Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Wibbs

Northernlily wrote: »

Well said. That generation have irked me for a long time. They don't understand or empathise with the challenges young people in 2021 face. This is the latest example.

They got greedy and are more asset rich than we ever will be.

Speaking as a 52 year old I agree with you 100%. And you'll find quite the number of those over 70 who are more vulnerable to this pox would also agree. They're seeing their kids and especially their grandkids suffering from those challenges.

voldejoie

I'm (almost) 30 and incredibly angry at how my life has been derailed by this poxy pandemic and the hamfisted response to it. I can't even think about how much worse it is for younger people, just starting out in their careers or at college or even at school, and seeing NPHET talk about there being a risk to schools and colleges reopening after the summer has me in a rage. Enough is enough

Richard Hillman

Red Silurian wrote: »

When they talk about full dismantling they mean no masks and no social distancing

NPHET will cling onto masks for years. It will be their last battle. It holds no economic detriment so government will probably let them have it to keep them quiet.

NPHET won't go quietly into the night. They have had fame and power suddenly thrust upon them. People have notions that they are infallible people, uncorrupted by these things.

Murph85

Ff are so screwed , it would make sense to take advantage of the situation, dump mm as leader, insta a new hardliner, who will dismiss nphet, reopen and sort out housing etc..

Not a yes man, not a spoofer, a like it or lump it type... not someone trying to be everything to all people, like every irish politician...

Ff would benefit far more from this than fg, given their support. Bit it would also help fg. Get someone in with the stones to end this nonsense, address housing and the outrageous rip off marginal rate taxes, reward the hard working...

Open goal, I can only prey a new party forms

Red Silurian

https://www.newstalk.com/news/corona-pass-could-mean-never-having-to-go-into-lockdown-again-varadkar-1218394

Never having to go into lockdown again with this corona-pass

Delaying re-openings so we can ensure our reopening plan isn't reversed

I'd worry that all of this echoes similar soundbites from last year

Quags

Red Silurian wrote: »

https://www.newstalk.com/news/corona-pass-could-mean-never-having-to-go-into-lockdown-again-varadkar-1218394

Never having to go into lockdown again with this corona-pass

Delaying re-openings so we can ensure our reopening plan isn't reversed

I'd worry that all of this echoes similar soundbites from last year

I wouldn't believe anything our Government says. Just hot air coming from them is all that is

Wibbs

Corona pass my arse. I staggers me that anyone would be gung ho for more government oversight and names on databases when we're already tracked quite enough thanks very much. Don't get me started on the "well I've nothing to hide" people... And once that kinda thing gets in it doesn't ever get removed. That's a guarantee. There'll always be some boogyman "variant" to rattle the cages with.

VinLieger

A covid pass isnt legal let alone workable, restaurants and pubs aren't in a place to enforce something like this and the gardai cannot effectively police it either, its absoluyte madness.

timmyntc

VinLieger wrote: »

A covid pass isnt legal let alone workable, restaurants and pubs aren't in a place to enforce something like this and the gardai cannot effectively police it either, its absoluyte madness.

I agree - however Varadkar has said they fully intend on doing it. Vaccine or proof of recovery, but negative test isnt good enough

Dr. Bre

RobitTV wrote: »

Varadkar is really struggling this morning, you really do wonder if he believe in the nonsense that comes from his mouth. He knows the government is on the ropes.

The next two weeks are going to be VERY interesting...

Crucial you mean

Quags

timmyntc wrote: »

I agree - however Varadkar has said they fully intend on doing it. Vaccine or proof of recovery, but negative test isnt good enough

Thus brings in a two tier system which is illegal surely.

Jinglejangle69

VinLieger wrote: »

A covid pass isnt legal let alone workable, restaurants and pubs aren't in a place to enforce something like this and the gardai cannot effectively police it either, its absoluyte madness.

Unfortunately it is legal.

Richard Hillman

Let's get one thing straight. No restaurant or pub will be refusing your business based on vaccination status. No Garda can ask you your vaccination or health status.

Anything is voluntary. And importantly, if a pub or restaurant refuses you because of your vaccination status, you will have a glorious civil case against them.

gozunda

Klonker wrote: »

I mean that they're not talking about the one or two countries that have all indoor closed, they're talking about the ones more open when they talk about further easing. Don't care what some stringency thing you link says, those countries are not as restrictive as Ireland and even when you do need a vaccine pass every single country accepts an antigen test too. But NPHET are against that, they have no leg to stand to now say we need vaccine certs.

I'm fairly certain they're including all EU countries in that report. They would have called out any exceptions if they thought it relevant. The stringency index looks at all countries not just Ireland btw and is based on 9 different criteria. But if you disagree maybe take it up with them. Vaccine certs and how they are applied in individual countries are a whole other caboodle.

Fandymo

Phishnet wrote: »

All Covid 19 vaccines are currently UNAPPROVED by the relevant regulatory authorities , but you know this.

For other readers of this thread, the European Medicines Agency has issued an emergency use authorization to permit the use of the unapproved vaccines for active immunization in individuals of 12 to 18 years of age, depending on what jab they opt for, hence you sign a disclaimer.

I’ve had 2 Astra-Zeneca jabs. I didn’t have to sign anything. I think your making stuff up in your head, or believing FB nonsense.

Jinglejangle69

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Let's get one thing straight. No restaurant or pub will be refusing your business based on vaccination status. No Garda can ask you your vaccination or health status.

Anything is voluntary. And importantly, if a pub or restaurant refuses you because of your vaccination status, you will have a glorious civil case against them.

Just said on RTE it was checked and isn't illegal.

seansouth36

It's obvious the "vaccine pass" is simply a diversionary tactic by the government. In two weeks they can claim the pass "is not ready" and therefore indoor dining/drinking can't be opened for the vaccinated. The conversation then shifts to the vaccine pass rather than the fact the pubs are closed; PR bolloxology and the pliant media fall for it hook, line and sinker.

Fandymo

Phishnet wrote: »

The person who vaccinated you read over certain declarations and asked you did you understand same. He/she then become the witness that you were given the proper advices and warnings. Speeds up the process.

Read the six pages document on HSE.IE

CONSENT FOR VACCINATION FOR COVID-19 GUIDING PRINCIPLES

Want a hand with those goalposts. I was asked the same questions I was asked when I got the flu vaccine.

Ballynally

namloc1980 wrote: »

The Green Cert regulation gives Member States the rights to impose their own restrictions as they deem fit and to "step out" of the Green Cert process. This is because health policy is ultimately a Member State competency in the EU and not an EU competency:

13. Although this Regulation is without prejudice to Member States’ competence to impose restrictions to free movement, in accordance with Union law, to limit the spread of SARS-CoV-2, it should contribute to facilitating the gradual lifting of such restrictions in a coordinated manner whenever possible, in accordance with Recommendation (EU) 2020/1475.

55. To ensure coordination, the Commission and the other Member States should be informed when a Member State requires holders of certificates to undergo, after entry into its territory, quarantine or self-isolation or to be tested for SARS-CoV-2 infection, or if it imposes other restrictions on holders of such certificates

Don't bet against us being an outlier on the Green Cert like we are with indoor hospitality come the 19th July.

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=CELEX:32021R0953&qid=1625042455003&from=EN

The way i see it is that the government cannot provide a good enough reason to delay the july19 date f the DCC to the EU because the scare modelling has to be seen in a EU context and the numbers in Ireland do not indicate it being an outlier atm. Projections are not good enough as a selling point.
Real data do make countries revise their policy regarding certain areas but they still will be able to use the DCC as an agreed method.
Legally they could delay but they wont imo.

Supercell

Dont know why they are making a big deal of this being hard to implement, show vaccination card and some form of picture id confirming name (drivers license etc), done.
Not exactly rocket science and if it helps encourage some people to step away from the Facebook nonsense and get the jab then all the better.

suicide_circus

bear1 wrote: »

I can't believe that we are waiting to see what happens in the UK.
A place which is far less restrictive and with a far higher population.
We are such a docile people.

We are a profoundly conservative and subservient nation

timmyntc

Supercell wrote: »

Dont know why they are making a big deal of this being hard to implement, show vaccination card and some form of picture id confirming name (drivers license etc), done.
Not exactly rocket science and if it helps encourage some people to step away from the Facebook nonsense and get the jab then all the better.

Vaccination cards can be faked
Also how do you track proof of recovery?

Quags

Supercell wrote: »

Dont know why they are making a big deal of this being hard to implement, show vaccination card and some form of picture id confirming name (drivers license etc), done.
Not exactly rocket science and if it helps encourage some people to step away from the Facebook nonsense and get the jab then all the better.

But people do not want the vaccine and to be basically bullied into it so you can enjoy indoor dining sounds very Nazism to me. This thing isnt going anyway soon and while it will kill people so will the flu and numerous other things so why cant people just get on with their lives and if you feel personally your not comfortable eating indoors with the non vaccination ppl then Im sure some places will accept the golden vac card

timmyntc

timmyntc wrote: »

Vaccination cards can be faked
Also how do you track proof of recovery?

They have a database of the vaccinated.

Surely, it can't be that hard to harness that data into some sort of digital pass / coupled with ID.

I've no idea how you can prove if someone had COVID-19 and recovered last month, for example. A positive antibody test? Unlikely, as they aren't too reliable.

Furthermore, it should be a conscious choice to opt to take a vaccine. The idea that, for all intents and purposes, it's made mandatory is a gross violation of civil liberties.

tommybrees

Is it the case that pubs can serve outdoors which is illegal and guards turning a blind eye too for the past few weeks, but when it comes to serving indoors which they do have a legal right too there not allowed do it?

bear1

suicide_circus wrote: »

We are a profoundly conservative and subservient nation

Chicken****s you mean.

Busi_Girl08

timmyntc wrote: »

Vaccination cards can be faked
Also how do you track proof of recovery?

And what kind of onus will be placed on hospitality business owners for missing fakes.

namloc1980

Ballynally wrote: »

The way i see it is that the government cannot provide a good enough reason to delay the july19 date f the DCC to the EU because the scare modelling has to be seen in a EU context and the numbers in Ireland do not indicate it being an outlier atm. Projections are not good enough as a selling point.
Real data do make countries revise their policy regarding certain areas but they still will be able to use the DCC as an agreed method.
Legally they could delay but they wont imo.

They don't have to provide a good enough excuse. They don't have to provide any excuse - just notify the EU if they intend placing additional restrictions. I was 100% of the belief that travel on the 19th would go ahead but after what happened yesterday I think NPHET will deliver more doom and gloom and try to twist the governments arm into stalling on the green cert. Let's see what happens.

Fandymo

Relax brah wrote: »

My job involved 4 days a week travelling Europe, I work in multicultural tech company and have done for the last 10 years.

I can assure you, the Irish drinking culture as a whole is on another level compared to most of Europe.

How come we only rank mid table in Europe per capita?? And falling steadily since 2010??

OwenM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

On NPHET and Tony, I've been saying since last year that there was a risk of public health zealots using the pandemic as an excuse to try and socially engineer the country out of its love of the sesh, in a "sure we may as well replace the plumbing while we've the floor open for electrical re-wiring" kind of mission creep. I don't think that's a conspiracy theory at all. Holohan is on the record as wanting coercive measures to tackle Ireland's binge drinking culture from many years ago. It's not a massive stretch to assume a "kill two birds with one stone" mentality among some in his group, even if they'll never say it out loud.

https://twitter.com/LVADublinPubs/status/1409432500804403201