Deplorable Conditions at Halting Site

NIMAN

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I think the only way this is going is that they'll have to set up halting sites around Ireland with good facilities, and councils will have to keep them clean and collect rubbish daily. They'll also need teams on call to attend sites where they randomly set up to clean up and bring them whatever they need.
I mean it sounds ridiculous but this seems to be the only way it can go at this stage for the various parties involved to be happy.

Why do you want the councils to go around and clean up after them?

They want to be treated the same as the settled population, but the councils don't come around the estates and clean up for people.

Time they got into the real world and took on some personal responsibility, instead of always blaming someone else.

Thelonious Monk

NIMAN wrote: »

Why do you want the councils to go around and clean up after them?

They want to be treated the same as the settled population, but the councils don't come around the estates and clean up for people.

Time they got into the real world and took on some personal responsibility, instead of always blaming someone else.

I don't want anything, but let's be realistic here - they are not going to get into the real world and sort themselves out, and we'll hear many more reports like today, which will mean more money for them and more services. That's the only way it's going.

Spideoige

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I think the only way this is going is that they'll have to set up halting sites around Ireland with good facilities, and councils will have to keep them clean and collect rubbish daily. They'll also need teams on call to attend sites where they randomly set up to clean up and bring them whatever they need.
I mean it sounds ridiculous but this seems to be the only way it can go at this stage for the various parties involved to be happy.

I believe a large portion of travellers would like to live in houses and their preference being group housing schemes like St Anthony's in Hollyhill. I suspect Cork City Council have seen the issues and unprecedented costs that have come with the new set up in Hollyhill and are scratching their heads on how to tackle the issue at Spring Lane.

If there are children living in squalor as per the conditions that are being highlighted, Tusla need to step in immediately and ensure the safety of these children first and foremost. This is a form of child neglect from both the parents and our child protection agencies, I can't believe that there are people who seem to think that the responsibility of their children's health is that of the Councils.

Thelonious Monk

Spideoige wrote: »

I believe a large portion of travellers would like to live in houses and their preference being group housing schemes like St Anthony's in Hollyhill. I suspect Cork City Council have seen the issues and unprecedented costs that have come with the new set up in Hollyhill and are scratching their heads on how to tackle the issue at Spring Lane.

If there are children living in squalor as per the conditions that are being highlighted, Tusla need to step in immediately and ensure the safety of these children first and foremost. This is a form of child neglect from both the parents and our child protection agencies, I can't believe that there are people who seem to think that the responsibility of their children's health is that of the Councils.

The people who seem to have the power to direct how these things go are never going to blame the travelling community and will blame the state for letting them down.

Gunmonkey

Gunmonkey wrote: »

A simple as **** solution but no....we have to now endure a Gov report on this and how "the state has failed the kids" because some families would rather allow their kids to be "ridiculed" or whatever they claim than spend less than a pack of smokes on solving it.

The State has failed these kids, though.

If I was to decide tomorrow that I'd cut the running water and electricity off, garland the back and front gardens with bags of rubbish and a smorgasbord of rodent and insect life, and send my children to school looking like extras from Oliver Twist, I'd have Tusla at the door faster than I could sharpen my slash-hook.

Why is Tusla not treating these kids like every other kid in the country? If the parents are not capable of providing these children with hot and cold running water, and clean clothing each day, Tusla should be removing them and putting them in homes that can.

The racism in our country about Travellers isn't against the adults. It's that we condemn their children to live in filth and squalor because they're the children of Travellers.

MrMusician18

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Well what have they done here? Looks like Tulsa are leaving children living in squalor. That's not right no matter who you are.

Dempo1 wrote: »

Perhaps you might enlighten us as to were Tusla were during the Three year period it took to compile this report? A traveller advocate group were so concerned they contacted the children's ombudsman, why weren't Tusla contacted???

I won't enlighten you. If you don't know then I wonder why you felt qualified to comment? Unless of course tusla are mandated to ignore privacy laws and get your input into their cases?

eviltwin wrote: »

No, its a TUSLA bashing attitude. I have no dealings with any other department to comment. I do, however, deal with TUSLA on a fairly regular basis and as a whole - obviously there are people within the organisation doing stellar work - they are not fit for purpose and tend to focus on the cases that they can deal with and close fairly quickly and easily.

As do I and they deal with ALL reports. They don't simple shred any report. If you deal with them then you know that.

Being unhappy with the agencies handling of a case is a different issue but they absolutely do investigate each complaint.

b0nk1e

b0nk1e wrote: »

The racism in our country about Travellers isn't against the adults. It's that we condemn their children to live in filth and squalor because they're the children of Travellers.

Attempting to make a group assimilate is just behind extermination and expulsion on the scale of genocide. So because we as a country have apparently decided that travellers are a distinct "ethnic group" doing anything to undermine their culture or remove children from those conditions pretty much meet the definition of genocide. That's where we're at now.

MrMusician18

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

I won't enlighten you. If you don't know then I wonder why you felt qualified to comment? Unless of course tusla are mandated to ignore privacy laws and get your input into their cases?



As do I and they deal with ALL reports. They don't simple shred any report. If you deal with them then you know that.

Being unhappy with the agencies handling of a case is a different issue but they absolutely do investigate each complaint.

Investigating and opening a file isn't much use when there's none or inadequate action being taken. And if children are being raised in squalor and left there(because surely, surely the children's ombudsman would have thought to report this at some point in the last three years), then it's quite obvious that Tulsa are failing.

Unless of course the actual purpose of this report is to get a group bumped up the housing list to be accommodated in and only in their preferred location.

end of the road

NIMAN wrote: »

Why do you want the councils to go around and clean up after them?

They want to be treated the same as the settled population, but the councils don't come around the estates and clean up for people.

Time they got into the real world and took on some personal responsibility, instead of always blaming someone else.

they already have personal responsibility, however personal responsibility will only get one so far for various reasons and factors.

the_syco

Dempo1 wrote: »

Halting Sites

Go on...

Dempo1 wrote: »

Traveller's

Yes...

Dempo1 wrote: »

RESPONSIBILITY

Wait, what? It's someone's else's problem, and money must be raised to fix this terrible issue! /s

NIMAN

end of the road wrote: »

they already have personal responsibility, however personal responsibility will only get one so far for various reasons and factors.

I have no idea what you are saying/hinting at with that statement.

end of the road

Deleted User wrote: »

Attempting to make a group assimilate is just behind extermination and expulsion on the scale of genocide. So because we as a country have apparently decided that travellers are a distinct "ethnic group" doing anything to undermine their culture or remove children from those conditions pretty much meet the definition of genocide. That's where we're at now.

it's not that we decided this, but it was always the case that they were an ethnic minority, and the government had no option but to recognise that fact.

end of the road

end of the road wrote: »

it's not that we decided this, but it was always the case that they were an ethnic minority, and the government had no option but to recognise the fact, either of their own accord or have it forced on them.

Bull****.
If ethnicity is inherent or inherited then I'm a traveller. Am I lying when I tick "Irish" on the census form? Or is my mother? I mean I spent a week in a caravan on holidays once, does that count? Did my dad become one by being around my mother? Since that seems to be enough to form an "ethnicity".

MrMusician18

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Investigating and opening a file isn't much use when there's none or inadequate action being taken. And if children are being raised in squalor and left there(because surely, surely the children's ombudsman would have thought to report this at some point in the last three years), then it's quite obvious that Tulsa are failing.

Unless of course the actual purpose of this report is to get a group bumped up the housing list to be accommodated in and only in their preferred location.

Again, do tusla need to get your input on their investigations?

If not, why are you qualified to state they haven't acted in this case?

end of the road

Deleted User wrote: »

Bull****.

incorrect.
i get that you probably don't like it, but that's the reality.

Niner leprauchan

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Again, do tusla need to get your input on their investigations?

If not, why are you qualified to state they haven't acted in this case?

Love to see you at the scene of an accident.
"Should we maybe try and pull that conscious person screaming in the burning wreckage of that car?"
"What makes you think you're qualified to make such a suggestion?"

MrMusician18

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Again, do tusla need to get your input on their investigations?

If not, why are you qualified to state they haven't acted in this case?

Do you think leaving children on an unsafe filthy site crawling with vermin is appropriate? And need I remind you that these conditions were created by the adults that are supposed to be minding them

You don't need a fetac level 5 qualification to know that it's a completely inappropriate setting for animals, let alone children

Maybe Tusla should have my input, because they seem unable to recognise and act in a real child welfare case staring them right in the face.

Burt Renaults

Deleted User wrote: »

Bull****.
If ethnicity is inherent or inherited then I'm a traveller. Am I lying when I tick "Irish" on the census form? Or is my mother? I mean I spent a week in a caravan on holidays once, does that count? Did my dad become one by being around my mother? Since that seems to be enough to form an "ethnicity".

Ethnicity and nationality aren't the same thing, duh.

Travellers are a distinct ethnic group and it's correct that they're recognised as such. That's according to the UN's definition of ethnicity. It's not a matter of opinion.

Burt Renaults

Burt Renaults wrote: »

Ethnicity and nationality aren't the same thing, duh.

Travellers are a distinct ethnic group and it's correct that they're recognised as such. That's according to the UN's definition of ethnicity. It's not a matter of opinion.

Duh doy indeed, you haven't addressed a single point I raised.

Burt Renaults

Deleted User wrote: »

Duh doy indeed, you haven't addressed a single point I raised.

You didn't raise a single valid point. Come back to me when you've learned the difference between nationality and ethnicity.

The Oort Cloud

A lot of travelers do not want to be associated with a controlled society, they want absolute freedom of movement in the wild and I can absolutely understand this. While your average person wants to settle down in one spot in one abode for a long period of time, travelers can move their home to any county in Ireland and experience the more wider openness of this country and wake up and decide to go anywhere they want, which is enticing to have that freedom.

The only problem I have with some/not all travelers is that when they decide to leave a location, they leave a lot of waste around and their attitude to this is feck-it, let the council dispose of our waste and that attitude is not a decent thing to do as it affects the folk that have to live there long-term. Talking about crime in regard to travelers and settled folk is not what I want to get into either as there are both travelers and settled folk that are right bastards.

Just clean the place up and move on to your new destination would be great, then travelers may get that bit more respect.

ED E

If the halting site is in good condition its much harder to lodge a PI claim against the LA.

A man who was awarded €60,000 after claiming to have injured his hand by tripping in a halting site failed to turn up at an appeal after new evidence of him injuring the same hand in a bare-knuckle boxing fight was submitted to court.

He also pointed out that Stokes had been in what he claimed was a serious car crash the day before the finger injury.

He said a doctor known to Stokes had agreed in the first case that it would be more probable a person in a serious accident wouldn't be going for a jog the following day.

He added that Stokes only put in the claim against SDCC for the fall after he had received a pay-out from the Personal Injuries Assessment Board (PIAB) for the car crash.

whisky_galore

end of the road wrote: »

they already have personal responsibility, however personal responsibility will only get one so far for various reasons and factors.

They *could* get together and like, tidy their place up. Their arms aren't painted on.

It's not like they have long days at the office or anything. But no, let's live in our own shyte and whinge about it.

Mike Murdock

end of the road wrote: »

it's not that we decided this, but it was always the case that they were an ethnic minority, and the government had no option but to recognise that fact.

Actually, the Government did have an option. The UN only made a recommendation that travellers be identified as a distinct ethnic group.

The Government could easily have said - We'll take that under advisement.

The media backlash had they done that however...

Mad_maxx

NIMAN wrote: »

I have no idea what you are saying/hinting at with that statement.

He means travellers can't be expected to clean up after themselves like the majority of people


It's a common belief amongst those on the left

Mike Murdock

Mad_maxx wrote: »

He means travellers can't be expected to clean up after themselves like the major of people


It's a common belief amongst those on the left

It baffles me that people will make excuse after excuse after excuse about something as simple as Travellers keeping their living spaces clean and habitable.

I've never seen anything like it.

Mad_maxx

Mike Murdock wrote: »

It baffles me that people will make excuse after excuse after excuse about something as simple as Travellers keeping their living spaces clean and habitable.

I've never seen anything like it.

The left view many of their sacred cows as inherently helpless victims, incapable of adhering to common norms and standards, hence the demand for cradle to grave nannying

Keyzer

Wanderer78 wrote: »

oh theres no question, theyre causing the bulk of their own issues, but does sitting on the internets, pointing the finger, ridiculing them and shaming them actually do anything?

Anyone who brings a child into the world in those conditions deserves to be shamed - its way beyond neglect. Absolutely disgusting and unsafe conditions for any child.

suicide_circus

Still can't get over the bit where the children take a muddy SHORTCUT to school and end up muddy. Why was this added to the report?

whisky_galore

suicide_circus wrote: »

Still can't get over the bit where the children take a muddy SHORTCUT to school and end up muddy. Why was this added to the report?

Tink of de childers bass.