Fly me to the Moon - your 3rd travel Megathread - read OP

Marcusm

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

It doesn't. Not in any way. All persons can enter Ireland and all call leave for essential reasons.

All are equal. It's not discrimination in any way.

It may not make sense, it may seem unfair but it's not discrimination

Ah now; do you believe that? The public health is protected by controlling inward flow but it is outward flow which is subject to an “essential reason” restriction. That’s why it is contrary and arbitrary.

njburke

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Would you rather they stopped everyone and performed detailed investigations? People have been caught with fakes..

I'ld rather they scanned it, to authenticate, as it was intended to be by design. I had after all, just paid 100€ for it. Better again would be the provision of a DCC for the two doses of vaccine I have received.

Marcusm

bubblypop wrote: »

I'm not sure how restricting movement on public health grounds could be unrelated to the current worldwide pandemic!

Except that the inward flow is where the public health exposure exists and that is not subject to the same restriction. I am now inured to this restriction but at least I can recognise how it is not effective or meeting any public policy objective.

Meself

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

I already pointed out that there is a secondary fine for them.

Where did you point this out ? I've gone back through ur posts but can't find it.

Bit cynical

Marcusm wrote: »

Ah now; do you believe that? The public health is protected by controlling inward flow but it is outward flow which is subject to an “essential reason” restriction. That’s why it is contrary and arbitrary.

This is the argument I was trying to make. Yes, ultimately, inward flow is also indirectly reduced by the fine on outward travel, but the burden of this measure disproportionately falls on Irish residents. Just because it is Irish residents disadvantaged by the Irish state does not mean it is not discrimination.

Marcusm

Marcusm wrote: »

Ah now; do you believe that? The public health is protected by controlling inward flow but it is outward flow which is subject to an “essential reason” restriction. That’s why it is contrary and arbitrary.

What are you talking about marcusm? That's not relevant to anything I said.

Bit cynical wrote: »

This is the argument I was trying to make. Yes, ultimately, inward flow is also indirectly reduced by the fine on outward travel, but the burden of this measure disproportionately falls on Irish residents. Just because it is Irish residents disadvantaged by the Irish state does not mean it is not discrimination.

It does. It's not discrimination. It's just simple not.

As I pointed out already, the law is being applied to non nationals in the same way, ergo not discrimination.

You two need to decide what you actually discussing here. Marcusm is talking about the the actual effect of the restrictions. Cynical is claiming to be making the same argument but keeps claiming discrimination. They aren't the same argument.

I'm not making any comment on how effective the measures are. In fact, I have questioned the Irish approach on numerous occasions. Doesn't mean you can claim discrimination.

sy_flembeck

sy_flembeck wrote: »

They don't, actually

Garda

My sincerest typo apologies

Bit cynical

Bit cynical wrote: »

This is the argument I was trying to make. Yes, ultimately, inward flow is also indirectly reduced by the fine on outward travel, but the burden of this measure disproportionately falls on Irish residents. Just because it is Irish residents disadvantaged by the Irish state does not mean it is not discrimination.

It is not discrimination, because the law says it is not.
I would think that it is unconstitutional however, because it treats it's own citizens differently. Basically, if you are rich, there is a levy to leave, if however you are poor, then you cannot afford the fine and therefore cannot leave.
Without anyone challenging it, we won't know.

54and56

If I'm reading the essential travel legislation correctly (https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/travel_abroad/travelling_abroad_during_covid.html) "to go to a funeral" is a one of the permitted reasonable excuses.

I don't see anything in the legislation setting any criteria or qualifying "to go to a funeral" in any way e.g. that the deceased must be related to you.

What's stopping people flying to XXX popping along to some randomers funeral service for a minute the day of their arrival in XXX and then staying on for two weeks by the beach?

If asked by a Guard why you, your partner and your 3 young kids are traveling to sunny XXX for 2 weeks and you say you're going to a funeral can the Guard fine you if he/she doesn't believe you?

Can the Guard require you to state the name of the person who's funeral you are going to, what your relationship with them is, when the funeral is being held etc?

njburke

njburke wrote: »

Just landed a few hours ago in from the Canaries. I went out Monday with an antigen test from gosafe. No issues going through Dublin airport at 4.30am.

I had a PCR test at 8 AM yesterday and by noon I was emailed an EU digital Covid cert. There's very little detail on it other than the QR code,name, DOB and sample time. No passport number, although passport was required for the Test. The QR is a pointer to the web where the test and data is securely stored.

The DCC was accepted without hassle at the Dublin immigration desk. No questions were asked this afternoon as to the purpose of my visit to spain, unlike when I returned to Dublin two weeks ago from a similar trip. I was stopped today by Gardai at customs who asked how long I had been away, they x-rayed my luggage. I guess they were looking for cigarette and booze violations, but I had the legal limit.

That's not an EU Digital Covid cert
Its just the results of your pcr test you had

njburke

Marine Layer wrote: »

That's not an EU Digital Covid cert
Its just the results of your pcr test you had

It has EU Digital Covid Certificate written on the top of it.

beggars_bush

bubblypop wrote: »

It is not discrimination, because the law says it is not.
I would think that it is unconstitutional however, because it treats it's own citizens differently. Basically, if you are rich, there is a levy to leave, if however you are poor, then you cannot afford the fine and therefore cannot leave.
Without anyone challenging it, we won't know.

That's absolute bollocks
If you can afford to head off on holiday abroad you can afford a test or two

faceman

beggars_bush wrote: »

That's absolute bollocks
If you can afford to head off on holiday abroad you can afford a test or two

Spoken like a rich man

Tazz T

beggars_bush wrote: »

That's absolute bollocks
If you can afford to head off on holiday abroad you can afford a test or two

... unless you have 15 children

TefalBrain

beggars_bush wrote: »

That's absolute bollocks
If you can afford to head off on holiday abroad you can afford a test or two

Christ on a bike

Most people scratch and scrimp money together for a holiday. Most do it because it's cheaper than holidaying at home anyway. A family of 5 would have to pay an extra 1000 euro on top of everything because of testing. You think people just have a grand lying about?

nice bit of green

Flew last night to Bratislava. Police were just waving thru all the cars on the approach road. None checking inside T1. Nothing to worry about it seems.

Solobally8

My daughter and 4 college friends flew Dublin to London this morning. Not a bother on them. No questions asked. Whereas I spent the last few weeks worrying about my trip to Spain next week even though I have a valid reason for traveling. Oh to be young!!

faceman

Bookmark this to see how it pans out

https://www.newstalk.com/news/minister-refutes-ryanair-claims-that-eu-travel-pass-delay-will-cause-chaos-at-irish-airports-1220145

RoryMac

"Member States can put their own restrictions on people coming into their countries if they wish, for example, this week Germany initiated some extra restrictions for people coming from Portugal.

"So the digital COVID cert doesn't give you a free pass into Germany from Portugal, for example."

This part is very worrying, so we could introduce the DCC on the 19th but could also impose restrictions on top of that to make travel very difficult for most people

Multipass

beggars_bush wrote: »

That's absolute bollocks
If you can afford to head off on holiday abroad you can afford a test or two

Do you realise that all travel isn’t holiday, how would you like to fork out an extra hundred or more every time you need to go to a relative.

SusanC10

faceman wrote: »

Bookmark this to see how it pans out

https://www.newstalk.com/news/minister-refutes-ryanair-claims-that-eu-travel-pass-delay-will-cause-chaos-at-irish-airports-1220145

No mention of the €2,000 fine in that either.

Tazz T

SusanC10 wrote: »

No mention of the €2,000 fine in that either.

No mention anywhere anymore. It's as if it doesn't exist.

TefalBrain

Solobally8 wrote: »

My daughter and 4 college friends flew Dublin to London this morning. Not a bother on them. No questions asked. Whereas I spent the last few weeks worrying about my trip to Spain next week even though I have a valid reason for traveling. Oh to be young!!

Why are you worried? Stop believing government driven scare tactics. Just tell them any old story and if they issue a fine so be it, nobody is paying it anyway.

SusanC10

Tazz T wrote: »

No mention anywhere anymore. It's as if it doesn't exist.

And hopefully it will officially lapse on Monday 5th or at worst 19th

TefalBrain

nice bit of green wrote: »

Flew last night to Bratislava. Police were just waving thru all the cars on the approach road. None checking inside T1. Nothing to worry about it seems.

This is more or less over in Europe. Yeah few local restrictions here and there but life goes on.

People aren't scared in Europe anymore.

Happydays2020

Anyone flown from Amsterdam recently. What is process and how much time ahead of flight is needed?

Solobally8

TefalBrain wrote: »

Why are you worried? Stop believing government driven scare tactics. Just tell them any old story and if they issue a fine so be it, nobody is paying it anyway.

I was worried for a few weeks when we decided to book the flights but I’m grand now. I know there will be no problem. I suppose I was just laughing at how a group of 21 year olds can fly off without a care in the world and yet older people like me have wasted all this time worrying because of the hype around fines and cancelled flights.

johnire

Are these 21 year olds vaccinated?

Solobally8 wrote: »

I was worried for a few weeks when we decided to book the flights but I’m grand now. I know there will be no problem. I suppose I was just laughing at how a group of 21 year olds can fly off without a care in the world and yet older people like me have wasted all this time worrying because of the hype around fines and cancelled flights.

Solobally8

johnire wrote: »

Are these 21 year olds vaccinated?

Nope

johnire

Ahhhh…… right. And people wonder why we’re in this mess.

Solobally8 wrote: »

Nope