Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

timmyntc

Ace2007 wrote: »

CPI over the last 10 years to April 2021 was 5.1%

So if you brought one of these affordable houses that you can’t sell on for anymore than inflation, a 300k house (would that even be affordable by definition?), would now only be worth 315k if you were to sell it.

The same 300k house in the open market environment could be worth near 40/50% more.

So how would you ever get out of the area???

You’ll end up with a new area that folk will feel a stigma to because only those that can’t afford anywhere else will live and with that may come
Social issues.

PS I have no problem with houses built for low incomes etc but it’s not going to take the heat out the market IMO.

Firstly - do you even need to get out of the area? If you need to upsize to a larger house there will be affordable houses with more bedrooms, not all 2 beds/3 beds.

Secondly, if you did want to move on - the money you will have saved by having a smaller mortgage can go towards your next house.

Finally, the more affordable houses are built, they will cool the market somewhat and price rises wont be as pronounced. If we had a section of the market with near fixed sale prices, we would not see house prices going up by 50% of their value.

Avon8

The general point here is fair I think. There's any amount of couples in their late 20s and 30s who wouldn't live in Cabra, Jobstown, Ballymun etc if you gave them the house for free. This isn't just Dubs wanting to live in the nice area their parents grew up. The standard well educated culchie route is to take a house in Kilcock or Ashbourne and then complain that you're being priced out of the city you work in and have a long commute.

There's simply not that many 'nice' areas of Dublin and demand for what's there is sky high. The natural gentrification of other areas though seems much slower here than it's been in other major cities. If you threw 100k houses out past the airport, it would have an affect but it'd still take a long time for that trickle to open supply in the 400k range with a postcode acceptable to young professionals

Summer2020

JDD wrote: »

- If you can get a three bed new build in Cherrywood for €350k, then you're not going to buy a second hand 3 bed for €470k in Sallynoggin. So those prices might go down. If you can get a three bed in Sallynoggin for €450k, then you're not going to pay €550k for the same house on the edge of Glenageary, and so on and so forth. It all has a trickle up effect.

Prices for the new 3 beds in cherrywood are starting from €500k. I got the pre launch email last week.

DataDude

Summer2020 wrote: »

Prices for the new 3 beds in cherrywood are starting from €500k. I got the pre launch email last week.

I wonder how long before the clamor starts for the HTB threshold to increase above €500k?
"People can't afford houses"
Fuel demand through subsidies
Increase prices (:eek:)
"People can't afford houses"
Rinse repeat!

JDD

Ace2007 wrote: »

CPI over the last 10 years to April 2021 was 5.1%

So if you brought one of these affordable houses that you can’t sell on for anymore than inflation, a 300k house (would that even be affordable by definition?), would now only be worth 315k if you were to sell it.

The same 300k house in the open market environment could be worth near 40/50% more.

So how would you ever get out of the area???

You’ll end up with a new area that folk will feel a stigma to because only those that can’t afford anywhere else will live and with that may come
Social issues.

PS I have no problem with houses built for low incomes etc but it’s not going to take the heat out the market IMO.

I'll take each one in turn here. You'd have to take €300k as affordable, as it means a couple would need an income of just under €40k each to afford the 3.5 times mortgage and 30k deposit. The average wage in Dublin is €47k.

There won't be any housing estate built that is all social and affordable housing. It'll be at least half private sales, then the remainder a mix of affordable and social. I understand your concern when we look at the Tullyvales and other estates in West Dublin that were knocked up during the boom with no amenities and no transport links. I think the councils have learned their lessons on that one and they are now making sure that there are town centres and schools and parks (transport always being the one lagging behind).

I think we have to accept that for an entire generation of early 30's to early 40's, there is no property ladder. So what they buy now is their forever home, and that may be in an estate that is a couple of suburbs away from their "ideal" area. The good thing about that is that the people that get the affordable houses and most of those that buy the houses sold privately are going to be in these new estates for a long time. That means they have a vested interest in making sure the estate doesn't go downhill. From talking to colleagues at work who have bought in new estates there seems to be much actual families rather than just-marrieds who have moved in and they have very active resident committees.

So those new estates have and will become gentrified. I drove up to a friend's house in Stocking Avenue near Rathfarnham. I imagine its full of families who want to actually live in Rathmines or Terenure, but this was the best they could manage. The houses are modest enough but there was enough new cars and SUVs around to tell me that the people who lived there weren't the types that would allow the estate to become stigmatized for being "the only place they could afford".

JDD

Summer2020 wrote: »

Prices for the new 3 beds in cherrywood are starting from €500k. I got the pre launch email last week.

I don't doubt it. But that's the market value price for a private buyer, and indeed the cost to the local council when they buy X% of the estate for affordable housing. But you would expect/hope that the price for affordable housing candidates would be 70%ish of the market value.

Bass Reeves

timmyntc wrote: »

The state has long moved on from building "ghettos" like Ballymun or Moyross.
It should be mix of social, affordable sale, and cost rental. Gifting people a site? You can sell them a leasehold on the property with the stipulation it cannot be resold above that value + inflation. So no speculation or no "gifting" of an expensive site.

You have a point with our construction capacity - there is definitely a cap there on how much we can build with our current labour availability. You would think commercial space will be in less demand post pandemic and that might free up some more builders. Even 30k+ a year would be a big boost - I think 2019 figure was 21k and 2020 was 20k new completions also.

The 16k is the projected figure for 2021. In late 2020 builders concentrated on completion of builds before year end. Very little new foundations or site preparation was completed in the last 3 months of 2020. This has left us along with the lockdown looking at a 25% drop in completions this year.

Those getto's were of much the same social structure as you referred to when they started. There is still a large portion of decent working people in these area's. However the concentration of delinquent's causes the issue

Ace2007

JDD wrote: »

I'll take each one in turn here. You'd have to take €300k as affordable, as it means a couple would need an income of just under €40k each to afford the 3.5 times mortgage and 30k deposit. The average wage in Dublin is €47k.

There won't be any housing estate built that is all social and affordable housing. It'll be at least half private sales, then the remainder a mix of affordable and social. I understand your concern when we look at the Tullyvales and other estates in West Dublin that were knocked up during the boom with no amenities and no transport links. I think the councils have learned their lessons on that one and they are now making sure that there are town centres and schools and parks (transport always being the one lagging behind).

I think we have to accept that for an entire generation of early 30's to early 40's, there is no property ladder. So what they buy now is their forever home, and that may be in an estate that is a couple of suburbs away from their "ideal" area. The good thing about that is that the people that get the affordable houses and most of those that buy the houses sold privately are going to be in these new estates for a long time. That means they have a vested interest in making sure the estate doesn't go downhill. From talking to colleagues at work who have bought in new estates there seems to be much actual families rather than just-marrieds who have moved in and they have very active resident committees.

So those new estates have and will become gentrified. I drove up to a friend's house in Stocking Avenue near Rathfarnham. I imagine its full of families who want to actually live in Rathmines or Terenure, but this was the best they could manage. The houses are modest enough but there was enough new cars and SUVs around to tell me that the people who lived there weren't the types that would allow the estate to become stigmatized for being "the only place they could afford".

You say it will be half private - but you still need to convince private buyers to buy in the area, If they wont' buy houses in cabra/finglas/ballymun/tallaght etc all of which have transport links and amenitites (and some walking distance to town/on Luas line), there is no guarantee they will buy in this new affortable area. What then, it could end up being 25% private buyers or less??

Regarding councils learning their lesson, only two days ago some SF lad was against the construction of apartments in his constituent because of facilitates issues, (and probably because his voters don't want new apartments and he has to be seen to help them to get re voted)

Yes because someone with aspirations of living in Rathfarnham/Rathmines or Terenure is clearly what we were talking about??? Do you think these people would consider moving out towards the airport and sharing 50% estates with folks whose incomes are much lower than themselves.

Ace2007

JDD wrote: »

I don't doubt it. But that's the market value price for a private buyer, and indeed the cost to the local council when they buy X% of the estate for affordable housing. But you would expect/hope that the price for affordable housing candidates would be 70%ish of the market value.

So would you be proposing that a private buyer would be paying the full market rate of new houses - say 300k, but the affordable housing candidate would be paying approx 210k for the exact same house on the same road?

Ace2007

Avon8 wrote: »

The general point here is fair I think. There's any amount of couples in their late 20s and 30s who wouldn't live in Cabra, Jobstown, Ballymun etc if you gave them the house for free. This isn't just Dubs wanting to live in the nice area their parents grew up. The standard well educated culchie route is to take a house in Kilcock or Ashbourne and then complain that you're being priced out of the city you work in and have a long commute.

There's simply not that many 'nice' areas of Dublin and demand for what's there is sky high. The natural gentrification of other areas though seems much slower here than it's been in other major cities. If you threw 100k houses out past the airport, it would have an affect but it'd still take a long time for that trickle to open supply in the 400k range with a postcode acceptable to young professionals

At least someone else agrees with the point

MacronvFrugals

Varadkar at leaders questions just now referring to the ESRI's report - "it may well be doable"

growleaves

Ace2007 wrote: »

I’ve said it before but will say it again - the government could build 100,000 houses in green fields out past the airport, but that’s not going to solve the heat in the market. It will give low income families a home and perhaps reduce homelessness.

But is that going to affect the bidding on 500k+ houses going for higher amounts? No it’s not.

Is the government going to build enough
Masses affordable houses in Blackrock? Or in SCD suburbs? What about malahide, portmarnock, clontarf, Drumcondra glasnevin - the list in endless where houses prices are through the roof. There are already areas in dublin where houses are cheap but people say no because of a social attitude associated with such areas.

People think that the amount of houses available is the issue , but it’s more where the houses are located thats the problem - supply not available where people want.

This is only partly true imo.

If there is a methadone clinic or drug dealers nearby then its not just about snobbery and attitude.

Only in places that used to be rough or have a bad reputation but are so no longer can you get any sort of huge discount. Because too many potential buyers are going by old or imperfect knowledge.

timmyntc

Bass Reeves wrote: »

The 16k is the projected figure for 2021. In late 2020 builders concentrated on completion of builds before year end. Very little new foundations or site preparation was completed in the last 3 months of 2020. This has left us along with the lockdown looking at a 25% drop in completions this year.

Those getto's were of much the same social structure as you referred to when they started. There is still a large portion of decent working people in these area's. However the concentration of delinquent's causes the issue

I never asked about the 16k - you said that 2020 had around 30k completions. You were wrong.

Ace2007 wrote: »

So would you be proposing that a private buyer would be paying the full market rate of new houses - say 300k, but the affordable housing candidate would be paying approx 210k for the exact same house on the same road?

You mean like private buyers pay full price for the house that social housing gets for "free" on the same road?
Its already happening, and people still buy them. This new proposal wouldnt be any different.

Bass Reeves

timmyntc wrote: »

I never asked about the 16k - you said that 2020 had around 30k completions. You were wrong.



You mean like private buyers pay full price for the house that social housing gets for "free" on the same road?
Its already happening, and people still buy them. This new proposal wouldnt be any different.

I corrected it I hit the wrong number if you check my posting elsewhere I always reference 2020 as 20 k houses.

Private buyers will only buy a houses from a government build scheme of it is sold at a large discount to market rates.

As well if government now build houses will price development be absolved of there duty to provide social and affordable percentages in there developmemts

Ace2007

timmyntc wrote: »

I never asked about the 16k - you said that 2020 had around 30k completions. You were wrong.



You mean like private buyers pay full price for the house that social housing gets for "free" on the same road?
Its already happening, and people still buy them. This new proposal wouldnt be any different.

Is it happening in government built estates currently ? Is the private buyer being told they can’t. Sell for more than impact of inflation?

jill_valentine

Apologies if I missed it, but do we have any ideas yet about the proposals in Housing For All, the Rebuilding Ireland successor plan?

timmyntc

Ace2007 wrote: »

Is it happening in government built estates currently ? Is the private buyer being told they can’t. Sell for more than impact of inflation?

No - whats happening now is that some houses in an estate are given to social tenants for cheap rent whereas others in the estate have to pay full price.
Affordable housing sales in new estates will just continue this trend.

JDD

Ace2007 wrote: »

So would you be proposing that a private buyer would be paying the full market rate of new houses - say 300k, but the affordable housing candidate would be paying approx 210k for the exact same house on the same road?

Yes.

That's *literally* the point of affordable housing.

The State understands that there is a need for certain categories of workers to live within city limits. Gardai, nurses, shop owners, security guards, supermarket workers etc etc. The State essentially subsidises housing for this category. The State has learned its lesson that it can't buy over an entire estate for affordable housing because - as has been argued above - that will stigmatise the estate and lead to issues down the line. So it buys over 20% of each new build estate whether it is in Blackrock or Tallaght. That way you have no idea whether the family that lives in No.32 paid full price or got it through affordable housing.

And so what? Is it fair that your next door neighbour paid 30% less than you? They're probably still paying the same proportion of their take home pay in mortgage payments. And they don't get to sell it at a profit. Will the fact that they earn under the average make them unsociable neighbours? I doubt it.

I mean, if we're going to make everything fair, perhaps no private buyer should be allowed to take a gift from their parents for a deposit. If we brought that in, the housing market in SCD would crash. That would be one way to stop the market overheating. I don't have a chip on my shoulder here, half my deposit came from my parents. I'm just pointing out that the whole system isn't fair, so tipping something in the favour of lower income workers is hardly turning us into a communist state.

Villa05

Jmc25 wrote:

Borrowing to build houses would be a very solid investment in my opinion, I just can't really believe we're at the point where the ESRI is saying it.

We hear alot of public servants letting us down, maybe it's government policy that's getting in the way of getting things done sensibly

Ace2007 wrote:

So you would basically be stuck in the area and would not be able to trade up to an "established area" like you perhaps wanted to.... right would love to see that being sold to people. Your ideas get better and better.

You have security of tenure, affordable purchase/rents, the savings can be spent in the local economy or a better holiday generating increased economic activity, happier families and thriving business

increased supply would cool inflation in established areas.
Increased savings would negate the need for ftb grants, shared ownership which only further inflate established areas.
With regard to mortgage arrears, we can eliminate this issue by having a safety net of affordable housing so that people in trouble with mortgages can move to the non speculative market. This would also cool inflation in established areas and create a fairer market.

Taking all these factors together the gap between non speculative and established markets would be greatly reduced. Should the occupants wish to progress to established areas. They should be able to do so with natural career progression

I'm not so sure they'd want to though we're these areas well managed

Ace2007 wrote:

So would you be proposing that a private buyer would be paying the full market rate of new houses - say 300k, but the affordable housing candidate would be paying approx 210k for the exact same house on the same road?

This is current policy

growleaves wrote:

If there is a methadone clinic or drug dealers nearby then its not just about snobbery and attitude.

Too many unemployed in one area and the grip of drugs gangs are the root cause of deterioration of housing estates.
Focus these estates on workers. Long term unemployment is very low. They should not be gathered together in one location

Ace2007

timmyntc wrote: »

No - whats happening now is that some houses in an estate are given to social tenants for cheap rent whereas others in the estate have to pay full price.
Affordable housing sales in new estates will just continue this trend.

Cheap rent, is different from buying the house cheaply and under market value.

You seem to have no problem that two houses could be sold to two buyers - one an "affordable house candidate", and the other a private buyer - but at vastly different prices.

Your going to end up with a pubic market for houses - which who knows what sort of sh!t show that will end up in, and the private market - the market that will see how prices go up and up as more people will want this type of housing.

I can't think of one project that is publicly funded en mass that you would say has been a success. Dare i say what your proposing is basically what Ballymun was proposed to be when it was first built

timmyntc

Ace2007 wrote: »

Cheap rent, is different from buying the house cheaply and under market value.

You seem to have no problem that two houses could be sold to two buyers - one an "affordable house candidate", and the other a private buyer - but at vastly different prices.

Your going to end up with a pubic market for houses - which who knows what sort of sh!t show that will end up in, and the private market - the market that will see how prices go up and up as more people will want this type of housing.

I can't think of one project that is publicly funded en mass that you would say has been a success. Dare i say what your proposing is basically what Ballymun was proposed to be when it was first built

No problem, and no.

Ace2007

timmyntc wrote: »

No and no.

Ballymun (Irish: Baile Munna) is an outer suburb of Dublin, Ireland, at the northern edge of the Northside, the green-field development of which began in the 1960s to accommodate a housing crisis in inner city areas of Dublin

Basically what you want the new site to achieve...

At the time of its construction, Ballymun was a sought-after location and prospective tenants had to pass an interview to get housing there.

Well sought-after location, with interviews to get there - so not every tom dick and harry got in... and yet look how it turned out.

It will be the exact same if you build 100,000 houses on a green field site near airport and move all those in need of affordable housing out there or those who are homeless and need accommodation.

There are houses in Ballymun now - that young professional couples won't touch even though they are cheap - because of the out dated social stigma attached to them.

timmyntc

Ace2007 wrote: »

Basically what you want the new site to achieve...



Well sought-after location, with interviews to get there - so not every tom dick and harry got in... and yet look how it turned out.

It will be the exact same if you build 100,000 houses on a green field site near airport and move all those in need of affordable housing out there or those who are homeless and need accommodation.

There are houses in Ballymun now - that young professional couples won't touch even though they are cheap - because of the out dated social stigma attached to them.

You have invented a hypothetical scenario of 100k houses in a green field site near the airport, with no specifics or details, and now are trying to use that against me as an argument? LOL

Well this hypothetical development would have the best amenities and transport links in the country and would be a utopia - I have as much right to say that as you do to say it will be Ballymun 2.0.


Besides, we were talking about the merits of mixed estates of private houses, affordable houses, social houses - your hypothetical 100k houses past the airport doesnt factor into this discussion.

Honestly you seem to leap from topic to topic like a child with ADHD.

Ace2007

timmyntc wrote: »

Besides, we were talking about the merits of mixed estates of private houses, affordable houses, social houses - your hypothetical 100k houses past the airport doesnt factor into this discussion.

Ok tell us all where you are going to build these en masses to solve the problems?

L1011

Ace2007 wrote: »

Ok tell us all where you are going to build these en masses to solve the problems?

There are a number of suburban SDZ or masterplan zones awaiting a start in Dublin alone

http://www.clonburris.ie/

https://omahonypike.ie/projects/woodbrook/

https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/planning/strategic-planning/strategic-development-zones/poolbeg-west-sdz

https://www.fingal.ie/hansfield-strategic-development-zone (long started, but a vast amount of this left)

Ace2007

L1011 wrote: »

There are a number of suburban SDZ or masterplan zones awaiting a start in Dublin alone

http://www.clonburris.ie/

https://omahonypike.ie/projects/woodbrook/

https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/planning/strategic-planning/strategic-development-zones/poolbeg-west-sdz

https://www.fingal.ie/hansfield-strategic-development-zone (long started, but a vast amount of this left)

Only 10% of Cloburris is for social housing, which is not the 50% that has been mentioned on here. I don't see any mention of affordable on the websites, one states the prices are unknown.

For the Hansfield project - is that bulk buy from the state, or who is bulking the houses? The house prices shown on PPR wouldn't be classified as affordable by some around here - Indeed 18 properties sold for 13m - that's not what affordable is???

Housing estates are being built, and are giving 10% to the state for social housing, which is very different to affordable housing.

woejus

moving away from the worthy but dull topic of social housing, we turn now to Homes of The 1% on Killiney's Vico Road, featuring eye-searingly bat**** decor. Has to be seen to be believed! only €2.9m

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-villa-belvedere-vico-road-dalkey-co-dublin/3268419

Ace2007

woejus wrote: »

moving away from the worthy but dull topic of social housing, we turn now to Homes of The 1% on Killiney's Vico Road, featuring eye-searingly bat**** decor. Has to be seen to be believed! only €2.9m

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-villa-belvedere-vico-road-dalkey-co-dublin/3268419

Is there a thread for 1m+ homes to admire - that would be worth looking at.

Gorgeous views but yea bit OTT inside - a good interior designer would make it beautiful though

enricoh

Amadan Dubh wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/esri-borrowing-housing-5456342-Jun2021/



Wow, I didn't think the ESRI would say that the government could borrow a lot more in order to do something. Maybe the government will use the magic money tree that apparently doesn't exist but only when people talk of SF's housing policy. This report is lubricating the wheels of policy justification should they go down the McWilliams route of undertaking significant borrowing to get houses built.

Sweet Jesus, we can't be helped in this country! Government spending is causing rises in house prices at the moment and a government think tank proposes to spend even more! A week ago they wanted income tax rises.
New helicopters for any self respecting developer - why should bam be the only one to milk the taxpayer dry with the kids hospital!

Cyrus

woejus wrote: »

moving away from the worthy but dull topic of social housing, we turn now to Homes of The 1% on Killiney's Vico Road, featuring eye-searingly bat**** decor. Has to be seen to be believed! only €2.9m

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-villa-belvedere-vico-road-dalkey-co-dublin/3268419

I'd figure out the decor for the views!

Someone has gone all 1800s castle in there!

Hubertj

woejus wrote: »

moving away from the worthy but dull topic of social housing, we turn now to Homes of The 1% on Killiney's Vico Road, featuring eye-searingly bat**** decor. Has to be seen to be believed! only €2.9m

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-villa-belvedere-vico-road-dalkey-co-dublin/3268419

Is that a galley kitchen? In a gaff that size?!?

mcsean2163

enricoh wrote: »

Sweet Jesus, we can't be helped in this country! Government spending is causing rises in house prices at the moment and a government think tank proposes to spend even more! A week ago they wanted income tax rises.
New helicopters for any self respecting developer - why should bam be the only one to milk the taxpayer dry with the kids hospital!

Yep, new land rovers for all labourers. It's like 2001 again....

Anyway, I think propqueries needs to have a chat with the ESRI, they're obviously not aware of the tsunami of houses due to hit the market in August.

jay0109

woejus wrote: »

moving away from the worthy but dull topic of social housing, we turn now to Homes of The 1% on Killiney's Vico Road, featuring eye-searingly bat**** decor. Has to be seen to be believed! only €2.9m

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-villa-belvedere-vico-road-dalkey-co-dublin/3268419

It's like someone downsized from a country estate to Vico road and brought every last one of the pictures and heirlooms with them!

enricoh

mcsean2163 wrote: »

Yep, new land rovers for all labourers. It's like 2001 again....

Anyway, I think propqueries needs to have a chat with the ESRI, they're obviously not aware of the tsunami of houses due to hit the market in August.

Can't be towing the jetski with anything less!

The columnist Conor skehan is on prime time n has the solution to unaffordable rents for workers in dublin - they should move elsewhere! It should free up more units for social housing anyway!

Amadan Dubh

woejus wrote: »

moving away from the worthy but dull topic of social housing, we turn now to Homes of The 1% on Killiney's Vico Road, featuring eye-searingly bat**** decor. Has to be seen to be believed! only €2.9m

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/semi-detached-house-villa-belvedere-vico-road-dalkey-co-dublin/3268419

How do people share beds that aren't at least super kings?! It is like nails on a blackboard to see such an extravagant house with such meagre double beds! I'm a humble renter but even we don't sleep in a mere double bed and always go bigger when we've moved in to a place.

L1011

You would have very little space putting a super king in to the double bedrooms in my fairly large 70s 3 bed. They are not normal in Ireland at all; so even those with bigger houses aren't that likely to buy them.

MeadowMaker

Is this a bit of a bubble price? 115m2 Shankill terrace for 615K . Kitchen/Dining/Sitting room sure looks depressing.

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/end-of-terrace-house-66-olcovar-shankill-dublin-18/3265453

Cal4567

enricoh wrote: »

Can't be towing the jetski with anything less!

The columnist Conor skehan is on prime time n has the solution to unaffordable rents for workers in dublin - they should move elsewhere! It should free up more units for social housing anyway!

Skehan is right but and it is a big but, Dublin unlike every other major city I have seen does not have the transport infrastructure that could possibly mean a commute from outside the city is sensible, and not back breaking.

Yes, maybe now if you can work from home, possibly. Skehan does come across though as rude (we aren't allowed to swear here) and comments such as victims and peasants don't sit well at all. Bordering on offensive.

The problem is as much Dublin and everything is Dublin. Maybe the outfall from Covid may help to shift that.

mcsean2163

MeadowMaker wrote: »

Is this a bit of a bubble price? 115m2 Shankill terrace for 615K . Kitchen/Dining/Sitting room sure looks depressing.

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/end-of-terrace-house-66-olcovar-shankill-dublin-18/3265453

It seems like a LOT of money for a small house.

Villa05

Cal4567 wrote:

Yes, maybe now if you can work from home, possibly. Skehan does come across though as rude (we aren't allowed to swear here) and comments such as victims and peasants don't sit well at all. Bordering on offensive.

He and our friend in DCC seemed exceptionally gleeful about the presence investment funds and long term leases.

As I understand the program, the plan appears to be to increase the number of long term leases by 300% this year

Rent paid is 85% if DCC manage the properties while it's 95% when the fund manages them and as the funds are openly manipulating rents the whole scheme is a bit of a money printing machine.

On value for money Long term leasing is twice the cost of building based on average inflation figures over the past 20years of 1.3%. With inflation predicted to be much higher in the coming years one can expect the cost of leasing over building to multiply significantly

MeadowMaker

MeadowMaker wrote: »

Is this a bit of a bubble price? 115m2 Shankill terrace for 615K . Kitchen/Dining/Sitting room sure looks depressing.

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/end-of-terrace-house-66-olcovar-shankill-dublin-18/3265453

Crazy money!
Tiny house and looking into apartment blocks. They will never get that price for it.

Ace2007

bubblypop wrote: »

Crazy money!
Tiny house and looking into apartment blocks. They will never get that price for it.

Doesn’t look to bad to me - plenty of folk want to live around there - I’m sure it’ll meet its asking price.

Ace2007

Ace2007 wrote: »

Doesn’t look to bad to me - plenty of folk want to live around there - I’m sure it’ll meet its asking price.

Crazy!
Lots of better options, for example, there's a 3 bed semi across the road in castlefarm estate for 485K, better estate, nicer house

Hubertj

mcsean2163 wrote: »

It seems like a LOT of money for a small house.

Small living area for a 4 bed too I think

Ace2007

bubblypop wrote: »

Crazy!
Lots of better options, for example, there's a 3 bed semi across the road in castlefarm estate for 485K, better estate, nicer house

Of course, there are better options - there always are. And if there is one across the road in better spot then either that will be prop up on price with bidding, or the 4bed will come down. Although, the appearance outside of the 4bed isn't very appealing, I think inside is nice which coupled with the location might be why they are asking for that price.

Do EA's in Ireland ever say no to a property is the seller asks for too much, or will they always just take it and if doesn't sell say that to the seller that they told them so etc?

I recently saw that one of the nicest houses I've ever seen for sale go for ~25% below asking price,and got me wondering how was it priced up in the first place. Would love to know how much it cost to build

It's still up on myhome with pics, location might not suit everyone but there is very little else wrong with the house imo (on market for 1.9m, sold for 1.475m

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/16-the-oakwood-killeen-castle-dunsany-co-meath/4443036

Bass Reeves

Cal4567 wrote: »

Skehan is right but and it is a big but, Dublin unlike every other major city I have seen does not have the transport infrastructure that could possibly mean a commute from outside the city is sensible, and not back breaking.

Yes, maybe now if you can work from home, possibly. Skehan does come across though as rude (we aren't allowed to swear here) and comments such as victims and peasants don't sit well at all. Bordering on offensive.

The problem is as much Dublin and everything is Dublin. Maybe the outfall from Covid may help to shift that.

Problem is the truth hurts unfortunately it is still the truth. Often you have to be blunt and condescending for people to understand your point.

SmokyMo

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Problem is the truth hurts unfortunately it is still the truth. Often you have to be blunt and condescending for people to understand your point.

No you don't. It means you either don't understand what you talking about or cant articulate well.

Amadan Dubh

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Problem is the truth hurts unfortunately it is still the truth. Often you have to be blunt and condescending for people to understand your point.

I find it is the complete opposite in fact; if you can't articulate to lay people then you are spoofing, waffling and displaying ignorance. It's all well and good having the knowledge but if you can't apply it then it has no real use to other people.

Separately, I noticed Vesta Living are advertising on Instagram for their available rentals. Not sure if that can be read into but perhaps a sign of a lack of demand, particularly with the offer they have of what appears to be 2 months free rent (15% haircut?).

The girl in the picture looks like she is being held against her will!

timmyntc

Amadan Dubh wrote: »

I find it is the complete opposite in fact; if you can't articulate to lay people then you are spoofing, waffling and displaying ignorance. It's all well and good having the knowledge but if you can't apply it then it has no real use to other people.

Separately, I noticed Vesta Living are advertising on Instagram for their available rentals. Not sure if that can be read into but perhaps a sign of a lack of demand.

The girl in the picture looks like she is being held against her will!

The offers to save 4,200 a year if you start a lease are likely a way of making up for reduced demand.
INstead of dropping rent prices, you give an upfront discount, but the headline rent remains the same. I think it gets around RPZ rules, but also crucially it keeps the property valuations from dropping along with rental demand.

Amadan Dubh

timmyntc wrote: »

The offers to save 4,200 a year if you start a lease are likely a way of making up for reduced demand.
INstead of dropping rent prices, you give an upfront discount, but the headline rent remains the same. I think it gets around RPZ rules, but also crucially it keeps the property valuations from dropping along with rental demand.

Not pocket change as it is the equivalent of not having to hand over approximately €8,000 of your gross salary in a year!