Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

PalLimerick

bucketybuck wrote: »

Its very hard not to advise young people that the best thing they could do for their future is to move to the UK, a place that unlike Ireland actively wants to take the pandemic noose off their neck.

Ireland has made it quite clear that it doesn't give a **** about its kids, if it wanted to intentionally sabotage their futures it couldn't have done that any better than it has in recent years.

Now the kids look at a place that is a world apart in terms of intent and energy to get something done. Yes Brexit was a cluster**** and a huge mistake but the UK never hid under their beds in the same fashion as the cowardly Irish have, they have always been pumping to get going again and I think a lot of young people will see that and desire that.

Yet again I can see another huge brain drain of our youth emigrating and going to places that will give them better opportunities.

You forgot to add *in your opinion, Brexit was a clusterxxxx and huge mistake. It wasn't for the majority of "Brits ".

FlubberJones

facehugger99 wrote: »

With the youngest population in Europe and our rate of vaccine take-up, one would imagine Ireland would be the first county to see a return to full normality.

Instead we are lagging way behind, crippling our economy and building up a mountain of debt.

Maybe some journalists would like to ask few questions about this if they can find a bit of time away from the constant fear-mongering and hysteria.

This was also something I thought about, seems that even though you are so young, the leaders of this country fear you are weak and are unable to cope with this illness... thus they wrap you all in cotton wool and shaft the entire economy and country at the same time.

Red Silurian

FlubberJones wrote: »

This was also something I thought about, seems that even though you are so young, the leaders of this country fear you are weak and are unable to cope with this illness... thus they wrap you all in cotton wool and shaft the entire economy and country at the same time.

Let's not forget we need levels that our underfunded health service can cope with

Klonker

namloc1980 wrote: »

According to the HSE dashboard of the people being admitted to hospital in the last 2 weeks there was only 1 day where 10 or more were admitted to hospital. Some days it's been as low as 2 and average around 6. Glynn is spoofing or else the HSE is lying.

Is the dashboard still showing admissions and discharges per day? I thought this was one of the things supposedly lost with the hack.

Also how many people are admitted to hospital for any reason every day? If everyone of them is tested some are likely to be positive. There stay has nothing to do with covid, they'd be in hospital anyway for whatever reason brought them there in the first.

Doctor Jimbob

facehugger99 wrote: »

With the youngest population in Europe and our rate of vaccine take-up, one would imagine Ireland would be the first county to see a return to full normality.

Instead we are lagging way behind, crippling our economy and building up a mountain of debt.

Maybe some journalists would like to ask few questions about this if they can find a bit of time away from the constant fear-mongering and hysteria.

Instead, they're going with headlines about an unstoppable 4th wave. Which seems to me like a great way to encourage vaccine hesitancy.

TomTomTim

FlubberJones wrote: »

This was also something I thought about, seems that even though you are so young, the leaders of this country fear you are weak and are unable to cope with this illness... thus they wrap you all in cotton wool and shaft the entire economy and country at the same time.

Not many will admit it, but the ever expanding state is the reason for all of this. Governments would never have even tried this 50 years ago. Now, with so many people hooked on the need for state intervention for everything, something like this is easy to get away with. I'm not exactly a libertarian, but we'd all be better of if the state took a few steps away from the control that they have over our lives.

Hurrache

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Long Covid" even mentioned :rolleyes:

And what exactly is wrong with mentioning that?

keano_afc

facehugger99 wrote: »

With the youngest population in Europe and our rate of vaccine take-up, one would imagine Ireland would be the first county to see a return to full normality.

Instead we are lagging way behind, crippling our economy and building up a mountain of debt.

Maybe some journalists would like to ask few questions about this if they can find a bit of time away from the constant fear-mongering and hysteria.

Genuinely laughed out loud. Our media is even more non-existent than our opposition.

Ballynally

Allinall wrote: »

Roughly the same amount of people will be discharged each day as those admitted, if the numbers remain steady.

So 10 hospitalizations, and 10 discharges.

I have been following the HSE portal w the official nrs f hospital admission, discharges and inpatients (and deaths).
The data doesnt add up. It seems discharges have not been reported for some time while admissions have gone up but it isnt reflected in the covid19 inpatient nrs which, according to my calculation, should be higher than they are reported.
What would be really good right now but isnt forthcoming, is the breakdown in age group, duration of hospital time, co morbidities.
That is such an important indicator how Delta impacts in real time.
But i dont even think the NHS comes out with that although ive seen stats comparing under 50s to over 50s, vaccinated vs unvaccinated.
Vaccinated under 50s death rate btw is still.....0 (yes, you read that right).

Hurrache

facehugger99 wrote: »

Why are people still being allowed to drive motor vehicles, given the near certainty that 'someone somewhere will need to be hospitalized'?


Surely we have established that this is the metric by which we are assessing risk in this country?

You may have heard, but there's a load of restrictions put in place when it comes to driving a motor vehicle, restrictions on who can drive, where it can be driven, at what speed it can be driven, mandatory safety equipment in the car, and mandatory use of it, more and more legal obligations on how the car is designed, and legal consequences if you don't adhere to these restrictions.

You're looking for restrictions around Covid to be similar so?

namloc1980

Klonker wrote: »

Is the dashboard still showing admissions and discharges per day? I thought this was one of the things supposedly lost with the hack.

Also how many people are admitted to hospital for any reason every day? If everyone of them is tested some are likely to be positive. There stay has nothing to do with covid, they'd be in hospital anyway for whatever reason brought them there in the first.

Still shows admissions per day but curiously not discharges.

seamus

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Heard Ronan Glynn say on Newstalk this morning that we're currently running at 10 Covid hospitalizations a day. How can this be when the hospital numbers have been pretty steady for a few weeks now?

namloc1980 wrote: »

According to the HSE dashboard of the people being admitted to hospital in the last 2 weeks there was only 1 day where 10 or more were admitted to hospital. Some days it's been as low as 2 and average around 6. Glynn is spoofing or else the HSE is lying.

Average for the last two weeks is 7.1 per day.

Over the last week that's up marginally to 7.4.

The last two weeks has overall seen the lowest average number of hospitalisations in a long time. The signs are that it's trickling back up. The numbers are low enough though that a single day of 12 admissions could be a freak.

namloc1980

seamus wrote: »

Average for the last two weeks is 7.1 per day.

Over the last week that's up marginally to 7.4.

The last two weeks has overall seen the lowest average number of hospitalisations in a long time. The signs are that it's trickling back up. The numbers are low enough though that a single day of 12 admissions could be a freak.

Glynn is lying or just "rounding up" to a nice even number of 10.

Rayne Wooney

There was a sense that the tide had changed after that NPHET farce, people who were just quietly accepting the restrictions had enough.

Only now the government are being proactive it seems, far too late in the game.

Ballynally

lee_baby_simms wrote: »

I would imagine based on Uk data that hospital stays are extremely short now due to age and vaccination. 24 hours is average stay in Uk now so maybe we are experiencing the same revolving door effect here keeping the numbers steady.

24 hours average stay in hospital f Covid19 patients?
Where did u get that information?Or is it just general average?

FileNotFound

seamus wrote: »

Average for the last two weeks is 7.1 per day.

Over the last week that's up marginally to 7.4.

The last two weeks has overall seen the lowest average number of hospitalisations in a long time. The signs are that it's trickling back up. The numbers are low enough though that a single day of 12 admissions could be a freak.

Also as we open more the virus will spread more - I thought this was just fact?

So we will see a rise in cases, hospital cases and deaths.

But will it overwhelm the hospitals or increase to the point it impacts the system (mind you a system that is always under strain so relativity would be needed).

The idea that numbers don't jump as we opened outdoor dining is a bit of an innocent naive view - if anyone holds it.

Klonker

namloc1980 wrote: »

Still shows admissions per day but curiously not discharges.

So Ronan Glynn just took the highest admissions of the last 2 week and said this is the average admissions per day which is almost double the actual average admission. And people think they are not deliberately misleading us. No wonder their modelling is off the charts.

FileNotFound

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

There was a sense that the tide had changed after that NPHET farce, people who were just quietly accepting the restrictions had enough.

Only now the government are being proactive it seems, far too late in the game.

Could not agree more. I have been supportive to date, very supportive. 3 day visits home (all outdoor with distance and even masks) since it began. Didn't travel for xmas (as what happened seemed somewhat obvious to me), still not had a haircut as working from home, so on and so on.


Yet the fact the government did no planning in the background, seems their planning amounted to a few prayers that the covid gods be kind.


The lack of an aim, the lack of explaining the vaccine is not 100% so cases will never go away, the lack of clear communication that every opening step will see jumps in cases - hell the decision to base decisions on cases after us being told for so long its protect the at risk and hospitals.


All in all I sit here shaking my head - ranting on boards.


Mind you, I'll follow the nonsense - but it will be remembered in years to come. May FF be dissolved as an entity (I blame MM as man at the top and the dope Donnelly is a joke). It does make you realise a trained teacher isn't really qualified to run a nation.

Ballynally

namloc1980 wrote: »

Glynn is lying or just "rounding up" to a nice even number of 10.

With numbers that low one could easily extrapolate the percentages of hospital admissions leading to severe pulmonary problems and deaths if somebody bothered to compile this.
Just a few people making phonecalls and/or hospitals reporting.
It isnt rocket science.
Or has everything now gone fully IT based w no paper backup?
There really is no excuse not to inform everyone about these details w 40+ people in hospitals including 14 in ICUs.
Blaming it on system issues is a non issue at this stage.

Edit: we know Delta has been with us for at least 2 months.
Given the fact that Alpha is still with us we can easily sequence the variants and do the calculations.
Paper to pen, even.
I suspect that, with nrs that low they see no point to calculate percentages other than how the Delta variant has grown in comparison with Alpha.
My dark mind thinks that is useful for official bodies to go on warning us about the upcoming threat. Its taking over!

HildaOgdenx

I have avoided watching news bulletins since March 2020, never watched the daily updates by NPHET or the government - if we still have a government, I have no idea. We seem to have a puppet in the form of Micheál Martin as Taoiseach. A man with no backbone.

Glimpsed the beginning of a news bulletin this morning, big headline, Ireland due to be hit with bla bla bla, before they went over to speak with Tony Holohan for more of his gloom laden predictions. This is disgraceful.
No balance whatsoever! No wonder some people are genuinely worried and wanting lockdown to continue forevermore listening to that.

Caught a brief glimpse of the newspaper headlines and more of the same. I despair. The initial lockdown made sense to me, and while I have continued to do things in line with restrictions, I thought the continued use of lockdown(s) demonstrated a complete lack of logic, or any kind of intelligence applied to the situation.

We could dine indoors at various times, in 2020 when nobody was vaccinated, but now, with many people vaccinated, this is absolutely not allowed. I'm deliberately using the word 'allowed' because that's another thing that has worked its way into the lingo coming from on high. We might be allowed or permitted to have a life, sometime, if we all behave ourselves...who knows. :rolleyes:

Tony Holohan tweeting about the 'shocking scenes' in Dublin some weeks ago, was a prime example of this. And it showed how much power this man has been given, and how much he seemingly can dictate to the great unwashed.

We seem to have people at the top now, (strangely, many of them unelected) who are most unwilling to relinquish their time in the spotlight, matched with politicians with no backbone, and tbh, that scares me more than any virus, at this stage.

Murph85

Agree with everything you say lads, but varadkar also has no backbone, remember it was him that put nphet on the pedestal and allowed them ride roughshod...

FileNotFound

FileNotFound wrote: »

Mind you, I'll follow the nonsense

And this is why it Ireland is going to be the only country with Covid restrictions years after everyone else has moved on with their lives.

_Kaiser_

prunudo wrote: »

I think as a nation though we are more fearful of risk compared to other nations than we realise, and covid is bringing that to the surface.
You tell someone in Ireland you ride a motorbike and they nearly recall in horror at how dangerous it is or can't wait to tell you some story about their uncles neighbours friend who was killed or seriously injured off one back in 80s or whenever. Now look at the UK and rest of Europe and the volume of motorbike/scooter riders, people don't give it a second glance.

Anyway, its ot but I think it can explain how so many are happy to lap up the fear and hysteria being spread by media and 'the experts'.

It's two-fold. Yes absolutely are many people risk-averse generally, but there's also an element that "we" don't like anything different or that stands out.

For example, Mark on NT actually asked Pascal Donoghue if we were happy to be in a group of 9 nations (incl Hungary) that are objecting to the minimum corporation tax idea - as Donoghue (surprisingly) said, it's more important that we are looking out for our national interests in these negotiations, but it shows how "we" really have a need for approval and validation in this country and to be SEEN to be doing the right thing"

The second point is that many people have a natural deference to authority figures - no matter how incompetent or unsuitable they prove themselves to be, or how wrong they are. It's a hangover from the dark days when the Church was running things in this country.

Henry...

Just checking in

Is the Pandemic over yet ?

MOR316

Mate of mine asking me this...They're 34 and can register from the 12th.

He doesn't want the AZ vaccine due to previous history with a bleed on the brain and they want to travel to America in winter but, they're currently not accepting people who take AZ.
My friend wants the Pfizer or Moderna (spelling?)

Is my friend going to be forced to take the AZ or J&J vaccine?

Klonker

Shane in NT also put it to Ronan that some expert (can't remember name) said the projected death rate in the modelling was 1.6 times what we are currently seeing and is he happy that the modelling is accurate. Mentioned that modelling isn't exact but then skipped on to its not just about deaths and started mentioning long covid. Absolute no defense on their modelling or why its estimated deaths is so much higher than we are seeing now. Embarrassing stuff.

_Kaiser_

Hurrache wrote: »

And what exactly is wrong with mentioning that?

It's another nonsense term designed to frighten people.

Some will take longer to recover from illnesses and may even suffer setbacks (up to and including severe complications or even death in some unfortunate cases).

This has always been the case and thankfully such people are outliers. We haven't caused massed hysteria over it before though.

FileNotFound

Murph85 wrote: »

Agree with everything you say lads, but varadkar also has no backbone, remember it was him that put nphet on the pedestal and allowed them ride roughshod...

In fairness - the 3 stooges did a great job at the start - like him or hate him Leo was worlds above MM when it came to Covid clarity.

He has also been one of the only people to have a go at NPHET - and remind us they consider 1 death too many. And they do not care if it bankrupts the nation (They shouldn't - there job is unadulterated public health advice on Covid only).

Its up to MM and Donnelly to interpret and pick a course of action - something MM admits he cannot do.

_Kaiser_

Henry... wrote: »

Just checking in

Is the Pandemic over yet ?

Pretty much now that the actually vulnerable are almost all vaccinated and we're down to vaccinating perfectly healthy younger people - I myself had my 2nd jab yesterday.

What's not over is the stranglehold that the proven incompetents and bureaucrats in NPHET and the HSE have over national policy.

Hurrache

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

It's another nonsense term designed to frighten people.

You need to stop with your whitewashing bull****, it's pretty pathetic particularly if it's only yourself you're trying to convince.