Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

Former Former Former

People like the OP are like that Japanese soldier who was still fighting World War 2 until 1975. Except that guy eventually got the memo.

The debate is over. The vaccines worked incredibly well. The lunatic conspiracy theories were no more than that. The bullshit about ivermectin, chloroquine and all the other snake oils was just gullible people being exploited by conmen.

For those who are genuinely interested, the vaccines worked very well against transmission of the earlier variants because they were designed for these. Once we hit Delta and subsequent mutations, the virus resembled the original version less and less so efficacy against transmission waned. This was always going to happen once Covid proved to be so adaptable.

I wouldn't use the data as a stick to beat vaccines with.

I would use it though to question lockdown policies and the narrative that this illness is a risk to all of us.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481770#Comment_119481770

What part of the lockdown policies do you disagree with in terms of trying to overcome an infectious disease that had the potential to kill (and did kill!) a lot of vulnerable people?

As for the narrative that it was a risk to us all, well it was and still can be. Many healthy peope got covid and are still suffering the after effects.

As for the data being used as a stick to beat us or anything else with, would you rather our government, along with pretty much all other governments, recommended that doing nothing?

Jesus, I wish people would shut up moaning because they were inconvenienced somewhat.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481892#Comment_119481892

Just for clarity - a lockdown is not merely an 'inconvenience', it is a complete change in the way a 'free' society operates - a reconfiguration of the social contract. Lockdowns cause enormous societal, psychological, educational and economic damage, to name a few. To say that lockdown is an 'inconvenience' is a pretty narrow view of the policy.

Liberal democracies work because we are largely able to do our thing, pursue our own interests - with appropriate limitations on liberty (not stealing for example). Lockdown deprived many of us of this ability.

If lockdown didn't affect you, then good for you. But for many it was a catastrophe - do they not matter? I thought we were supposed to care about one another...

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119482138#Comment_119482138

But for many it was a catastrophe - do they not matter? I thought we were supposed to care about one another...

When it comes to whether someone cannot travel more than a few KM from home during a highly infectious influenza pandemic unless it is an essential trip then nope, it doesn't trump someone's right to not be infected.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119482218#Comment_119482218

Is there such a thing as a right not to be infected by an airborne, respiratory pathogen? Where does it say that in the constitution, or the declaration of human rights - please show me.

P.S. people, as you rightly point out - people are still getting sick with this (I am referring to C19 now, not flu - as you seem to be), and some are dying - why aren't we in lockdown now then?

Also, we are not just talking about being allowed more than x km's from home - that is not the only affect of lockdown - I am sure you are in agreement on this?

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119482218#Comment_119482218

Where is the line though. You are calling for level 5 lockdowns for the flu now. What about the winter vomiting bug? Or some cold viruses. How do we define when to lockdown and by how much?

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481277#Comment_119481277

I read these two links.

They state that the vaccines reduced illness and deaths.

I don't see any reference to the vaccines reducing "the spread of the virus".

AFAIK, the vaccines reduced illness, hospitalisation and deaths, but did not reduce transmission or infection.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481654#Comment_119481654

Sure if you have not been infected you can't transmit anyways, vaccine or no vaccine.

If I don't the virus in me, then I can't pass it on.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481704#Comment_119481704

Equally there are people out there, and I saw one today, walking down the street in a quiet suburban area with a face mask on, they were the only person on that street and where the danger was is a mystery.

There are people who have yet to let go of this on either side of the debate, possibly because it has the potential to come back every year.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119482578#Comment_119482578

Strawman nonsense.

Look at the figures for hospitalisations and ICU admissions. The people, including 'healthy' people who pulled through with medical support. Restrictions and vaccines were about ensuring that capacity was there to treat covid and non-covid patients.

And multiple studies have shown reduction in infection and transmission for both the 2021 and Omicron variants. This protection wanes however having significant protection against infection for months is important in a pandemic, for the reasons outlined above.

Lancet Study from Sweden in 2021

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(22)00089-7/fulltext

Qatar Study focusing on Omicron

https://news.weill.cornell.edu/news/2022/06/qatar-omicron-wave-study-shows-slow-decline-of-natural-immunity-rapid-decline-of

walus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481277#Comment_119481277

The first study did not control for factors such as rules on wearing a face mask masking and physical distancing at the time, which may have affected their results. It did not establish the causal relationship between the vaccines and the death rate. Causation vs correlation. Massive difference.

The second article is based on a computer modelling from CDC. As the time goes by CDC there is more and more question marks over their decision making and how they have been influenced by pharma and politics. As for the computer model we can only hope that it is a bit better than the one used by some so called experts in Ireland/UK.

political analyst

I'm aware of the research being done on a pan-coronavirus vaccine but why would it be necessary to have a new vaccine to apply to the Alpha strain as well as to Omicron? After all, the Alpha strain has run its course, hasn't it?

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119485347#Comment_119485347

A new variant may emerge which is not based on Omicron and so Alpha may be as good as you can get.

Carrie098

Was wondering I had covid last week, I'm over 60 so eligible for booster, reading a a article lately saying omicron doesn't boost your immune system, so do I have to still wait 4 months for booster.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119496557#Comment_119496557

According to the below HSE website you should still wait 4 months:

Plus a study in Qatar showed that 'hybrid' immunity of vaccination and Omicron is the strongest protection you can have.

https://news.weill.cornell.edu/news/2022/06/qatar-omicron-wave-study-shows-slow-decline-of-natural-immunity-rapid-decline-of

HSE:

If you had COVID-19, wait at least 4 months since you tested positive or from when your symptoms started.

https://www2.hse.ie/screening-and-vaccinations/covid-19-vaccine/get-the-vaccine/covid-19-vaccine-booster-dose/

tandcapply

A question re covid cert and getting the 1st booster shot more than a year after getting the initial 2 dose Pfizer:

I'm due a visit to the US next year.they require non us citizens to be fully vaccinated.

I had the 2nd Pfizer last July and was not intending to take another, but as it stands, I'll need to have a valid covid cert in order to enter the US.

CDC's website states:

"Are you Fully Vaccinated for Air Travel to the United States?You are considered fully vaccinated:

• 2 weeks (14 days) after your dose of an accepted single-dose vaccine
• 2 weeks (14 days) after your second dose of an accepted 2-dose series
• 2 weeks (14 days) after you received the full series of an accepted COVID-19 vaccine (not placebo) in a clinical trial
• 2 weeks (14 days) after you received 2 doses of any “mix-and-match” combination of accepted COVID-19 vaccines administered at least 17 days apart*

If you don’t meet these requirements, you are NOT considered fully vaccinated. A booster dose is not needed to meet this requirement."

URL: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/travelers/proof-of-vaccination.html

What I'm not sure of, is that since the covid cert I have is showing up as expired, will it be allowed in the US. Rather not chance it but prefer to know for sure first

Does anyone know if taking a 3rd shot after this long will make the covid cert valid again?

I'm not even sure where to get vaccinated now that mass vaccination centres are gone but that's a different issue

political analyst

If scientists can create vaccines that prevent the transmission of other viruses then why have they been unable to create vaccines that could prevent the transmission of coronavirus?

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119508247#Comment_119508247

You seem to be fully vaccinated by this clause:

• 2 weeks (14 days) after your second dose of an accepted 2-dose series

Doesn't say anything here about the expiry date.

https://www.dfa.ie/travel/travel-advice/a-z-list-of-countries/united-states-of-america/

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119508794#Comment_119508794

Well the vaccines do prevent transmisison but the immunity wanes as you need quick response antibodies in your mucous membrane.

They haven't been able to create vaccines that prevent transmission of a virus if you can spread it when infected in mucuous membrane.

For the other viruses, you become infectious more slowly - only when the infection gets into the lymphatic system or blood. So there's much more opportunities for the vaccine immune system to trigger \ respond in time.

(paraphrasing from an article I read in New Scientist a while back)

DLink

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119508247#Comment_119508247

The initial two jabs have you covered for the USA with no need for a booster.

leahyl

For some reason they send me a covid vaccination cert again - I got the vaccine in June (1st dose) and July (2nd dose) last year - the one they sent me says for latest dose and the June 2021 date.....

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119482317#Comment_119482317

It's easy enough to forget you're wearing one after being in a shop, etc.

Their choice is not affecting you in any way so why pass comment on it? Their medical history is unknown to you and none of your business.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548231#Comment_119548231

Same, would guess its either an old notification queued to be sent or someone performing some database maintenance.

Hippodrome Song Owl

Is there any update on the plan for a third booster for the elderly? The HSE website states that if you are over 65 and had the second booster over 4 months ago then you will be offered your next booster "soon".

But with the flu vaccine now available I'd have thought there was more specific information ready to go about whether GPs will be doing both together or what.

ddarcy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119552178#Comment_119552178

There are flu/Covid dual vaccines going through clinical trials now. Initial rollout should be starting. My guess is HSE wants to see what happens here and then get going. Probably know more later this month.

so could be one jab or two (one for flu and probably another dose of Pfizer/ Moderna or nova vax in stock)

ddarcy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119552562#Comment_119552562

On this it’s being reported that the omicron vaccine is in final stages of approval with the EMA and they’ve opened up the next round of boosters.

Honestly I’d wait instead of getting the same over again (just my opinion)

https://www.thejournal.ie/ema-set-to-approve-omicron-specific-covid-vaccines-5854837-Sep2022/

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-vaccine-booster-long-term-conditions-5854694-Sep2022/

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119552840#Comment_119552840

I would share that opinion. Only catch is that by the time the lower age groups become eligible for a dose the chances are the next wave will have come and gone and we will once again have missed the opportunity to get ahead of the virus

ddarcy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119558796#Comment_119558796

If it wasn’t for the fact that basically everyone has now been hit by ba1 /ba4/5 I’d agree. But personally I’ll wait if I get it since I got omicron. (Again this is me personally everyone else can make up their own minds)

odyssey06

New Covid-19 vaccine boosters which protect against strains of the Omicron variant will be rolled out from next month. The National Immunisation Advisory Committee (NIAC) has recommended authorised adapted bivalent vaccines for all those aged 12 years and older who are eligible for a booster vaccination. The new boosters include components of the original virus strain of Sars-CoV-2 and the Omicron variant.

First booster doses continue to be offered to people aged 12 and older and people aged 5 to 11 with a weak immune system who have yet to receive one.

Second boosters are being offered to the following:

• People aged 50 to 64
• People aged over 12 who are at high risk of severe illness
• People aged over 12 in a long-term care facility
• Healthcare workers
• Pregnant women (over 16 weeks)

Anyone who is eligible for both a flu vaccine and a Covid booster vaccine can receive them at the same time from participating GPs and pharmacies from next month once its been at least four months since their last Covid-19 vaccine or infection.

https://www.thejournal.ie/new-covid-booster-jabs-omicron-strain-next-month-5868741-Sep2022/