Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

Steve012

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117891975#Comment_117891975

"Even more so" ... Not really no, 50% of people in ICU have been fully vaccinated, that's the long and the short of it.

Wasn't the vaccine "originally" made for those who were vulnerable in society? The very people with underlining issues and immune issues? 🤔

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896079#Comment_117896079

I think you're having a bit of a breakdown.

50% of the people in hospital are those who are in the non-vulnerable groups and unvaccinated, the other 50% are those with underlying conditions and a weak immune system where vaccines will be less effective, this was known well in advance, the way to protect those people is via herd immunity and reducing spread of the virus, the idiots causing most of that are the unvaccinated cohort like yourself.

You not getting vaccinated is putting both yourself at risk and putting the vulnerable at risk, you have to live with your sins for doing that.

Steve012

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896099#Comment_117896099

Brilliant !! 😂😂😁👍🏽

nocoverart

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117892071#Comment_117892071

One of the worst posts I’ve read on here since this sh1t began, and that says a lot. I’d actually ban your ass if I was a mod on here.

Steve012

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896139#Comment_117896139

Why ban?? It's freedom of speech, plus my post was factual? why be so hostile man? "Now according to mod rules" your back seat modding and you should receive a warning for that statement 😁👍🏽

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117891564#Comment_117891564

I dont think you are right that vaccinated people are getting infected because of less efficient immune systems.

"Even though he was ‘double-jabbed’, Meyler was among those to contract Covid after the virus got into his own family home."

Thats him holding the sam maguire, his mother works in covid wards is fully vaccinated and still brought it home unfortunately.

Hes probably one of the fittest young men in the country, fully vaccinated and still caught covid.

These vaccines protection you from severe illness of current strains, not from getting covid.

Maybe your saying this to make yourself feel better, but vaccines reduce risks massively from severe illness.

Infection risk is still very leaky to say the least.

A vaccinated person got infected and infected another vaccinated person in the example above.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/if-somebody-drops-on-this-pitch-whos-to-blame-tyrone-players-reveal-the-inside-story-of-their-covid-crisis-40854742.html

nocoverart

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896146#Comment_117896146

I’ll survive. Worth it rather than tolerating misinformation.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896146#Comment_117896146

There's no freedom of speech on the internet, but I see you're using it to make ridiculous statements that you can't debate over anyway so not much of an issue in this case.

Steve012

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896182#Comment_117896182

There's always freedom of speech, just you folks on here are so biased

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117892071#Comment_117892071

Why would you regret it?

Nobody under 50 fully vaccinated has died in the UK in the last month. See statistics in video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPrKA5p9a_I

3 young people unvaccinated reported in newspapers today in NI.

Mother and daughter (32) care workers died days apart and beds apart.

46 year old DUP councilor died recently.

NI is less than 5% of UK but theres load of big data vaccines saves lives.

Steve012

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896265#Comment_117896265

You Trust Nurse John Campbell as a source?? 🙄

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896256#Comment_117896256

Go on then, add some discussion, back yourself up with facts and evidence and engage rather than calling everyone biased and look weak.

Both science and religion are on the side of vaccines, the Taliban are anti-vaccines, are you in the same group as the Taliban? You're someone who has faith yet are completely ignoring it and putting others at risk due to your own selfish reasons, how do you rationalise your actions?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896268#Comment_117896268

Hes going to make them up?

Ive read similar reports.

Vaccine reduce covid risk by around 10 times.

So why are all these young unvaccinated dieing in NI?

Why did one of the Tyrone footballers unvaccinated end up in hospital?

Unvaccinated is a mixture of mistrust of government, marginalised in society and fear.

They are mainly hurting themselves.

How would you and your relatives feel if you got sick with covid, ended up in hospital taking up time and resources from nurses and doctors.

If you end up in hospital with covid you might permanently hurt your organs etc.

These are the regrets unvaccinated have when in hospital with covid.

How preventable it all was.

As AZ creator Sarah Gilbert says, that first vaccine dose, does the greatest benefit.

Covid is no longer a novel disease when vaccinated.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896169#Comment_117896169

Thanks for that !

But what I said was correct. I think you are misunderstanding my post .

Most of the vaccinated people getting breakthrough infections are those older with waning immunity or those with compromised immune systems . These are the vaccinated coming into hospital now.

Obviously viral load at point of infection comes into play so in higher infective areas eg healthcare, people would be more at risk than others because exposure to the virus is much higher and more frequent .

So yes , am very concerned about catching it as I got my vaccine in the first batch , and dread bringing it home to my immunocompromised son or others in the family .

That young guy would be one of the unfortunate few that can also get breakthrough infection. You know VE is not 100% effective and even this can affect those fit and healthy . (Or did you say he was unvaccinated , don't follow )

However they are less likely than the other groups to get infected or get a severe illness.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117896146#Comment_117896146

Your post is not factual . It is a manipulation of the facts . And you are here posting long enough to know that .

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897421#Comment_117897421

He wasnt unfortunate, he was asymptomatic, but its clearly not rare to get a breakthrough infection.

He is supremely fit healthy and vaccinated with pfzier only a few months ago and still caught it.

Annecdotely I know a local case of a young lady who got AZ got it and infected everyone in house, husband (pfzier) and two children unvaccinated.

The children unvaccinated were sicker than their parents. Its doing its job.

This thing of only old and sick getting breakthrough infections is an urban myth at this stage, due to new strains and waning immunity.

At this point in time with current vaccines we all have to accept we are going to get this.

From your perspective youve likely had covid so no need to worry too much and from younger people UK statistics out recently in last month, nobody vaccinated

under 50 died of covid in a country of over 60 million and infection rates very high.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897488#Comment_117897488

With the usual vaccines vs the original strain that were say ~95% effective, meaning you will statistically see 5% breakthrough cases.

Obviously with delta that % is lowered.

The issue is, even if there was no waning of immunity over time, if it was the original strain still in circulation but at the same incidence as we have now, you would still see a lot of breakthrough cases in the immune suppressed people. People fail to realize for many of them, 2 jabs may as well be 1 jab and 1 placebo, it's that ineffective for them. Last I seen, ~40% of hospitalizations in Israel and ~60% in UAE among fully vaccinated people are immune comprised.

And your last point, I'm not sure you've seen this chart posted in the restriction thread today? That's a total of 38 deaths under 50 in people fully vaccinated in the UK.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897488#Comment_117897488

The fact that I may have had Covid , and vaxxed means nothing when working in a high risk environment. I know people who have got it again and while they were very mildly sick they were infectious enough to give it to others in their families.

I will not be at ease tbh until my son gets that extra dose , as like Wolf says although he is fully vaxxed it is not over for him .

Many breakthrough infections don't end up in ICU once fully vaccinated unless they are old eith underlying conditions or have immunocompromise.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897571#Comment_117897571

Another poster put that graphic up on the Delta thread saying .. look it's not that bad ! And that is just those registered over 3 weeks!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897571#Comment_117897571

I thought it was 0 when you look at graphs on John Campbells of those figures.

Its still statistically 0 for under 50 given the 60 million population and the high levels of infection.

RIP to those individuals.

Say the 40-49 risk fully vaccinated is 0.4 per 100,000.

The risk is 1 in 250,000 of dying in that age category.

The risk of a rare very dangerous blood clot for AZ was lower than that for people in that age group.

A medical doctor would call this vanishingly rare risks of dying of either.

All we can do is keep jabbing (boosters and unvaccinated).

I think we need to go to lower age groups for vaccines.

Say 5 and over with dose of pfzier only.

We also need to look at early at home treatments for people.

This can still swamp our hospitals unfortunately.

Alot done more to do.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897614#Comment_117897614

It means everything if you got covid and werent hospitalised.

Your body dealt with it without severe illness and you are also vaccinated.

In all liklihood a doctor would tell you are unlikely to get very sick if infected.

You've been exposed three times by the virus (naturally + vaccinated).

Those numbers are brilliant and if people are so worried after vaccination why not

get an antibody test after vaccination rather than worrying when maybe you dont need to?

Worry by your body sometimes is a call to action.

To walk around and think my vaccine probably hasnt worked and not get an antibody test

seems like alot of undue worry. Information is power and some control over the situation.

I listened to this indian doctor who treats alot of covid patients, every month he checks his vitamin d

and antibodie levels. He is calm and in control. Over the top for most people, but you have got to

respect the man for taking control of his situation and not being overly negative.

I know I tested for both and its helped my confidence.

Being too negative is a covid risk in itself.

is_that_so

Interesting new research based on the chemicals in cigarette smoke! Very early days, just lab tested.

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210912/Drugs-that-mimic-effects-of-cigarette-smoke-could-become-a-potential-tool-to-fight-COVID-19.aspx

Steve012

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897571#Comment_117897571

Great post!, you post this and the breakdown of cases, I posted that over 50% of people in ICU are double jabbed, and I got ripped on here for it...... 🙄

Apogee

A long, detailed Twitter thread which summarises recent findings on vaccine efficacy from Public Health England - worth a read.

Infection

https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1438100718112628740

Hospitalisation

https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1438100728623546373

Impact of underlying conditions

https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1438100734181089281

Death

https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1438100740946501634

And Israeli data on boosters

https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1438100753894215684

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897665#Comment_117897665

It's not that I think my vaccine hasn't worked . Where have I said that ? I have been looking after Covid patients without so much as a sniffle up to this week .

The issue is

1. I am higher risk because I am a frontline health worker

2. I am well over 50 and have underlying high risk conditions .

3 . Most importantly , my vaccine shots were end December and January so the vaccine will by all the evidence be waning now .

4. My husband and another son are high risk , but one of my sons is very high risk being on immunosuppressant therapy .

5. Even though I keep fit , eat well and am in as good shape as possible the above conditions will predispose me towards less effective immunity . I would hope that I would have good t cell and b memory cell immunity because of vaccination and possible previous infection , but I won't know that until I become infected if ever , and I can't risk that especially for . my son

So my risks are fairly big . No doctor would tell me that I am unlikely to get sick , as you say in your post . The opposite in fact . Considering quitting work as my family situation is so risky now .

I just hope they roll out extra doses for those vulnerable and immunocompromised asap , would be happy with that tbh .

I would hope that boosters would be given to other vulnerable groups and HCWs, but it may not be in time to keep me at work .

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117901182#Comment_117901182

Have a look at the previous post on vaccine effectivity. The waning is real but has been significantly overplayed. Anyone but the very high risk should be fine without a booster. Get them to countries that actually need them

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117901807#Comment_117901807

Yes . Saw that after I posted .

Looks like great data on initial read , but it doesn't take into account high risk categories working in high risk healthcare .

I agree totally that only high risk need boosters , and that is what I have said all along .

We will never get rid of this until all the world sufficiently vaccinated .

However frontline healthcare workers are 2.6 times more likely to get infected with Alpha, don't know what the risk is with Delta but would imagine it's a lot higher .

I would be high risk along with 3 family members and my son would be especially , so should be getting a third dose soon , according to Paul Reid .

I initially stepped back from my role and while still working in the area tried to keep in the background but due to illness in other essential colleagues ended up back on frontline once vaccinated .

I didn't mind as felt safe initially , and love my job , but now am increasingly anxious having seen people catching it again , even though mild .

I can't afford even a mild dose not for me , but for my son, and that unfortunately is my situation going into this winter .

Early retirement or special leave beckoning , I think , without a booster ;)

floorpie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117900859#Comment_117900859

Full paper is here, also worth a read: PHE monitoring of the effectiveness of COVID-19 vaccination - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

CTRL+F "Vaccine effectiveness and duration of protection"

The Twitter guy says "Waning much more muted (if happening at all) among under-65s", but the paper points out that it wasn't actually assessed, which is why the lines are missing on the graphs...not because it may not be happening at all.

Apart from the waning immunity, another interesting thing stands out to me in the data table (below), which is the amount of people reporting with symptoms of sickness unrelated to COVID-19. Going by the number of 16+ people currently vaccinated in UK, and 16+ population of UK, 7.5% of vaccinated people reported with symptoms unrelated to COVID-19 during this period, vs 5% of unvaccinated people.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117901909#Comment_117901909

Is it that they don't have that data yet , as in it was mostly AZ they gave initially ?

floorpie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117901935#Comment_117901935

Yeah exactly, there was "insufficient follow-up time in this group", they say. For the same reason that they couldn't fully assess infection with the alpha variant: "Follow-up data after infection with the Alpha variant was also limited because this variant stopped circulating by the time the later follow-up periods were reached"