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Can she keep the rent that I paid?

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124

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    #92
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,513 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Why, do you think you can answer it? It's open ended, but you knew that already. It was ended at the OPs timing.

    Take the emotion out of it guys. The judge is unlikely to get so tied up in it.

    As you don’t believe me, the Macmillan Dictionary describes it as:

    at the earliest/first opportunity.

    I’m not sure I could put it any more simply or succinctly than that, so I hope that will do.


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    #93
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Dav010 wrote: »
    As you don’t believe me, the Macmillan Dictionary describes it as:

    at the earliest/first opportunity.

    I’m not sure I could put it any more simply or succinctly than that, so I hope that will do.

    Shur, lets go legal with definition.

    The Court of Appeal has held that the words "as soon as possible" in a notification clause for an insurance policy do not impose a positive duty of inquiry on the insured.

    Not exactly the same thing, but the inference here is that As Soon As Possible (which I've indicated from my first post) is not definitive, and would not require a forced exit. The OP could have left later than she did. She DID NOT need to leave on the 13th as she was paid up until the end of the month.


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    #94
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I've read up further on the legal implication of 'As soon as possible.' Because of its ambiguity if someone is relying on it for their case it wont be given in their favour.

    I would take that to mean, if the OP says the LL needs to pay me back 17 days of May rent because I left due to her telling me to leave 'As Soon As Possible'. It wont be accepted.

    But, ask someone from the legal forum to review. Send them the link to this thread - As soon as possible, if you don't mind:p


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    #95
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    OP,

    You're getting back your deposit bar the €170 "expenses"*. If this went to the SCC you'd hopefully get a little over half the €170 back - approx €93. Given the right judge you may even get back €192 of the rent or €285 in total less the € 25 SCC fee. For that you'll likely need to take a day off work.

    IF she was a fair LL she should have given you back the rent from the 14th to the 31st of May, simply because it was the decent thing to do. Some people aren't decent.

    *Although, €170 does sound expensive, were you paying that every month?!


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    #96
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,377 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Shur, lets go legal with definition.

    The Court of Appeal has held that the words "as soon as possible" in a notification clause for an insurance policy do not impose a positive duty of inquiry on the insured.

    Jaysus lads


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    #97
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    Jaysus lads

    It was either that, or my daddy would beat your daddy.


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    #98
    JoChervil
    Registered Users Posts: 2,022 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    Deleted User wrote: »
    We're going around in circles.


    If there is a notice period the OP needs to pay that. She was given a notice to leave and made use of two weeks of that, if she didn't make use of any further period for which she possibly could have stayed she'll need to pay.

    Not true. Notice period indicates how long licensee/tenant may stay. But they may stay shorter and all rent they haven't used must be paid back.


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    #99
    JoChervil
    Registered Users Posts: 2,022 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    Treppen wrote: »
    As soon as possible could be months, weeks, days, hours...

    Rent was paid monthly. If the op paid for a month but decided to move out prior then it's on them, it's not a pro rata agreement (although bills would be).

    It's like buying a coffee , the waitress says they'll need the table ASAP, drinking half and demanding half the cost back because you only drank half.

    What a rubbish reasoning! You can't sell half drunk coffee but you can rent an empty room for the remaining part of the month.


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    #100
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JoChervil wrote: »
    Not true. Notice period indicates how long licensee/tenant may stay. But they may stay shorter and all rent they haven't used must be paid back.

    Wah?

    You said tenants don't need to give notice?

    https://www.threshold.ie/advice/ending-a-tenancy/ending-your-tenancy/

    And before you say this is a licencee agreement, yes, and it'll be bound by the LL/Renter agreement, which seems to be a months rent. We don't know much else beyond that.


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    #101
    JoChervil
    Registered Users Posts: 2,022 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Wah?

    You said tenants don't need to give notice?

    https://www.threshold.ie/advice/ending-a-tenancy/ending-your-tenancy/

    And before you say this is a licencee agreement, yes, and it'll be bound by the LL/Renter agreement, which seems to be a months rent. We don't know much else beyond that.

    Where did I say that?


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    #102
    JoChervil
    Registered Users Posts: 2,022 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Wah?

    You said tenants don't need to give notice?

    https://www.threshold.ie/advice/ending-a-tenancy/ending-your-tenancy/

    And before you say this is a licencee agreement, yes, and it'll be bound by the LL/Renter agreement, which seems to be a months rent. We don't know much else beyond that.

    I was talking about any notice period given by Landlady because we were discussing this particular situation


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    #103
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JoChervil wrote: »
    Where did I say that?

    What's the meaning of this...
    JoChervil wrote: »
    Not true. Notice period indicates how long licensee/tenant may stay. But they may stay shorter and all rent they haven't used must be paid back.

    It seems like you're saying that the notice period is only for the benefit of the licencee and they may leave when they want and get a refund. How else were we supposed to take it?


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    #104
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JoChervil wrote: »
    I was talking about any notice period given by Landlady because we were discussing this particular situation

    The Land Lady didn't give a Notice Period. There's been about 50 posts on this already. You might want to give those a read first.


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    #105
    JoChervil
    Registered Users Posts: 2,022 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    Deleted User wrote: »
    The Land Lady didn't give a Notice Period. There's been about 50 posts on this already. You might want to give those a read first.

    You are a troll


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    #106
    matchthis
    Registered Users Posts: 1,874 ✭✭✭matchthis


    Should you not still be able to stay there when you want as you’re still paid up? If you did take it to the small claims court, they could say that they didn’t stop you living there while paid up. That you moved out and did not need the room. Just a perspective they could use as a defence. Apologies if wrong, just a thought


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    #107
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,513 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    The Land Lady didn't give a Notice Period. There's been about 50 posts on this already. You might want to give those a read first.

    And yet it was posted early in the thread that the op was told to leave, and that the LL wanted the room as soon as possible.
    JoChervil wrote: »
    You are a troll

    I don’t think it is trolling, more likely to me an issue with understanding the situation.


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    #108
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Dav010 wrote: »
    And yet it was posted early in the thread that the op was told to leave, and that the LL wanted the room as soon as possible.

    And as we have learned 'As soon as possible' is ambiguous and cannot be relied upon in a court of law to prove your case.


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    #109
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    matchthis wrote: »
    Should you not still be able to stay there when you want as you’re still paid up? If you did take it to the small claims court, they could say that they didn’t stop you living there while paid up. That you moved out and did not need the room. Just a perspective they could use as a defence. Apologies if wrong, just a thought

    This is exactly my point. This isn't a case of the decent thing being done, but what a court will decide.


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    #110
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Dav010 wrote: »

    I don’t think it is trolling, more likely to me an issue with understanding the situation.

    I think I preferred being called a troll :pac:

    I've given my understanding of the legal definition of 'As soon as possible'g, which I don't think is in the OPs favour.


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    #111
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,513 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    And as we have learned 'As soon as possible' is ambiguous and cannot be relied upon in a court of law to prove your case.

    Of course “as soon as possible” is ambiguous/undefined, you did give me a giggle though when you quoted a court ruling for that.

    It appears the LL wants payment for a defined period even though both she and the op agreed for him/her to move out on the soonest undefined date possible.


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    #112
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Of course “as soon as possible” is ambiguous/undefined, you did give me a giggle though when you quoted a court ruling for that.

    It appears the LL wants payment for a defined period even though both she and the op agreed for him/her to move out on the soonest undefined date possible.

    I'd like the record to show that you started with the definitions first :p

    IF the OP was obligated to pay a month's rent, then her moving out early (she could have stayed until the end of the month) would likely mean she was obliged to pay the month's rent. And she cannot rely on 'As Soon As Possible' as a defence.


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    #113
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    JoChervil, if you have a problem with a post report it. Do not call posters out for trolling.

    Dav010, Chinese whospers take it to PM.


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    #114
    Treppen
    Registered Users Posts: 4,605 ✭✭✭Treppen


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Are you really asking how long “as soon as possible” is? Surely not.

    Yes .

    Can you quantify?

    I want an answer as soon as possible btw


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    #115
    Treppen
    Registered Users Posts: 4,605 ✭✭✭Treppen


    JoChervil wrote: »
    What a rubbish reasoning! You can't sell half drunk coffee but you can rent an empty room for the remaining part of the month.

    So if a person decided to move out on Monday 15th would you have another person in the 16th to finish out just that month, then leave!


    If the payment was for 1 month then that's the full cup of coffee. That was the agreement entered into by the OP paying one month. If a change takes place then a conversation and agreement needed to be had.
    No other conversation or agreement took place.

    Some mention of "as soon as possible" but that was never clarified only assumed by the OP. As soon as possible could easily mean by end of rented month, who knows! Maybe the OP didn't move out as soon as possible which would have been 1 second after the owner mentioned it.


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    #116
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,513 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Treppen wrote: »
    Yes .

    Can you quantify?

    I want an answer as soon as possible btw

    Good, you are getting the hang of it.

    This is the first opportunity I have had to respond to your request, therefore in this case it is 25mins. I have satisfied your request.
    Treppen wrote: »
    So if a person decided to move out on Monday 15th would you have another person in the 16th to finish out just that month, then leave!

    Considering the LL wants it “as soon as possible” for a family member, it’s a distinct possibility that the new occupant will move in without delay.


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    #117
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,369 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Lorlaa wrote: »
    That’s correct. He just showed up one day and kept coming back. It got to a point that I would see his car outside when getting home from work and I was enraged because he was there AGAIN. I felt so uncomfortable in a place that I was paying to “live” in

    Considering it was shared bills, that's a legitimate complaint. A minor one but still legit


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    #118
    Treppen
    Registered Users Posts: 4,605 ✭✭✭Treppen


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Good, you are getting the hang of it.

    This is the first opportunity I have had to respond to your request, therefore in this case it is 25mins. I have satisfied your request.

    Too late, I meant 5 minutes.

    Dav010 wrote: »
    Considering the LL wants it “as soon as possible” for a family member, it’s a distinct possibility that the new occupant will move in without delay.

    Going by your interpretation of ASAP the family member had to move in 25 minutes from when the conversation finished right!


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    #119
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,513 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Treppen wrote: »

    I want an answer as soon as possible btw



    Treppen wrote: »
    Too late, I meant 5 minutes.




    Going by your interpretation of ASAP the family member had to move in 25 minutes from when the conversation finished right!

    I’m going to quote these posts, and just leave them up there to illustrate the difference between you asking for something asap and having a specific time frame, and the difference between asking for an online reply, and someone moving out of a rented room.


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    #120
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    And as we have learned 'As soon as possible' is ambiguous and cannot be relied upon in a court of law to prove your case.

    We haven’t learned that. You and one other guy who doesn’t understand the meaning of ASAP have muddied the waters, even after the dictionary definition was produced.

    You also seem to think that a tenant or licensee has to give notice if they have been given notice.

    I’ve no idea why you are continuing to argue a position that’s been totally debunked.


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    #121
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Treppen wrote: »
    Too late, I meant 5 minutes.




    Going by your interpretation of ASAP the family member had to move in 25 minutes from when the conversation finished right!

    No that’s your insane definition of the word. ASAP isn’t ambiguous. It doesn’t mean - whenever suits you. It means as fast as possible.

    Try it on google. This is what I got.

    What is another word for as soon as possible?
    quickly, immediately
    directly, soon
    soon after, promptly
    early, expeditiously
    instantaneously

    https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=What+is+another+word+for+as+soon+as+possible%3F&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

    you can’t possibly exist in the adult world and assume that if a boss says ASAP he means take your time.


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