Russia - threadbanned users in OP

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346138#Comment_120346138

You can be sure that native Ukrainians had bad memories of life under the Russians, and that would have carried on to a certain extent after their independence, especially in areas where there were large congregations of ethnic Russians. But the level of antagonism or even violence back then pales into insignificance compared to what Putin unleashed. I'd say that by now, the most fervent separatist is deeply regretting the day Putin came in to "protect them". The devil they knew, is a million times better than the one they didn't know ( or in this case, the one they thought they knew)

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120345508#Comment_120345508

When a minority language and ethnicity can be exploited to cause the largest war and loss of life in Europe since WW2, I would totally disagree with you.

Extinguising the Russian language from Ukraine is as valid a form of self defense as having a military or buying weapons, and probably cheaper and more effective as a preventative measure. It's also righting the wrongs of the past, where Stalin and others supplanted native speakers with Russians, such as the near total ethnic cleansing of Tatars from Crimea in favour of immigrant Russians.

And do you remember the Ukrainian schoolboy Stepan Chubenko from Kramatorsk, Donetsk region, who was killed by Russian fighters from the Kerch gang just because of the yellow and blue ribbon on his backpack.

And how many people were murdered by the Russian occupiers just for the Ukrainian language, for a vyshyvanka, for some diploma in yellow and blue colors, or simply because they wanted to kill an unarmed person.

And this is repeated again and again, every century the Muscovites come to our land to kill, abuse, and commit genocide of the Ukrainian people.

And our historical mission is to break this circle of suffering and make sure that the Russian empire of evil falls, crumbles into pieces and never again can bring grief to our land and our people. It is our historical mission that our grandchildren and their descendants can live freely and never be attacked by enemies again. Our historical mission is to make Ukraine so strong that no one else can encroach on this land and the will of our people.

And the realization of this historic mission is now closer and more real than ever before. We must win, not for ourselves, but for posterity.

If Ukrainians wish to expunge the Russian language from their country, then I would fully support them in such a an effort and believe it's no one elses business. 'Walk a mile in my shoes' would seem to apply; in spades.

Gatling

500 dead Russians in a single day in bakhmut,

If the figures are true makes you wonder what Will happen when the big spring counter offensive begins across the lines can't see how they can't break through Russian lines fairly quickly .

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1634595589135515650?s=20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120345508#Comment_120345508

Its the russian speaking population in Moldova,Georgia and Ukraine Putin have used in his seperatists formula to misinform and destabilise for then to invade later.

Its part of Putins hybrid warfare,and having russian as language you are an easy target for misinformation

Thats why Ukraine have started to ban it too

And Germany used the same excuse in 1938 to invade sudetenland

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346325#Comment_120346325

What needs to happen once ukraine is settled ,is Russian populations need to be reduced across Europe, especially with the balkans or stop more Russians travelling to settle in Europe,let the current population dwindle with age,

Enforce strict Visa controls on anyone coming from Russia

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346323#Comment_120346323

I'd need to know some other statistics before even hazarding a guess at the second part of your post. Russia have, allegedly, mobilised a further 500,000 (?) men since they officially invaded Ukraine a year ago. I was under the impression that Wagner were primarily operating on the Bakhmut front and the proper Wagner soldiers weren't even doing a lot of the really dirty, dangerous fighting, but were leaving that to the tens of thousands of convicts they had recruited, and so it is this group who have - presumably - taken the most casualties. If Wagner can fully take Bakhmut using this brute force tactic of theirs, it still leaves their elite soldiers plus potentially hundreds of thousands of Russian recruits along the whole front line to try and resist a Ukrainian counter attack.

On the other hand, even assuming that the above figures are broadly true (and I'm not saying for sure that they are, this is just what I have been reading), the new Russian recruits may not be all that motivated or well-equipped or well-fed. And if Ukraine can get the promised weapons and if they can complete the training on them and get organised with it, there's obviously that glittering chance to punch big holes in the Russian front line. They'll certainly have to do something to that effect because winning the war through numbers and grinding attrition warfare is one way I'm quite confident a Ukrainian victory will not come about.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346377#Comment_120346377

Yes something needs to be done,thats for sure

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346532#Comment_120346532

500,000 Mobilised,I'm not so sure they ever did , but even if they did the figures for loses in early January was 25,000 + dead and similar number of injured and incapacitated, in that case by the end of this month they are looking at 75,000 dead ,and possibly an estimated similar number of injured or incapacitated soldiers, that's 150,000 in 12 weeks,in pretty low level localised fighting,as in Most of the actual fighting is taking place in bakhmut, kreminna and zuledar,

If the Ukrainans push 50,000 men , armor and tanks anywhere along the front Russians won't be able to hold them off based off what were seeing in 3 areas alone ,but I reckon we will be looking at Ukrainian forces 100,000 + men and equipment on the spring counter offensive,

Hopefully bakhmut is nothing but a grinder to keep the Russians occupied .

We know ukraine Mobilised 28,000 men recently, but they won't be trained and equipped in a few weeks and thrown into a major offensive, that's playing the same game as the Russians if they go that route

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346532#Comment_120346532

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3673603-serhiy-naiev-joint-forces-commander.html

..

greenpilot

Noble61, B52 currently north of Estonia. Transponder on.

85603

It was the exiled oligarch Berezovsky who most threatened Putin at one point.

There was a real good chance at one point that he could have taken Putin down politically, well before Ukraine. Hence 6 assassination attempts before well, spoiler alert.

You want people like that, and those educated types capable of designing, sourcing and manufacturing, to be able to flee the regime.

When theres a dictatorship in power you want to leave the means in place for the opposition and rival elites to escape and attack from safety.

If locked inside Russia they can't oppose and can only add to the dictatorship.

The stories of Russian oligarchs in London (and their many eventual fatal accidents) are fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLPxyDlQfBc

of course some oligarchs don't meet strange ends in London. some of them end up befriending Bojo and become lords.

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346562#Comment_120346562

I think that must depend on what direction Russian society takes if and when Russia is defeated in Ukraine. You do have to at least leave the door open for rehabilitation of a country and its society, otherwise you're essentially helping engineer more conflict down the road. Obviously Russia would have to work on itself in order for that rehab to happen, though. If it doesn't, then what you're suggesting would probably be the only way.

Gatling

Iran is buying su35s from Russia,it's been in the pipeline for several years,but I think Irans weapons to Russia helped seal the deal,

But won't be much use against the Israelis upgraded F35s,

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1634617331488882695?s=20

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346325#Comment_120346325

Sure, I am aware of the strategy of using expats to invade a country as an excuse to invade, it still doesn't mean we should look to cleanse europe of a certain ethnicity or culture as seems to be suggested. If you become your enemy to defeat your enemy, you have basically lost already.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346666#Comment_120346666

Just Russians put very tight restrictions on their movement, ability to own businesss or properties,that or every few years another group aligned to Moscow decide they want independence from a EU state and another localised frozen conflict begins ,

Cut the cancer out to stop it spreading

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346683#Comment_120346683

I see it as part of a larger ideological war, one which western globalist capitalist ideology is winning hands down. The more individual liberty and wealth we bring people, the less likely they are to support authoritarian regimes. The propaganda is a huge problem though. It also seems wrong to collectively punish people who have nothing to do with the Russian government.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346666#Comment_120346666

Very lofty ideals. Putin certainly approves of your stance. You won’t be the first up against the wall.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346665#Comment_120346665

You’d think Russia could do with every Whirpool chipped aircraft they can build themselves.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346713#Comment_120346713

But unfortunately even in this country the Russians are loyal to and support Putin either through fear or they genuinely believe Russian are the master race superior to all others, that's dangerous the biggest supporters of the far right and separatists across Europe and the balkans is the Kremlin,

There has to be push back, look at all those who fled the Russian mobilisations they still support Putin they just don't want to fight and die in Ukraine,

But allowing more and more Russians into Europe will lead to more issues in the future

junkyarddog

https://twitter.com/Azovsouth/status/1634571413230088192

More stupidity.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346742#Comment_120346742

Just shows Money speaks,he tried the same with Argentina a few years ago so they could reinstate their sovereign territories,aka here's a few jets now go take the Falklands back with some assistance from the Kremlin,

Didn't happen in the end

pcardin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346199#Comment_120346199

Dead can not run for a president

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346827#Comment_120346827

Very true

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346635#Comment_120346635

@greenpilot flown over

Spain

-The U.K.

-Norway

-Denmark

-Germany

-Poland

-Estonia

-Latvia

-Lithuania.

And still going

flew close to kalingrad too (9miles),

True power projection

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346713#Comment_120346713

Given the choice ( and especially now) a large proportion of Russians would have nothing to do with Putin, none the less, willing or unwilling Putin is able to use them as his excuse and justification for invading. In Georgia. he was handing out Russian passports to anyone who wanted one, even foreigners could have gotten one. He did this to increase the Nrs he was "Protecting". At some point in time, I can see this strategy coming back to bite him in the ass, with Xi Jinping doing the biting. Xi has started putting the old Chinese names on Russian maps beside the Russian names, showing who owned them in the past. Putins headaches are going to get worse, much worse down the road. I wonder has he sent Xi a Diplomatic Note voicing his displeasure over this mapping issue?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346666#Comment_120346666

Where does Ethnic cleansing comes into it,we are talking about languages?

Why should Russians have the advantage of speaking russian in another country when it obviously is being used to stir up trouble?

They asked for it themselves,remember.

They actually demands it as first language many places?why

Would Russia like if Fins living in Karelia demanding only Finnish to be spoken?

Think you misunderstood the whole thing here

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346654#Comment_120346654

Russia wont take another direction,this is the playbook Putin plays by,and take advantage of.

Only thing thats going to stop that is to prevent the misinformation and seperatist formula that Russia uses,and language happens to be the key there.

And russiophobia is often used together with genocide as an excuse to stir up trouble and have an excuse to send Peacekeepers or simply invade because Russians are threatened.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346323#Comment_120346323

Looks more like 200 dead + 300 wounded than 500 dead going by that tweet

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120347132#Comment_120347132

Don't want to pick on an individual but

"What needs to happen once ukraine is settled ,is Russian populations need to be reduced across Europe, especially with the balkans or stop more Russians travelling to settle in Europe,let the current population dwindle with age"

That sounds pretty close to ethnic cleansing to me.

Perhaps the murder part is missing but it's getting very close. Particularly systematic reduction of population of a single unpopular culture. Even dictators feel that their views are righteous.

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120347370#Comment_120347370

Let's try to take a more middle ground approach on this - if any Russians living in EU/NATO countries are found to be engaging in activities which compromise national security, they can be jailed or deported. Russians seeking entry to EU/NATO countries in order to work & live, or just to visit should be given visas only after extensive vetting is carried out, and even then there should be a limit on overall numbers allowed to come.