Civil Service - Post Lockdown - Blended Working?

gauchesnell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653137#Comment_118653137

we kinda have some protocols around this but again its in flux. Im public sector and we havent been asked to go back but we can if we like.

Open place definitely impacts my work - especially with lack of private space for meetings and online meetings taken at your desk. Its a weird situation for us anyway. Some colleagues take all their online calls and meetings at their desk as they want to be in the office - no real protocols yet in place but the majority still opt to work remotely still.

gauchesnell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653123#Comment_118653123

Ive never been a fan of spending most of my work day getting to a different location for a meeting....or the chats before meetings. Online meetings are way more efficient. What we are kind of seeing now is a hyrid version of meetings but again space is the issue.

Avenger2020

To the person who was complaining about the waiting times while on call with the public service above.

the Central Bank has released a report today outlining “excessive” waiting times of 2 hours or more and a high abandonment rate of calls across all of the five main retail banks in Ireland.

on their salary and expenses best get a job there. Nobody complains about banks eventhough they need our money!

BrianD3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653236#Comment_118653236

Outside of Dublin and outside of the civil service, travelling to meetings (and conferences, seminars) is a great excuse for senior PS staff to claim travel expenses and be unavailable. Someone could easily make 150+ quid "profit" in travel/subsistence for attending one short meeting and then "take their time" getting back to the office afterwards.

For this reason I expect a major pushback against conducting meetings online. I already heard some of it when people thought that the pandemic was coming to an end in summer 2020 - Teams is rubbish, Zoom is rubbish, meetings should be conducted in person, let's get back to normality. Junior staff ordered back to their desks, senior staff coming and going as they please.

hardybuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653123#Comment_118653123

Yeah I'd definitely be an advocate for that, can go for a walks at lunchtime if you want! Glad to be getting the most out of my time and getting through more work.

I've also seen certain regional based teams coming up regularly for maybe one meeting and then going home again on the train when they could have easily been dialling in, or scheduling more into their day when they were up in HQ. You'd have to wonder about the motivations there.

Avenger2020

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653614#Comment_118653614

Wow. There’s a great public interest story there. Tax payers money n all.

i wonder how much senior management claimed in expenses for meetings that could be done more productively online.

gauchesnell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653614#Comment_118653614

Im PS but in Dublin - when i first joined staff still travelled first class internationally and had accounts with numerous expensive restuarants for lunches/dinners. The good old days.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653194#Comment_118653194

What exactly does your contract state?

Because a right to flexible working hours was never part of the civil service contract, it was always considered a privilege, not a right, and could be withdrawn at any time as Departments (or your manager) saw fit.

Even different departments operate flexi time differently - some offices don't operate it at all.

Quote from the Circular 11/2013

18. Management has the responsibility and the right to actively manage flexible working arrangements (flexitime) in their organisations to ensure that Departments/Offices can meet their business needs across the full working day. Flexitime is only possible as long as it supports and enhances the efficient operation of Departments/Offices. In particular, all areas must always be appropriately staffed during the working day, including lunch breaks; all arrangements must ensure that this is consistently the case. 

You'd be surprised how many departments / offices do not have the equipment for video conferencing.

Mine did, but it was unreliable, and often glitchy. Only for we have lots of very knowledgeable tech heads in our office who knew how to sort it themselves, it would never have been used if we'd been waiting for tech support to come down from Head Office.

Ours is being seriously upgraded at the moment, to coincide with the move to hot desking / no assigned desks. Lots of break out rooms planned for meetings.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118631910#Comment_118631910

Most of us never had a private office.

gauchesnell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118654292#Comment_118654292

neither did I but senior management would have and possibly HR. Not sure anyone needs an office - just a space for meetings. That is what we are short of.

Usually you get a single occupany office when you get AP. No guarantee of that any more.

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118652126#Comment_118652126

staff not using their headphones when in a meeting when at their desk

No jury would convict.

Seriously, though, it's been two years. How people don't know now to mute themselves when not talking, and to invest in even a rudimentary headset with mic (or request one from their I.T.), especially if doing meetings in an open plan room... I think part of the problem, obviously, is that the public service don't hire enough gamers.

gauchesnell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118654739#Comment_118654739

true 😁 we bought headsets for everyone aswell but yeah - basic cop on would tell you to use a headset and change/blur your background if having a meeting in an open plan setting but what can you do. Work in progress. Nobody wants to attend someone else's meeting by accidentally appearing in the background.

At least at present we havent been asked to return and so the majority of staff are opting not to but there are always some who chose to go into the office and do their remote meetings from there.

We definitely need more structure for whenever we are required to return but like a lot of posters here we havent heard anything yet.

dublin_Horse

Just a thought. If the CS went fully remote, what would happen if there was a strike? A strike works because there is a picket line that workers wouldn't cross or don't want to be seen crossing by other colleagues. If people are working from home, they could say they were on strike and just work away.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118654731#Comment_118654731

Dept if health moved all their APs onto the open floor when they moved from Hawkins House. Some of the offices were twice the size of my sitting room.

Only the po kept and office that wasn't much bigger than 2 toilet cubicles put together

Hotblack Desiato

Strike? I'd have to picket my own front door LOL

Another scenario could be people saying they are working on the strike day so they get paid, but not doing any work...

Strikes in the civil service are very rare and generally last half a day.

cuttingtimber22

The big conclusion from this thread is that 1. The public services stood tall in many areas during the pandemic and showed they could perform remotely, and 2. Many managers want to revert to type and reverse all the gains made.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118656887#Comment_118656887

Yeah, that would be my takeaway from what I have seen as well on the ground tbh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118655281#Comment_118655281

There have been a grand total of two one day long strikes (that I can recall) within my civil service career, which began in 1987. I wouldn't worry too much about strikes. :)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118655384#Comment_118655384

I once worked with an A/Sec who hated being tucked away in his office. He used to come out and sit in the open plan office with us when he didn't have meetings.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118657134#Comment_118657134

Sketch!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118657181#Comment_118657181

Nah, he was grand! lol. He had no notions about himself, nice guy.

He told me it can be very isolating when you get to that level. Everyone watches what they say around you, and tells you what they think you want to hear. It was insightful.

billyhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118658012#Comment_118658012

The classic luck arses who nod and agree as if everything the ASec says is gospel. The Civil Service is full of them.

hardybuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118654731#Comment_118654731

Not the case in most places, and has been that way for quite a long time.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653614#Comment_118653614

I had one role where I did a lot of travel, you generally ended up with early starts, getting on the road pre 7am to avoid rush hour, and late finishes, home at 7-9pm. If you're getting €150 on mileage, you won't be getting back to the office anyway. Yes, you did get a few quid on mileage, but you paid a lot of it back in fuel, tolls, servicing, tyres and more.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118659055#Comment_118659055

Always in mine. Never seen an AP in an open plan office. 🤷‍♀️



BrianD3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118659166#Comment_118659166

It is absolutely possible to claim 150 or more and still have a lot of the day left. 1 hour meeting, 200 km round trip travel @ 83 cent per km, say 3 hours' travel time. An hour for lunch. Approx 15 euros for a 5 hour sub if lunch isn't provided. Any toll and parking charges fully reimbursed on production of receipts.

Even with current fuel prices, it costs nowhere near 83 cents per km to run a car unless the person buys a car specifically for business use and wouldn't have one otherwise. That's a tiny minority of people.

Anyone looking at this would say it is terribly wasteful for a 1 hour meeting - which is the point. Such meetings should be conducted online.

hardybuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118659748#Comment_118659748

Wouldn't doubt you but you're in the minority I'd say.

I can think of a couple of Depts who did away with it well over a decade ago, and anyone moving to new buildings will lose it as a matter of course. I actually haven't come across anywhere still doing it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660095#Comment_118660095

83c per km is the highest possible rate, for the largest engine size (anything over 1.5) and between 1500km and 5500km total km done per year.

Mileage rates come in bands depending on engine size, and how much mileage you do per year. At the other end of the scale they can be as low as 21c per km.

Mileage rates haven't been raised since 2017 - and considering petrol is now hitting €1.80 per litre... I wouldn't begrudge them it. (Disclaimer: I don't drive for work).