High risk/cohort 7 - GP doesn't seem too interested

ShineOn7

Marine Layer wrote: »

You simply ask someone in the queue or someone that got a text for that mvc
Thats very easy

lol - that's not easy

You simply ask someone in the queue

So you go to a MVC not knowing what vaccine they're doing and ask. And if it's not Pfizer or Moderna, you turn back? Then try again tomorrow?

ask someone that got a text for that mvc

Not really following you there either. How do you source such a person?

Asking on Social Media? WhatsApp groups etc?

None of them sound like they'd work in this scenario or are a bit "shot in the dark"

Not having a dig at you ML, I just don't see how these ways would work out/are straight forward

These are the methods the "government" have left Cohort 7s to resort to though

krissovo

ShineOn7 wrote: »

This might be the case outside of Dublin and Cork, but in both these places (Dublin especially) there are multiple MVCs

And multiple MVCs mean different vaccines

Even if it is not the right vaccine at least you can onto system for the right one.

ShineOn7

ShineOn7 wrote: »

lol - that's not easy



So you go to a MVC not knowing what vaccine they're doing and ask. And if it's not Pfizer or Moderna, you turn back? Then try again tomorrow?



Not really following you there either. How do you source such a person?

Asking on Social Media? WhatsApp groups etc?

None of them sound like they'd work in this scenario or are a bit "shot in the dark"

Not having a dig at you ML, I just don't see how these ways would work out/are straight forward

These are the methods the "government" have left Cohort 7s to resort to though

Its very easy to chat to people in the car park and the queue at an MVC and they will tell you what vaccine is on their texts
Ditto friends or family going to the same centre
Nobody has signed a non disclosure
I've a seperate question for readers,I'm putting in a new post

No immunocompromised people were included in any of the trials for the vaccines we are currently using

Being immunocompromised means vaccines may not work or work poorer
Has anyone here consulted with their GP or specialist about vaccine effacacy reduction for the immunocomprimised
Its very concerning
It is advised that we get them but their magic bullet effect is not guaranteed with us

Has anyone considered contacting pfizer for example to be studied if you have been vaccinated by them?

Wolf359f

Marine Layer wrote: »

No immunocompromised people were included in any of the trials for the vaccines we are currently using

Being immunocompromised means vaccines may not work or work poorer
Has anyone here consulted with their GP or specialist about vaccine effacacy reduction for the immunocomprimised
Its very concerning
It is advised that we get them but their magic bullet effect is not guaranteed with us

Has anyone considered contacting pfizer for example to be studied if you have been vaccinated by them?

It seems to be all down to the medication/treatments. Not all immune suppressed people would be on the same treatment. There's a little detail here:
https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-briefing/2021/04/20/immunocompromised
With figures and comparations.

Wolf359f

Wolf359f wrote: »

It seems to be all down to the medication/treatments. Not all immune suppressed people would be on the same treatment. There's a little detail here:
https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-briefing/2021/04/20/immunocompromised
With figures and comparations.

Interesting and frightening
I wonder as roll out continues world wide are tabs being kept on all immunocompromised types ?

Wolf359f

Marine Layer wrote: »

Interesting and frightening
I wonder as roll out continues world wide are tabs being kept on all immunocompromised types ?

You have to also remember, the fact vaccines also reduce an infected person spreading covid, it's another layer of protection to those immune suppressed people.

I'm sure all breakthrough infections would be recorded for surveillance purposes, possibly only those requiring hospital treatment though. It would give a better idea of what vaccines worked best in certain groups with certain conditions etc...

ShineOn7

Marine Layer wrote: »

Its very easy to chat to people in the car park and the queue at an MVC and they will tell you what vaccine is on their texts
Ditto friends or family going to the same centre
Nobody has signed a non disclosure

I just don't see this working in Dublin where there are multiple, huge MVCs

Running around from MVC to MVC asking "what's the flavour today lads?"

Hope you get sorted soon

ShineOn7

The number has definitely improved on this one below

We just don't know by how much and - based on this thread and #theforgottencohort on Twitter - many are still being ignored

https://twitter.com/irishexaminer/status/1399261876324818952

ShineOn7

https://twitter.com/ToniTaylor546/status/1399410652377239558




https://twitter.com/Adriuzo/status/1399463638994456581




https://twitter.com/m_e_elwardduffy/status/1399387067948359681




https://twitter.com/Wolf_Claw97/status/1399184367914790917

is_that_so

ShineOn7 wrote: »

The number has definitely improved on this one below

We just don't know by how much and - based on this thread and #theforgottencohort on Twitter - many are still being ignored

https://twitter.com/irishexaminer/status/1399261876324818952

The HSE have acknowledged that data is wrong and that some were wrongly added to group 4 instead. That journalist should know that but why let it get in the way of a story. IMO that is a pretty ridiculous attention seeking hashtag. As we've seen on the appointment thread people are more than capable of pushing the HSE via the helpline. TDs are also a good outlet for publicising things. Either of the two is likely to be of more use than venting on social media.

Unrealistic

is_that_so wrote: »

The HSE have acknowledged that data is wrong and that some were wrongly added to group 4 instead. That journalist should know that but why let it get in the way of a story. IMO that is a pretty ridiculous attention seeking hashtag. As we've seen on the appointment thread people are more than capable of pushing the HSE via the helpline. TDs are also a good outlet for publicising things. Either of the two is likely to be of more use than venting on social media.

1) I think it's not so much of a case that the HSE have acknowledged that the date was wrong but rather that the HSE pushed the story that the data was wrong as a self-serving PR response the day after this issue first blew up on social media.

2) Even if you take the HSE's numbers at face value only a maximum of 10% of the Cohort 7 would have been erroneously included in Cohort 4. So at least 90% of Cohort 7 were still unvaccinated, many with no path to being vaccinated, when the HSE started its big push to vaccinate healthy people ahead of them.

3) The HSE rushed through an online module, that was to piggyback on the blood test portal that GPs use, where they could register patients from Cohort 4 or Cohort 7. That failed with the ransomware attack, fair enough, but the main vaccine portal is run by Salesforce and is still working. That the task of adding on a module to that portal for Cohort 4 and Cohort 7 hasn't been given to Salesforce is a huge missed opportunity and an illustration of the lack of priority being accorded to this problem by the HSE.

4) Misleading press releases by the HSE compound the problem and suggest they are more interested in a PR solution than a real solution. How cynical is it to push the story that High Risk people will be allowed to register on the portal and then later issue a clarification that the people at High Risk, and aged 45 to 49, will be able to register with everyone else aged 45 to 49 and anyone younger and High Risk will continue to be ignored.

5) Ranting on social media does have an effect. The news story about Cohort 7 people being included in Cohort 4 was clearly a reaction to the explosion on social media. The social media explosion was then picked up by journalists and their questioning was instrumental in the announcement that GPs would be given a path to book vaccines for patients through the HSE's IT system. I've written to my local TDs, and received responses from all, but the feedback I'm getting does not give the impression that it will actually change anything. The social media push, and having that picked up by the media, has made a concrete difference in at least getting the HSE to acknowledge the issue, even if their response so far is PR based rather than practical.

6) I've got my first dose so I'm not concerned on behalf of myself but I believe it is grossly inequitable that younger people with serious illnesses are not getting vaccinated while hundreds of thousands of healthy people my age are being vaccinated ahead of them. The fact that some Cohort 4/7 patients are able to blag their way to a vaccine through the helpline doesn't change that. Some unofficial pot luck successes don't excuse the fact that there is a significant systemic problem that the HSE is not addressing.

The HSE's actions suggest that they are taking a view that everyone in Cohort 7 will get vaccinated by the end of July anyway, and it's not worth the hassle of trying to prioritise them, but they just don't have the balls to say it.

is_that_so

Unrealistic wrote: »

1) I think it's not so much of a case that the HSE have acknowledged that the date was wrong but rather that the HSE pushed the story that the data was wrong as a self-serving PR response the day after this issue first blew up on social media.

2) Even if you take the HSE's numbers at face value only a maximum of 10% of the Cohort 7 would have been erroneously included in Cohort 4. So at least 90% of Cohort 7 were still unvaccinated, many with no path to being vaccinated, when the HSE started its big push to vaccinate healthy people ahead of them.

3) The HSE rushed through an online module, that was to piggyback on the blood test portal that GPs use, where they could register patients from Cohort 4 or Cohort 7. That failed with the ransomware attack, fair enough, but the main vaccine portal is run by Salesforce and is still working. That the task of adding on a module to that portal for Cohort 4 and Cohort 7 hasn't been given to Salesforce is a huge missed opportunity and an illustration of the lack of priority being accorded to this problem by the HSE.

4) Misleading press releases by the HSE compound the problem and suggest they are more interested in a PR solution than a real solution. How cynical is it to push the story that High Risk people will be allowed to register on the portal and then later issue a clarification that the people at High Risk, and aged 45 to 49, will be able to register with everyone else aged 45 to 49 and anyone younger and High Risk will continue to be ignored.

5) Ranting on social media does have an affect. The news story about Cohort 7 people being included in Cohort 4 was clearly a reaction to the explosion on social media. The social media explosion was then picked up by journalists and their questioning was instrumental in the announcement that GPs would be given a path to book vaccines for patients through the HSE's IT system. I've written my local TDs, and received responses from all, but the feedback I'm getting does not give the impression that it will actually change anything. The social media push, and having that picked up by the media, has made a concrete difference in at least getting the HSE to acknowledge the issue, even if their response so far is PR based rather than practical.

6) I've got my first dose so I'm not concerned on behalf of myself but I believe it is grossly inequitable that younger people with serious illnesses are not getting vaccinated while hundreds of thousands of healthy people my age are being vaccinated ahead of them. The fact that some Cohort 4/7 patients are able to blag their way to a vaccine through the helpline doesn't change that. Some unofficial pot luck successes don't excuse the fact that there is a significant systemic problem that the HSE is not addressing.

The HSE's actions suggest that they are taking a view that everyone in Cohort 7 will get vaccinated by the end of July anyway, and it's not worth the hassle of trying to prioritise them, but they just don't have the balls to say it.

Given that we are now mostly into the 40s, with the under 40s coming in maybe next week it makes sense. My impression is that the HSE always assumed that groups 4/7 would be addressed by GPs, but with some backing out after Group 4 there had no easy process to work out what to do with those remaining apart from by age.

Unrealistic

is_that_so wrote: »

Given that we are now mostly into the 40s, with the under 40s coming in maybe next week it makes sense. My impression is that the HSE always assumed that groups 4/7 would be addressed by GPs, but with some backing out after Group 4 there had no easy process to work out what to do with those remaining apart from by age.

So you are happy to tell an 18 year old, whose chronic illness puts them "at high risk of severe disease and death" in the HSE's own words, that they should wait another couple of months and hope for the best while hundreds of thousands of healthy people get vaccinated ahead of them?

Even GPs who are willing to vaccinate Cohort 7 and the remainder of Cohort 4 aren't getting the doses they need. There is clearly a deliberate policy to override the published priority lists and focus on getting the maximum number of jabs in arms through calling the general population to MVCs. That the HSE doesn't acknowledge this and justify the change in policy, but instead is relying on PR fudges to try to obscure the issue, further damages its already poor reputation.

is_that_so

Unrealistic wrote: »

So you are happy to tell an 18 year old, whose chronic illness puts them "at high risk of severe disease and death" in the HSE's own words, that they should wait another couple of months and hope for the best while hundreds of thousands of healthy people get vaccinated ahead of them?

Even GPs who are willing to vaccinate Cohort 7 and the remainder of Cohort 4 aren't getting the doses they need. There is clearly a deliberate policy to override the published priority lists and focus on getting the maximum number of jabs in arms through calling the general population to MVCs. That the HSE doesn't acknowledge this and justify the change in policy, but instead is relying on PR fudges to try to obscure the issue, further damages its already poor reputation.

Why do posters insist on inventing things that are neither alluded to nor expressly stated in posts? This is all in your head I'm afraid.

You seem to be dug in on this position, that's fine and I get the point about the lack of fairness but I'll ask the one question I've repeated more than once on this.

Why has the risk to certain groups suddenly become greater at a time when the prevalence of the disease is declining?

Unrealistic

is_that_so wrote: »

Why do posters insist on inventing things that are neither alluded to nor expressly stated in posts? This is all in your head I'm afraid.

You made a statement that the HSE's approach "makes sense". There is no doubt that the effect of the HSE's approach is putting people that the HSE has defined as being "at high risk of severe disease and death" at the back of the queue. So it's definitely not "all in (my) head". It's the logical outcome of what you are advocating.

is_that_so wrote: »

You seem to be dug in on this position, that's fine and I get the point about the lack of fairness but I'll ask the one question I've repeated more than once on this.

Why has the risk to certain groups suddenly become greater at a time when the prevalence of the disease is declining?

I don't think anyone has said that the risk has become greater. But those that the HSE determined are at High Risk are now being deprioritised in favour of those the HSE determined to be a lower risk. If the HSE believes that the balance of risk has changed and this approach is justified it should say so. Instead it is trying to maintain a fiction that it is still treating Cohort 7 as High Risk but in practical terms it is doing the opposite.

There's a new pharmacy vaccination system announced today
It should be easy to channel cohort 7's into this
Its not rocket science
They have peoples prescriptions and can measure BMI

krissovo

is_that_so wrote: »

Why has the risk to certain groups suddenly become greater at a time when the prevalence of the disease is declining?

Being high risk I was fine the last 14 months, I could manage my own destiny but I noticed a major change in attitudes of the public and my own family in the last 4 weeks which is increasing risk for the remaining vulnerable as the general public are starting to go into frenzy that its all opening up and yes for the many the risk is diminishing but those still at risk its quite scary.

In my own family now the grandparents, uncles and aunties are vaccinated all rules are off the table, brothers/sisters are back to work. They are now having parties for kids, mass family gatherings that are turning into drunken parties with zero social distancing. This is what fueled me to take action and I do not want them to stop or prevent my kids from joining that fun.

is_that_so

Unrealistic wrote: »

You made a statement that the HSE's approach "makes sense". There is no doubt that the effect of the HSE's approach is putting people that the HSE has defined as being "at high risk of severe disease and death" at the back of the queue. So it's definitely not "all in (my) head". It's the logical outcome of what you are advocating.

Yeah, it's really not advocating, it's an explanation. It's a leap you made and one clearly influenced by your own position on this. Anyway going to move on here.

is_that_so

krissovo wrote: »

Being high risk I was fine the last 14 months, I could manage my own destiny but I noticed a major change in attitudes of the public and my own family in the last 4 weeks which is increasing risk for the remaining vulnerable as the general public are starting to go into frenzy that its all opening up and yes for the many the risk is diminishing but those still at risk its quite scary.

In my own family now the grandparents, uncles and aunties are vaccinated all rules are off the table, brothers/sisters are back to work. They are now having parties for kids, mass family gatherings that are turning into drunken parties with zero social distancing. This is what fueled me to take action and I do not want them to stop or prevent my kids from joining that fun.

We still only have control over our own actions and that includes decisions about where go and what we do.

is_that_so

is_that_so wrote: »

Why has the risk to certain groups suddenly become greater at a time when the prevalence of the disease is declining?

A cohort 7 is as much at risk as at anytime
Arguably higher now that a laissez-faire attitude is creeping in amongst the unvaccinated, which younger cohort 7's and 4's also unvaccinated are more likely to encounter

iamwhoiam

is_that_so wrote: »

Why do posters insist on inventing things that are neither alluded to nor expressly stated in posts? This is all in your head I'm afraid.

You seem to be dug in on this position, that's fine and I get the point about the lack of fairness but I'll ask the one question I've repeated more than once on this.

Why has the risk to certain groups suddenly become greater at a time when the prevalence of the disease is declining?

The groups 4 and 7 were deemed high risk by NIAC and the experts then and now .Unless the risk has changed then they are still at risk and should be prioritised .Its that easy really because the message hasnt changed just the priority it seems .

This thread was great for helpful ideas or how to get a vaccine for the at risk group .Now it seems they have to justify why they are at risk and why ?

is_that_so

iamwhoiam wrote: »

The groups 4 and 7 were deemed high risk by NIAC and the experts then and now .Unless the risk has changed then they are still at risk and should be prioritised .Its that easy really because the message hasnt changed just the priority it seems .

This thread was great for helpful ideas or how to get a vaccine for the at risk group .Now it seems they have to justify why they are at risk and why ?

Nobody is claiming they need to justify anything but the de facto position of the HSE now seems to be to funnel everyone though the portal by age. That suggests that all people can do is make a case based on their cohort, either through the helpline or as other posters have said the less likely route through their GP.

Even if is by age, it doesn't mean that the HSE may not specifically focus on this group as they have done with some of the over 50s this week.

fun loving criminal

krissovo wrote: »

Being high risk I was fine the last 14 months, I could manage my own destiny but I noticed a major change in attitudes of the public and my own family in the last 4 weeks which is increasing risk for the remaining vulnerable as the general public are starting to go into frenzy that its all opening up and yes for the many the risk is diminishing but those still at risk its quite scary.

In my own family now the grandparents, uncles and aunties are vaccinated all rules are off the table, brothers/sisters are back to work. They are now having parties for kids, mass family gatherings that are turning into drunken parties with zero social distancing. This is what fueled me to take action and I do not want them to stop or prevent my kids from joining that fun.

I am in group 7, same issues as the rest that fall into group 7, gp not vaccinating, being told to wait by age. And I had someone tell me to go get the vaccine so they could do what they want. They don't understand that alot of us are still waiting. And even if I wasn't in group 7, there is still a large amount of the population unvaccinated, 18-44 are still waiting to register. There is alot more selfishness regarding all this.

agoodpunt

my relative got a vaccine today he is 61 and cohort 4 stopped by security but they where very helpfull and got a member of HSE to meet him and was offered a pfizer if he joined the queue he is now a happy camper.
They told the helpline is useless so go direct yourself if you have been passed this was the Croke park centre.

krissovo

fun loving criminal wrote: »

I am in group 7, same issues as the rest that fall into group 7, gp not vaccinating, being told to wait by age. .

Turn up at your vaccination center, take proof of being group 7 and there is a good chance they will sort you out. There is a growing list on here who have done the same and have been vaccinated.

suisi

krissovo wrote: »

Turn up at your vaccination center, take proof of being group 7 and there is a good chance they will sort you out. There is a growing list on here who have done the same and have been vaccinated.

Does anyone know what time most of the MVCs open until in the evenings?

iamwhoiam

suisi wrote: »

Does anyone know what time most of the MVCs open until in the evenings?

The latest I heard in City West was a 6:30 appointment

agoodpunt

krissovo wrote: »

Turn up at your vaccination center, take proof of being group 7 and there is a good chance they will sort you out. There is a growing list on here who have done the same and have been vaccinated.

All you need is to be registered and just give them ur PPS number they will have you on the system
He didnt have to show id but was amazed at the amount of younger age people there.

is_that_so

suisi wrote: »

Does anyone know what time most of the MVCs open until in the evenings?

The Helix is going to 12 hour shifts, might be the same for some of the other very big ones.