Republic of Ireland Team 2023/24 [old thread]

McFly85

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667313#Comment_119667313

The FAI shouldn’t be relying on qualification money to fund themselves. Due to the criminal negligence of the John Delaney and previous administration, we spent years trying to qualify for tournaments without putting anything into player development so it would serve as some quick cash and a handy deflection.

The cats out of the bag now, we know what situation we’re in. We should be looking to wind down our debt long term in more sustainable ways instead of gambling the future trying to qualify for every tournament regardless of the quality of our squad.

yourdeadwright

We don't have the players we once had but we have manger way out of his depth ,

The longer he is in the charge the more people like myself who said from day one he is not capable are proved right

He' is just not a good manager at this level end of debate ,

johnnyryan89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667194#Comment_119667194

The way Ghana are set up behind the scenes could be something the FAI might look at. International football isn't a job that many are gonna jump at. Think the pickings are gonna be slim for any new manager.

Clubs are often willing to give young decent coaches the managers job like Eustace, Beale who came in to QPR, Cooper at Swansea, and clubs were chasing Anthony Barry too.

Cooper was different because he was already in international football but many aren't gonna jump from club football to do international football full-time and might be worth considering hiring a head coach to just coach the team and a senior advisor type to do all the other stuff a manager does outside of the international window.

Just an example, but if Kenny was to go within the next 12 months and the FAI were making a list and Barry was part of the list because he's already been involved plus left a positive impressive. You ring him up and I don't see him packing in club football to become an international manager but might be tempted if the role was more head coach than full time manager.

johnnyryan89

https://twitter.com/irish_abroad/status/1574403302288232449

This was the youngest team to start a competitive international since a World Cup qualifier against Cyprus in November 1980 when Eoin Hand named a starting XI with an average of age of 24.88.

The team that started against Scotland was first time that nine players under the age of 30 started a competitive game since a World Cup qualifier against Denmark in October 1969.

~Rebel~

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667631#Comment_119667631

And yet the whinging in here when most of them were introduced was unreal! If many on here had their way, we'd have been sticking with the old experienced heads from the previous generation, and maybe only now be starting to introduce the younger talent. That many of those young players have been given time to bed in and form the backbone of our team is a credit to the manager and puts us in a significantly stronger position going into the qualifying campaign.

johnnyryan89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667774#Comment_119667774

John Egan won his 27th cap the other night and should reach 30 caps by November just after he turns 30. The back of this team/squad is gonna be these U23s that have been introduced and so far Molumby is already half way to that 30 mark Egan is yet to hit. Knight has 17, Parrott has 16, O'Shea has 14, Idah 13 and Bazunu 11.

That's six lads already in double figures when you also consider Cullen has 21 and some of those lads like O'Shea would be closer to Cullen only for injuries. By the end of 2023 could at a minimum 10 caps to each player injury permitting with someone like Knight possibly hitting the 30 mark if he plays every game.

Dara O'Shea could be where Egan is now at age 24, same with Molumby, and Jason Knight by 22. Some great groundwork being laid for whoever comes in next.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119665401#Comment_119665401

It it fairly obvious what I am saying, a younger generation of Irish soccer fans desperate for any success have been duped by the playing the 'right way' mantra. Now the truth is you have players available to have the technical ability to 'play the right way'. In other words technically proficient midfielders which Ireland do not have.

But the young Irish fans hear such media chat of 'playing the right way' and allied to their support of of big Big British clubs and naively think that Ireland can do the same.

But the truth is the players are not of that type to 'play the right way' meaning progressive through balls possession football that actually causes a danger to teams. But Kenny does not have a midfielder to do that. So it ended up as the worst kind of possession football passive and easy to defend against - pointless.

I actually blame the Irish media because they know there is a cohort of young Irish soccer fans who buy into this new era 'playing football the right way' which in their mind is possession football.

But the problem is in order to have effective possession football you have to have the players available to play it. Ireland simply don't an effective Ireland is a team playing with energy, chasing, with the pace up front they could be set up as a good counter attacking team.

Hopefully Kenny has copped this now. But the worrying part for me in these threads if you even suggest that Kenny has gone wrong, or if the players are not up to it. It is viewed as almost treason.

And such fans respond with looking at the 'positives' 'easy on the eye' and so on. That is where the delusion comes in. And some people seem to think there are only two choices then Kenny IN or Kenny OUT. There is an automatic assumption that any praise or criticism is one or the other. Which is an odd place to be.

I think Ireland should beat Armenia, and I hope they do. But Armenia is about Ireland's level. That is where the reality check needs to be. And the delusion of 'playing football the right way' style wise needs to stop.

For me playing football 'the right way' is not one based on style it is one that maximise the players potential as a team. Results based.

Which eventually means beating teams you are supposed to beat/near in level comfortably, and regularly. Which is phase one.

Then it difficult for better standard teams and maybe nicking a result. Which is phase two.

And the final level of progression is a team punching above it's weight and consistently beating teams they are not supposed to. Which is phase three.

That is what good managers and good teams do. So far I have not even seen phase one - beating teams you are supposed to beat regularly and consistently. And we are what two years in?

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668051#Comment_119668051

I will make it simple for you so in the last two years are Ireland beating teams in or around them on a consistent basis?

Yes or no?

And if not, why do you think Ireland have not even done this?

The only good thing I have seen so far is chasing and energy. has returned. It is nice to have that basic back. Because without that this Irish team is very limp and no threat at all . But that to me is a basic of an Irish football team, regardless of style.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667472#Comment_119667472

Now lads there you have it we can all go home.

End of debate 🤣

secman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668035#Comment_119668035

I back you for the job, replacement right under our nose. .

BonnieSituation

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667774#Comment_119667774

All over the weekend we kept on being told that any old manager could bring youth through.

thebaz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668060#Comment_119668060

so sack Kenny and bring in a retired Big Sam , will resolve everything - football has moved on, and BTW I grew up with the glory days of the 80s / played the physical game back then . But today, given resources Kenny is a much better fit than a dinosaur like Big Sam.

BonnieSituation

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668035#Comment_119668035

Can I have a TLDR for that?

Gusser09

Otb sponsored by SK PR are giving him a pass on Armenia. Losing would be unthinkable but they are saying SK should stay on for the euros regardless.

Im sorry. But if we lose tomorrow he'll have to go.

I think we will win and comfortably. But lets see.

If we lose tomorrow are there any posters who would persist?

johnnyryan89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668135#Comment_119668135

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668051#Comment_119668051

...

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119665334#Comment_119665334

Correct if I am wrong, but weren't they raving about McShane's performance v the Czech's? He was held up as the next best thing.

Also in retrospect Kevin Doyle has claimed Staunton was harshly treated.

 https://www.balls.ie/football/doyle-steve-staunton-ireland-manager-419555

Plus Staunton gave all sorts of players their debuts under his tenure.

https://www.balls.ie/football/ireland-international-where-are-they-now-usa-friendly-lapira-76635

Joe Lapira!

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/schoolboy-dixon-in-dreamland-after-call-up-26383491.html

Terry Dixon called up under Stan aged 16.

That was blooding players and hunting for players if there was.

Yet at the time the knives were out. In stark contrast to Kenny's tenure now where he is treated with kid gloves by the media.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668134#Comment_119668134

I never said sack Kenny, the FAI have made their bed now. But I suspect his next campaign will be his last.

A more experienced manager with good organisational skills will hopefully take the helm after him. As Kenny has done the blooding of youngsters work and minded the house, until a manager who can make a team play better than the sum of its parts at international level comes along.

thebaz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668180#Comment_119668180

So why did you keep bringing up Big Sam - actually doesn't matter - i need a rest

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667495#Comment_119667495

There was a lot to be said for the Staunton era when Bobby Robson was around. We played some great stuff and you could clearly see his fingerprints all over it.

Unfortunately for us, we hired him and then he got very ill. After he left the set-up it was a disaster. People often forget that when talking about the Staunton era. Looking back on him now, Robson was a manager way ahead of his time. The adaptive style we see across the world today is from his blueprint.

A Hughton/Barry team wouldn’t be a bad shout at all, providing Hughton left the coaching to Barry and was in an advisory role. Having said all of that, the FAI hasn’t a pot to piss in at the moment so it’s not going to happen.

Nobody here would argue that we should be losing to Luxembourg or Armenia. However, look at that Scotland team compared to ours. Not one single person here or in Scotland thought we’d beat them 3-0 at Lansdowne Road when you compare the two teams. We’re still punching above our station but the loses against lesser teams does need to be addressed. I find watching us, we struggle to break them down but once we do, the gloves are off. Look at Azerbaijan and Luxembourg away. Once we scored, they had to play and that opened up the pitch for us to score more with a lot more ease. Andorra too.

However, there’s also the argument that those losses need to show exactly where we are at the moment, but yet the first thing people do is blame the manager. San Marino and Cyprus under Stan were completely different as our team was full of Premier League regulars. On Saturday, the only Premier League regulars were Bazunu and Collins. That’s a massive, massive drop in quality, but you cannot argue that they’re not giving it their all and they’re clearly buying into the system.

This Irish team has no divine right to be beating Scotland and Ukraine. Ever. It genuinely baffled me seeing people sticking the knives in because we were beaten by Scotland at Hampden Park. The delusion is unreal.

If Scotland battered us off the park and we were lucky to only lose 2-1, then I’d be concerned. That’s not the case though. We should have won that game. We should have beaten Ukraine away and we were a finisher away from beating Portugal both home and away. Hell we missed an open goal against Slovakia and lost on penalties in a Euro 2020 play-off. We’re still putting it up to teams at another level to us player-wise. All that’s missing is that stroke of luck which isn’t happening at the moment and no manager brings you improvements in that regard.

pjohnson

A loss to Armenia wont cost Kenny his job so people wishing for an Armenia win are being daft.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119667631#Comment_119667631

They wouldn't have gotten the chance back in 2021 if we got Allerdice like some wanted.

Guys like Bazunu would probably not be first team in the Premier League if he wasn't given the backing.

pjohnson

Wheres the idea that Kenny helped Bazunu become a PL keeper coming from?

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668257#Comment_119668257

In fairness, his exposure at international level at such a young age definitely raised his profile, as it would for any 19-year-old keeper that saves a penalty from Cristiano Ronaldo in a World Cup Qualifier.

I agree it’s not all down to Kenny. Southampton definitely would have Portsmouth well monitored, but he was given a new exposure to a vastly higher level of football with Ireland.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668200#Comment_119668200

Because of the snobbish narrative about Allardyce, on these threads, which when you look at what the guy achieved with his clubs, he got the job done. Improving teams and making them greater than the sum of their parts.

As I said, to me playing football 'the right way' is not just easy on the eye stuff. To me playing football 'the right way' is the one that makes a team overachieve and get results, regardless of style.

I just think Irish fans cannot afford to be snobby about 'style of play'. International football managers have a short time with players. And the smart ones keep it simple, with limited players.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668277#Comment_119668277

Southampton monitor a lot of young players (especially from City).

Bazunu's 70+ games in League One makes him a veteran compared to Lavia who made the same move minus any Belgian caps and has been an immediate first choice aswell.

Two others kids moved that direction aswell so trying to credit Kenny at all is a strech.

Azatadine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668139#Comment_119668139

Yeah, heard them earlier on. They've always loved Kenny. He can't do a thing wrong with them.

They were even going on about how the next manager will be so, so lucky to take over and make hay as a result of Kenny. He's just the greatest thing ever according to them.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668287#Comment_119668287

I don't give a fk what way we play if we win.

I just think what he is trying is the best way to win. I don't think we are good enough to park the bus and soak it up so we need to control the play.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668215#Comment_119668215

Him losing won't get him the sack and regardless of what people are saying a win won't ease the pressure one bit either.

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668296#Comment_119668296

Lavia played cup games for City at the age of 17 which with the depth of squad they have shows what raw talent he has. Pretty sure he was in their Champions League squad too.

Bazunu wasn't even in contention at that age. Goalkeeper is a completely different position of course, but he got exposure on the international stage which raised his profile. Lavia already had one.

Like I said, Southampton would have been watching Portsmouth very closely as their nearest rivals, but to say nobody stood up and took notice of Bazunu's ability while playing for Ireland is way off the mark, in my opinion. His previous loan spell at Rochdale didn't exactly earn him any rave reviews to the point where he was dropped.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668168#Comment_119668168

Correct if I am wrong, but weren't they raving about McShane's performance v the Czech's? He was held up as the next best thing.

You are on the right track.

After the debacle in Cyprus they were playing Czech republic a few days later.

Some defender,vI think it was John O'Shea, was suspended and the new McShane was coming in to replace him. I think it was his first cap.

Everyone was very nervous, they thought he would be taken to the cleaners by a very good Czech team.

But that wasn't the case, McShane had a stormer, man of the match performance.

There is a great thread about it here of you can find it.

Brock Turnpike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668615#Comment_119668615

McShane played very well but was caught out for the equalizer.

Brock Turnpike

I think people saying a loss to Armenia won't result in him being sacked are being overly assured in SK's position.

I say that as someone who wants him to succeed and thinks we are heading in the right direction. However, there will be huge pressure placed on him should we lose tomorrow night. I expect there are some in the FAI who are not fully bought into Kenny's regime.

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668924#Comment_119668924

But yet they gave him a contract until after the Euros campaign.

The FAI can't afford to pay that out. They're completely broke.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669075#Comment_119669075

Utterly bonkers that they caved to his cheerleaders in the media and gave him a contract. 500k a year, it's not as if anyone else was beating down his door either.

johnnyryan89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669075#Comment_119669075

There's an escape clause in his contract that allows the FAI to cut ties if they want to after tomorrow's game.

mjsc1970

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669201#Comment_119669201

Say what now ?

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669167#Comment_119669167

Ah g'way. 'Cheerleaders in the media'.

Go to the Aviva tomorrow and see where the real support is coming from. 44 thousand tickets sold for a Tuesday night game against Armenia.

The sooner you shut up about 'the media' and realise the fans who actually go to and support the team are fully behind him, the better.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669075#Comment_119669075

But there is also a point where they know keeping him is untenable and they would have made arrangements for that in his contract.

In the long run which makes more economic sense ?

Keeping a bad manager that will allow you to cascade down the rankings and thus reduce your seeding and thus reduce your chances of major tournament qualification, or cutting your losses and getting rid of said manager with the hope that a new one will stabalise things.

A failure to win v Armenia should tip that balance.

johnnyryan89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669219#Comment_119669219

CEO confirmed back when the contract was signed there's a clause in the contract which allows the FAI to part ways with Kenny if they feel things aren't going to plan after this Nations League campaign at a reduced rate. Said it's common in many business practices to have such clauses.

Since we've finally got a competent CEO and had to pay massive money to MONROY and then paid Mick an arm and leg which included a bonus for seeing out his contract I'm not one bit surprised the new guy will want clauses like this in all contracts going forward.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669229#Comment_119669229

...Tuesdays night's game against Armenia. A side that in normal circumstances would not expect to get a result away to Ireland but can feel reasonably confident if not of getting a win but being in the mix.

Fixed your post there for you.

Utterly bizarre that Armenia could win (and they have a reasonable shout against Kenny's Ireland) and we have posters here primed to excuse it.

Quazzie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669291#Comment_119669291

I think what's more bizarre is that we have posters here actually hoping we lose so that they can try justify their stance on SK being sacked.

sterz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119664636#Comment_119664636

Still working on that list of yours, @MrMusician18 ?

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669291#Comment_119669291

Name me an Irish manager where we were ever full sure of a win against anyone ?

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669485#Comment_119669485

Oh come on

For decades we always were sure we could beat the lowest seeds in the group and with the very odd exception like away to Liechtenstein in 1995 we have won those games handy.

It's a huge indictment of the current the current regime if people are already making excuses about not being able to beat Armenia at home.

the kelt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119668139#Comment_119668139

its kinda like the maga boys following the trump cult at this stage when it comes to Stephen Kenny and the OTB crowd amongst others.

I genuinely believe there’s actually no line where they go “ah here enough is enough” I mean beat Armenia comfortably like we should and we will be 1970s Brazil incarnate, lose or draw and we were still brilliant but unlucky and Armenia are actually quite good don’t ye know!

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669544#Comment_119669544

That was the lowest seed in a Euros group which have seeds from the whole spectrum. This is a merit based tournament designed to lump teams of a similar standard together.Armenia are here on merit.

You are also misremembering how easy those games were. 2 goal wins are pretty rare for Ireland and there's a reason Apres Match have a song called "but we drew"

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669564#Comment_119669564

You could say sinilarnfornthe alternative view. Lose or draw and it's a disgrace, Kenny out. Win and it's , well it's only Armenia, my granny would beat them.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669593#Comment_119669593

Well it is only Armenia, a team that should be a very comfortable win at home. You can't guage progress against a side like that, but failing to beat them is regression.

TheCitizen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119665437#Comment_119665437

We did ok first half in midfield. The 3 in midfield worked hard and ran their legs off. Kenny must then recognise that and replace at least 2 if not all 3 of them on the hour mark and ask the subs to give the same commitment and energy. That’s where Kenny is still going wrong in a big way. You can have 5 subs these days. He needs to use the subs better. He needs to have a better strategy re substitutions. Get subs on at 60 minutes or earlier to inject new energy in the team and keep momentum going.

Doherty was out on his feet should have had Coleman on at halftime. The midfield 3, same thing. Bring in subs on time, even if they’re inferior players, you need fresh legs if you’re getting the effort and legwork that Knight Molumby and Cullen gave. They can’t do it for 90 minutes. It’s 60 minutes at the very maximum and then sub them.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669593#Comment_119669593

I don't think that's the case. It's a bit disingenuous also I think.

I've said it before that Kenny will ultimately be judged by these kind of games. So far we have been on a back foot early on in groups by losing to Luxembourg at home and Armenia away. In the World Cup Qualifiers we might have given him a pass but the loss to Armenia has ruined our chances in this group. A group that Kenny said he wanted to win. A pattern like that is unacceptable.

We're at home tonight so it really needs to be a dominant display and a comfortable win for the likes of OTB to be able to claim that we are making the progress which they have been banging on about.

Let's see. If we win comfortably tonight I think he should be given the benefit of the doubt. But if it's a struggle I think questions will still remain.