Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

SSeanSS

Strazdas wrote: »

Interesting vox pop of people in Ennis in their 20s on Drivetime earlier. Most of them said they would have no problem taking AZ or J & J and would be happy just to be offered a vaccine. So the idea that they would mostly refuse AZ or J & J if offered it might have very little substance in fact (especially with talk now that the AZ second dose might be shortened even further).

I'm 31 and would happily take AZ if offered. I haven't seen enough data on J & J against the Delta variant so wouldn't take that.

ACitizenErased

The amount of people on Twitter trying to discredit the vaccines with the Delta variant is actually scary.

ACitizenErased

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The amount of people on Twitter is actually scary.

FYP

ACitizenErased

Deleted User wrote: »

FYP

No you didn't, but okay.

mightyreds

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The amount of people on Twitter trying to discredit the vaccines with the Delta variant is actually scary.

I was out there Wednesday for a few pints and was chatting to a good few people, lads who wouldn't be online that much, RTE and facebook probably their main source of news, all telling me their not getting the vaccine as its useless against the Delta variant and the Delta plus is twice as bad.

The media scaremongering has a downside it seems.

Deeper Blue

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The amount of people on Twitter trying to discredit the vaccines with the Delta variant is actually scary.

To be expected when the ISAG lunatics are given free rein to peddle their lies, and RTE are only too happy to indulge them.

Graham

mightyreds wrote: »

I was out there Wednesday for a few pints and was chatting to a good few people, lads who wouldn't be online that much, RTE and facebook probably their main source of news, all telling me their not getting the vaccine as its useless against the Delta variant and the Delta plus is twice as bad.

That's an odd conclusion considering the amount of reporting suggesting vaccinations are the solution.

mightyreds

Graham wrote: »

That's an odd conclusion considering the amount of reporting suggesting vaccinations are the solution.

Good news like that doesn't generate clicks unfortunately and the negative news is also exaggerated a bit in our media lately.
Might not be RTE, I guessed at that and shouldn't have, could have been some other outlet, but they had made the decision that they weren't getting the vaccine cause they were useless against the delta variant.

Dickie10

registered on wednesday afternoon the 23rd June, got text today for first jab on Friday 2nd July, ; Pfizer.
Age 37

Graham

mightyreds wrote: »

could have been some other outlet, but they had made the decision that they weren't getting the vaccine cause they were useless against the delta variant.

I don't know of any mainstream media where. the overriding message isn't pro-vaccination.

Does their usual 'news' source. extoll the danger of 5G radiation by any chance?

Either way, I don't think it's particularly representative of the larger population here.

mightyreds

Graham wrote: »

I don't know of any mainstream media where. the overriding message isn't pro-vaccination.

Does their usual 'news' source. extoll the danger of 5G radiation by any chance?

Either way, I don't think it's particularly representative of the larger population here.

Ah the good old if they aren't getting the vaccine they are a conspiracy nut, no they are not just normal lads. There was a scare in the media there that vaccine effectiveness on delta was way down so it's not hard to see where they got the information. Even if you want to throw a blind eye to those reports.

Luckily I didn't mention it being representative of the wider population just a few lads I hang round with down the pub that was all, I didn't try to say everyone feels that way.

baldbear

Dickie10 wrote: »

registered on wednesday afternoon the 23rd June, got text today for first jab on Friday 2nd July, ; Pfizer.
Age 37

Where ya based?

Qrt

Taking the decision to unfollow the covid threads on boards, gotta stop obsessing over them all. I’ve gotten mine now, hopefully won’t be too long for all of you. Thanks for all the info in the meantime!

tfeldi

I can't get my head around the fact that cases in many European countries are dropping much faster than here. Germany reported 592 cases yesterday against 380 cases in Ireland - with a substantial difference in population. Reopening and vaccine roll out happen at a different pace - but not significantly different pace.

So, what is the reason and why is this not discussed much?

Lumen

tfeldi wrote: »

I can't get my head around the fact that cases in many European countries are dropping much faster than here. Germany reported 592 cases yesterday against 380 cases in Ireland - with a substantial difference in population. Reopening and vaccine roll out happen at a different pace - but not significantly different pace.

So, what is the reason and why is this not discussed much?

It's possible that lower delta percentage has contributed, but that's a relatively recent development and Germany's cases and positivity rates have been declining for a while now.

They are about 5% ahead of us in full vaccinations as a % of total population, and have been less restrictive about dosing by age - vaccinations have been open for booking for all adults since early June.

Restrictions vary by local authority, but in Berlin FFP2 masks are required on public transport, in all non-private indoor spaces like shopping centres. Proof of negative Covid test, vaccination or recovery is required for indoor dining. They've essentially implemented domestic covid "passports".

There are also free daily rapid antigen tests.

So I'm guessing that this combination of better targetted restrictions, free rapid testing, more diffuse vaccine coverage including into the more socially active age groups, plus behaviour differences (the famous German tedency to follow rules combined with the feeling amongst young people that they are close to being vaccinated, which we know tends to make people more careful) have all combined positively.

I don't want to get into restriction or behaviour bashing on this thread, but just because certain rules are in place doesn't they are the best rules or that people will follow them, and Ireland's restrictions have been particularly badly targetted. For instance, the complete lack of progress on mask advisories despite it being common knowledge that cloth face coverings do nothing in poorly ventilated indoor spaces. I've been double-masking with a FFP3 and cloth face covering since January but this is extremely unusual in Ireland.

So in summary, we might be in the same position as Germany if we had re-opened more but with sensible restrictions, embraced free rapid antigen testing, and given people more ways to safely enjoy life, and the extra vaccine coverage was the icing on the cake.

degsie

Still fuming I stepped forward for the AZ first dose and now feel totally exposed to the new variants. Won't happen next time!

duffman13

degsie wrote: »

Still fuming I stepped forward for the AZ first dose and now feel totally exposed to the new variants. Won't happen next time!

Stepped forward? What's wrong with AZ? Still waiting your 2nd dose or something?

tfeldi

Lumen wrote: »

It's possible that lower delta percentage has contributed, but that's a relatively recent development and Germany's cases and positivity rates have been declining for a while now.

They are about 5% ahead of us in full vaccinations as a % of total population, and have been less restrictive about dosing by age - vaccinations have been open for booking for all adults since early June.

Restrictions vary by local authority, but in Berlin FFP2 masks are required on public transport, in all non-private indoor spaces like shopping centres. Proof of negative Covid test, vaccination or recovery is required for indoor dining. They've essentially implemented domestic covid "passports".

There are also free daily rapid antigen tests.

So I'm guessing that this combination of better targetted restrictions, free rapid testing, more diffuse vaccine coverage including into the more socially active age groups, plus behaviour differences (the famous German tedency to follow rules combined with the feeling amongst young people that they are close to being vaccinated, which we know tends to make people more careful) have all combined positively.

I don't want to get into restriction or behaviour bashing on this thread, but just because certain rules are in place doesn't they are the best rules or that people will follow them, and Ireland's restrictions have been particularly badly targetted. For instance, the complete lack of progress on mask advisories despite it being common knowledge that cloth face coverings do nothing in poorly ventilated indoor spaces. I've been double-masking with a FFP3 and cloth face covering since January but this is extremely unusual in Ireland.

So in summary, we might be in the same position as Germany if we had re-opened more but with sensible restrictions, embraced free rapid antigen testing, and given people more ways to safely enjoy life, and the extra vaccine coverage was the icing on the cake.

Thank you. Some food for thought

Graham

Lumen wrote: »

They are about 5% ahead of us in full vaccinations as a % of total population

According to ECDC

Germany
One Dose 60.9 %
Fully Vaccinated 37.2 %

Ireland
One Dose 63.8 %
Fully Vaccinated 38.4 %

EU/EEA
One Dose 57.9 %
Fully Vaccinated 34.9 %


Looks like we're slightly ahead of Both Germany and EU average.

degsie

duffman13 wrote: »

Stepped forward? What's wrong with AZ? Still waiting your 2nd dose or something?

Yep, 2nd dose is a long time coming.

duffman13

degsie wrote: »

Yep, 2nd dose is a long time coming.

It'll be done soon depending on part of the country your in. I was called a week early but a few i know in work have been called at 8 and 9 weeks now.

Caquas

Caquas wrote: »

What about all those older people waiting for their second jab of AZ?

Remember all the fuss about cohorts? They sliced and diced the population into sixteen different cohorts who were going to get inoculated in a precise order based on risk. Then they dumped that and substituted 9 cohorts based largely on age. The teachers and the Guards were threatening to strike when their priority was lost.

https://www.thejournal.ie/vaccine-overhaul-government-ireland-5396168-Mar2021/

Turns out that was all BS. What matters is which vaccine you get. If you got AZ, you're on the slow train. Many younger people with no special risks are now getting J&J . One jab and you’re home and hosed. I got my first jab of AZ six weeks ago, the HSE can’t say when I’ll get my second appointment but it could be late July.

The weird thing is, it’s probably for the best. Most cases now are among the young. Not that the geniuses who cooked up the 16 cohorts had a clue about that.

It took a couple of weeks but the major media have now spotted the absurdities of the vaccine roll-out. FO’T in today’s IT does a good job explaining the twists and turns. The readers’ comments show public patience is running out.

The Government face an impossible choice next Tuesday- delay re-opening or ignore NEPHT and take the blame if the Delta variant brings another surge. The medics keep saying “it’s a race against time” but that’s because they got the rollout wrong, leaving most over-60s still waiting for their second AZ jab (because they were used “to mop up the supplies” of AZ.)


https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-those-who-did-what-they-were-told-on-vaccines-now-feel-like-eejits-1.4601196

St.Spodo

fun loving criminal wrote: »

Where will this leave us come September? We're not going to have young people vaccinated by the time schools and colleges open again.

I think this is the biggest question facing us this summer. Looking at the level of educational disruption caused by Delta in the UK, whereby hundreds of thousands of unvaccinated children are currently self-isolating, it is quite possible that similar will happen here in the autumn. We won't have any children under 16 vaccinated by early September.

AdamD

Caquas wrote: »

It took a couple of weeks but the major media have now spotted the absurdities of the vaccine roll-out. FO’T in today’s IT does a good job explaining the twists and turns. The readers’ comments show public patience is running out.

The Government face an impossible choice next Tuesday- delay re-opening or ignore NEPHT and take the blame if the Delta variant brings another surge. The medics keep saying “it’s a race against time” but that’s because they got the rollout wrong, leaving most over-60s still waiting for their second AZ jab (because they were used “to mop up the supplies” of AZ.)


https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-those-who-did-what-they-were-told-on-vaccines-now-feel-like-eejits-1.4601196

Using Pfizer on the over 60s and letting more AZ go to waste would have been more ridiculous

giveitholly

Hitting over 50k doses a day the last 4 days

https://twitter.com/muirtheimhne/status/1408673920904052737?s=19

duffman13

Caquas wrote: »

It took a couple of weeks but the major media have now spotted the absurdities of the vaccine roll-out. FO’T in today’s IT does a good job explaining the twists and turns. The readers’ comments show public patience is running out.

The Government face an impossible choice next Tuesday- delay re-opening or ignore NEPHT and take the blame if the Delta variant brings another surge. The medics keep saying “it’s a race against time” but that’s because they got the rollout wrong, leaving most over-60s still waiting for their second AZ jab (because they were used “to mop up the supplies” of AZ.)


https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-those-who-did-what-they-were-told-on-vaccines-now-feel-like-eejits-1.4601196

NIAC have badly hamstrung the roll out, even the slow dropping of age limits meant the older cohort were given AZ as they were the only real option.

It wasn't an issue up until the Delta variant and hindsight is great. The real issue is there should have been am immediate movement to do 2nd doses as soon as stock became available. Its happening now but as much as I complain about the HSE/NPHET, the restrictive guidance on AZ/JJ has slowed down things.

Caquas

duffman13 wrote: »

It wasn't an issue up until the Delta variant and hindsight is great. The real issue is there should have been am immediate movement to do 2nd doses as soon as stock became available. Its happening now but as much as I complain about the HSE/NPHET, the restrictive guidance on AZ/JJ has slowed down things.

It was an issue with me, though the Delta variant now makes it critical, and it’s not just hindsight.

It was absurd to give AZ jabs to top priority groups even though that really put them to the back of the queue. What gets me is the fuss that was made about 16 cohorts, slicing and dicing the population for their first jab when they must have know the second jab is what matters (or didn’t they?)

CruelSummer

St.Spodo wrote: »

I think this is the biggest question facing us this summer. Looking at the level of educational disruption caused by Delta in the UK, whereby hundreds of thousands of unvaccinated children are currently self-isolating, it is quite possible that similar will happen here in the autumn. We won't have any children under 16 vaccinated by early September.

But schools and colleges have been open since March and children haven't been vaccinated? Why the goalpost change now? Children are not seriously affected by Covid, and most of the adult population will be vaccinated by Autumn hopefully. Anyone quoting the ISAG figure of 1 n 7 children will get Long Covid need to realise that's a lie / misinformation but it seems ok for them to say anything they like these days without getting pulled up on it. It was 1 in 7 children who were already in hospital that might get Long Covid.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Caquas wrote: »

It was an issue with me, though the Delta variant now makes it critical, and it’s not just hindsight.

It was absurd to give AZ jabs to top priority groups even though that really put them to the back of the queue. What gets me is the fuss that was made about 16 cohorts, slicing and dicing the population for their first jab when they must have know the second jab is what matters (or didn’t they?)

Pre delta (or actually pre South African but that never got prevalent here) there was a lot of evidence that a single shot provided 50%+ protection from coronavirus and 90-95% protection from hospitalisation and death.

As such there was a priority to giving as many first doses as possible while obeying manufacturers instructions on second doses.

The UK didn't obey the manufacturers instructions on second doses (giving Pfizer second doses after 12 weeks) as part of their strategy to get as many people as possible with some protection.

duffman13

Caquas wrote: »

It was an issue with me, though the Delta variant now makes it critical, and it’s not just hindsight.

It was absurd to give AZ jabs to top priority groups even though that really put them to the back of the queue. What gets me is the fuss that was made about 16 cohorts, slicing and dicing the population for their first jab when they must have know the second jab is what matters (or didn’t they?)

I'm sorry but this is revisionism, immunologists were advocating for us to follow the UK and stretch out the dosing regimes for mRNA as first dose efficacy against severe illness was so high. The delta variant has changed the thought process of a lot of people which is exactly hindsight as it didn't exist when these operational decisions were made.

Priority was made to not waste vaccines, get as many first doses into people as possible and vaccinate as quick as possible.