the conveniences of Ballybrack Cross are less than a 10 minute walk away!

Sadly, the tennis court needs reseeding and the "Georgian" windows are naff - a deal breaker for me 😜

DataDude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118663403#Comment_118663403

It does matter though. The whole system is interlinked. If the tech couple on €150k can’t afford to live in the traditionally expensive areas, they move down into the cheaper areas which pushes ‘normal’ people out of those houses.

David McWilliams has written extensively on this. The struggles of the high earners directly impacts the low earners. If you’re on €40k then you need the guy on €200k banging the drum that he can’t afford a 5 bed in Dalkey, because as soon as he starts to accept the 3 bed semi in Finglas as normal, well then the guy on €40k is truly f*kd

Gael23

When a sale falls through does it get offered to other bidders involved in the previous process or do you go back in the market all over again?

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664165#Comment_118664165

Oh yes and in a socialist system everyone live in a wonderful properties in beautiful areas like 1980s east berlin lol

houseyhouse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664904#Comment_118664904

I understand how it works. I grew up in a beautiful Georgian house is south county Dublin that I will likely never be able to afford. But there is a difference between not being able to buy the house that you would like in the location that you want and not being able to afford to buy a house full stop. I don’t think entitlement plays well. It doesn’t with me anyway. I have no sympathy for those people.

Did you read the article in the Indo? The guy said there were only ‘a handful’ of 3 bed houses available under 550k in Dublin on Daft. I checked. There are 750. If none of those are good enough for him, then that says as much about him as it does about the housing market.

Meanwhile there are plenty of people who find themselves in genuinely very difficult situations that rarely seem to be in the paper (at least the ones I read).

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664374#Comment_118664374

Agree with you on almost everything except I don't think 150k would touch the sides to start a refurb and ber improvement!

DataDude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118665264#Comment_118665264

I do to be honest. By most yardsticks, €150k a year is a good number. He probably sacrificed a lot to get there. Many would consider him ‘rich’, demand his income taxes be higher etc.

Had a quick scan there of what 550k gets you in Dublin. Not much. Certainly not the house of a rich man.

Do I feel as sorry for him as the nurse on 40k who’ll never buy anything at all? Of course not. But still think they are both falling foul of very unfortunate timing. Any first time buyer right now is doing so at the worst timing in history through 0 fault of their own. I wouldn’t belittle anyones struggles no matter where on the spectrum they fall.

houseyhouse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118665587#Comment_118665587

We bought our first house in 2020 so I understand how hard it is.

But I still think that he came off entitled and that articles like that make the situation seem like a problem of high expectations. But if you disagree, that’s ok too!

Caquas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118665289#Comment_118665289

Yes, I reckon around €150K for BER upgrade and €100K for bathrooms. That why I said it would suit someone with €1.7M.

PommieBast

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664910#Comment_118664910

In my experience, usually back to market with a different agent. Sales typically fall through 1-2 months down the line when "things" get discovered by the buyer, by which point other bidders have long moved on.

MacronvFrugals

O’Devaney Gardens developer warned Minister it would sell 500 homes to cuckoo fund if Government didn’t buy them

Bartra's CEO Mike Flannery sent a letter to Housing Minister Darragh O'Brien warning him that they had already engaged with an estate agent about potentially selling the homes to a cuckoo fund.

https://www.thesun.ie/news/8395075/odevaney-gardens-bartra-housing-ireland-dublin/

Amadan Dubh

This is the policy of bowing down to institutionals coming home to roost; they control government policy and it is 100% geared towards big investors with a few bones thrown to those at the very bottom. But what is essentially happening is that the institutionals are harvesting the productive capital of individuals for themselves; the State and the citizens don't benefit from this policy at all. Then the government wonders why it is polling so poorly when it is doing what the institutionals say is needed to fix the housing crisis or why individuals get up in arms over any effort to do anything with taxes other than decrease them.

Institutionals have a part to play in a functioning market, but in Ireland for the last decade the institutionals ARE the market; a trickle of new builds are being given to the individual home buyers as this is how the institutionals want it; to keep demand for their rentals high - artificially high at that. It is a con that the housing crisis is based on stable demand, it is being totally manipulated by a tiny handful of vested, faceless interests and the whole two-card trick can fall apart very quickly with some real government intervention to direct policy more towards what is better for the individuals; i.e. plentiful, affordable housing.

MacronvFrugals

Sold in November 2021 for 695k back up for 845k or around 21.6% increase in a couple months

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118666864#Comment_118666864

Do you have a link to land registry? Or was this just on daft “for sale” @ 695?

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-134-kincora-road-clontarf-clontarf-dublin-3/3690731

134 for sale 750

Pussyhands

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664904#Comment_118664904

You hardly need David McWilliams to tell you that though. It's basic economics.

That said, the guy saying they have 100k deposit and can't buy a home doesn't get much sympathy from me. They can't buy a home in the place they want.

All throughout the history of buying properties, many people have had to compromise.

In the 90's people were priced out of homes in Dublin and had to buy in Celbridge, Leixlip and Maynooth.

You have a park and ride in Meath for 1200 cars for commuters into Dublin - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M3_Parkway_railway_station

A lot of these are people who were living in Dublin but had to move out to a commuter town to afford to buy.

A friend of mine working in Dublin just bought a house in Laois because they couldn't find somewhere affordable.

And I think articles like that guy with 100k deposit complaining doesn't help sway those who support FFG. Just means they can come back to them with answers like "you have 100k deposit and salary of 150k, meaning you can buy a house worth over 550k, you can buy a mighty house in X place"

There's levels to this and of the people deserving sympathy, the lads with 100k deposits are way down the list.

howiya

General question here. Didn't want to start a new thread. If you buy a new build, do you get any input into how it's finished? Paint colours, worktops etc that kind of thing.

1percent

Have to say I find it funny working in dublin with Dubs who can't imagine the idea of buying outside of Dublin.

Myself and my partner are SA halfway between her home place and mine. Fine home and literally half the price of a shoebox apartment in Dublin. With WFH should be manageable with the Dublin Jobs a day or even two a week.

Personaly I think the mental block that some Dublin people have with property outside the pale offers good opportunities for the rest of us. But maybe that's just me.

SmokyMo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667561#Comment_118667561

Thats way too much of a simple take.

Ush1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667561#Comment_118667561

To be honest I find it more common country people moving to Dublin and afraid to live anywhere apart from DLR. Co-worker from Cork was shocked when I told him I lived in a 4 bed semi in a private estate in Tallaght.

optogirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667561#Comment_118667561

Well I'll put it this way - if we move out of Dublin we then have to move jobs & schools. We also would have no family support when we currently have 9 available adults for babysitting & some teenagers. Our main social activity is going to gigs which, at the moment., we can walk to in the vast majority of cases. Moving out of Dublin is not something either of us want to do and we would rather continue to rent here then have a 3 bedroom house in Louth where we all have to start again. Our eldest has Aspergers and gets phenomenal support from his school - something that is not true across the board if the Autism parenting forums I am in are anything to go by. It's all well and good to say 'Move out of dublin' but it's not just the cost that is a factor for us. Quality of life matters too.