United Rugby Championship announced, beginning September 2021

irelandrover

irelandrover wrote: »

I get the argument. However on the flip side Glasgow will have 2 games against a Zebre team who are targetting those 2 games. Zebre will target 6 games in the year to top their pool and qualify for the champions cup.

I'd take a pumped up zebre over a standard week leinster any tbh.

The flip side is this should help push the Irish provences on as they have their more competitive league now

bilston

Hopefully they don't geo block RTE's coverage in NI

ClanofLams

I can’t see RTÉ getting away with similar to last time but maybe I am being overly optimistic. The league has come a long way since and with CVC likely wanting to take it to higher levels, I would expect they will show Leinster and Munster every week, they might leave some Ulster games to BBC NI and some Connacht games to TG4.

Six of the 18 rounds will be all inter pros anyway so they will obviously show them.

Also I might be mistaken but from what I can remember, RTÉ had more sport the last time they had Celtic league. They have very little now during the winter months, premiership gone.

icdg

An interesting thing is that, with the pool system, there is effectively an Irish interprovincial championship again, with a guaranteed Heineken Cup place on offer as the prize. So that alone should give the derbies a significance they didn’t have before, where unfortunately we saw weaker teams played.

Still no official word on TV rights. Talk of Premier Sports retaining some rights seems to have disappeared in the latest reports. FTA is great for the causal fan but hardcore fans should be prepared for less games on TV next season, particularly if you don’t have a satellite dish or access to non-NI regional U.K. broadcasters (Virgin/eir/Vodafone customers).

Red Silurian

Nikolas Narrow Bulb wrote: »

I'd take a pumped up zebre over a standard week leinster any tbh.

The flip side is this should help push the Irish provences on as they have their more competitive league now

Makes it easier to determine the inter-provincial champions every year as well, no more calculators or excel sheets... I wonder would the IRFU create a trophy for one of them to lift to add a bit of buzz

Podge_irl

Red Silurian wrote: »

One thing they could do is reduce the Italian and Scottish teams to 16 Regular games ie they play everybody once and an additional derby

It means that the nations willing to put more teams into the league get the leg up instead of the nations that don't seem to care much

Yes. Having a league where teams play different numbers of games would totally be more fair and reasonable.

pickarooney

Poor Cheetahs

phog

thomond2006 wrote: »

There's no alternative to an imbalanced competition unless you scrap the home and away derbies and that isn't a runner. From a rugby pov, I wouldn't mind but financially they are vital.

I'm not a betting man but I'd put money on there being a change to the format before season 3.

Teferi

This looks good. Really excited about it. Hopefully the IRFU spin up a new Interpro Championship trophy for the Irish divisional. Adds an extra layer of spice to proceedings.

Podge_irl

phog wrote: »

I'm not a betting man but I'd put money on there being a change to the format before season 3.

What kind of change though? The respective unions won't countenance losing derbies and an increase in games would be extremely counter-productive.

aloooof

phog wrote: »

I'm not a betting man but I'd put money on there being a change to the format before season 3.

I don't think that's the point thomond was making tho. Even if there is a change, it'll still likely be to an imbalanced format, as the provinces etc. won't want to lose their derbies.

Red Silurian

Podge_irl wrote: »

Yes. Having a league where teams play different numbers of games would totally be more fair and reasonable.

It's not but it's more fair and more reasonable than watching Glasgow or Edinburgh getting ahead of the Irish teams every season with 4 BP wins against the lowly Italians while we only play them once and all because the Scottish and Italians aren't as interested in the league as the Irish

Scythica

Screw it.

Tougher league, directly makes life harder for Ulster to do well.

You know what though, I love it. Very excited to see how this goes.

Big question - will Nufi start moving players around with more earnest given the lack of gametime players will get now?

Red Silurian

aloooof wrote: »

I don't think that's the point thomond was making tho. Even if there is a change, it'll still likely be to an imbalanced format, as the provinces etc. won't want to lose their derbies.

The only change I can realistically see happening is teams merging with each other in Wales or Italy possibly supplying just one team. The Welsh could always leave us for the English Premiership as well

Then you'd have reduced numbers which would potentially pave the way for a more simplified league system

sydthebeat

Red Silurian wrote: »

It's not but it's more fair and more reasonable than watching Glasgow or Edinburgh getting ahead of the Irish teams every season with 4 BP wins against the lowly Italians while we only play them once and all because the Scottish and Italians aren't as interested in the league as the Irish

2015 called, looking for your viewpoint back....

ClanofLams

Red Silurian wrote: »

The only change I can realistically see happening is teams merging with each other in Wales or Italy possibly supplying just one team. The Welsh could always leave us for the English Premiership as well

Then you'd have reduced numbers which would potentially pave the way for a more simplified league system

The Welsh would have left for the Premiership years ago if they could have but the Premiership has zero interest in them. Hopefully they might stop acting like children and wake up to this reality but I won’t hold my breath.

Squidgy Black

Red Silurian wrote: »

The only change I can realistically see happening is teams merging with each other in Wales or Italy possibly supplying just one team. The Welsh could always leave us for the English Premiership as well

Then you'd have reduced numbers which would potentially pave the way for a more simplified league system

The Premiership wouldn't touch the Welsh teams with a barge pole.

Podge_irl

Red Silurian wrote: »

It's not but it's more fair and more reasonable than watching Glasgow or Edinburgh getting ahead of the Irish teams every season with 4 BP wins against the lowly Italians while we only play them once and all because the Scottish and Italians aren't as interested in the league as the Irish

No it isn't. It is, on any number of levels, demonstrably more unfair and utterly ridiculous.

Apart from anything else, I highly doubt 4 BP wins against the Italian teams will be anything close to a regular occurrence. Also, the Irish are plenty uninterested in the league, they just have better and larger squads. There is no perfect setup and this seems like a pretty good option overall.

thomond2006

Wales joining the Premiership is pipe dream stuff repeated ad nauseam by some pretty delusional people online.

I'd expect the PRL to ringfence the tournament shortly.

aloooof

ClanofLams wrote: »

The Welsh would have left for the Premiership years ago if they could have but the Premiership has zero interest in them. Hopefully they might stop acting like children and wake up to this reality but I won’t hold my breath.

I read Winter Colours last year during lockdown. There were sections in it written in the late 90's where (I think) the likes of Rob Howley mentioned the possibility of the Welsh teams joining the Prem. That gave me a chuckle.

Lost Ormond

Red Silurian wrote: »

The only change I can realistically see happening is teams merging with each other in Wales or Italy possibly supplying just one team. The Welsh could always leave us for the English Premiership as well

Then you'd have reduced numbers which would potentially pave the way for a more simplified league system

I dont see the Italians merging. Or wanting to.
The welsh looked at merging some sides a few years back and it didnt happen. And i dont see it happening now.
The welsh arent going to leave us for the English now. The english want to ringfence the premiership and wont do that if it means losing 2 or 3 english sides to get the 4 welsh in their place

Cookiemunster

icdg wrote: »

An interesting thing is that, with the pool system, there is effectively an Irish interprovincial championship again, with a guaranteed Heineken Cup place on offer as the prize. So that alone should give the derbies a significance they didn’t have before, where unfortunately we saw weaker teams played.

It doesn't though. They pool positions will be decided on your results over 18 games rather than 6. So in reality the pools are just a way to guarantee that there'll always be a Scottish/Italian or Welsh team in Europe.

Teferi

ClanofLams wrote: »

The Welsh would have left for the Premiership years ago if they could have but the Premiership has zero interest in them. Hopefully they might stop acting like children and wake up to this reality but I won’t hold my breath.

Despite it being bad for us, I'd love to see what happens the Welsh went over to the premiership. 2/3 of them would be in the championship within 2 years and whoever was left in the premiership would be permanently bottom of the league.

Would give the welsh a nice wake up call.

phog

Podge_irl wrote: »

What kind of change though? The respective unions won't countenance losing derbies and an increase in games would be extremely counter-productive.

aloooof wrote: »

I don't think that's the point thomond was making tho. Even if there is a change, it'll still likely be to an imbalanced format, as the provinces etc. won't want to lose their derbies.

I'm not suggesting they would but there has to be a better option for the IRFU and the 4 provinces than they knocking each other out of contention in our own pool.

Maybe revert to 2 conferences??????????

Red Silurian

Scythica wrote: »

Screw it.

Tougher league, directly makes life harder for Ulster to do well.

You know what though, I love it. Very excited to see how this goes.

Big question - will Nufi start moving players around with more earnest given the lack of gametime players will get now?

Considering we now essentially have an Irish League and no promotion or relegation to a second division Nucifora could merge the provincial academies in the name of the IRFU. At the start of every season then have an american style draft where the lowest ranked province signs the new players first. It would involve about 10% of the players involved Vs what we have across the Atlantic but could add a bit of buzz

Former Former Former

thomond2006 wrote: »

Wales joining the Premiership is pipe dream stuff repeated ad nauseam by some pretty delusional people online.

I'd expect the PRL to ringfence the tournament shortly.

Ring-fencing would make it easier for the Welsh to join.

The English were in favour of it when it would have suited them. If circumstances change again, they might think it's worth exploring.

Teferi

Former Former Former wrote: »

Ring-fencing would make it easier for the Welsh to join.

The English were in favour of it when it would have suited them. If circumstances change again, they might think it's worth exploring.

The English were in favour of adding the Welsh? I don't believe so - it's a handy carrot for them to dangle in front of the Welsh when they want something out of them but I don't think there was ever true intent.

PMC83

Teferi wrote: »

Despite it being bad for us, I'd love to see what happens the Welsh went over to the premiership. 2/3 of them would be in the championship within 2 years and whoever was left in the premiership would be permanently bottom of the league.

Would give the welsh a nice wake up call.

Yet the Irish nation team would still struggle against theirs! How do they do it!?

Red Silurian

Lost Ormond wrote: »

I dont see the Italians merging. Or wanting to.
The welsh looked at merging some sides a few years back and it didnt happen. And i dont see it happening now.
The welsh arent going to leave us for the English now. The english want to ringfence the premiership and wont do that if it means losing 2 or 3 english sides to get the 4 welsh in their place

My point is that the only way I can see the format changing is if teams join, merge, split or leave

aloooof

Lost Ormond wrote: »

I dont see the Italians merging. Or wanting to.

Can't remember if I dreamt this or what, but wasn't there some talk last year or so of an Italian team moving / being set up in Rome?

irelandrover

Red Silurian wrote: »

Considering we now essentially have an Irish League and no promotion or relegation to a second division Nucifora could merge the provincial academies in the name of the IRFU. At the start of every season then have an american style draft where the lowest ranked province signs the new players first. It would involve about 10% of the players involved Vs what we have across the Atlantic but could add a bit of buzz

So you force a guy going to University in Dublin to either quit university or quit rugby if Munster draft him?

aloooof

irelandrover wrote: »

So you force a guy going to University in Dublin to either quit university or quit rugby if Munster draft him?

I'm completely against the idea of a draft as well, but I've never really understood why this choice is seen as such a big deal?

Red Silurian

irelandrover wrote: »

So you force a guy going to University in Dublin to either quit university or quit rugby if Munster draft him?

Not at all, I'd be talking about professionals, not the college game

sprucemoose

Red Silurian wrote: »

Considering we now essentially have an Irish League and no promotion or relegation to a second division Nucifora could merge the provincial academies in the name of the IRFU. At the start of every season then have an american style draft where the lowest ranked province signs the new players first. It would involve about 10% of the players involved Vs what we have across the Atlantic but could add a bit of buzz

i presume this is a joke?

irelandrover wrote: »

So you force a guy going to University in Dublin to either quit university or quit rugby if Munster draft him?

to be fair, similar enough situation happening at the moment according to UCC and to a lesser extent CIT/MTU

irelandrover

aloooof wrote: »

I'm completely against the idea of a draft as well, but I've never really understood why this choice is seen as such a big deal?

It might just be me, but in a sport as attritional as rugby we should be encouraging players to get degrees so they have a life after rugby rather than the other way around.

The draft in the states works as it is after players have already been in university and gotten a qualification.

But this is way off topic so ill stop it there.

sprucemoose

aloooof wrote: »

I'm completely against the idea of a draft as well, but I've never really understood why this choice is seen as such a big deal?

we're alot more parochial in this country and the majority of players want to represent their local/provincial teams

sydthebeat

Red Silurian wrote: »

Not at all, I'd be talking about professionals, not the college game

LOL

Lost Ormond

irelandrover wrote: »

So you force a guy going to University in Dublin to either quit university or quit rugby if Munster draft him?

They wouldnt have to quit university or rugby if this came in. I dont see it happening or see it as necessary but the pandemic has shown even more that you dont have to be in city where you are studying to be doing degree there and there is loads of players now and been plenty in past who've been studying online/part time etc in order to complete degrees or any other course.
Most universities offer the same or very similar courses so no player will have to quit university if they move province

Podge_irl

Lost Ormond wrote: »

They wouldnt have to quit university or rugby if this came in. I dont see it happening or see it as necessary but the pandemic has shown even more that you dont have to be in city where you are studying to be doing degree there and there is loads of players now and been plenty in past who've been studying online/part time etc in order to complete degrees or any other course.
Most universities offer the same or very similar courses so no player will have to quit university if they move province

It absolutely has not shown that.

Anyway, regardless a draft is never happening and the Welsh are never joining the English Premiership.

ClanofLams

https://twitter.com/murray_kinsella/status/1404763208175472644?s=21

90% of Irish provinces games will be on free to air per Murray Kinsella, four year broadcasting deals.

Podge_irl

Former Former Former wrote: »

Ring-fencing would make it easier for the Welsh to join.

The English were in favour of it when it would have suited them. If circumstances change again, they might think it's worth exploring.

Unless they are planning on moving to an 18 team league, which they are not and are never going to, it is a complete non-runner.

Of course, it is a non-runner anyway cause the English just don't want them.

bilston

ClanofLams wrote: »

https://twitter.com/murray_kinsella/status/1404763208175472644?s=21

90% of Irish provinces games will be on free to air per Murray Kinsella, four year broadcasting deals.

This doesn't make sense.

Why pay for a subscription for the sake of 1 or 2 matches if the other 16 matches are FTA? Surely the Pay TV companies recognise this?

Podge_irl

ClanofLams wrote: »

https://twitter.com/murray_kinsella/status/1404763208175472644?s=21

90% of Irish provinces games will be on free to air per Murray Kinsella, four year broadcasting deals.

Excited about a potential international "game pass" option. EPCR had it this year and, while way too expensive, was quite handy.

PMC83

bilston wrote: »

This doesn't make sense.

Why pay for a subscription for the sake of 1 or 2 matches if the other 16 matches are FTA? Surely the Pay TV companies recognise this?

Is this the case? I read it as the Pay option would cover every other game (not just the provincial ones), like Eir currently does. I'd pay for that tbh.

irelandrover

bilston wrote: »

This doesn't make sense.

Why pay for a subscription for the sake of 1 or 2 matches if the other 16 matches are FTA? Surely the Pay TV companies recognise this?

they might have taken short term pain for a long term gain. Start of a new league, increase the viewership with FTA games and then start charging when people are invested.

ClanofLams

bilston wrote: »

This doesn't make sense.

Why pay for a subscription for the sake of 1 or 2 matches if the other 16 matches are FTA? Surely the Pay TV companies recognise this?

I guess it would more be if you want to see more matches like Glasgow v Sharks or something. But yeah need to see the details obviously.

sydthebeat

bilston wrote: »

This doesn't make sense.

Why pay for a subscription for the sake of 1 or 2 matches if the other 16 matches are FTA? Surely the Pay TV companies recognise this?

subscription to who?? and for what?

essentially the vast majority of irish games will be on RTE, and other games involving scots welsh etc will be on BBC

BBC wales to show 15 matches. S4C will increase their numbers as well

aloooof

irelandrover wrote: »

It might just be me, but in a sport as attritional as rugby we should be encouraging players to get degrees so they have a life after rugby rather than the other way around.

The draft in the states works as it is after players have already been in university and gotten a qualification.

But this is way off topic so ill stop it there.

I think that's fair enough (and I'm admittedly not fully familiar with the timeline at play) but yep, topic for another thread maybe.

Red Silurian

Podge_irl wrote: »

Unless they are planning on moving to an 18 team league, which they are not and are never going to, it is a complete non-runner.

Of course, it is a non-runner anyway cause the English just don't want them.

The premiership could go to an 18 team league depending on how we fare in the URC, there have been many calls to get rid of their promotion/relegation structure for a few years now, I don't think promotion/relegation works in professional rugby in fairness

The Welsh joining probably won't happen though in fairness

Shaka Hislop

Would it be our games in SA? Local broadcasters only.. rugby pass or somesuch to watch it, would anyone know?