Russia - threadbanned users in OP

malinheader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880208#Comment_118880208

About time our government grew some balls and acted on this embassy farce. Time to stop running with the hares and the hounds.

deise08

Is it tomorrow that Zelensky is addressing the Dáil?

I hope they don't do that standing ovation crap that benefits no one.

ronivek

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880232#Comment_118880232

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880286#Comment_118880286

I mean yes it is of course propaganda.

However it often tends to be elderly women who probably (with the greatest of respect) have no idea or care about the politics or nuance and just want to live their lives in peace. So when the Ukrainian defenders ordered them to leave their homes for example; they didn't take that very kindly and so it becomes very easy for pro-Russian "journalists" to frame that as being Ukraine somehow responsible for their homes getting destroyed.

I'm sure there are a proportion of people who support Russia in various ways and for various reasons but from what I've seen they tend to be the local Cossack weirdos or middle-aged ethnic Russian men who feel the call of empire or simply see a way to money and/or power by aligning with Russia/DPR/LPR.

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880221#Comment_118880221

You've pretty much just described a Russian woman I know. Genuinely sound, decent and like you say would give you the shirt of her back, but has a complete and utter reality distortion field when it comes to her home country - which I can understand, And putin - which I really don't understand given him and his cronies have stolen the money out the pockets of ordinary Russians while leaving them the scraps from their table. The "what about the USA" is a given too. I haven't bumped into her since this all kicked off, but I'd be completely gobsmacked if she didn't toe the Kremlin line.

I mostly feel like a piece of **** but ya know what, Zelenskyy makes me feel better about myself. Because I look at him and see all of the positive attributes I can think of in humanity and I feel intense admiration. It also makes me feel like I'm a little less fucked up than the people who look at Putin and see greatness. I'm pretty sure I'm better than those people. Like they look at Putin who got a Tiger killed through fairly typical Russian ineptitude so he could get his several layers of bullshit photo op. Who gets opponents poisoned when they've already fled. A man who won't sit near anyone. A man who is clearly deluded as to the world outside Russia's borders. A man who is hiding and scurrying with an army of protection following him. That's what they admire in a man.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880390#Comment_118880390

Another one who enjoys all the luxuries of 'western' living a term I abhor but rails against it. Because she has the luxury and allowance to do it. I.e free to speak her mind. The ignorance of that is absolutely edible. Utter muppets tbh and theres a pile of them.

If they hate it all so much. Then sod off back to the land of bloody milk and honey so.

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880286#Comment_118880286

Oh I would agree, it's almost certainly slanted reporting. Unlike in the Ukrainian controlled areas where anyone with a press badge can show up and question the official narrative and anyone with a smartphone can upload anything dodgy on the Ukrainian side, including agents and sympathisers of Russia, the Russian controlled areas have a very curated press presence and bugger all smartphone footage from ordinary people.

Now you can be sure that Ukrainian side atrocities will happen. It's war and war is bloody and ugly, but given the remarkable lack of media and evidence of them from the Russian side, never mind the free media everywhere else it seems they're pretty rare. If the Russians had even the slimmest of evidence they'd be shouting it from the rooftops. And they're not.

joseywhales

I feel like Zelensky's political troubles are going to become overwhelming though. He has to earnest negotiate with the Russians to attempt to save his people from atrocities and try to sell the ones left on giving up more territories for untrustworthy security guarantees, his own people might be the ones taking him out after that, through no fault of his own. I believe in fact he will be really reluctant to accept anything as their best chance is to prolong the war and keep western interest and aid flowing in 10 years when the wolf returns, conditions and support might not be so easy to come by.

Iamhere

Kingspan have sold their Russian operations according to RTE.

JoChervil

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879616#Comment_118879616

It's real, this Russian Freedom has around 200 members. I posted a tweet from reputable source earlier in the thread.

riffmongous

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880384#Comment_118880384

Well a few years ago they had in government a far right party who were deeply connected to the russians, the foreign minister at the time even danced with Putin at her wedding (she's now a RT shill)

gandalf

Russians soldiers stupidity and greed know no bounds. One lad changed his armour plate in his bullet proof vest with a looted MacBook. He's now dead.

https://twitter.com/Julia_the_who/status/1511058141701623818?t=33d99jS9_0LWqAmwxB4luA&s=19

Ten of Swords

@wotzgoingon don't post in this thread again

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880417#Comment_118880417

It's not that simple or so black and white Lister. I can't speak for Seenitall's example, or in general obviously, but the woman I know is just as quick to defend Ireland, indeed quicker than many Irish people and holds no truck with that trend you can sometimes see with some Irish people who have an insecurity about this country and seem to get the horn for running it down.

There can be a cultural difference in play too. Since WW2 and even since the 80's in Ireland, Western Europe had become much more twitchy around notions of patriotism/nationalism for obvious reasons of fallout from WW2 and see it as the preserve of the Right wing. Which it all too often is. The Left abhor the notion, the Centre tend to avoid it and Western Europeans are more likely to question even denigrate their own nation. Outside Western Europe and worldwide, including much of Eastern Europe patriotism/nationalism is a much less frowned upon thing and you'll see positive expressions of it from people on the Left, Centre as well as Right. That can be jarring to our western European Liberal sensibilities. It has on occasion been to mine.

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880386#Comment_118880386

You've pretty much exactly described the makeup of the people interviewed in that youtube vid I saw Ron. I wish I could link it. It came up in my feed(before I logged onto youtube so must be getting some hits?), but I didn't save the link and obviously didn't sub to it as it smelled "off". Like I said I noticed that no questions were posed around who was ultimately responsible for his disaster. No wider questions either. Basically summed up as "it was Ukrainians that wrecked our homes".

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880475#Comment_118880475

It's pretty black and white frankly. She lives in absolute luxury in comparison to home. She has unadulterated access to all the real news of all shades she can get her hands on.

Yet she defends a dictator who murders his opposition at home and abroad. Let's put the war to the side for the moment.

That's indefensible. She's a muppet.

I could understand and possibly sympathise with someone who has a diet of home grown cultivated propaganda. And lives day to day with nothing in their small east Russian town, even being proud of their fight against so called western agressors.

But no sorry, it's black and white. She's a fool who has it all, but chooses specifically by choice to be a fool.

deise08

Another aircraft question.

National guard. Would that be different to army?

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880250#Comment_118880250

Did you actually buy into the horse **** that it was all the European ideal? Funny how all the stalwarts of the EU are all for leaving the Ukraine to swing, so they can still do business with Vlad, while the Yanks and Brits do the heavy lifting.

The EU was mostly about putting everyone elses money into Fritz's pocket. Sorry for you loss.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880303#Comment_118880303

Obviously it doesn't really apply in terms of legality but context is always important to me. A defending nation should be cut a lot of slack, those invading basically none. I always think of the accounts from the Yanks and Brits liberating concentration camps and wondering to myself how they had the self-control to not kill every well-fed 18-60 year old they came across. And I know there were different incidents that happened and all the rest but the scale and acceptance is just completely different. That the Ukrainians are still sticking to the anti-Russian government rather than anti-Russia people message bodes well for how Ukraine will rebuild itself.

ronivek

Seems like Mariupol is on the brink; first reported significant surrender of Ukrainian forces in the area:

https://twitter.com/Osinttechnical/status/1511059121067511814?s=20&t=NFeK2Ed0Ydxs6jFFxZHKeg

Curious_Case

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879130#Comment_118879130

One could argue that he might choose to detonate a tactical nuclear weapon over Mariupol as a warning

In my opinion, various nations should deploy in Ukraine (by invitation) as separate parties

Play Putin's game - "Oh we're not NATO, we're here to help with the denazification"

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880498#Comment_118880498

Propaganda and the truth are easy to separate all you've to do is go back to the start and see whos invading who and why, the rest is all logical and anyone believing or even entertaining Russian nonsense needs to give there head a wobble.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880232#Comment_118880232

I've seen reports that the Russian violent assault on the city and total destruction of it has turned people totally against Russia, even those who were formally sympathetic. I read an interview with one man from Mariupol who said he had always regarded himself as Russian but the extreme violence against his city has him now hating Putin.

It would be a bit like the British going into East Belfast and the Shankill Road, completely flattening the place and making it uninhabitable and killing thousands of Protestants, in the hope that they might wipe out some Catholics in the process.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880531#Comment_118880531

Assuming it's genuine. did they run out of ammo I wonder? The West for all it's fine words, not willing to provide military equipment that might assist Ukrainian army to relieve that siege.

POBox19

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879879#Comment_118879879

Russia most likely. In the same way the Irish embassy building in Paris is owned by Ireland.

ronivek

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880617#Comment_118880617

I see no reason why it wouldn't be genuine. A load of guys in various types of Ukrainian gear, they all look pretty dirty and demoralised, some evidence of wounds and tourniquets/bandages.

Add to the fact they have been cut off from resupply and relief for weeks now and it was only ever a matter of time.

I also assume they wouldn't have had internet access and so wouldn't have known what happened in Bucha; that might have delayed any surrender potentially.

fritzelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880531#Comment_118880531

Something looks off - no soldiers watching over them, no insignia I could see

Edit source is Russian propoganda mouthpiece

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880499#Comment_118880499

There are religious people who have more access to all the science on the planet in human history sitting on their phones yet choose to believe in virgin births, elephant headed gods and angels. Hell, we had a load more of them here in Ireland not so long ago. Because as you've said we have grown so used to(and should be extremely grateful for) access to many voices with many angles, and more the choice to pick and choose ones we decide we like, it's easy to forget how so many in the world haven't and grew up with only one narrative all their lives and had little choice in it. As the Jesuits said give me the boy I'll give you the man. That's hard programming to overcome. Indeed built into such programming is a strong defence against even trying to. The secular version of the religious "it's a sin to even consider it" stuff. There's a reason that stuff has been so pervasive throughout human history, it works.

In some cases it could even be harder for those living away from home as that's the narrative that connects them. I mean look at some of the Irish Americans back in the day who had access to wider information, but instead chose to think Chuccky arrrr laaa!! and here's twenty bucks for The Lads. Hell, on a more mundane note we have some Irish and English people living in Spain, or even on holiday who insist on going to Irish/British bars. 😁

Mark me well Lister, I do NOT condone, or come within an asses roar of supporting her opinions, but I kinda understand where she gets them if you see what I mean? Now to be fair too, I haven't seen or heard from her since this invasion kicked off(I'd only see her a couple of times a year kinda thing) and she may well be at the putin's a wanker stage, but I'd not be surprised if she wasn't.

As for the absolute luxury in comparison to home angle: There are two Russias in many ways. You have the rural villiage life far from the centre and the world with the cows, the chickens and a half acre of spuds and you have the urban Russia in places like St Petersburg and Moscow, where there is a middle class spread not so unlike our own and with similar trappings of skinny lattes, social media, European cars, iphones and foreign holidays. This particular person comes from the latter and is young enough not to have remembered the 90's too clearly.

zv2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880472#Comment_118880472

The MacBook is no match for this Barrett .50 Cal Puts the PC to Bed | Military.com of which the Ukrainians have plenty.

GM228

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880133#Comment_118880133

Very appropriate reply to that Tweet:-

https://twitter.com/mewndog/status/1511031920930566148?t=R7x6isu8veC31tOTnUCuKg&s=19