Russia - threadbanned users in OP

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118843583#Comment_118843583

They shouldn't give an inch to Russia they have em right where they need em, financially crippled, a military depleted of morale and growing discontent and desertions.

I know it's easy talk but I think over all for the Ukraine it would be far better for them to fight on now that they have the complete backing of the west.

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844192#Comment_118844192

We should just join it we aren't neutral anyway.

eire4

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844192#Comment_118844192

I would agree that we should end our military neutrality. Currently we spend about 0.3% of our gdp on defense. As recently as the early 1980's that figure was about 1.5%. I think we should be looking to work back towards that number and as a first step we should formally join the new EU defense force.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844250#Comment_118844250

Better with them than against them eh? ;)

machiavellianme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118843669#Comment_118843669

In what world is it acceptable for Russia (or any other state) to dictate the decisions and actions of any other sovereign state? With all due respect, Russia can go and f*** itself.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844037#Comment_118844037

Agree.

Standing by and doing nothing because Putin threatens the world because he knows he can’t win without Nukes is shameful.

Fuck him. Take him out and his 1900s backwards bunch of cowards

lmimmfn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844192#Comment_118844192

We would be idiot's to join NATO at the moment, we can't house our own, HSE is a disgrace, so it's better to spend those much needed billions on defence?

It's completely stupid, our location by itself means neither the US nor the UK want us compromised and we're hardly in the top 10 for receiving a nuke.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118843928#Comment_118843928

That's what might suit the 'west', but the 'west' will need to have Ukraine over some barrel to get them to agree to anything like that soon. They have taken massive damage to some of their cities and towns, lost many people, uprooted the civilian population. Short of launching nuclear attacks on their other cities and crushing them into submission, how is Russia going to force them to submit and accept Putin's land grab? His goose is cooked and it's only a matter of time.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844357#Comment_118844357

We can’t house our own???

What do you even mean by this statement?

Relax brah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844357#Comment_118844357

This is absolutely ridiculous tbh

Right now 0.5 GDP goes into defense, during the troubles it was 1.5 GDP and believe or not, economy and health system are in much better place than they were back then.

We can absolutely afford to invest and should do as a matter of priority for public safety.

threeball

I dont think NATO is the way to go but definitely increasing our military spending and becoming part of the EU alliance is a smart move. We don't need to be getting dragged into **** shows like Afghanistan.

A strengthened EU alliance with strong France, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Italy, Poland and Holland would be a serious disincentive for anyone taking liberties. It would be the 2nd most powerful military in the world. That group can then choose to support the US or not depending on the circumstances. And I don't see a possibility of the US and EU going head to head at any stage.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844232#Comment_118844232

If Finland,Sweden and Ireland joins NATO it would be a major kick in the nuts for Putin

Same for any country in eastern europe thats still neutral and neigbour of Russia

ronivek

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844310#Comment_118844310

In this world unfortunately: the one we live in.

Or rather it's acceptable up to a point and that specific point is decided primarily by the larger and more militarised nations. We haven't reached that point with Ukraine obviously; and it's unlikely we ever will based on current evidence.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844337#Comment_118844337

Yes, how on earth does Russia recover from this calamity? Even if there was a peace agreement next week, nobody would want to do business with them again. No tourist would want to visit the country. Their brand is utterly toxic now.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844505#Comment_118844505

I don't agree with joining NATO, but being a member of it does not mean that we would have been involved in the U.S. lead invasion of Afghanistan. Nothing even close to the majority of NATO members provided troops for the 2001 invasion. The same would be the case for any future military action undertaken by a Nato member, other members are not required to join in any such action.

More countries including Ireland had military personnel involved in the U.N. established International Security Assistance Force in Afghanistan from late 2001 to 2014 than those involved in the initial invasion.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118843696#Comment_118843696

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118843696#Comment_118843696

If they ( the EU/ World) did not give damn about the Ukraine before Putin invaded, they as sure as hell do now. Because this is far from just a "situation" between Russia and Ukraine, it concerns all of the European Country's, and much of the rest of the World as well. Just have a look at the world wide reaction. Its pretty safe thing to say that Putin's invasion will change the whole world. It will never be the same again, when the dust settles, it will be on a completely changed landscape.

ronivek

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844604#Comment_118844604

Utterly toxic to the West at any rate. Not really sure what way things could go between Russia and India/China/Brazil/etc.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844310#Comment_118844310

Well of course it's not acceptable but unfortunately we have to deal with the realities on the ground. Putin may be looking for an 'off ramp' that involves granting him a few token concessions so he can tell his people the invasion wasn't a total flop. One of those concessions may invole Ukraine ruling out joining NATO for the foreseeable but gaining instead some form of security guarantee that means much the same in practice.

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844604#Comment_118844604

I think it would be a similar situation to Iran, regarding tourism, in the sense that the average person is probably friendly enough when treated in a friendly way, but you'd be pretty nervous dealing with the authorities in case they decide to detain you for some arbitrary reason. Therefore, yeah, I would expect tourism to Russia from the West to drop off fairly precipitously for the next few years at least.

Russia is looking to form stronger bonds to its east. I mean, I don't doubt that China/India and Russia can do business, but it has to be a surface-level partnership at the end of the day. The countries would share little to no cultural similarity. I have this mental image of Russians packing into the cinema on a Friday night to watch the latest Neeraj Pandey blockbuster and having to grit their teeth like they're getting as much out of it as they would the latest Mission Impossible. Maybe the Russians would crowd around the TV with snacks of an evening to watch Chinese ping-pong. Or maybe not.

threeball

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844610#Comment_118844610

Yes but there's a chance you get drawn into something you shouldn't. The EU countries I mentioned are not hawkish countries so there's practically no chance of getting involved in something you shouldn't perhaps through just feeling pressured or obliged to do so.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844693#Comment_118844693

Can't access

Double post... erm.... Nice weather we're having lately... looks like its going to break... coming over from Russia... typical!

goldenmick

@briany - Maybe the Russians would crowd around the TV with snacks of an evening to watch Chinese ping-pong.

After they've eaten their cabbage soup.

EU army yes. NATO army no. Can't see British troops stationed in ROI any time soon.

PrzemoF

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844604#Comment_118844604

Brand might ve toxic but business don't do moral decisions. The companies linkend with names like Coke, McDonalds, Adidas wouldn't be quickly coming back but I bet a subsidiaries registered in Kayman Islands of all companies that are not facing the average Joe on social networks would be back in Russia as soon as they could make money there. Russia has tons of different raw materials and trading bans can be worked around using China, Israel or other countries that are not in the hard line trade ban group. Since 2014 at least 10 EU countries suplied banned goods to Russia. Toxic customer brand just makes the stuff more expensive. And nobody asks a Bosch CEO is they supplied electronic parts to Russian transporters. The CEO is asked for business results.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844713#Comment_118844713

Actually there isn't a chance of getting dragged into something you shouldn't, no more than there is by us providing military personnel for U.N. missions.

Hence why suggestions by some posters on here that Poland should get directly involved militarily with the Ukraine by sending in troops etc as it means that all the other members of NATO would have to assist are wrong. If Poland did decide to do so no other NATO countries are required to come to their defence under the articles of NATO if Russia then attacked Poland.

Hobgoblin11

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844505#Comment_118844505

the Uk might object to their neighbour and former colony joining the EU army, they might invade and split the country like north and south Korea...oh wait

wylo

Us boosting our conventional defense would be an utter waste of time imo and just a reactionary decision. We are too small so at best if we were invaded all out and received no assistance from US or UK then a good defense would probably buy us a few weeks at most. We may as get real and acknowledge our tiny size and take advantage of the fact it would be futile. It would be like giving a 8 year old child the best self defense classes available to someone that age in case they get mugged.

Perhaps we should invest in guerrilla warfare training. Peacekeeping yes (as a way of doing our bit) but conventional warfare no. Either way if ireland is invaded we will either need USA or UK or EU to assist or we will have to let ourselves be occupied without a fight and start a guerrilla war.

As for our neutrality I think it’s absolute bull at this stage, we aren’t neutral and never have been, we might have slightly appeared neutral during WW2 but even that wasn’t the case then.

Allowing US planes into Shannon coming to and from Iraq was the nail in the coffin as far as I’m concerned as far as neutrality is concerned.

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844754#Comment_118844754

I think even greedy/shortsighted companies do have some memory for the pain suffered when they get beaten up and robbed of their property. Russia seems to be gearing up for that (e.g. they have already taken all the leased Western civilian aircraft that were on their territory when war started and sanctions came in).

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/transport-and-tourism/hard-landing-lessors-lose-hope-of-getting-russian-planes-back-1.4836461

I think there could be an escalating situation for the companies that try and carry on, caught between Western govt.'s bringing in more sanctions which will force them to exit Russia in the end (a slower process...), and Russia's crooked system which can be "fixed" by decree of Putin (can happen almost overnight!) so their assets are expropriated and gifted to a crony of the regime.

AyeGer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118844188#Comment_118844188

Lets hope so, it would be great to see Putin humiliated and hopefully thrown in jail or done away with.