The Tipperary GAA Discussion Thread

challengerbell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119343641#Comment_119343641

I was fascinated with the pathetic number of supporters that attended Clare matches in 2016. Just 3 years after being All Ireland champions. Munster semi final, 19k versus a well supported Waterford. Just 5k at home to Laois and just 15k at a double header was particularly sad. Are Clare supporters traumatised by decades of lack of success?

Even this year at your highest ebb in nearly a decade you and Kilkenny couldnt break 40k for an All Ireland semi final!

Did you ask Kilkenny fans here about their poor support this year? 13k at home to Wexford. 33k (it was less) for the Leinster final. 39k All Ireland semi final.

What about the so called great Wexford supporters, hardly breaking 10k at home championship matches. Iv been at tipp league games v dublin with that attendance.

The great Limerick supporters have not shown up on multiple occasions including as recently as 2016 and 2017.

Do you find the supporter for all these counties pathetic or are you just here for the cheap dig?

challengerbell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119344249#Comment_119344249

And ill ad to that, that 15k you mention in 2016 Wexford v Cork was a double header with no other than Limerick and Clare. 15k from 4 counties playing championship hurling.

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119344365#Comment_119344365

Very well noted. Now that attendance is what can be correctly called pathetic.

evolvingtipperary101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119344354#Comment_119344354

I was thinking a bit more about this. And one thing that hurts us in Tipp, in terms of momentum and a sense of a large group creating fanfare around upcoming games is we have no city. I think in other counties that have cities, (when they're going well it has to be said,) the sense of fanfare and momentum comes to a boil.

Fred Astaire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119344270#Comment_119344270

Why would this "treatment" of Colm Bonnar make the support "problem" worse?

The reason the team was so poorly supported this year was because of Colm Bonnar. How many games did you go to? Because 2 out of the 3 Tipp Championship games that I was at were amongst the worst days I've ever had as a fan. That Clare game was a complete disgrace and the fans should have been offered refunds after the disgraceful, pathetic effort in the Cork game.

Colm Bonnar was a complete failure as Tipperary manager. He led the team to their worst championship performance in the history of intercounty hurling. The team were woefully unprepared, with no gameplan, no fitness, no puckout strategy, no knowledge or plan to change things in game. If I was as bad at my job as Bonnar was at his then I'd have had the cop on to walk away from it, or know that I'd deserve a firing. Unfortunately, he decided he should stay on, when everybody could see he was miles out of his depth so he had to be pushed. A bit mean how it was done, but it was the right decision.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119342503#Comment_119342503

Cahill has one blot on his copybook at intercounty level and aside from this season has proven himself to be one of the freshest, most innovative minds in the hurling scene. Cahill too at least had the league this season. Bonnar has been sniffing around intercounty level for 20 years with a few years break for club or college exploits - and failed at Wexford and managed to get a few plucky performances out of Carlow. That should never have had him anywhere near the Tipp job - miles out of his depth.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119341704#Comment_119341704

He has an All Ireland Final appearance and an All Ireland Semi Final appearance in his first 3 seasons of intercounty management, having inherited a team that had 0 championship wins the year before he took over. Sound familiar?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119341337#Comment_119341337

Yes he will.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119340610#Comment_119340610

No there wouldn't. Christ what the absolute f*ck are you on about.

Am I annoyed that he put us in the position where Bonnar was hired? Yes. We desperately needed him last year and he turned us down. However I am not going to cut my nose off to spite my face, and only utter ignoramuses would be saying no to Cahill at this point. I want to win. Cahill is the best chance of doing so. Cahill has more than proved himself at intercounty level, both underage and senior.

You've talked an absolutely ridiculous amount of shite over the last few pages.

realdanbreen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119346033#Comment_119346033

Horseshit from beginning to end!

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119346033#Comment_119346033

To call it worst performance in championship in history is ridiculously harsh and completely unfair to Bonnar and anyone else involved right now. Its also ridiculous to compare eras especially when talking about straight knockout and the format now.. You are very personal attacking Bonnar. why? Very harsh and unfair.

Fred Astaire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119346448#Comment_119346448

Can you name me any other Championship where Tipperary lost 4 games in the Championship and won none?

I don't think you can.

Therefore, it is factually the worst Championship in history

Fred Astaire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119346215#Comment_119346215

You're the expert in that field, clearly.

Swimming in the stuff.

farmerval

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119346606#Comment_119346606

The round robin era is the only one where we are guarantied 4 games. Have we had 4 years of it? Is this then the worst year in 4 or however many round robins we've had.

1974 to 82 we never won one game; was that the worst era ever???? Were you jumping up and down then!!!! Was that era Bonnars fault as well???

Fred Astaire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119347062#Comment_119347062

When you have 1 game to lose and you're gone, anything can go wrong. You can get caught cold, a break might not go your way, the referee might screw you - anything.

When you lose 4 games, and 2 of them in the disgraceful manner we did, there can be absolutely no bones about it. That Cork team embarrassed us like a Cork team hasn't embarrassed us in a half century and they are a terrible side.

He started his reign by losing to Kerry. He had an atrocious league, managing to beat Laois and Antrim, and edge Kilkenny in one of the worst games of hurling I've ever seen. A poor showing v Dublin and a terrible showing v Waterford.

Into the Championship where he has lost four games and it's hard to tell if the team have worked on anything throughout the whole year.

If you think that anything that happened this season was acceptable or that Bonnar wasn't a colossal problem due to being completely out of his depth, you're codding yourself. I genuinely don't know what lads were watching to say that Bonnar deserved more time. A fella 20 years past his sell by date at intercounty level.

windy shepard henderson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119347447#Comment_119347447

no one is talking about the fact that this was a team with several key players injured , then john mcgrath went off at the start of the second game against clare . ye were missing 6 players against us no one can cope with that

but as far as tactics goes , it was the right decision , grand play that type of hurling and give that amount of space in bonners day but not today , good decision deceitful and all it may look like

farmerval

I felt when Bonnar took over he was likely onto a sticky wicket, nothing to do with him. The popular narrative is that Liam Cahill would have brought on the successful underage players he had and all would be well in the world.

However looking at the Tipp team post 2016 a few things stand out. Several of the 2016 intake have underperformed or been extremely inconsistent. In the 2019 final Paidi and Brendan were the catalysts to drive us on when KK had us on the backfoot. If all the 2009 -2010 era guys retired we were extremely short on leaders, ironically for Bonnar Dan McCormack's nosedive in form made this even worse. Really, Forde, John McGrath, Bubbles, Seamie Kennedy, Barry Heffernan, Dan McCormack were the men that should have been leading a new era for Tipp. They haven't stood up and drove on.

If we're saying they underperformed because of the manager, what does that say about them. They're not guys just into the panel depending on the management to bring them forward. When Waterford were shocking against Clare the players got lots of the blame for downing tools, in Tipp it's the manager.

For some Sheedy didn't start the underage stars when he should, the unpalatable truth may be that they aren't that good. The U20 and U21 finals should have given us two teams to pull from, there was little overlap between them, yet Cork seem to have gotten more from their losing teams than we did from our winning teams.

Players like Mark Kehoe, Jake Morris, Willie Connors, Ger Browne, Robert Byrne have been around the panel since 2019 yet only Jake is a regular starter. With the 2008-2009 and 2010 teams Sheedy proved that he wasn't slow to bring young players through, but these ones haven't stepped up yet. In the modern game not many that aren't involved with the senior panel at U20/U21 stage come through afterwards.

There's a huge amount of conflicting opinions around, The county Board were wrong not to appoint Cahill in 2019, to they should never speak to him again after he turned them down. The bottom line is Bonnar is gone, did he do well, no, definitely not, should they have appointed him, no, in hindsight, when Cahill turned then down who else did they look at? William Maher for the record seems to be forever in the conversation yet I don't know why? Has he a record that suggests he is good enough for the job.

No-one is coming out of this smelling of roses, Cahill stepping down in Waterford as soon as Bonnar was sacked while still being on the record as "couldn't wait to get back with the players" sounds particularly bad. I assume that he has already had assurance from the County Board re coming back to Tipp.

Funny thing is if Cahill stayed another year in Waterford and Cummins pulled an U20 AA next year would anyone want Cahill back.

Kylie06

Excellent post as always

fact is that if Cahill does well all this stuff about ‘ he turned us down ‘ will be forgotten.

times a great healer. Hope it goes well and he brings through some new blood….and is given time to do so too.

bonner couldn’t have stayed on. It was just handled awfully .

tooka

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119348538#Comment_119348538

Two words - Craig Morgan

sheedy did not give him a chance and Morgan was one of the best players this year.

My 2 predictions

1. if cahill gets the job he will win tipp an all Ireland.
2. people will query how sheedy could not bring those same players through

evolvingtipperary101

Liam Cahill announced as the new Tipp manager. 3 years. Bevans is joining him. More backroom to be announced over the coming weeks.

farmerval

Presumably agreed before Bonnar got the chop. The most sensible move. I would say all parties are a bit scarred from the fiasco of Cahill turning it down, Bonnar not working and Cahill falling flat in Waterford.

It was possibly dubious whether the Waterford players would have gone back under Cahill. Big change in perceptions in a year.

PTH2009

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119355585#Comment_119355585

very bittersweet from a Waterford point of view but by god ye have made a good appointment up there and fully believe he will bring ye back

going to a fiery in the league and championship when we meet

evolvingtipperary101

I hope Cahill has learned his lesson in his first senior job. No looseness around a mic. Players train too hard to be hung out to dry. I have no problems with ridiculously hard training. It's a good weeding-out process in pursuit of the ultimate. I think he had found the weaknesses in Waterford through that kind of training. They just had too much clout down there, saw the chop coming, and it was coming, and pushed him out.

I hope Cahill gives some players a heads up and lets them announce their retirement. No point in cutting the likes of Bonnar. Let him announce his retirement himself. He and others have earned it at this stage. If they don't want to retire, that's another story.

evolvingtipperary101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119355648#Comment_119355648

It's going to be full on. But, sure look, it always is.

Did you hear anything about Derek McGrath talking himself out of the job with demands? And that the Waterford board have talked to Darren Gleeson.

jimmythesulk

Hard training during the league makes sense. Running the shite out of lads in the middle of the Munster championship makes no sense. I think his reputation has taken a nose dive this year and I'm afraid from what I hear that is not the fault of the Waterford players. Then to hang the players out to dry in a post match interview tells me this manager has alot to learn. Tipp don't have enough decent players at the moment so I can't see him turning things around

evolvingtipperary101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119355865#Comment_119355865

It was a handful of players who felt the training was too hard in the lead up to games. Cahill, Bevans, McGuinness, and a lot of other players thought different...

evolvingtipperary101

Anyone else hear that Laffan is taking on the Laois job? They've got themselves some man there. I think he'll do a good job.

realdanbreen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119355585#Comment_119355585

I see Colm Bonners club Cashel King Cormacs have issued their own statement about the affair. The county board have managed to make divisions in the county even worse.

Montys return

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119355585#Comment_119355585

You must be fuming

evolvingtipperary101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119356153#Comment_119356153

I'm drinking a beer in a hot tub, singing He's coming home, He's coming, Cahill's coming home, He's coming home - etcetera

Montys return

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119356203#Comment_119356203

Thought you'd be bulling, he's no respect for Tipperary hurling after all!!!

farmerval

Question is; what's moved the dial since last year? Was there conditions of Cahill's that the Co Board wouldn't agree to a year ago that they will agree to now? Or does he realise that the gig is up with Waterford.

Last year he saw huge potential in Waterford, the County Board were fantastic to deal with, so why run away now? It's not like Tipp improved in the year.

Dayor Knight

What changed...... the year Tipp had, the direction things went for Cahill in Waterford. Both parties in a very different place to last last year.

evolvingtipperary101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119357261#Comment_119357261

He's not running away from anything. I'd say it's a mixture of the things you've mentioned. But you've also got Cummins and Woodlock developing groups. You've got a number of Tipp managers on the county scene and more to come from what I've heard. One of them might have real success. Suddenly you're down the pecking order. You've got to strike while you've got the most chips.

Tipp didn't improve. But there is a goldmine, albeit, of raw talent to be brought in - that Bonnar didn't bring in.

It'll be really interesting to see what type of player Cahill and Bevans pick for the panel. Will he try to coax Jerome Cahill back? Will he pick Sean Hayes, McGarry, and Max Hackett? Ormonde? All small men but very fast, wristy, off-the-cuff hurlers. Running game hurlers. They're the antithesis of what Limerick is doing.

Or will he go with the likes of Bill Seymour, Creedon, Jack Leamy, and Kyle Shelley.

Or will it be a clear out of over half the players and pick both groups of young players - a new squad. It'll be an interesting panel.

Another factor is, Sheedy brought in 13 players of Cahill's under 20/21 squads. They've had top end S&C for years now. Sheedy had Cairbre Ó Cairealláin in with him. Limerick have since coaxed him back. More of those players got more time under Bonnar. It's go time now. They're all 22/23 now. Players like Dillon Quirke starting to look big. They've had a taste of it. It's go time now.