Russia - threadbanned users in OP

Markcheese

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118436560#Comment_118436560

Ironically , I think there was zero chance of Ukraine joining NATO before Russia invaded,

Gatling

Yurt2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118436255#Comment_118436255

Minor point of order: Ireland broke the peg with sterling in the late 70s by joining the European Exchange Rate Mechanism. The value of the Irish pound had more to do what the Deutschmark and Bundesbank was doing than the British Pound and the BOE.

Elmer Blooker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118436892#Comment_118436892

is this from a comic for ten year olds?

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118437122#Comment_118437122

It's called Twitter ,we have social media in the west , instead of Kremlin am radio and tv broadcasting 24/7 Soviet era propaganda ......

Gatling

Just looking at the russian forces flowing into Kazakhstan ,lots of armoured vehicles and electronic warfare teams ,

Definitely not a short term visit ,so far something like 140 flights have come in from russia in less than 48 hours.

There's been various claims that the protests were cover to allow certain factions to maintain power,and this inviting the Russians to put down protests gives those on power the ability to bypass their own military forces and use Russia to maintain the status quo.

Kazakhstan has a military strength of just over 100,000 men and women and a reserve of another 130,000 that can be called up as well as active conscription ,

So why the need for several thousand Russian special forces and armour

Sand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118436560#Comment_118436560

I totally agree. But what isn't recognised I think is that Russia takes Ukraine far more seriously than NATO or by extension the US does. So the external repercussions to Ukraine from taking an anti-Russian policy will be far more severe than economic sanctions or diplomatic disapproval. Russia can and has endured repercussions against what it views as a vital strategic interest. Can Ukraine? Will the US not at some point trade recognition of Russian advances in Ukraine for something it wants?

Lets face it - by taking a hostile anti-Russian stance since 2014, Ukraine has irrevocably lost Crimea. It has lost day-to-day control of its eastern provinces and has reduced itself to a bargaining chip between Russia and EU/NATO over what remains. For all time, Russia now has a veto on Ukrainian policy because of the "frozen" conflict. For all these real losses, it has gained no more than well wishes from the EU and NATO. Any person with Ukrainian interests at heart would have not encouraged Ukraine to become the host to the next round of EU/NATO vs. Russia. Whoever wins, Ukraine loses.

This is the lesson Georgia learned in 2008. In April 2008 at the Bucharest summit, NATO - with deep objections voiced by Germany - issued a statement that Georgia would at some point in the future be a NATO member. This essentially pretended that all of Europe would go to war to defend Georgian borders. A clearly insane claim given the disputed South Ossetia, which Russia cared more about than NATO did given the very short 2008 war between Russia and Georgia on that dispute. 14 years later, no Georgian membership of NATO. Whatever the russophobia that guides the media, there is yet some sane voices in policy making that have prevented inviting Georgia to NATO any time since.

This is the reality. People might hate Putin a lot. They might have an irrational hatred and fear of Russia and a complete dismissal of its interests as a nation and a state. But the peoples and countries living close to Russia cannot afford that sort of insane hatred. Distant allies who promise much and deliver little only encourage conflicts which re-establish a brutal reality: Russia, right or wrong, is stronger than its neighbours. So Russia's neighbours need to cultivate a good relationship with Russia's rulers. The US will never go to war over the borders of Ukraine or Georgia. Russia will. This is simple realpolitik.

“Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.” Thucydides observed that at least 2,400 years ago. The real question is how are so many people so naïve 2,400 years later?

bob mcbob

I think that there is a lot more going on in Kazakhstan than meets the eye.

Massive violent & armed protests break out over the country at the same time - supposedly over fuel prices.

Massive security operation with troops from friendly countries drafted in to support the current government.

Then today the head of Kazakh national security is arrested on suspicion of treason.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jan/08/kazakhstan-detains-former-national-security-chief-on-suspicion-of-treason

To me this feels like an attempted coup by the security chief with some military units involved. Russia has been brought in to put down the coup so they are not behind it.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118436892#Comment_118436892

Yes and Vladimir's "assistance" to President Assad comes at a price..the Russians now have 49 years use of the port of Tartous .This is Russia's sole navel base outside the Soviet Union, and gives them access to the Mediterranean. A priceless asset in the present times.

Gatling

@BobMcBob To me this feels like an attempted coup by the security chief with some military units involved. Russia has been brought in to put down the coup so they are not behind it.

Of Russia would not be involved a bit like how they intercepted the Turkish coup that cemented Erdogan in power

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118438752#Comment_118438752

Exactly and a direct supply route into iran as a bonus

bob mcbob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118438763#Comment_118438763

This makes no sense - even assuming your statement about Erdogan is correct -

Lets work thru this -

Turkey

Russia wants Erdogan in power, Russia hears about coup against Erdogan so they tell Erdogan to keep him in power

Kazakhstan

Russia wants current president Tokayev in power, ......Gatling's Russian coup conspiracy theory....., Russia sends troops to keep Tokayev in power

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118438835#Comment_118438835

Pro Russian autocratic leadership with ties to the previous Yanukovych regime in Ukraine,calls in Russian military to put down protests despite having the ability to call 100,000 plus of his own military...

Which it's likely the russian forces won't be leaving

Putin supported Erdogans rule because he threatened to close the Bosporus straight to the Russian navy either locking them into or out of the blacksea ,

The same Erdogan who bought some expensive Russian anti aircraft missiles which the Russians are going back on ,just after Erdogan supported the Azerbaijan military very recently pissing in Putins cornflakes again..

But anything involving Putin is never so straight forward,

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118438672#Comment_118438672

Coup or not ( and most likely was / is) Russia response was lightning fast..and of course a debt was incurred, plus successful coup's are not to be encouraged (unless by Moscow) as they might give other Country's ideas.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118439917#Comment_118439917

Wonder if those IVFs and special forces were sitting there expecting to be deployed else where ,

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118439949#Comment_118439949

Certainly looks like they were all dressed up and ready for the dance...unless they had advance knowledge of it?

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118439997#Comment_118439997

Possibly ,seems very convenient to have several thousand special forces ,IFVs and electronic warfare units along with dozens of heavy lift aircraft ready to go,and not have prior knowledge of where and when they were going first ,

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118440339#Comment_118440339

Definitely bears more resemblance to an invasion force than a peacekeeping mission. The sheer scale of the logistics alone involved in an operation that size is mind boggling.

10000maniacs

Just as expected, all the anti Kremlin bureaucrats and politicians are being rounded up in Kazakhstan.

Putin is in for a big fall. His repression of the Ukraine, Kazakhstan and in his own country cannot be sustained.

He's been in power too long and the his hunger for and coveting of power is his only way of surviving.

If a power change happens in Kremlin he isn’t able to control, he can’t keep his assets and his family inside Russia without harm coming to them.

His days are numbered. Tick tock.

Gatling

It's been claimed that the military were stood down in the city of Almaty main airport Kazakhstan which apparently allowed protesters to occupy the airport ,now several hours later Russian troops already occupied Almaty airport, which has become the Russians military staging post ,

Odd how the Kazakhstan military were moved out of the airport several hours before thousands of russians arrived ready for war, and no protesters to seen too

Need a Username

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118178948#Comment_118178948

It is a beautiful country and I met some great people there. More than once I was offered a place to sleep or a meal.

What western media is being unfair to the people of Russia? I haven’t seen or heard anything bad directed towards them.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118442524#Comment_118442524

I've lived there as well, and the people themselves are fine, its the management that is the problem.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118442357#Comment_118442357

There is a possibility that he could get bogged down as they were in Afghanistan, but I can't see that bringing him down , not for a long time yet any way. He has surrounded himself with people whose wealth and well being depend on him. Now if these people start to feel financial pain as a result of even more harsh sanctions imposed if Ukraine is invaded that could well change. He is a master chess player, and still controls the FSB. so still has some very powerful tool's at his disposal. Ultimately of course, his biggest enemy is old Father Time.

Need a Username

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118443256#Comment_118443256

That is the way with everything, not just countries

I’m currently experiencing a bizarre situation brought about by management- I can’t even begin to explain it. Jonathon Swift or Aramdo Iannucci could write about it

how long did you live there and where if you don’t mind me asking? I have been there backpacking

Elmer Blooker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118442524#Comment_118442524

It’s all part of the indoctrination of the masses, the US needs an ‘enemy’ to hold NATO together and keep Europe under the thumb and that’s why the masses must be constantly reminded that Russia is ‘bad’.

I remember the hate campaign towards Russia ahead of the 2018 World Cup, don’t go there because they are all racist homophobe hooligans. What I saw on television was fans from Africa and Russia all sitting together and having a great time enjoying the football and absolutely no trouble whatsoever.

The only trouble that I know of was English hooligans giving nazi salutes in a bar in Volgograd which of course used to be Stalingrad. If the Russians are that bad they would have been locked up and the key thrown away.

Elmer Blooker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118443256#Comment_118443256

Sounds familiar. I would think even Russia for all it faults is capable of building a children’s hospital and effective public transport.

The Irish ‘solution’ is taking away people’s front gardens to widen the roads for more traffic.

Need a Username

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118443379#Comment_118443379

Okay but the US needing a bad guy doesn’t explain the view that western media is being unfair towards the Russian people?

I’m assuming you are not suggesting that the US government controls the world’s media.

I have seen reports on corruption, etc. and how Putin is not a nice fella but I’ve never seen a newspaper article attack the “man on the street”

I don’t know about the World Cup but I remember hearing that Russian authorise closed gay bars and night clubs in places close to the last Winter Olympics there - and the Russian authorities (maybe Putin himself) denied this happened because there are no homosexuals in Russian apparently.

Again though, this isn’t an attack on the Russian people.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118443256#Comment_118443256

Could be said of any country on earth. But it's particularly true of militaristic countries -- the people are fine, but if your country is militaristic, scum certain types will be attracted to positions of power. Funny enough, and this reinforces your point, there is no real dislike for ordinary Russians among ordinary US citizens.. I lived in a US city w/ lots of Russian immigrants, there were Russians bars etc. But as you get closer to the top of political power, the quality of human being declines and antipathy --or the appearance of antipathy, which can be just a profitable for the US and Russian weapons industries respectively-- rises.

Elmer Blooker

I have no evidence that the US ‘controls’ the world media but it does make me wonder sometimes why staunch US ally Saudi Arabia gets off so lightly when it comes to women’s and LBGT rights.

There was that Khassogi journalist murdered by Saudi agents in Istanbul and dropped by media suddenly , why was this?

You ‘remember hearing’ , isn’t that my point?

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118443461#Comment_118443461

Start a thread on Saudi LGBT rights....

Doubt you can discuss it ,

Putins LGBT rights lol