Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Beechwoodspark

Vicxas wrote: »

Is he bollox. He has an agenda and it's obvious as day he has a thing for drinking in Ireland.

I really do think you need to step back and create a bit of a distance to the issue if you genuinely think TH is “scheming” for want of a better word, by manipulating NPHET advice with the “real agenda” being to reduce alcohol consumption in this country

bucketybuck

votecounts wrote: »

Not defending TH but it his job to give public health advice.

Covid health advice, to be more specific. He clearly doesn't give a **** about non covid issues.

Beechwoodspark

beaz2018 wrote: »

'most normal people realise Tony is doing his best'. Christ what a pathetic nation we really are.

Why Pathetic ?

The majority of ppl in this country have a considered, mature view of NPHET and the CMO.

Why is that “pathetic”?

aziz

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Why Pathetic ?

The majority of ppl in this country have a considered, mature view of NPHET and the CMO.

Why is that “pathetic”?

Speaking to people over the last week,their views of Tony,nphet and the government have drastically changed.

The “majority “ are now pissed off

Deeper Blue

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Why Pathetic ?

The majority of ppl in this country have a considered, mature view of NPHET and the CMO.

Why is that “pathetic”?

In the real world the majority are sick to the back teeth of NPHET and the government.

Don't Chute!

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Why Pathetic ?

The majority of ppl in this country have a considered, mature view of NPHET and the CMO.

Why is that “pathetic”?

You keep telling us what the “majority of people in this country” thinks. You have absolutely no idea what they think. There cannot be many people left that don’t realize he’s a complete and utter charlatan.

aziz

My 87 year old mother in law who never swears,calls nphet “****”

She’s really missing lunch in the pub and bingo and says life isn’t worth living under these restrictions

lawred2

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I really do think you need to step back and create a bit of a distance to the issue if you genuinely think TH is “scheming” for want of a better word, by manipulating NPHET advice with the “real agenda” being to reduce alcohol consumption in this country

He's on record, multiple times over his career, as to his desire to reduce alcohol consumption in Ireland. Why do you think that's not a matter for him any more?

UK had 24,000 cases and 13 deaths today. As I said in a previous tweet, this is the equivalent of 1,800 cases here and 1 death.

Therefore, if NPHETs prediction of 700,000 cases came true, it would equate to 388 deaths over a 3-month period.

That's 4 deaths per day. And this is NPHETs "WORST" case, most unlikely scenario.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

Some of us made this very obvious point 6 months ago when we pointed out that the rational for lockdowns then would logically also apply to other "health emergencies", and as such we should now expect calls for lockdown every winter to "flatten the curve" and "protect the hospitals".

As usual such comments were dismissed as not possible. Conspiracy nonsense.

Yet here we are. The usual suspects will again dismiss it because of course they will, but when the head of the HSE in the middle of summer is warning that our hospitals are close to collapse then it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to see what comes later.

But why haven’t they improved bed capacity. There are long waiting lists already made worse by covid delays, people who can’t even afford it are now having to go private.

votecounts

votecounts wrote: »

Not defending TH but it his job to give public health advice.

I wish he would give it to the Government rather than leaking it to newspapers or having more Late Late Show appearances than Pat Kenny.

He wants to be a celebrity, but he also wants to make decisions which affect the day-to-day lives, jobs, and businesses of people at secret meetings.

Our democratic system has worked for a century at keeping out dangerous extremists. But we now have an extremist running the country who we cannot ever vote out.

His meltdown at South William Street was the mark of the man. Bitter, spiteful and angry. Ranting and raving on Twitter about the young people with their lives ahead of them. It was an embarrassment.

The best thing for Dr. Tony Holohan, and for Ireland would have been if he'd quietly retired in October. He would have had his memories of the superhero murals and his redemption arc would have been pretty complete.

But he's had far too much power, for far too long, and has completely lost the run of himself. He's probably never going to be able to walk into a pub or restaurant ever again in his life without wondering will he be put out of it. I find that quite sad.

beaz2018

'Tonys job is to give advice...its the govs fault....' christ almighty if i hear that again. Yes in a normal country where they dont have murals, freedoms of the city, late late show appearances, yes the cmo gives advice and the gov act. In this backwater, we have given such an enormous pedestal to a GP with a dodgy past that it is political suicide to go against him. Therefore he doesnt just advise, he dictates.

lawred2

beaz2018 wrote: »

'Tonys job is to give advice...its the govs fault....' christ almighty if i hear that again. Yes in a normal country where they dont have murals, freedoms of the city, late late show appearances, yes the cmo gives advice and the gov act. In this backwater, we have given such an enormous pedestal to a GP with a dodgy past that it is political suicide to go against him. Therefore he doesnt just advise, he dictates.

Murals.

What a sad shower of fanatics we have inhabiting this country..

beaz2018

b0nk1e wrote: »

I wish he would give it to the Government rather than leaking it to newspapers or having more Late Late Show appearances than Pat Kenny.

He wants to be a celebrity, but he also wants to make decisions which affect the day-to-day lives, jobs, and businesses of people at secret meetings.

Our democratic system has worked for a century at keeping out dangerous extremists. But we now have an extremist running the country who we cannot ever vote out.

His meltdown at South William Street was the mark of the man. Bitter, spiteful and angry. Ranting and raving on Twitter about the young people with their lives ahead of them. It was an embarrassment.

The best thing for Dr. Tony Holohan, and for Ireland would have been if he'd quietly retired in October. He would have had his memories of the superhero murals and his redemption arc would have been pretty complete.

But he's had far too much power, for far too long, and has completely lost the run of himself. He's probably never going to be able to walk into a pub or restaurant ever again in his life without wondering will he be put out of it. I find that quite sad.

He will most likely never have to pay for dinner or buy a pint for as long as he lives in this country. Thats where were at.

aziz

b0nk1e wrote: »

. He's probably never going to be able to walk into a pub or restaurant ever again in his life without wondering will he be put out of it. I find that quite sad.

Hopefully he and the rest of nphet will be barred from every bar and restaurant

eskimohunt

eskimohunt wrote: »

UK had 24,000 cases and 13 deaths today. As I said in a previous tweet, this is the equivalent of 1,800 cases here and 1 death.

Therefore, if NPHETs prediction of 700,000 cases came true, it would equate to 388 deaths over a 3-month period.

That's 4 deaths per day. And this is NPHETs "WORST" case, most unlikely scenario.

UK is further along with vaccinations though so not completely equivalent situations.

prunudo

b0nk1e wrote: »

I wish he would give it to the Government rather than leaking it to newspapers or having more Late Late Show appearances than Pat Kenny.

He wants to be a celebrity, but he also wants to make decisions which affect the day-to-day lives, jobs, and businesses of people at secret meetings.

Our democratic system has worked for a century at keeping out dangerous extremists. But we now have an extremist running the country who we cannot ever vote out.

His meltdown at South William Street was the mark of the man. Bitter, spiteful and angry. Ranting and raving on Twitter about the young people with their lives ahead of them. It was an embarrassment.

The best thing for Dr. Tony Holohan, and for Ireland would have been if he'd quietly retired in October. He would have had his memories of the superhero murals and his redemption arc would have been pretty complete.

But he's had far too much power, for far too long, and has completely lost the run of himself. He's probably never going to be able to walk into a pub or restaurant ever again in his life without wondering will he be put out of it. I find that quite sad.

Oh to be a fly on the wall the day he is refused service in a cafe, restaurant or pub.

Beechwoodspark

lawred2 wrote: »

He's on record, multiple times over his career, as to his desire to reduce alcohol consumption in Ireland. Why do you think that's not a matter for him any more?

He addressed the issue a few days ago and I am happy to take him on good faith.

Ppl have to remember the cabinet and wider NPHET scrutinise the recommendations

Also the wider govt, the opposition, and the media scrutinise the recommendations.

Dare I say Some posters have a very simplistic overly personalised, almost school yard childish view of the situation. (Boo hiss the bad man Tony).

It’s not the case that TH dials up Michael Martin and gives him advice off the top of his head.

Do ppl accept that There’s a professional process involving many stakeholders here

aziz

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

He addressed the issue a few days ago and I am happy to take him on good faith. .

Your easily fooled

Beechwoodspark

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

He addressed the issue a few days ago and I am happy to take him on good faith.

He did.

He began by saying alcohol had no part to play in the decision making process, then spent 4 additional minutes explaining the reasons why alcohol was damaging to the process of containing the virus. :rolleyes:

Of course alcohol access plays a role. Pubs are nuclei of ethanol consumption -- and they've been closed for the best part of 15 months. Other indoor zones remain accessible, but pubs do not.

The idea that it's got nothing to do with alcohol is absurd.

Deeper Blue

Holohan has been anti-alcohol for his entire career in the public eye.

The fact that people are trying to argue this is genuinely hilarious.

aziz

Yeah,he was hardly going to say that drink and pubs are evil and he’s going to do his best to keep them closed

Beechwoodspark

[Deleted User] wrote: »

He did.

He began by saying alcohol had no part to play in the decision making process, then spent 4 additional minutes explaining the reasons why alcohol was damaging to the process of containing the virus. :rolleyes:

Of course alcohol access plays a role. Pubs are nuclei of ethanol consumption -- and they've been closed for the best part of 15 months. Other indoor zones remain accessible, but pubs do not.

The idea that it's got nothing to do with alcohol is absurd.

The “Covid loves to party “ line...

ie to break it down, covid easily spreads

in warm humid enclosed settings

with poor ventilation

Lots of common surfaces and ppl handing glasses to each other and money changing hands

- such as pubs and bars -

especially when the punters are NOT observing distancing

Even more so if ppl have consumed alcohol (in a bar in ireland it’s pretty likely come on) are wasted and falling all over themselves and each other bellowing and singing etc

Now, Regardless of TH personal views on alcohol,

It’s kinda true though?

Pubs would be almost perfect spreading locations for this virus.

Beechwoodspark

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

The “Covid loves to party “ line...

ie to break it down, covid easily spreads

in warm humid enclosed settings

with poor ventilation

Lots of common surfaces and ppl handing glasses to each other and money changing hands

- such as pubs and bars -

especially when the punters are NOT observing distancing

Even more so if ppl have consumed alcohol (in a bar in ireland it’s pretty likely come on) are wasted and falling all over themselves and each other bellowing and singing etc

Now, Regardless of TH personal views on alcohol,

It’s kinda true though?

Pubs would be almost perfect spreading locations for this virus.

True -- and there also locations that Tony Holohan has a personal aversion to.

And when you dislike a place, you are less likely to be sympathetic to it if you don't visit these places yourself.

niallo27

Loves to party but hates schools.

Beechwoodspark

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

The “Covid loves to party “ line...

ie to break it down, covid easily spreads

in warm humid enclosed settings

with poor ventilation - such as pubs and bars -

especially when the punters are NOT observing distancing

Even more so if ppl have consumed alcohol (in a bar in ireland it’s pretty likely come on) are wasted and falling all over themselves and each other bellowing and singing etc

Now, regardless of TH personal views on alcohol,

It’s kinda true though?

Pubs would be almost perfect spreading locations for this virus.

Right but what about seated service. Have had a few days away here since hotels reopened, tables were well spread out, small groups sitting together, some having bar food, others a few drinks. It wasn’t the same as before but was still really nice. At some point people have to be trusted surely. Place was well ventilated too.

aziz

Pubs are one thing but for the love of god, open the restaurants
I be happy just to be able to sit in Macdonald’s

lawred2

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

The “Covid loves to party “ line...

ie to break it down, covid easily spreads

in warm humid enclosed settings

with poor ventilation

Lots of common surfaces and ppl handing glasses to each other and money changing hands

- such as pubs and bars -

especially when the punters are NOT observing distancing

Even more so if ppl have consumed alcohol (in a bar in ireland it’s pretty likely come on) are wasted and falling all over themselves and each other bellowing and singing etc

Now, Regardless of TH personal views on alcohol,

It’s kinda true though?

Pubs would be almost perfect spreading locations for this virus.

Yeah yeah so because of the few who never gave a toss anyway, every other business and every other punter has to suffer.

That's cowardice.

shocksy

If it wasn't known before (however, it was to many) the covid pandemic, this country has a really serious drinking problem. I await the posters who will jump on this post. However, no matter what way people try and defend it, it is true and really disturbing. There are people frothing at the mouth waiting to be able to drink indoors again and get absolutely stupid drunk again. The whole "social argument" doesn't cut it. It's a lame excuse. There are plenty of other ways to be social. However, all most people can think of doing in this country to be social is getting $hit faced drunk. It's pure desperation in a way that alcohol is their only "fun" way of being social with friends and family etc. It's a sad state of affairs when all people can think of doing is getting into a pub again. Thankfully I don't fit into this part of the population. I'm not anti drinking before anyone says it, but there is serious alcohol addiction in this country that many won't dare admit too. There is also a major drinking problem in this country to the extent that certain cohorts of society won't acknowledge it and will fight to the death on internet forums to deny it exists.

namloc1980

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

The “Covid loves to party “ line...

ie to break it down, covid easily spreads

in warm humid enclosed settings

with poor ventilation

Lots of common surfaces and ppl handing glasses to each other and money changing hands

- such as pubs and bars -

especially when the punters are NOT observing distancing

Even more so if ppl have consumed alcohol (in a bar in ireland it’s pretty likely come on) are wasted and falling all over themselves and each other bellowing and singing etc

Now, Regardless of TH personal views on alcohol,

It’s kinda true though?

Pubs would be almost perfect spreading locations for this virus.

This is true for any respiratory illness - flus, colds etc. What's the endgame here? Will vaccines ever be enough or do we have to shut down pubs indefinitely? 4.5m vaccine doses administered and we still have these idealogical posts