Sophie: A Murder in West Cork - Netflix.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449639#Comment_118449639

It seems strange to me that Farrell had never set eyes on such a distinctive character as Bailey in the months she was living and working in Schull? And, in her original description of Bailey, failed to reference his build and relative height (big, large, very tall etc).

Why would Bailey be thumbing a lift at 715am on the morning of 22 December 1996? And where exactly in relation to the Murphy house is MF supposed to have seen this hitchhiker? And when did MF clearly delineate these three different witnessings? As 'Fiona' in anonymous calls .. or in the noteless interviews at Garda Kevin Kelleher’s house... or later.

According to the version of the DPP report 'in the wild':

There is no evidence on file to support Marie Farrell’s assertion that she saw Bailey at 7.15 a.m. on the roadway on 22 December 1996. Bailey actually had breakfast in the Murphy house. Mark Murphy states that he drove Bailey home at about 2 p.m. on 22 December 1996.

What is the significance of this note from the DPP 'report':

Marie Farrell’s evidence is further diminished by the fact that on 11 January 1997 she phoned the Gardaí under the alias Fiona... Superintendent Dwyer noted the details on a work sheet by recording that: “At 4 a.m. on Sunday – Monday morning near Knitwear Shop – place O’Connell’s, Schull – Goleen Road. Man wearing long black coat and a hat. Wiping himself and stumbling along.” This note of Superintendent Dwyer was not included in the Garda file submitted to this Office.

OwlsZat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449605#Comment_118449605

The man thumbing from the house the morning after being on the beer was Bailey. The sighting at the bridge was a 5"8 Mediterranean looking man before AGS leaned on her to change the description. They are clearly different people. Sure MF has gone on to pick out a French man as the man she spotted at KB. Surely, you know all that?

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450040#Comment_118450040

If the Knitwear shop is what is now OSKA, then he was well on the road to Goleen.

Not surprising Dwyer didn't want it included if he was trying to place Bailey at the bridge.

DontHitTheDitch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449858#Comment_118449858

According to Yvonne Ungerer, Bailey told her he was seen out in the middle of the night. Marie Farrell said in media interviews that Ian said to her 'I know you saw me at the bridge but I had no blood on me'.

DontHitTheDitch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449429#Comment_118449429

We only have her word that she was given a video to watch of Bailey at the Christmas swim. She says she was given the video to take home, another garda's statement says he saw her with detectives in an interview room sometime in February and there was a video on the TV but it was paused.

Gardai didn't know she was 'Fiona' until much later, no other witness who saw Sophie or Ian Bailey in Schull that day was given a video to watch so I think its another thing she just made up to help Bailey's case against the Garda commissioner.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450385#Comment_118450385

How exactly did MF come to identify Bailey as the man described by 'Fiona' who was a 'stranger'?

tibruit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450062#Comment_118450062

You clearly have not comprehended what I`ve been saying.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450385#Comment_118450385

She says she was given the video to take home, another garda's statement says he saw her with detectives in an interview room sometime in February and there was a video on the TV but it was paused.

She may have done both ie. taken it home , and sat down with the detectives in the interview room after to point out the people she knew in the video.

DontHitTheDitch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450655#Comment_118450655

She said she was in a shop, looked up saw him outside. She recognised him as the man she saw. She then went out and found two gardai nearby who identified the man she spotted as Ian Bailey.

DontHitTheDitch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450669#Comment_118450669

But no one else was given a video to take home, even those who also saw Ian and Sophie in Schull at the same time on the same day, like Ceri Williams. So we are supposed to believe the gardai picked her out of everyone else, even before she rang in with the 'Fiona' calls, called to her house and gave her a video to watch of Ian Bailey a few days earlier at the Christmas swim?

tibruit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450040#Comment_118450040

West Cork Podcast episode 5 about 12 minutes in. It deals with the party at Murphy`s. It is pretty clear that he left the house early to go home but then returned. There are witnesses who say so and it seems this was something else the DPP was not aware of.

As far as I am aware, Marie Farrell, in her December 27th statement, spoke of the man outside her shop and the hitcher she saw the following morning. She didn`t actually identify this man as Bailey until the 17th of January which as I would understand was nearly a week after the first Fiona phone call.

DontHitTheDitch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450142#Comment_118450142

The whole road looks like a bridge while you are on it there for maybe 200m. There is water on both sides.

OwlsZat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450657#Comment_118450657

Being honest I comprehend very little of what you say.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450744#Comment_118450744

That's true ,but if he was walking towards Goleen at the Knitwear shop he was going in the opposite direction to the Prairie;

bridge.jpg

tibruit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450748#Comment_118450748

I get it. A lot of people seem to post here having only half read what they are replying to.

saabsaab

I wonder were any samples taken from her rental car? Of course being a rental there would be many DNA sources unless they were well cleaned after each hire.

tibruit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449858#Comment_118449858

But then you are saying that the shop sighting and the hitcher sighting are two different men. There is no suggestion of that in the Farrell testimony as far as I can see. Even WCP accept that it was the same man. I would agree with you about the bridge. On the balance of probability I`d say Bailey wasn`t there. But then I would say that on the balance of probability Marie Farrell wasn`t there either.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118451280#Comment_118451280

But then you are saying that the shop sighting and the hitcher sighting are two different men.

Sorry that should have been Sun morn on her way to Cork, not Sat I've edited now.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118450724#Comment_118450724

Doesnt the podcast also note that whoever MF saw was thumbing a lift in the direction away from Baileys residence?

How did she come to identify Bailey?

Was she shown a picture or video by AGS and when?

Did she see a picture of Bailey in newspaper?

Did she see Bailey on the street ... which again begs the question how she never noticed him before.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449605#Comment_118449605

Wouldn't rule out a hitman but if a hitman was at Kilfeada surely he would attempt to hide when he would see the MF car lights. And would not be staggering or drunk. He also would make sure he was not seen/obvious if he was watching MF's shop

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118451650#Comment_118451650

He wasn't on the road a few minutes later when she turned around at Toormore and headed back towards Goleen.

If he couldn't get off the road in time when he was first seen where better to hide than in plain sight?

Stumble a little and shield your eyes against the oncoming headlights (thus hiding your face) and you could be taken for a drunken Christmas reveler on the way home from a party.

There may have been no man in a black coat at Ballyrisode / Kealfadda Bridge, if there was, there may have been a perfectly innocent explanation, or not. To date it has not been possible to link anyone, identified or unidentified, directly with the murder.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118452401#Comment_118452401

There may have been no man in a black coat at Ballyrisode / Kealfadda Bridge, if there was, there may have been a perfectly innocent explanation

agree would not believe a word MF would say

chooseusername

Anyone got that Indo article today about Bailey and Sophie meeting at a festival a year before her murder?

dublin49

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118454589#Comment_118454589

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gardai-to-re-examine-claim-ian-bailey-met-sophie-toscan-du-plantier-at-festival-a-year-before-her-murder-41227370.html

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118454589#Comment_118454589

Mark McCarthy of Schull, sworn statement in Pearse street garda station 3rd October 1997... says he was at Cape Clear during the summer of 1995 at a story telling festival.

"When I saw her (Sophie) at the festival I saw her talking to Ian Bailey. I did not hear their conversation but it was the sort of occasion everyone talked to everyone. They would have only talked for a few minutes... I did not know Sophie du Plantier at the time but I recognised her afterwards when I saw her pictures in the papers and on the television."

Alleges that conversation took place outside the Club bar at the island's pier.

The article mentions "Photographs taken at a festival in 1995 are now at issue".

But the article provides no information about these photographs or how they connect to the statement.

odyssey06

This angle has popped up before but with very little followup... was it looked into and established if Sophie was at the festival in 1995? And McCarthy could be mistaken as to his recollection of the woman Bailey spoke to?

The French indictment also refers to a statement from Mark McCarthy, a friend of one of Jules Thomas’s daughters, who said he saw Bailey speaking to a petite blonde woman at the Story Telling Festival on Cape Clear in September 1995 and he later recognised her from photos as Sophie Toscan du Plantier.

A 23-year investigation: What next for the Sophie Toscan du Plantier murder case? (irishtimes.com)

EdHoven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118454814#Comment_118454814

Not read the paywalled article but if this titbit is being pushed by the Garda press office to cloak the reopening of the investigation it doesn't bode well for a genuine unbiased review.

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118455129#Comment_118455129

I guess if there is a review they have to critically examine everything in the case file. Given how long this case has remained unsolved there's hardly going to be some glaringly obvious clue that has been overlooked up

{edit} Anyone else having trouble with boards cutting off the end of posts? This has happened to me on more than one post in the last few hours. {end_edit}

{adding what I recall was cut off} ... to now. I would expect a review would have to re-examine every bit of information in the case file, no matter how tenuous or insignificant it might seem, investigate it and determine its relevance, if any, to the case.

EdHoven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118455740#Comment_118455740

I was referring to the emphasis of the article. I think we would all pin our hope on advances in DNA technology. Just rehashing the same circumstantial evidence helps nobody.

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118456231#Comment_118456231

Agreed - trace DNA from the stone or concrete block or from her boot is the only real hope for a breakthrough. Without that it's just clutching at straws.

As it stands we don't know of any witness or motive and opportunity is so wide open, due to the uncertainty of the time of Sophie's death that the murderer could be almost anybody who was in the country at the time.