Russia - threadbanned users in OP

Danzy

https://twitter.com/KedzierskiMarc/status/1616575900614815745?s=20&t=CibhwoJRB-Y6A9aqP66_cg

"Because today's decision is a "note in the history book." As the new RU offensive will be successful, DE will have to take co-responsibility on the chest""Associations with the Second World War and the Ribbetropes/Molotovs will appear imho not only in Poland, but also in the Balts or Nordics"

The damage being done by Scholz to Germany's reputation cannot be underestimated, and it will take years to get past. In an existential war for their brother nation, the Poles, Baltics etc see Germany choosing Russian friendship over Ukrainian lives.

This fellow is Professor of international relations in Krakow, Poland's most prestigious university.

It's coming to a stage where their will be a complete breakdown in relations between the Scholz Govt and their immediate Eastern neighbours.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136777#Comment_120136777

Not true.

Doesn't fit the narrative on here ,

Oh another one of those ...

surprise

Gatling

What's with the alternative views and the weather forum's

Jinglejangle69

Yeah Ukraine aren’t winning this war.

It’s clear to see politics and greed will see to that.

Never again…. how ironic.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136907#Comment_120136907

I'd say that the overriding consideration at the moment is to save Ukraine and defeat Russia, at all costs literally. If Ukraine loses, and is taken over by Russia, the west and US etc. can forget about any payment of any kind. Whatever kind of financial "Package" that will be put in action, is even now is most likely being discussed, but its not even remotely a case of weapons being withheld because of a cash or payment issue. Imagine the massive cash input during the Marshall Plan after the second world war, which turned two destroyed country's into success story's after the war. Something similar to that will be put in place I imagine , ( but this time, only one Country will benefit, )

.Donegal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136957#Comment_120136957

It’s not a view it’s a fact so bbc news is wrong and you’re right ok. Btw I think Germany should should send tanks to Ukraine and can do more to help.

And the narrative is Germany is evil/useless constantly on here and do nothing when they’ve taken in over 1 million refugees and sent the 2nd most in military aid in the world after the US. I couldn’t even give 2 flying Shiites about Germany it’s the constant nonsense spouted in that regard that just needed corrected. You’re wrong just get over it, it’s funny how when pointed out that you’re wrong you double down and try to insinuate some conspiracy. Laughable, pathetic yet predictable.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136982#Comment_120136982

As I said alternative views.

We have a long enough list of people who come from the same forum spouting the same old I'm here to correct people .

Yeah No.

mikewest

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136982#Comment_120136982

Well said. There is an awful lot of horse s**t spouted on this thread about who is helping and how, and who is allegedly not! Who kept Ukraine in ammo and diesel in the early months of the war (hint not the US, UK, nor Germany). A huge amount of good stuff is happening under the radar or out of the media's view

.Donegal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137007#Comment_120137007

So I posted another user that Germany has sent the second most military aid in the world after the US that it was on the bbc tonight.

You quote me saying no they aren’t.

I reply with a link to the bbc news video stating Germany is 2nd

You reply no. Then insinuate a conspiracy to deflect from you being wrong and are now running with it.

Imagine being so insecure that you just can’t admit you got it wrong you have to be childish and make stuff up. You sound like Kelly Anne Conway with your alternative facts lol

Well sorry, all the deflecting in the world won’t change a thing. Here’s a link to you being wrong again. Skip to 4.46

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=As6H7HWNiOM

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137024#Comment_120137024

Again that seems to be promised not delivered. The site I linked says otherwise and is pretty reputable.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137024#Comment_120137024

There 4th on the list behind Poland and behind on Poland who's taken in more refugees too

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137040#Comment_120137040

A time gap between announcement and delivery is not uncommon, throughout the countries.

For example, the challenger 2 has not yet arrived. Promised, announced, yet not delivered.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137040#Comment_120137040

I see according to the Germans they have delivered 40 Maraders to Ukraine.

But they haven't sent any to Ukraine as of yet

20Wheel

I see according to the Americans they have delivered Bradley IFVs to Ukraine.

But they haven't sent any to Ukraine as of yet

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137040#Comment_120137040

The figures are easily confused: Military Aid committed/pledged and then that's broken down to if it's actual aid (weapons etc...) or money to finance weapons etc...

The annoyance on the thread towards Germany I think stems from the start. Not allowing UK/US flights with arms fly over Germany on the way to Ukraine. I think that was far back as Dec 2021. Then we had the donations of helmets..... good god. Then there was the big rearmament speech by Scholtz that seems like hot air. Then we had the fiasco with rusted Anti Tank weapons that they had etc...

The IRIS-T system and Geppards have been literally lifesavers for Ukraine and fair dues for them delivering them and Germany do supply a whole load of logistical help that goes under the radar. But they literally have to be shamed into delivering the heavy stuff. Countries like Estonia have literally given Ukraine every single piece of Artillery they have similar for Poland with their tanks. The latest list from countries donations have been incredible, really digging deep, Challengers, Bradleys, Styrker, Archer....... but the leopard is still caged. The best beast to beat the bear!

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137058#Comment_120137058

US/UK announce something it arrives. German says things and excuses after.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137069#Comment_120137069

The requested helmets? That will have saved lives?

Its thanks to the German exchange (Ringtausch) program that 40 Greek BMPs, 30 Slovakian BMPs, and 35 Czech T-72s are in Ukraine.

Vehicles directly from Germany include:

14 self-propelled howitzers Panzerhaubitze 2000.

54 M113 armored personnel carriers.

50 MRAP vehicles DINGO.

10 HMMWV

30 self-propelled 30 self-propelled GEPARD anti-aircraft flakpanzer.

5 multiple rocket launchers MARS II.

COBRA mobile counter battery radar system.

107 border protection vehicles.

15 armoured recovery vehicles.

13 tank transporter tractors.

143 Pick-ups.

35 load-handling 8x8 wheeler trucks.

12 heavy duty trailer trucks.

6 lift trucks.

18 load-handling trucks 8x8.

3 (beaver) bridge-laying tanks.

280 vehicles (trucks, minibuses, all-terrain vehicles).

6 mobile decontamination vehicles.

8 mobile ground surveillance radars.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137094#Comment_120137094

Germany make an announcement on why they can't send something!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Poland can't export a Leopard tank to Ukraine without Germany's permission, but Poland could invade Belarus and then Russia using Leopard tanks, or would they need German permission?

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137105#Comment_120137105

Not sure of the wording in the contract But I assume its for defensive actions and not resale. for example. Giving them is not selling.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137094#Comment_120137094

I have a slight digression to make here, but its an essential question.

What is this "US/UK" thing I keep seeing coming almost exclusively from British people.

It seems like a deep yearning to bask vicariously in the glow of the US's power. By a people who were cuckholded out of the top spot by American independence.

Its very groupie-ish. And I don't see the sentiment being returned. Which makes it quite pathetic.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137099#Comment_120137099

My issue is with the slowness of Germany supplying critical heavy weapons.

I know they have supplied critical logistical equipment but one would expect more.

The same time Germany was handing over helmets the US was flying in javelin missiles to Kyiv to keep the UK NLAWS company. That says it all really.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137109#Comment_120137109

One is our neighbour and one has close ties to Ireland. Will I mention the places like Poland then instead ? How does that effect Germany not delivering and presenting excuses.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_foreign_aid_to_Ukraine_during_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War#:~:text=The%20Czech%20Republic%20delivered%20the,already%20on%2027%20February%202022.

Germanys to be delivered is an interesting read.

Gerry T

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136969#Comment_120136969

I'm not pitting the goal of the war and Ukraine winning against who pays what. Just curious what debt Ukraine will have with say the UK post the war. In WW2 the UK owed a lot to USA, that debt was finally paid off in 2006. At the end of thos war, will Ukraine be handed a bill from the UK. You can substitute the UK for many other countries, but for curiosity sake, whats the UK position.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137113#Comment_120137113

Both the US and the UK are nicely tucked away far from Moscow, with nice wide water obstacles in between.

Countries which share the continent with Russia, and are a days drive from Moscow, unsurprisingly must move more carefully.

Although, Germany and France have been helping Ukraine in various ways, including supplying weapons since at least 2014. Long before the flights you talk of.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137120#Comment_120137120

Dated sep 2022.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137114#Comment_120137114

whats interesting about it?

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137121#Comment_120137121

Meanwhile the UK trained 20k troops from 2015.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137121#Comment_120137121

6 European countries physically have a border with Russia (excluding Belarus and Ukraine) and those 6 countries have not being shy in delivering arms to Ukraine. But Germany with Poland as a buffer is!

Yes and Germany and France werealso help arm Russia since 2014, but that was more a creative way around the sanctions!

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137126#Comment_120137126

Self explanatory it's in Plain English. Should we mention 9m from Ireland. Granted the 3bn set aside for the refuges should be taken into consideration. But it's not direct aid.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137133#Comment_120137133

Does it have to be?

I would think 60k places for refuge is something not to be scoffed at.

And yes, mention the 9m from Ireland, please do.

(ps list doesn't include hospital transfer missions and hospital beds)