A, B or C: you die anyway

ohnonotgmail

starkid wrote: »

50 states and two extra jurisdictions - Alaska and Hawaii.

So in effect lets call it 52 states. It just renforces the point, comparing the justice system in small homegenous countries with such a behomouth is just disingenuous.

I mean look if Russia doesn't do the death penalty, then its kind of means you may be the bad guy.

But if people don't want the death penalty then lets not pretend life should mean life in many many cases.

Huh?? Alaska and hawaii are states. the two extra jurisdictions are Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia.

Capt'n Midnight

starkid wrote: »

50 states and two extra jurisdictions - Alaska and Hawaii.

Puerto Rico abolished the death penalty in 1929.

More US citizens than 21 states or DC.

starkid

50, 52 whatevs

But that last point is part of the complexity of it all. I mean it ties into that whole bull**** around America and the idea its not a colonial power even though it has about 14 territories.

To bring it back to justice, this is my point. Its a continent housing every viewpoint and culture known to man, more than any other nation. Judging it from this ISland and our way of life is wrong imo.

We have people in this country holding the view that execution is wrong. Thats fair enough. But those very same people would also argue that life means life is wrong. Tell that to the victims of a double or triple murder. We have the opposite extreme in this countrry, and imo its just as disgraceful at times. people like Michael McHugh or the lad in DOnegal that killed a Garda walking free.

TheValeyard

It's a barbaric act that has no place in a civilised society.

starkid

TheValeyard wrote: »

It's a barbaric act that has no place in a civilised society.

Somebody murders somebody in cold blood, do you think life should mean life without release?

TheValeyard

starkid wrote: »

Somebody murders somebody in cold blood, do you think life should mean life without release?

I believe there must be a way to rehabilitate the person to make them a productive member of society. That does not nessessarly involve release in the short or long term.

starkid

TheValeyard wrote: »

I believe there must be a way to rehabilitate the person to make them a productive member of society. That does not nessessarly involve release in the short or long term.

So even if they've murdered or raped children, or comitted multiple murders?

You see this is the issue people like me have.

There is no rehabilitation to be had for the extreme murders (of which in America there is loads). They deserve to die in prison. Crimes of passion, manslaughter yeah that can be argued for etc.

And we can judge America all we want, there would be multiple millions of people who would be just outraged at your opinion.

Baggly

Mod

Barring perhaps the first response, this thread doesnt belong in AH. Moving to CA now.

TheValeyard

starkid wrote: »

So even if they've murdered or raped children, or comitted multiple murders?

You see this is the issue people like me have.

There is no rehabilitation to be had for the extreme murders (of which in America there is loads). They deserve to die in prison. Crimes of passion, manslaughter yeah that can be argued for etc.

And we can judge America all we want, there would be multiple millions of people who would be just outraged at your opinion.

Ah outraged at my opinion...... I dont care.

Eye of an eye old testament sh1te is not needed in this day and age.

osarusan

If they did the firing squad properly - somebody presses a button/flips a switch that pulls a trigger on a gun that's 6 inches away from the head - it would be the quickest and thus probably be the least inhumane (wouldn't be a 'squad' anymore I suppose).

Why they still have people firing at the heart from a distance away is baffling.

starkid

TheValeyard wrote: »

Ah outraged at my opinion...... I dont care.

Eye of an eye old testament sh1te is not needed in this day and age.

Yeah but people are equally outraged at the US position. Hypocrisy much?

Locked up for life for evil heinous crimes is though.

Overheal

Mickeroo wrote: »

Alaska and Hawaii are part of the 50 I thought. DC and Puerto Rico are the extra jurisdictions to bring it to 52, otherwise there's only 48, or am I going mad?

50 state constitutions and a federal constitution DC is under federal law. Then the US territories.

This State sucks though. Passing anti abortion laws and ushering in firing squads. The sanctity of life logic on full display

Stovepipe

osarusan wrote: »

If they did the firing squad properly - somebody presses a button/flips a switch that pulls a trigger on a gun that's 6 inches away from the head - it would be the quickest and thus probably be the least inhumane (wouldn't be a 'squad' anymore I suppose).

Why they still have people firing at the heart from a distance away is baffling.

They have tried an automated system whereby a gun on an automated mount fires a shot directly into the heart, when a timer is started. This does away with the need for a firing squad but requires a human to initiate the process. When Gary Gilmore was shot by firing squad, it was done in such a way that the firing squad could only see the patch of cloth over his heart through their sights and he could not see them. 12 rounds through the heart means that death is about as instantaneous as you can get. The old Russian system was to fire a single pistol bullet into the brain stem from behind. Death was also instant. In the case of Gary Gilmore, they were allegedly oversubscribed with volunteers to shoot him.

the purple tin

Stovepipe wrote: »

They have tried an automated system whereby a gun on an automated mount fires a shot directly into the heart, when a timer is started. This does away with the need for a firing squad but requires a human to initiate the process. When Gary Gilmore was shot by firing squad, it was done in such a way that the firing squad could only see the patch of cloth over his heart through their sights and he could not see them. 12 rounds through the heart means that death is about as instantaneous as you can get. The old Russian system was to fire a single pistol bullet into the brain stem from behind. Death was also instant. In the case of Gary Gilmore, they were allegedly oversubscribed with volunteers to shoot him.

Would a captive bolt gun not be the best? Like they use on cattle and the baddie in No Country For Old Men had.

Stovepipe

Possibly not instant enough for some folks. No matter what method you use,somebody will claim that it's inhumane/too slow/messy,etc,etc

JustAThought

Stovepipe wrote: »

Possibly not instant enough for some folks. No matter what method you use,somebody will claim that it's inhumane/too slow/messy,etc,etc

their relation or loved one probably them wasnt the one mutilated/gang raped/ abused and murdered etc so. Usually bleeding heart liberals who tend to get frostier when the murders or child abusers victims are closer to home.

The reason they use a firing squad is so no one man feels guilty for having killed directly - used be they’d have a gun with blanks for added psychological comfort. Far more humane than the lives destroyed or awful deaths of their innocent victims.

I think the Japanese have the right idea about crime and punishment. EmWatched a documentary a while back on their prison system - one nominated visitor only, no tv, mindless marching and drilling for exercise, bland food, witk parties with no party involved, no bleeding hear liberals visiting or handing them smokes/playstations and of course the possibility of a sudden death if your crime is deemed awful or brutal enough or involves innocent children. Seems reasonable & fair. I’d be dissappointed with them if they gave up the death penalty.

Personally I think we should bring it back.

Choices :

- removal of all useful organs for donation and then left to die under anaesthetic. Body allowed to be reclaimed by family for burial given you have been generous and served a useful purpose.

- nice inexpensive eco-friendly hanging
- guilloteine

Then cremation and either spread in prison compound or on payment of fee returned to family.

- All assets including house/ car/ bigscreen tv of the criminal to be seized by the courts and paid to the families of the victims or their estate or their preferred cause .

Crime should not pay.

Pherekydes

starkid wrote: »

50 states and two extra jurisdictions - Alaska and Hawaii.

Did you ever hear of Hawaii five oh? What do you think the 5-0 represents?

What do you think the 50 stars on the Star Spangled Banner represents?

Back on topic: murder is murder!

Overheal

Pherekydes wrote: »

Did you ever hear of Hawaii five oh? What do you think the 5-0 represents?

I hope you're not suggesting it's meant for the 50 states.

corner of hells

Overheal wrote: »

I hope you're not suggesting it's meant for the 50 states.

I hope he is .

ohnonotgmail

Overheal wrote: »

I hope you're not suggesting it's meant for the 50 states.

somebody earlier didnt even think that Hawaii was a state.

Quantum Erasure

Overheal wrote: »

I hope you're not suggesting it's meant for the 50 states.

Not all of them, just the 50th

Pherekydes

Overheal wrote: »

I hope you're not suggesting it's meant for the 50 states.

Hawaii was the 50th state admitted to the union.

ohnonotgmail

Pherekydes wrote: »

Hawaii was the 50th state admitted to the union.

indirectly that is the reason. its come from the TV Show Hawaii 5-0

Pherekydes

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

indirectly that is the reason. its come from the TV Show Hawaii 5-0

The name of the TV show came from the fact that the state was the 50th. Not the other way around.

ohnonotgmail

Pherekydes wrote: »

The name of the TV show came from the fact that the state was the 50th. Not the other way around.

yeah I know. The show was named Hawaii 5-0 because Hawaii was the 50th state and the police are called 5-0 after the show.

begbysback

Can you not just buy your own drugs, like down a few Valium first and then whack in some hard stuff like heroin?

NewbridgeIR

odyssey06 wrote: »

Why did they stop with hanging as an option if they are now going back to firing squad?

Hanging is a secondary option in New Hampshire if you're on death row pre-2019.
Last man to be hanged in USA was in 1996.

Someone mentioned guillotine earlier; there is an interesting eye-witness account of France's last execution by guillotine in 1977. Written by a judge who was present at the prison in Marseilles. See here and scroll down to the heading 20 Minutes to Death: Record of the Last Execution in France

"This man is going to die, he knows it; he knows that he can do nothing but delay the end by a few minutes. And he became almost like a child that will do anything to delay bedtime! A child who knows that he will be treated indulgently, and who makes use of it."

stoneill

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Huh?? Alaska and hawaii are states. the two extra jurisdictions are Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia.

And that is why it is called Hawaii 50.

Hande hoche!

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

yeah I know. The show was named Hawaii 5-0 because Hawaii was the 50th state and the police are called 5-0 after the show.

Never knew the police bit. Every day is a school day.

kildare lad

iffandonlyif wrote: »

Good lord, that really is barbaric. 'Closure and justice' shouldn't mean eye-for-an-eye.

Just out of curiosity if someone raped and murdered your wife/ daughter , would you like to see them get the death penalty ??