Kerry footballers smash someone's head in. €400 fine.

Feisar

Ronin247 wrote: »

This is a scummy, victim blaming post. It is sh1te attitudes like this that enable scumbags like these two.

How is it victim blaming?

Strumms

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

They didnt get arrested because they did something 'stupid'. They were arrested, charged and convicted of assaulting somebody....a serious assault.... but as usual with these tosser judges... its a priority to look after the wellbeing of these degenerates over their poor victim and society at large..

bocaman

Sickening to hear. Small men big egos

BPKS

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

Certainly did stupid things in my youth but never beat up anyone.

Arghus

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

I did stupid things when I was 21, 22 for sure - everyone has - but I never beat anyone up.

I don't think the lads lives should be ruined forever on account of what happened, but the eventual punishment they got seems fairly lenient. I don't have an axe to grind about the GAA.

Feisar

Feisar wrote: »

How is it victim blaming?

The ‘smart remarks’ part at the end, I’d presume.

spacetweek

Shocking how being a “rising GAA star” gets you off the charge with a piddling fine. At least there’s this bit:

“However, Judge Waters asked to view the incident when he was informed it was caught on CCTV security cameras and witnessed by security staff at a nearby hotel.

Having watched it, Judge Waters said it was too serious an incident not to record a conviction.”

I honestly think prison makes you more not less violent so not appropriate here. Few 100 hours community service and probation monitoring. Much larger fines.

The J Stands for Jay

BrianBoru00 wrote: »

What a daft comment. This was not related to the GAA in any way according to any reports I've seen on it.

should they be banned from the golf course and swimming pools as well?
Stopped partaking in amateur drama if that's their thing?

Their solicitor claimed that they should be let off because of their exploits within Kerry GAA. You can't get a more obvious case of bringing an organisation into disrepute than that.

Strumms

spacetweek wrote: »

Shocking how being a “rising GAA star” gets you off the charge with a piddling fine. At least there’s this bit:

“However, Judge Waters asked to view the incident when he was informed it was caught on CCTV security cameras and witnessed by security staff at a nearby hotel.

Having watched it, Judge Waters said it was too serious an incident not to record a conviction.”

I honestly think prison makes you more not less violent so not appropriate here. Few 100 hours community service and probation monitoring. Much larger fines.

Then by that logic don’t imprison anybody... if the outcome is they become more violent... do you have any stats to back up this theory that prison for violent crime increases recidivism of this type of crime ?

The public need to be protected and suitable tariffs applied, to protect people and punish assailants.

TimHorton

wes wrote: »

If the punishment for a crime is a fine, then the rich are effectively above the law.

A conviction for assault will likely rule them out of visiting certain countries such as the USA and Australia.

Strumms

TimHorton wrote: »

A conviction for assault will likely rule them out of visiting certain countries such as the USA and Australia.

Indeed, if you don’t want to be excluded from visiting these country’s, don’t assault anybody.

whisky_galore

TimHorton wrote: »

A conviction for assault will likely rule them out of visiting certain countries such as the USA and Australia.

Lucky US and Oz.

Plenty of our convicts over in OZ anyway. The entry checks are not as rigid as you would think.

Thelonious Monk

Yes my brother got a working holiday visa for oz and nz with a record, albeit nothing serious

The DayDream

The DayDream wrote: »

No other country are serious unprovoked assaults not met with jail time and then monitored probation.

In Spain you don't serve why sentence under 2 years. They are automatically suspended.

In Spain, no person over 77 can be sentenced to custody, no matter what.

That's just my limited knowledge. Can you actually back your claim regarding other countries? We aren't as lenient as people think.

Coillte_Bhoy

The J Stands for Jay wrote: »

Their solicitor claimed that they should be let off because of their exploits within Kerry GAA. You can't get a more obvious case of bringing an organisation into disrepute than that.

Where in the report in the OP does he say that? And even so if the solicitor wants to bring the GAA into it, there is nothing they can do about that so bit unfair to use this as a stick to beat them with

BrianBoru00

The J Stands for Jay wrote: »

Their solicitor claimed that they should be let off because of their exploits within Kerry GAA. You can't get a more obvious case of bringing an organisation into disrepute than that.

Have you a source for that equally daft claim?

He requested applying the probation act which is granted in circumstances where the defendants have had previously good records - again, granted regularly to people who have no involvement with the gaa.
Secondly it's their solicitor doing his job, perfectly legally and that is not them (or the solicitor) bringing the organisation into disrepute.

Muahahaha

What a lame sentence, a 400 quid fine is a laugh and more suited to someone caught speeding. This was a violent and vicious assault, they were raining blows down on him. At a minimum they should be getting two or three months in prison as a bit of shock therapy. As it is they didnt even get a suspended sentence to warn them if they do it again they'll be off to prison.

Darc19

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

I did plenty of stupid things.

But I never smashed someone's head in to leave them in such a state that they were unrecognisable.

And the person who bore the brunt of this violence did not pass smart remarks.

They just got battered by a pair of scum

Did Mickey Harte wade in with a character reference

Strumms

dobman88 wrote: »

Should they be expected to?

I think so... I’d not be enamored if I’m sitting in a public relations department of the GAA and hearing that two lads who beat the fûck out of some poor dude for shîts and giggles are expecting leniency based partly or in total down to them playing Gaelic Games...and their association to the .... association.

“The GAA doesn’t condone it in fact condemns the behaviors of Buckley and O’Donohoue, nor does it appreciate the efforts of them and their legal team to downplay the severity of the crime related to the sentencing and use their association with our sport to achieve leniency...”

The J Stands for Jay

Premier League footballers can be sanctioned for 'bringing the game into disrepute' if they get up to criminal activity or whatever. I don't think the same standard should apply to gaa players, but where they bring up their membership as part of their defence, then I do think some disciplinary action would be warranted.

jippo nolan

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Good point, maybe they are so cut off from the rest of the country that they start to believe there isnt a world beyond Tralee! Who was that fool a few years ago who strutted around the pitch like he was Gods gift,all fake tan and big ego, Galvin?? Incredible to think how deluded some of these GAA players are, and how fragile the whole delusion is- when they leave Ireland, it hits them how insignificant they are ha ha

And there still trying to flog his “Lord of the Rings “ clothes in Dunne’s stores!

Wanderer2010

The J Stands for Jay wrote: »

Premier League footballers can be sanctioned for 'bringing the game into disrepute' if they get up to criminal activity or whatever. I don't think the same standard should apply to gaa players, but where they bring up their membership as part of their defence, then I do think some disciplinary action would be warranted.

They are playing an amateur sport that they dont even get paid for. The only ones who make money out of it is the GAA. They couldnt give a flying fcuk what their stars do so long as they line out and bring in the fans and the money. The irony is, at least Premier League players have a reason to have enormous egos: they have the money and the cars and the sponsors.
These 2 scumbags only have a career in teaching or banking, 2 extremely generic ways to earn a living, ahead of them on their inevitable path to obscurity.

dublinman1990

I can't believe those pair of **** from Kerry got away with a measly fine for a serious assault on an innocent man who was known to be a harmless individual and nearly twice their age. If these two scumbags weren't in the GAA in anyway shape or form; they might have received a more serious sentence for their crimes. However, in a place like Ireland, it probably wouldn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things given how the sentencing is currently applied in the courts. It's a disgrace that they got away with what it amounts to in real terms; a very very light slap on the wrist.

If they were doing an assault like that in another country if they were on duty playing for the GAA or not; they wouldn't have had a chance in hell to get away with it so lightly. Police forces in those countries would have went down on them hard like a ton of bricks. And it also would have given them more severe consequences on their GAA careers if they were caught straight away. That's how proper justice should be done to allow it to fit the crime.

It's painfully embarrassing that we don't have a proper justice system like that in Ireland. It would do wonders for our justice system if we had it.

handlemaster

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/kerry-footballers-who-assaulted-local-musician-will-appeal-convictions-40570521.html

Are actually appealing. The victim where is he in all this. 400 euro fine no time in prison and appealing the conviction .

3DataModem

SeaFields wrote: »

To be fair the defence tried to play the footballers card "they are role models" which the judge rejected outright.

The fact they are role models is a reason to send them to jail. Sets an example.

Necro

Ok I'm reopening this thread after cleaning it up a bit and moving it to the correct forum for discussion.


Stay on topic and post in a civil manner. That means discuss the incident.

This is not a wider discussion on the GAA, there's a forum dedicated to that.


Now we have set a few ground rules that some posters don't seem to want to follow prior to this, discussion can continue.

ineedeuro

Didn’t the Healy Rae lads get off with a fine after they lied on the stand and they had CCTV coverage of what happened, even the judge told them they lied as well

Yet nothing, seems to be a bigger issue in Kerry legal system

robbiezero

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

They are playing an amateur sport that they dont even get paid for. The only ones who make money out of it is the GAA. They couldnt give a flying fcuk what their stars do so long as they line out and bring in the fans and the money. The irony is, at least Premier League players have a reason to have enormous egos: they have the money and the cars and the sponsors.
These 2 scumbags only have a career in teaching or banking, 2 extremely generic ways to earn a living, ahead of them on their inevitable path to obscurity.

Did a GAA player ride your missus or something? You seem incredibly bitter about them.

The_Kew_Tour

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

No, I never attacked a innocent man and beat him up badly. Neither did my friends. No you dont do that no matter what age you are.

ineedeuro

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

I think we can all agree you are in the minority.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

BPKS wrote: »

I'm delighted that nobody here has done anything stupid when they were young.

Unfortunately I got into a few scrapes with pints on board when I was younger. Some my fault, some not.

I'd like to think that I probably wouldn't pass smart remarks to a few young fellas when I was going home p1ssed on a Sunday evening at my age now either.

You have issues with adulthood and alcohol if you think this is normal behaviour.

Eire392

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I can't believe those pair of **** from Kerry got away with a measly fine for a serious assault on an innocent man who was known to be a harmless individual and nearly twice their age. If these two scumbags weren't in the GAA in anyway shape or form; they might have received a more serious sentence for their crimes. However, in a place like Ireland, it probably wouldn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things given how the sentencing is currently applied in the courts. It's a disgrace that they got away with what it amounts to in real terms; a very very light slap on the wrist.

If they were doing an assault like that in another country if they were on duty playing for the GAA or not; they wouldn't have had a chance in hell to get away with it so lightly. Police forces in those countries would have went down on them hard like a ton of bricks. And it also would have given them more severe consequences on their GAA careers if they were caught straight away. That's how proper justice should be done to allow it to fit the crime.

It's painfully embarrassing that we don't have a proper justice system like that in Ireland. It would do wonders for our justice system if we had it.

You do realise the 'police force' has nothing to do with sentencing and the court outcomes. The guards arrested and charged them and brought a clearly particularly strong case before the court. What more do you expect them to do?

dog_pig

Who was the third unnamed person involved? Lots of people saying it's a current Kerry player.

BattleCorp

handlemaster wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/kerry-footballers-who-assaulted-local-musician-will-appeal-convictions-40570521.html

Are actually appealing. The victim where is he in all this. 400 euro fine no time in prison and appealing the conviction .

Kind of risky appealing this. There's a chance that their sentence can be increased upon appeal. They could end up getting jailed.

If I was either of the lads, I'd take my punishment as it was pretty light.

Beechwoodspark

Did the bishop of Kerry sign and bless a character reference for these 2

ineedeuro

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I can't believe those pair of **** from Kerry got away with a measly fine for a serious assault on an innocent man who was known to be a harmless individual and nearly twice their age. If these two scumbags weren't in the GAA in anyway shape or form; they might have received a more serious sentence for their crimes. However, in a place like Ireland, it probably wouldn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things given how the sentencing is currently applied in the courts. It's a disgrace that they got away with what it amounts to in real terms; a very very light slap on the wrist.

If they were doing an assault like that in another country if they were on duty playing for the GAA or not; they wouldn't have had a chance in hell to get away with it so lightly. Police forces in those countries would have went down on them hard like a ton of bricks. And it also would have given them more severe consequences on their GAA careers if they were caught straight away. That's how proper justice should be done to allow it to fit the crime.

It's painfully embarrassing that we don't have a proper justice system like that in Ireland. It would do wonders for our justice system if we had it.

Police force have no say in the actual sentence and would be as frustrated as you are.
Plus you will see all over the World claims that "sports stars" get bad behaviour glossed over.

ineedeuro

BattleCorp wrote: »

Kind of risky appealing this. There's a chance that their sentence can be increased upon appeal. They could end up getting jailed.

If I was either of the lads, I'd take my punishment as it was pretty light.

Doubt it, the Healy Rae lads appealed after they got told by the judge they lied on the stand before he done nothing. Nothing was ever heard about how the appeal went but I would expect it got brushed under the covers and any record of a guilty verdict was removed from their record.

Especially in this case as they will probably want to play GAA in US an can't fly now

JCDUB

From the Irish Times:

"Mr O’Connell said Mr Buckley’s “teaching career is in jeopardy” as a conviction would stay with the young men, who had learned a lesson."

This man actually wants to become a teacher, a role model, somebody for young people to look up to. What a start to his career.....

The sad thing is there are principals around Kerry (and probably beyond) who will line up to take him in.

ineedeuro

JCDUB wrote: »

From the Irish Times:

"Mr O’Connell said Mr Buckley’s “teaching career is in jeopardy” as a conviction would stay with the young men, who had learned a lesson."

This man actually wants to become a teacher, a role model, somebody for young people to look up to. What a start to his career.....

The sad thing is there are principals around Kerry (and probably beyond) who will line up to take him in.

Outside Kerry? no
In Kerry? yes

stooge

Swap the 2 kerry footballers for 2 inner city dublin unemployed of similar age and I would imagine the punishment would have been jail time.

This is probably the main thing driving the debate here. Should personal character/value to community etc have any bearing on sentencing and conviction? Or should the law be more black and white? i.e. a crime is a crime and the punishment applied according to the crime, not the person committing it.

They pleaded guilty and were convicted and are appealing the result.
What a sensible system we have that that's a possibility.

ineedeuro

Deleted User wrote: »

They pleaded guilty and were convicted and are appealing the result.
What a sensible system we have that that's a possibility.

At least they pleaded guilty
https://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/healy-rae-brothers-found-guilty-of-assault-38729355.html
Not like this shower of sc*mbags

whippet

I understand the anger at the relatively lenient punishments here ... however .. if they were drug addicts with 50+ convictions they probably would have been given another chance without the fine or having to put forward compensation.

handlemaster

handlemaster wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/kerry-footballers-who-assaulted-local-musician-will-appeal-convictions-40570521.html

Are actually appealing. The victim where is he in all this. 400 euro fine no time in prison and appealing the conviction .

Hopefully their sentence is increased

fly_agaric

The court was told that the defendant’s friend had engaged in some “tomfoolery” with the two older men as the two groups passed.

Youthful "tomfoolery" or was it "high jinx"? :rolleyes:

rightmove

Montage of Feck wrote: »

There is a horrible meaness currently in the GAA. Win at all costs even if you have to resort to "puke football" and cynical dirty tricks. This is also being pushed at underage levels so it's little wonder that sportsmanship is a foreign idea to many young lads.

Baseless statement. I see the opposite esp at under age level

ineedeuro

Montage of Feck wrote: »

There is a horrible meaness currently in the GAA. Win at all costs even if you have to resort to "puke football" and cynical dirty tricks. This is also being pushed at underage levels so it's little wonder that sportsmanship is a foreign idea to many young lads.

What are you talking about?
Only for the GAA we would have more obese kids than already around Ireland. They do excellent work all over Ireland for the kids and that should not be forgotten

The DayDream

The DayDream wrote: »

2 20 something athletes beating the shoite out of a middle aged man for fun. They barely got punished, only a fine and they only barely got a conviction recorded, almost dodged that except the judge actually bothered his hole 5o watch the CCTV.

No other country are serious unprovoked assaults not met with jail time and then monitored probation.

It's well known in Ireland that due to lack of prison space, once you pay compensation and have no previous, you never go to prison.

This happens across the country, all the time.

When they appear without compensation its usually adjourned to allow them the chance to gather it.

It's like our only solution to this type of case due to our prison capacity and if you were personally assaulted you better hope they're willing to pay you as the sentence alternative wont amount to very much(due to spacing).