Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII Read OP For Mod Warnings

Blut2 · 21-12-2021 4:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356426#Comment_118356426

Patients in hospital in London have gone from approx 600 in September in the most recent peak to approx 900 as of this week. Which might sound scary, but needs to be considered in the context of the 8000 covid patients they had in hospital in February. Its still barely over 10% of that peak.

I linked to the figures for Gauteng, which is at least two weeks ahead of London. Heres a JPG to be more specific:

https://i.imgur.com/8Tr7BLQ.jpg

Cases have already peaked and declined significantly within the past week. Hospitalizations are 64% lower compared with Delta. Plenty of South African experts are talking about how few hospitalizations Omnicron has resulted in, and how its much closer to a normal 'flu' than covid. This in a province with a vaccination rate of only 31%, and where 18% of the population is heavily immunocrompromised because they have AIDS, for context.

So its boggling my mind as to why none of this is being reported on in the Irish media? Instead all we're hearing about is the need to lockdown. But the data doesn't support this at all.

At least in the UK there are reports that half of the cabinet is demanding more time be given before restrictions are brought in, are asking questions of the SAGE models etc. Apparently we have literally nobody in government in Ireland doing the same.

astrofool · 21-12-2021 4:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356659#Comment_118356659

The logic is a set of measures to reduce the average number social contacts people have. The €9 meal stopped some people (not all people) from going out, the 12PM then 8PM closing does the same, nothing magic happens at €9 or 8:01PM other than on average contacts get lessened, that's it.

The government then has to figure out which set of measures to implement to minimise disruption as much as possible, they do not always get it right and sometimes get it very far from right, but that's the logic.

Hego Damask · 21-12-2021 4:11pm

I see the spread is "eye wateringly" bad in the UK !

haha the fearmongering media is running out of grand descriptions for this.

Anything to distract us from the fact that omicron itself seems mild ...

B2021M · 21-12-2021 4:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356621#Comment_118356621

Exactly. And that antagonises people too.

Scotland will review their new restrictions at end of first week in January but ours in until at least 30 January

MisterAnarchy · 21-12-2021 4:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356567#Comment_118356567

How long will these restrictions remain in place?

They come into force on Monday morning and are due to continue until January 30th, but there will be a review on January 11th.

21-12-2021 4:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356832#Comment_118356832

January 11...well, by the time that the hospitalisation effects of Christmas mingling take hold exactly 2-weeks later after Xmas, it will be at the height of hospitalisations in January.

NPHET will never agree to reducing restrictions at that point, so the January 11 "review" will only be a review to find more reasons to continue until their definite and final target of January 30.

Beautifully timed by NPHET.

bokale · 21-12-2021 4:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356856#Comment_118356856

Why do you think NPHET are doing this? What is in it for them?

21-12-2021 4:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356925#Comment_118356925

If you focus on NPHET alone, you lose the bigger picture.

This country as a whole is obsessed with technical groups, reviews, bureaucracy, and all the rest; the kind of system where rules are made for the sake of making rules. These bodies come together and assume a greater function than they deserve. Anyone who has observed what happens in other countries will know exactly what I'm talking about.

NPHET is the latest manifestation of this almost uniquely Irish mentality to bend the knee to these kinds of bloated bodies.

With power in their hands, they have to be made to be seen to do something - and they overreact.

It's not limited to NPHET, as I say. You could throw construction bodies in this country into the same category.

shesty · 21-12-2021 4:53pm

God knows, but I am beginning to wonder.

bokale · 21-12-2021 4:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356973#Comment_118356973

Well thanks for replying anyway!

shockframe · 21-12-2021 4:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118355862#Comment_118355862

I'd bring Vincent Browne back to front a Covid debate.

Its badly needed.

TomTomTim · 21-12-2021 5:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356993#Comment_118356993

No debate allowed in new Ireland, it's way too dangerous. People might get notions what they are free to hold opinions that goes against supposed consensus, and that can't be allowed.

JRant · 21-12-2021 5:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356925#Comment_118356925

NPHET is primarily made up of HSE personnel. It's perfectly fine for them to want to protect the health systems from any threat, real or imagined. These restrictions not only help with covid numbers but other seasonal winter illnesses. This can be used to gloss over the incredible ineptitude with which they have managed the health system with for a long period of time. There's nothing sinister going on. It's just good old fashioned ass covering.

robbiezero · 21-12-2021 6:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356925#Comment_118356925

The is absolutely no incentive whatsoever for them to relax restrictions or to not recommend restrictions however unwarranted or unnecessary they may be.

Figures drop - They say restrictions worked.

Figures rise - They say people didn't obey restrictions or the Government didn't go far enough with the restrictions.

Ridiculous that 2 years in, our response to the pandemic is still entirely dictated by a group with such a narrow outlook. They have cost the country billions with their idiotic "restrictions to avoid future restrictions" strategy and the strategy of very slowly exiting restrictions to ensure we don't have return to restrictions.

But of course none of the Government or NPHET ever get asked about these utterly failed strategies by the media.

MisterAnarchy · 21-12-2021 6:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356993#Comment_118356993

Vincent is a big loss, he wouldnt have left politicians away with whats happened over the last 21 months.

bokale · 21-12-2021 6:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357120#Comment_118357120

I would agree with you in that they are trying to protect the health service.

I think most would agree they are trying to protect the health service though?

bokale · 21-12-2021 6:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357330#Comment_118357330

Yes I see what you mean that they can kind of claim to be right regardless of the outcome.

Yes they do have a narrow outlook, but I guess the anger then needs to be directed at the government as nphet are probably correct in their stance you know? The government have done well to create/allow this, a lot of anger directed at this advisory group across social media platforms. Dilutes it a bit for the government.

Often a difficult question can be answered with well nphet said, but then at the same time I wouldn't want Michael Martin making these decisions either, do we have much sight of the other groups who feed in to the decisions, or is it purely nphet meeting cabinet and then decision made.

Stheno · 21-12-2021 6:24pm

MM says they are under constant review. Leo says no review before end of Jan

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40770780.html

bokale · 21-12-2021 6:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357432#Comment_118357432

But also that there could be a review

"People at least know where they stand between now and the end of January, but there is always a caveat that of course, things change dramatically for the better or the worse so we can review things." - Leo

AlekSmart · 21-12-2021 6:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118354407#Comment_118354407

Whilst it does carry a risk of being warned,I agree 100% with your opinion. Totally incomprehensible as to why NO media organs are even asking the most timid of questions. Conspiracy ?....nothing theoretical about it this time..Absolutely damn certain. !

AlekSmart · 21-12-2021 7:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356208#Comment_118356208

How anyone is going to change that, I have no idea, but right now it is what it is and it does not make a great case for any country not to avail of the boosters and donating them to others until they sort out their own population hesitancy

Why in God's name would anybody in Ireland have any wish,or need to change African attitudes to anything ?

It smacks of some form of Imperialist superiority syndrome,in which we see ourselves as having to direct the lives of the dusky foreigners,and recieve some thanks for it also !

Many millions of Africans with tribal traditions stretching back millenia,have as good a reason to decline Mr Bourla's chemical potions as any of us savvy caucasian hipsters.

The fact that we pooh-pooh the old faith based methods does'nt make our views any more relevant than theirs.

Is it the case that you suddenly want Africa to ride to your Covid rescue,if so,I wish you luck !!

is_that_so · 21-12-2021 7:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357549#Comment_118357549

TBF the team they are facing are formidable and once or twice when they have had a go, they've been kicked hard. The media's problem is that they just don't have the expertise to challenge them in depth. Leo has done it but only in very limited way.

AlekSmart · 21-12-2021 7:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356331#Comment_118356331

Why ? WHY ? WHY ??.....so many questions now being asked by the "Man on the 19 bus" at this stage,but most incredibly not a single professional journalist appears able to ask the same questions in the Public Arena.

What has gone on between the Media and the Governments of the West ?...as it is now Blindingly obvious that significant information is being suppressed,manipulated or refuted without consideration to the benefit of nobody save for a small number of well placed administrative types .

It STINKS.

AlekSmart · 21-12-2021 7:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356925#Comment_118356925

The somewhat inbred relationship between NPHET and Government dictates the answer to your question.

Remember NPHET's members are already fully paid up members of the Parent Company,Ireland Teo which makes them fully embedded with the Official line.

Virtually all of it's members,including the Depeartmental officials,have long and in depth experience of operating at or near the HSE coalface,so it's very possible that these people simply do NOT see the issues which confound ordinary people in Ireland.

This makes them highly impervious to criticism a,d worse still,inherently defensive of THEIR previous roles in the HSE shyttshow.

NPHET's current status,makes it highly unlikely it's members will ever respond to the Lower Orders questioning their decisions !!....EVER.

bokale · 21-12-2021 7:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357750#Comment_118357750

Are you saying - essentially they are protecting the health service?

AlekSmart · 21-12-2021 7:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357773#Comment_118357773

They are,as they see it,protecting a "Service" they have administered,in some cases for decades.

Subconsciously these types tend to view these elements as reflecting their stake in the good governance of Ireland,whilst we,the end users are often berated for being unthankful and simply not understanding the complexities.

So yea,call it protecting,if you will....I prefer to view it as Unconscious Ass Covering.

the kelt · 21-12-2021 8:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118356706#Comment_118356706

Did you ever tell us the follow up to that great story you had about your neighbour getting omicron, ye know the bit where they were specifically told it was omicron!