Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

seamus

The "someone" is kind of a catch-all. Some children may not be in the care of a guardian, they could be with a social worker, foster parent, etc.

On the non-consenting issue, the consent of only one parent or guardian is required for medical decisions. The other parents' non-consent does not override this.

The non-consenting parent can get a court order to have a stay put on the procedure while the court rules on it, but if the consenting parent goes ahead and does it before anyone gets to a court, then there's fvck all the other can do about it, and they've done nothing wrong or illegal.

There was a vaccination case a couple of years back where a mother was anti-vax but the father wanted his baby to get vaccinated. He could have just done it, but obviously unsure about the legality of it, he brought it to court where the judge ruled that being vaccinated was in the childs' best interests.

Functionally this creates an established precedent where any consenting parent who wishes to get an appropriate vaccination for their child, may do so without seeking consent from the other.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746683#Comment_117746683

Thank you, that makes it clearer, I just thought the Somebody reference a little vague 😉

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746203#Comment_117746203

Is that good or bad? How many in Ireland are in that age group like?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117744358#Comment_117744358

I was fine in the beginning but then 25 days after my first jab of moderna I got another pain in my arm and was out for the count for about 24 hours afterwards with fever, fatigue and chills

Of course i did get my second jab 25 days after my first so that could be the cause

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746246#Comment_117746246

There may well be rational reasons why some choose not to take a vaccine. What we tend to hear is irrational fear however.

Also, even those who make a reasoned decision not to take a vaccine are still wrong unless its for specific medical reasons

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746991#Comment_117746991

You cant argue with "my body, my choice", but you also cant argue that its in any way rational

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746991#Comment_117746991

You could make the argument that his lack of vaccination could cause you to catch a breakthrough infection putting you and your households lives at risk, especially if you have a young child at home... Meaning your entitlement to bodily autonomy gets negatively affected but his entitlement

growleaves

'In any case your friend is choosing their bodily autonomy over somebody elses'

That is not correct. Vaccinated people have not lost bodily autonomy just because unvaccinated people walk the earth and according to some hypotheses this doesn't entirely eliminate their own chances of a breakthrough infection.

cgcsb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746844#Comment_117746844

There's about 250,000 12 to 15 year old so it's roughly a quarter of the cohort. But it's only the first 2 days. The government should come up with some incentives. Adults have indoor drinking and dining, there should be some motivation for teens also

iamwhoiam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746991#Comment_117746991

Yes and my argument back to him would be then its my choice to avoid you and not allow you in my house or in my space .

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747206#Comment_117747206

25% is not bad at all in the first 2 days to be fair and if there's a few walk-ins happening this weekend the actual number being vaccinated should get a good boost

The point of indoor hospitality was a public health measure, not a motivational move, the 12-15 age cohort are unlikely to need motivation, just like the adults...

seamus

We don't need incentives for younger cohorts while we're still stacking them up.

On the first day of the portal opening for 69 year olds, about half of that age group signed up. Considering there's considerably less urgency in the younger cohorts, 25% signing up on the first 2 days is huge.

We will get to the stage of offering incentives, but unlike the US, it'll be smaller scale. Universities will have walk-in centres offering a voucher for a free pint or coffee or sandwich with each jab, outside of that will be a €5 voucher for McDonalds or entry into a draw to win an iPhone or something.

BrentMused

Hello all,

I attended my second dose appointment this morning. Signed in at the check-in desk and was in and out very quickly.

All fine, but a short time ago I received a text advising that I did not attend and would be sent new appointment details.

Contacted the HSE line who were baffled. They've opened up a case and someone will get back to me.

Just wondering if this has happened to anyone else and was it any difficulty in getting sorted?

I brought the vaccination card with me which now has the batch lot sticker on it (put on by the nurse), and the date given, but my worry is that they will say that anyone could have filled that in (which is true) and there's no proof that I actually received it?

Many thanks.

ceegee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747511#Comment_117747511

If you log into the website does it show that you've received both doses?

machaseh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117743664#Comment_117743664

Cant find an appointment through Boots so maybe I wont put it in no.

BrentMused

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747561#Comment_117747561

Coming up as a cancelled/unattended appointment according to HSELive.

I wonder if the nurse maybe forgot to hit the button on the tablet, as we were chatting throughout and she brought me out for some water afterwards?

She did ask if I consented etc. It's a strange one.

I do have the batch lot stuck onto the vaccine card so I assume that every batch is tracked and they'll be able to trace it in the end, although I am sure it will take plenty of back and forth!

ixoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748127#Comment_117748127

There was an issue with their systems this morning :https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0813/1240613-reid-vaccine/

Possibly that's the reason and it'll get cleared up.

revelman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747206#Comment_117747206

There are 280,000 in that age group according to HSE. But uptake is still incredible.

JTMan

Interesting, and depressing FT article on Israel. Israel on the Verge of New Lockdown ...

https://www.ft.com/content/c21e2053-0373-4b8e-80b7-fad10f235604

• From a few dozen daily cases in early June — even zero on June 9 — new Covid infections twice hovered near 6,000 this week, the highest daily rate in six months.
• The Israeli ministry of health has twice revised downwards the long-term efficacy of the jabs — from the advertised 94 per cent protection from asymptomatic infections against the then-dominant Alpha variant, to as low as 64 per cent.
• Officials predict at least 5,000 people would need hospital beds by early September, half of them with serious medical needs, twice as many as Israel is equipped to handle.
• $770m emergency plan to double hospital capacity to deal with seriously ill patients.
• Prospect of locking down the State over the high holidays.
• FT Comment: If there’s a lesson to be learnt from Israel today, it is this: corona, in fact, is not over. This summer was just an intermission. Next comes winter.

JPup

Israel's vaccination rate plateaued at just below 60% of total population. Seems like a much higher figure is needed to reach herd immunity as well as booster shots.

revelman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748339#Comment_117748339

I think the real concern this winter in Ireland will be the flu mixing with other respiratory diseases (including Covid). I read an interesting article about immunity and the flu. It stated that it is quite important that the flu circulates each year as the population builds up some level of natural immunity each year. Because of social distancing, we have had virtually no “normal” respiratory viruses circulating and little immunity built up since last year. A relaxing of social distancing this winter will mean that the flu is likely to spread in a much more significant way this winter.

blackcard

Another 56k vaccinated yesterday, 12k first doses and 42k first doses bringing Ireland to 62% of population fully vaccinated, 70.5% of population partly dosed. Though I did see Paul Reid say that supply of mrna vaccines the country is currently down to 200000k/week

BrentMused

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748156#Comment_117748156

Many thanks for this. I wasn't aware of the IT issue.

I rang back to follow up and it is now showing as course complete on the main portal, but unattended on another system of theirs.

The guy I spoke to asked his supervisor to look into it and supervisor feels that once I am down as course complete on the portal that I should be fine and that the unattended issue may simply be down to the IT problems earlier.

He said give it until Tuesday or Wednesday next week and if no cert is forthcoming to contact the DCC helpline.

I have to say the staff on the HSELive site are excellent, in my experience anyway. That's the 4th time I've spoken to them and always found it to be an efficient and friendly service. Fair play.

JTMan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748448#Comment_117748448

Yeah, some say there is a risk of RSV, respiratory illnesses, flu and Covid at a lesser rate combined overwhelming hospitals this Winter. There are reasons to think it will happen and reasons to think it won't.

There is international evidence of RSV and respiratory illnesses increase in spread.

Will a flu serge happen? Immune deficits are a reason to be concerned but there are little international evidence, yet, of a flu surge. Plus some say Covid and flu 'compete' so if Covid is circulating, flu circulation is reduced. Also, there is less ways for flu to replicate given that it has not being circulating for the last year.

Flu is a big unknown this Winter but a RSV and respiratory surge this Winter seems possible.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748448#Comment_117748448

Thats rather surprising re the flu given that it mutates so much year on year we need different vaccine strains to cope with it and people can get infected year on year with different strains afaik.

Would a large scale flu vaccine campaign not achieve much the same effect?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746430#Comment_117746430

Well Pfizer and Moderna are currently being investigated by the EMA over new possible side effects; two kidney disease and a skin reaction. Maybe they’re factoring that in? It was only announced a couple days ago though so who knows.

MrStuffins

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748927#Comment_117748927

"Maybe"

Maybe you could let the poster answer the question instead of plucking guesses out of your a*se

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117746891#Comment_117746891

Factually wrong or morally wrong? And how can you be so certain?

I saw people argue prior to the revelations about blood clots and heart conditions as side effects that the injections simply didn’t have any possible way to cause side effects beyond the mild immune response you’d normally expect from a vaccine, because the spike proteins produced when the RNA is decoded just ~poof!~ disappears. Then came the capillary syndromes, the heart issues, the cerebral bleeds, and those same people simply rolled it all into their existing all-vaccines-the-same-and-good position and switched to “well they’re rare and they happen within a few weeks so it’s ridiculous to be concerned about long-term safety.” And now this week the EMA are investigating three new side effects; Erythema multiforme, glomerulonephritis, and nephrotic syndrome.

Even if you are of the opinion that it would require a very significant rate of serious side effects to change the balance on the benefits of these injections, which is a reasonable position to hold, to call those with concerns about more side effects coming to light irrational seems at this point (and even as concerns are being raised by the authorities responsible for monitoring medical safety) to be… well. Irrational.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117748942#Comment_117748942

LMAO

Yo, buddy. Don’t quote my post, ask me a direct **** question and then get your frilly knickers in a twist when I give you an answer. It’s not making you look the way you think it’s making you look.

If you’re that desperate for an answer from the poster, maybe try quoting their post and asking them.

Christ.

MrStuffins

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117749066#Comment_117749066

I did.

You were throwing your own two sents in so I asked you too.

You started making assumptions about what the poster meant, I called you on it.

JEC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747206#Comment_117747206

You would think vaccination against a deadly disease would be enough of an incentive!

Or maybe the reason incentives are required is that this vaccine provides no health benefit to a healthy child. According to the HSE, male 12-15 year olds have a 1 in 16,000 of developing heart inflammation post vaccination compared to their 1 in 100,000 chance of being hospitalised with Covid if they remain unvaccinated! However, the HSE claim they should be being vaccinated 'to maintain access to educational opportunities' and to 'faciliate pyschosocial development'. Silly old me, I thought the purpose of a vacccine was to prevent disease.