Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

speckle

Lumen wrote: »

Some perspective.

A 30 year old with a 30 BMI has no higher probability of death than their age group, and only a 25% higher risk of hospitalisation.

This is in rank 14 out of 100, where 100 is most at risk.

Lumen, please would you post a link to that scoring system. And is it that you take your highest scoring co morbidty and what if you have more than one is there a math equation behind it? Thanks

Edit just realised are you talking about one of those apps?

Lumen

Gile_na_gile wrote: »

All that extra ramp-up energy seems to have hit a neverending wall of 40-something year olds that never seems to clear. I know it is the population bulge in our demographic, like that bit of dense rock sheet when mining. Can hope against hope for a quick turnaround from registration to vaccination, at least for 44 year olds who will soon be the new 48 year olds. Means no full protection until end of July on mRNA platform.

Maybe my expectations are wrong.

If we are taking two weeks per 5-year age group we'll have hit age 35 by end of June, and that would mean 2.7m people (+extras from young HCW and cohort 4/7) would have been vaccinated, and vaccine hesitancy will probably cancel out the effects of those extras.

2.7m is 71% of the adult population, which is what the EU are signalling as the end-June target.

We're only one week into the 45-49s, so maybe there's not much cause for griping yet.

Lumen

speckle wrote: »

Lumen, please would you post a link to that scoring system. And is it that you take your highest scoring co morbidty and what if you have more than one is there a math equation behind it? Thanks

Edit just realised are you talking about one of those apps?

Yeah, this

https://qcovid.org/Calculation

I don't know of a better way. My main point by referencing these risk calculators is not to dismiss the concerns of the cohort 7s, but just put the risks in context to avoid people panicking. They're high risk relative to their age group but in absolute terms the risk may not be concerning (but depends on condition).

bennyineire

Lumen wrote: »

Maybe my expectations are wrong.

If we are taking two weeks per 5-year age group we'll have hit age 35 by end of June, and that would mean 2.7m people (+extras from young HCW and cohort 4/7) would have been vaccinated, and vaccine hesitancy will probably cancel out the effects of those extras.

2.7m is 71% of the adult population, which is what the EU are signalling as the end-June target.

We're only one week into the 45-49s, so maybe there's not much cause for griping yet.

But this is boards :D

SuperTortoise

Where should someone in their late 30,s with asthma be in the cohort list?

Sun2Snow

seamus wrote: »

Anecdotally hearing of a lot of that too; people who happen to know a GP well through whatever means, are getting a call and being given a spare dose because the GP has a load leftover.

It's a bit of a kick in the teeth tbh after all the kerfuffle made about nepotism in the Coombe and elsewhere, to hear that GPs are engaging in widespread nepotism with doses because they made a balls of cohort 7.

I'm not sure if that *is* impacting rollout, but it would explain why there's been a pause and a bit of silence about when they're going to open the next age cohort.

Of course there will always be anomalies however Not everyone knows what other people’s health history is. Some people appear to be fit and healthy but behind it all aren’t.

I have had my vaccine (thankfully), if you ask some of my friends they would question it and would ask me what Dr do I know. I fall into Coh-4, but that’s between me and my Dr.

Zipppy

JimmyVik wrote: »

How long since you got the first dose?

4 weeks today

ACitizenErased

SuperTortoise wrote: »

Where should someone in their late 30,s with asthma be in the cohort list?

You need to be on steroids to be prioritised as an asthmatic.

harr

Marine Layer wrote: »

My GP is telling people like that to lose weight
He is not vaccinating them

same as mine , I am just about 30 BMI but fairly healthy and fit enough and my GP said he isn’t doing anyone close to a 30 BMI will only do those who are morbidly obese and who’s health suffers because of weight issues and most of those would have additional health issues.

mossie

SuperTortoise wrote: »

Where should someone in their late 30,s with asthma be in the cohort list?

I'm a bit older, 56, with relatively mild asthma. Doc told me I'm on his next group for vaccine (cohort 7?) but I've already been vaccinated based on age. Don't know if asthmatics in general would fall into the same group.

Goldengirl

astrofool wrote: »

Cutting down to the actual questions (again, the average age of a HCW is lower than the age of those at high risk of COVID, that doesn't mean that there isn't older HCW):

a) If second doses aren't being given, that is bad, those due second doses should be getting them followed up with on schedule as soon as possible, we shouldn't be giving out first doses if we're lagging on second doses. The HSE is literally in charge of the rollout so how is this happening and who in the HSE is to blame for not getting vaccines to it's own staff.

b) Younger HCW aren't being treated different, they are following the dosing schedule (at least if the second dose is being scheduled properly), the risk of hitting an issue from AZ is very low (and is now treatable), much lower than the risk of getting COVID in a hospital setting. There is very little data on an AZ/mRNA schedule to say that it is safer or less safe than an AZ/AZ schedule and this data won't be available for multiple months, you are at best swapping a known low risk issue for an unknown level unknown risk issue.

As for the tone, that is your issue and your choice not to reply, people are waiting patiently for vaccines and the HCW's are now complaining that their vaccine (that they already got) isn't as good as the vaccine other people are getting, you were in the privileged position of being able to be vaccinated first because it was essential to your job after taking multiple risks last year in order to keep many people alive and not die, that should be commended, but again, the risk of an average HCW dying from COVID was less than that of an older person or a person in a care home, if it was coming down to just risk of dying then HCW would not have been getting vaccinated first (and I fully agree that HCW were correctly in the first rollout groups including all admin and backend staff because so many hospitals were understaffed last year with HCW isolating) and that makes it a privilege even if you see it as a requirement to do your job. It is clearly not an absolute must as the HCW job was being done for 9 months when vaccines didn't exist (and this is being pedantic, remembering I completely agree with HCW being first, but that is an emotional response by me).

edit: I would also add that saying "It is a disgrace" in your first post already moves it into an emotional state, I checked my response and it doesn't look like there was any emotion used there in my replies so it could be that you're projecting the emotions into my post that didn't exist, if I did, I apologize about that, I try and make my posts about facts and data and avoid anecdotal evidence, that can be cold but I can stand over them as introducing emotion does not lead to good outcomes when we're talking about a health crisis.

Again your responses are true to form. All blanket statements little fact .

Show me the source that you have for average age of a health care worker in Ireland .

Younger HCWs ARE being treated differently to the general population who are not been given AZ .
The risks were and still are higher for HCWs while Covid is circulating in the community.
Ridiculous to say otherwise really ( maybe even stupid )
A third of all cases of Covid are in healthcare workers .
I have written many more posts on the subject prior to you jumping in with your condescending drivel , not just that one you quoted.

The fact that you still think it a" privilege " and write a whole paragraph on it shows you are just on a wind up here .
....so called privilege that nurses should get a vaccine to protect them while they work through this caring for people with the most infectious disease in the midst of a pandemic .
And they should be happy with that and shut up , now I know you are trying to be insulting .
Do you or have you worked yet and di you know anything about conditions at work and employer obligations for health and safety of workers ?
Don't think so by your reply .

If you reply to me again on this I won't be answering .

Lucas Hood

https://twitter.com/DonnellyStephen/status/1399362915791159297?s=19

is_that_so

Call me Al wrote: »

A BMI over 30 is a covid risk factor.

Healthy or otherwise, statistically you are at an increased risk of a poorer outcome with a high BMI and that is classified as over 30.

It needs to be a lot more than just a BMI of over 30. A body with a good level of muscle mass will be in that range and definitely not in the at risk category.

is_that_so

mightyreds wrote: »

Ah that makes sense I would have to put up 3 stone to fit into that category so a major difference

Group 7 includes people in that BMI >35 category.

Strazdas

Interesting snippet from the European Commission today that member states are free to allow people to travel on the EU digital green certificate having received only one vaccine dose.

Let's see what Ireland does on this one.

rubberdungeon

The vaccine registration portal will open for people aged 40 to 44 from this Wednesday, the Minister for Health has said.

TheDoctor

rubberdungeon wrote: »

The vaccine registration portal will open for people aged 40 to 44 from this Wednesday, the Minister for Health has said.

Does anyone know when its open for 35-39 year olds :pac:

RavenBea17b

Woody79 wrote: »

I put the blame with NIAC. They seem very unsure of AZ. Granted its an evolving situation, but they have made far too many changes:

1. Not safe for over 70's
2. Suspended it briefly
3. Not safe for under 60's
4. Not safe for under 50's
5. Possibly safe for 40-50's


They actually have given up now and are just posing lots of questions to Tony Holohan to address.

Should we shorten length between doses?
Should we give Pfzier as second dose?

My opinion is they have a responsibility to instill confidence in vaccines. They have made too many changes and approaches in relation to AZ.

If they were to offer a certain cohort Pfzier then quite rightly many who had one dose of AZ will want this approach too.

Your also into the realm of a live trial given the small number of people who got an AZ and then a Pfzier.

Rollout will be delayed also for all beneath them.

Chance of getting blood clot second time is between 1 in 600,000 to 1 in a million.

Chance of dieing is probably one in a few million.

Has anyone in ireland died of AZ blood clot?

I have had one dose of AZ and am slightly nervous of getting second dose but im probably being irrational when you look at statistics.

The overall public good is:

Keep giving AZ second shots.
Were shots are available let over 50's get second shot after 8 weeks.

Does anyone have a link to reported side effects registered in Ireland for all the Covid vaccines. I've tried looking, but cant find it.

is_that_so

RavenBea17b wrote: »

Does anyone have a link to reported side effects registered in Ireland for all the Covid vaccines. I've tried looking, but cant find it.

Not looking hard enough - 2 second Google search!

https://www2.hse.ie/screening-and-vaccinations/covid-19-vaccine/

40 year old here. So my understanding is that we'll get a choice of vaccine?

Strazdas

Deleted User wrote: »

40 year old here. So my understanding is that we'll get a choice of vaccine?

Not in the sense that you can pick your own vaccine. At the moment though, it looks like you will be offered either Pfizer or Moderna.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

40 year old here. So my understanding is that we'll get a choice of vaccine?

No, you'll be given either Pfizer or Moderna.

In theory you could be offered J&J if either of those two were unavailable, but given the supply issues with the latter that's not likely. The HSE have also said it's not manageable.

astrofool

Goldengirl wrote: »

Again your responses are true to form. All blanket statements little fact .

Show me the source that you have for average age of a health care worker in Ireland .

HSE report here showing the median age for infection with SARS-COV2 for a HCW in January was 40, this is also likely raising the age as younger groups are more likely to be asymptomatic and not tested (understanding that there is blanket testing occurring as well), but taking the average as 40, a 40 year old is much much less susceptible to COVID than a 60+ year old:
https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/surveillance/covid-19casesinhealthcareworkers/HCW_report_20%2001%202021_1.0_website%20version.pdf

Goldengirl wrote: »

Younger HCWs ARE being treated differently to the general population who are not been given AZ .

Yes, they got vaccines first ahead of anyone else of their age group. They got the best vaccine available to them at the time. Nothing has changed in this.

Goldengirl wrote: »

The risks were and still are higher for HCWs while Covid is circulating in the community.
Ridiculous to say otherwise really ( maybe even stupid )
A third of all cases of Covid are in healthcare workers .
I have written many more posts on the subject prior to you jumping in with your condescending drivel , not just that one you quoted.

I'm not sure what attacking my post as condescending will do, if you have facts to refute the post, please include them. There is no point where I said that the risks for HCW being exposed were less than other groups.

Goldengirl wrote: »

The fact that you still think it a" privilege " and write a whole paragraph on it shows you are just on a wind up here .
....so called privilege that nurses should get a vaccine to protect them while they work through this caring for people with the most infectious disease in the midst of a pandemic .
And they should be happy with that and shut up , now I know you are trying to be insulting .
Do you or have you worked yet and di you know anything about conditions at work and employer obligations for health and safety of workers ?
Don't think so by your reply .

If you reply to me again on this I won't be answering .

I repeated multiple times that I agree that HCW were correctly prioritised for vaccination, but you are not looking at the big picture, a 30 year old nurse was receiving vaccination before a 70 year old person, the 70 year old is multiple times more likely to die from COVID than a 30 year old nurse, every vaccine given to a young HCW meant one less vaccine for someone at multiple times risk of dying. This was the price we paid as a society to keep our hospitals running so that we could have capacity to treat patients.

Someone working on tills in a supermarket or gardai or firemen or multiple other professions that are public facing were also taking risks every day, less risk than HCW, but they were not prioritised, again, because the risk of them dying of COVID was much much less than that of an older person that wasn't working in a public facing role. Health and safety of workers also applies to these workers. It also applied to HCW before vaccinations were available, it doesn't mean they don't work, HCW did trojan work day in day out keeping people alive and keeping hospitals running which is why it's more bizarre that the HSE themselves haven't been organising them properly for second doses.

This is not a wind up, but do try and take the abstract view of the situation, you do not need to reply.

xboxdad

Strazdas wrote: »

Interesting snippet from the European Commission today that member states are free to allow people to travel on the EU digital green certificate having received only one vaccine dose.

Let's see what Ireland does on this one.

Brilliant... Knowing that 1st dose only gives you 33% against the Indian variant. I hope we won't let new ppl in who can spread the virus.

stephenjmcd

Strazdas wrote: »

Interesting snippet from the European Commission today that member states are free to allow people to travel on the EU digital green certificate having received only one vaccine dose.

Let's see what Ireland does on this one.

Nothing, decision looks to have already been made, fully vax to come in here or negative test

tamova

Strazdas wrote: »

Interesting snippet from the European Commission today that member states are free to allow people to travel on the EU digital green certificate having received only one vaccine dose.

Let's see what Ireland does on this one.

"Fully vaccinated persons holding vaccination certificates in line with the EU Digital COVID Certificate should be exempted from travel-related testing or quarantine 14 days after having received the last dose. This should also cover recovered persons having received a single dose of a 2-dose vaccine. Where Member States accept proof of vaccination in order to waive restrictions to free movement also in other situations, for example after the first dose in a 2-dose series, they should also accept, under the same conditions, vaccination certificates for a COVID-19 vaccine."

Sort of difficult to understand here whether or not they're saying this is only applicable to those who had covid already...

"This should also cover recovered persons having received a single dose of a 2-dose vaccine."

"Where Member States accept proof of vaccination in order to waive restrictions to free movement also in other situations, for example after the first dose in a 2-dose series, they should also accept, under the same conditions, vaccination certificates for a COVID-19 vaccine."

RavenBea17b

humberklog wrote: »

Any one else having side effects from Pfizer like this...

Tuesday afternoon 1st shot.

Sore arm, head cold feeling with a touch of nauseous for 36 hours after. No biggy.

But from Wednesday I've been getting shooting pains down my sternum. It doesn't last long. It reminds me of having a broken rib (if anyone has had that it's not quite as shooting and excruciating as a broken rib, but kinda like it.)

I'm 51 and a smoker and toker but I've never had a pain there. Morning it mostly strikes.

Have you registered your side effects with? There may be others with similar symptoms.

RavenBea17b

Marine Layer wrote: »

My GP is telling people like that to lose weight
He is not vaccinating them

WWWWWWHHHHHHHATTTTTTTT!!!!
That is awful. Does the Dr do the same for smokers and drinkers ???

That Dr needs to be reported. Lose weight yes, but to withhold medicine.... WOW!!

IRISHSPORTSGUY

Pfizer brought the fast-tracked Q4 doses to Belgium today. Which means they delivered - or will deliver - the extra doses here too

Tyrone212

France has opened up Covid-19 vaccines to all adults, a week before Germany.

Until now, French authorities gave priority to people over 50, people in "priority professions" or younger adults with underlying health problems.