Deplorable Conditions at Halting Site

KrustyUCC

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Any comment on the intimidation of the council caretaker that the Examiner also reported a few months ago and that I linked earlier?

comment from RTE lol

No chance

SEPT 23 1989

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Any comment on the intimidation of the council caretaker that the Examiner also reported a few months ago and that I linked earlier?

no mention of parents taking responsibility for their children or their own living conditions either

Dempo1

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

no mention of parents taking responsibility for their children or their own living conditions either

The very reason I started this Thread

touts

If any member of the settled community forced their children to live in those conditions Tusla would immediately step in and remove the children for their safety. Yet travellers rights groups claim "culture" as a defence for abuse. We could throw millions at this site and within a couple of months of handing it over to the travellers it would be back to being a cess pool of filth and they would be back blaming the settled community for not giving them enough money.

Enough is enough. The only answer is to break up this halting site and force the travellers into houses. But not all in one estate. Scatter them across every housing estate in the country and they will have no choice but to integrate with the rest of society. Then start to apply the full rigor of the law to protect the children.

MrMusician18

It was an absolute cop out to not name the site, ostensibly to protect the children's identities. It also meant that we couldn't explore the particular issues that are on the site. Like where the rubbish is coming from, and why the LA isn't able to do is work. Listening to the report on RTE, I was puzzled that Ailbhe Conneely didn't think to ask these pertinent questions and why the LA should be expected to clean up after people?

Fair play to the examiner for naming the site. At least it can now be spoken about in specifics and not generalities.

Dempo1

Immortal Starlight wrote: »

Why can’t the group of fully grown able bodied men and women that live in the halting site pick up their own rubbish. Why can’t their children avoid walking in muddy puddles going to school. It’s not rocket science is it.

But these are the responsibility of the Local Authority surely? I gaurentee you little Johnny wouldn't be getting into big Johnny's brand new Range Rover with muddy shoes and clothes

Dempo1

MrMusician18 wrote: »

It was an absolute cop out to not name the site, ostensibly to protect the children's identities. It also meant that we couldn't explore the particular issues that are on the site. Like where the rubbish is coming from, and why the LA isn't able to do is work. Listening to the report on RTE, I was puzzled that Ailbhe Conneely didn't think to ask these pertinent questions and why the LA should be expected to clean up after people?

Fair play to the examiner for naming the site. At least it can now be spoken about in specifics and not generalities.

Ailbhe, god bless her, she's on a one women mission to advise the nation on the dispicable treatment of ethnic minorities. I've not once heard her ask difficult questions of why things are as they are, I'm just surprised RTE haven't opened a Travellers Bureau, fully staffed with war correspondents etc.

Atlantic Dawn

Whoy does anyone buy gift cards?

lawrencesummers

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touts wrote: »

If any member of the settled community forced their children to live in those conditions Tusla would immediately step in and remove the children for their safety. Yet travellers rights groups claim "culture" as a defence for abuse. We could throw millions at this site and within a couple of months of handing it over to the travellers it would be back to being a cess pool of filth and they would be back blaming the settled community for not giving them enough money.

Enough is enough. The only answer is to break up this halting site and force the travellers into houses. But not all in one estate. Scatter them across every housing estate in the country and they will have no choice but to integrate with the rest of society. Then start to apply the full rigor of the law to protect the children.

Are you putting your hand up to be a welcoming neighbour?

suicide_circus

Immortal Starlight wrote: »

Why can’t the group of fully grown able bodied men and women that live in the halting site pick up their own rubbish. Why can’t their children avoid walking in muddy puddles going to school. It’s not rocket science is it.

Ara you cant say dat!!

Dempo1

touts wrote: »

If any member of the settled community forced their children to live in those conditions Tusla would immediately step in and remove the children for their safety. Yet travellers rights groups claim "culture" as a defence for abuse. We could throw millions at this site and within a couple of months of handing it over to the travellers it would be back to being a cess pool of filth and they would be back blaming the settled community for not giving them enough money.

Enough is enough. The only answer is to break up this halting site and force the travellers into houses. But not all in one estate. Scatter them across every housing estate in the country and they will have no choice but to integrate with the rest of society. Then start to apply the full rigor of the law to protect the children.

And this the entire crux of the matter, its just outrageous that a statutory Children's Ombudsman spent 3 years on this report and didn't once enquire of Tusla as to what they were doing. Every parent, regardless of ethnicity has a duty of care to their children, indeed I'd go further what were the schools saying?

MrMusician18

Dempo1 wrote: »

And this the entire crux of the matter, its just outrageous that a statutory Children's Ombudsman spent 3 years on this report and didn't once enquire of Tusla as to what they were doing. Every parent, regardless of ethnicity has a duty of care to their children, indeed I'd go further what were the schools saying?

The children's ombudsman should be sacked if he witnessed these horrendous conditions and then did nothing about it.

suicide_circus

MrMusician18 wrote: »

The children's ombudsman should be sacked if he witnessed these horrendous conditions and then did nothing about it.

Children living in squalor due to the actions of their parents, better leave them in situ and write a lengthy report

Jerry Attrick

I've just checked and, as far as I could see, there were no rats running around our homestead. And I bet that Childrens Ombudsman Dr. Niall Muldoon hasn't any rats running around his home either.

My missus cleverly suggested that the fact that we pay about €300 a year to have our rubbish taken away might help to explain why we haven't any rats running around; I assume that Doctor Niall Muldoon also pays for his waste to be collected.

If I stopped paying for my rubbish to be collected, then I suspect that we might have a problem with mice and rats before long. And if this happened then I'd only have myself to blame.

However, if Doctor Niall Muldoon stopped paying for his refuse collection and his gaff was subsequently infested with rats, the evidence of his latest report suggests that he would blame his local Council.

It must be great to live on Planet Muldoon.

ebbsy

Some people should be neutered.

Imagine bringing kids into that world.

Jerry Attrick

MrMusician18 wrote: »

The children's ombudsman should be sacked if he witnessed these horrendous conditions and then did nothing about it.

In all fairness, he wrong his hands together very loudly before writing a hard-hitting report that totally avoided identifying the root cause of the problem.

suicide_circus

Jerry Attrick wrote: »

In all fairness, he wrong his hands together very loudly before writing a hard-hitting report that totally avoided identifying the root cause of the problem.

Not sure what else he could have done tbh

Jerry Attrick

suicide_circus wrote: »

Not sure what else he could have done tbh

Maybe included a epigraph at the start of the report?

The ancient phrase God helps those who help themselves comes to mind.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_helps_those_who_help_themselves

Dempo1

MrMusician18 wrote: »

The children's ombudsman should be sacked if he witnessed these horrendous conditions and then did nothing about it.

Not sure he witnessed anything as such but surely would have been obligated to ask serious questions well before he got around to releasing report, but let's not confuse the issue, his concerns seem more directed at big bad local authorities that are not cleaning up other people's mess.

Feisar

griffdaddy wrote: »

I've said this before to people when reports like this come up - the way that many, many travellers choose to live isn't a cultural choice, it's anti-social, child endangering behaviour. The prejudice arguement doesn't even come into it. Society has progressed. You have to raise your children to certain standards, you have to send them to school, you have to maintain hygiene levels. Living in your own sh1t and getting uppidity when someone calls you out on it is absolute nonsense and it's time a much harder line was taken by the likes of Tulsa, the Gardai and local authorities. Anyone who can't see the difference between this argument and saying something like 'all black people are criminals' is either being deliberately obtuse or is incredibly naive.

Go on out of here with that sensible talk.

Feisar

suicide_circus wrote: »

Children living in squalor due to the actions of their parents, better leave them in situ and write a lengthy report

But they are travellers so they get a free pass and a few more €€€.

And we push them down further.

1874

Saw it reported elsewhere online, No surprises
The answer and solution seem to be known, honestly having had a traveller family live beside me, I'd prefer if they want to live like that that they are away from me or anyone else, it might improve their situation but it only worsens some other poor sods life.

They create the problem, it must be known by all they create it, there is only so much you can do to help someone, but if they literally tear/burn it down, there is simply no point wasting any further effort or funds that could be used elsewhere.


Children should be removed and taken into care, probably what the adults want for a number of reasons,

maybe they are holding out for a property with stables

Richard Hillman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZgtEdFAg3s

Gatling

I gave up after I heard the kids walk through a mucky shortcut and their shoes get dirty ........

Duh don't walk through the mucky shortcut then

Hoboo

b0nk1e wrote: »

I wonder how all the rubbish got onto the halting site, it's a complete mystery how that might have occurred.

Because settled people keep fly tipping there.

suicide_circus

Gatling wrote: »

I gave up after I heard the kids walk through a mucky shortcut and their shoes get dirty ........

Duh don't walk through the mucky shortcut then

Hilarious

I worked teaching English for a while in Spain.

I remember over the course of Christmas to summer in a certain class, the numbers went from 20 to 8. The full-time teacher explained that the gypsies stopped going to school once they hit 16 and the state wasn't paying for them anymore.

I'm not sure how you deal with that for the parents but hopefully the kids will have a better attitude towards their own children's education and over the generation or two, it changes.

Larbre34

Kids of a settled family found to be living in those conditions would be removed and placed into foster care while the parents were investigated and taken to task.

For some reason, when it is replicated in Traveller accommodation, anyone and everyone EXCEPT the parents are investigated for it. Quite literally, the people reading this forum are being blamed more than the kids' parents.

Until that changes, nothing will.

MrMusician18

Hoboo wrote: »

Because settled people keep fly tipping there.

That line will never get old!

Thelonious Monk

If you look at any of these stories on Twitter, everyone is on the travellers side and blame everyone else for allowing this kind of thing to happen. Politicians, journalists, academics etc.
It's not going to change any time soon and they'll continue to be pandered to and we'll continue paying to clean up after them.
You're better off just accepting this as how it is, because we all know nothing is going to change in our lifetimes.

eviltwin

Larbre34 wrote: »

Kids of a settled family found to be living in those conditions would be removed and placed into foster care while the parents were investigated and taken to task.

For some reason, when it is replicated in Traveller accommodation, anyone and everyone EXCEPT the parents are investigated for it. Quite literally, the people reading this forum are being blamed more than the kids' parents.

Until that changes, nothing will.

TUSLA always go for the low hanging fruit

Couples made a choice to conceive children in such circumstances although no intelligent prospective parent would bring a child in to that environment. One or two children may be conceived by chance but by the time you get to the sixth or seventh child in a family it is just bare faced neglect.

Hoboo

MrMusician18 wrote: »

That line will never get old!

Nor will pointing it out.

jmayo

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

If you look at any of these stories on Twitter, everyone is on the travellers side and blame everyone else for allowing this kind of thing to happen. Politicians, journalists, academics etc.
It's not going to change any time soon and they'll continue to be pandered to and we'll continue paying to clean up after them.
You're better off just accepting this as how it is, because we all know nothing is going to change in our lifetimes.

It will eventually because with the way this country and a lot of Western nations are going, sooner or later right wing is going to take over.
Brexit was one example of this where people stop listening to mainstream parties and just went screw it.

Now of course what is termed right wing today would back in the day of the real right wingers be termed centrist or hell even left wing.
What Labour in the UK espoused in the 60s regarding immigration would today be labelled as far right.

TomTomTim

Larbre34 wrote: »

Kids of a settled family found to be living in those conditions would be removed and placed into foster care while the parents were investigated and taken to task.

For some reason, when it is replicated in Traveller accommodation, anyone and everyone EXCEPT the parents are investigated for it. Quite literally, the people reading this forum are being blamed more than the kids' parents.

Until that changes, nothing will.

Secondary targets. It's a very common thing in politics now days. Instead of focusing on the source of the problem, focus on the people reacting to the source. In this instance it's not the people reacting who are being made guilty, but it usually is.

punisher5112

Get them working, they are extremely good at driveways and helping the elderly. Why can't they put their energy to good use and clean up where they live themselves, I'm sure they could stop us settled folk from fly tipping on their doorstep s

Ri_Nollaig

MrMusician18 wrote: »

That line will never get old!

It is 'settled people' rubbish alright, as the Travellers are happy to act as unauthorized garbage collectors. For a nominal fee obviously
They have done this several times at this particular halting site and when it gets bad enough they know the council will eventually come and clear it.

eviltwin

eviltwin wrote: »

TUSLA always go for the low hanging fruit

Balony. They investigate all reports.

Typical bashing the public service attitude.

MrMusician18

According to the minister the state has failed travellers:

It must be acknowledged that the State has “repeatedly failed” Travellers over time, the Minister for Community Development and Charities Joe O’Brien has said

If argue that travellers have equally failed the rest of us too.

We have a Minister for charities now? Jesus Christ they do like to make up jobs dont they?

padd b1975

Dempo1 wrote: »

My God, Travellers could learn much from the Amish, I spent 2 months in an Amish community in Pennsylvania and what an eye opener it was, self sufficient, industrious, decent and quite amazing people. Sure they have their problems but certainly don't expect anyone to resolve them but themselves

Hope you didn't milk any bulls English.

aziz

“We’re travellers,we want to be treated the same as everyone else “

“We’re travellers,we want to be treated different to everyone else “

Well which one is it ?

Wanderer78

you have to hand it to boards, program 'personal responsibility' solves just about everything! we too good here!

MrMusician18

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Balony. They investigate all reports.

Typical bashing the public service attitude.

Well what have they done here? Looks like Tulsa are leaving children living in squalor. That's not right no matter who you are.

Dempo1

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Balony. They investigate all reports.

Typical bashing the public service attitude.

Perhaps you might enlighten us as to were Tusla were during the Three year period it took to compile this report? A traveller advocate group were so concerned they contacted the children's ombudsman, why weren't Tusla contacted???

MrMusician18

Wanderer78 wrote: »

you have to hand it to boards, program 'personal responsibility' solves just about everything! we too good here!

Well who else is responsible for bringing rubbish onto the site and intimidating the council and preventing them for doing their work?

Is it me? You? The local authority? Or is it the able bodied adults living on that site?

eviltwin

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Balony. They investigate all reports.

Typical bashing the public service attitude.

No, its a TUSLA bashing attitude. I have no dealings with any other department to comment. I do, however, deal with TUSLA on a fairly regular basis and as a whole - obviously there are people within the organisation doing stellar work - they are not fit for purpose and tend to focus on the cases that they can deal with and close fairly quickly and easily.

Wanderer78

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Well who else is responsible for bringing rubbish onto the site and intimidating the council and preventing them for doing their work?

Is it me? You? The local authority? Or is it the able bodied adults living on that site?

oh theres no question, theyre causing the bulk of their own issues, but does sitting on the internets, pointing the finger, ridiculing them and shaming them actually do anything?

Dempo1

Wanderer78 wrote: »

oh theres no question, theyre causing the bulk of their own issues, but does sitting on the internets, pointing the finger, ridiculing them and shaming them actually do anything?

I personally don't want to shame anyone but it's tge Parents of the kids described in this absurd report that should be shamed, I would have the same opinion of any parent regardless of ethnicity. This report was pushed for by a Travellers advocate group and its findings wish to blame everyone but the parents responsible for such appalling living conditions, it is not the responsibility of local authorities to clean up fter people nor supervise how people live. Tusla at some stage should have been involved and its striking the "Concerned" Travellers advo group didn't think it appropriate to report children being sent to school, unwashed, dishevelled and clearly not being cared for. Instead we get a report that blames everyone but the parents of these children and its a disgrace.

SpraySafely

Here we go now, on RTE Radio 1.

Sarah just after offering the members of the travelling community her front and back garden as accomadation.

Very generous of her.

Hopefully the rest of the RTE staff will follow suit.