TD Ciaran Cannon hit by SUV, suffers serious injury

TheChizler

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I think the hi-vis question is very fair. Yesterday evening would have being dark from 7pm on with the cloud cover. I had a similar experience mid summer a few years ago. I was driving through a junction a bike came from my left with no light on or visibility vest. Except that I had stopped the yield sign I would have hit him. Standard saloons give you less visibility than an SUV.

Are we living in the same hemisphere?

Kander

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I think the hi-vis question is very fair. Yesterday evening would have being dark from 7pm on with the cloud cover. I had a similar experience mid summer a few years ago. I was driving through a junction a bike came from my left with no light on or visibility vest. Except that I had stopped the yield sign I would have hit him. Standard saloons give you less visibility than an SUV.

Very few bikes have lights nowadays. From now on sunset will reduce by 10 minutes a week. It's a fair questions to ask had someone out cycling a high vis top on. It would be fair to ask if they had a light on there bike as well.

Watching car drivers most are putting light on from 7-8 pm on over the last week.

Yes the hi-vis question is very fair to ask however it's important to realize how little it matters in Ireland with the shocking bad standard of drivers & infrastructure we have.

No amount of lights or hi-vis is enough to protect against the dangerous drivers on Irish roads.

You remembered an incident from a couple of years back and likely more as happened since then. Even with as many lights the bike can hold, what cyclists face is akin to idiots per minute.

km991148

The high viz argument can f*** right off tbh.. its nonsense - something people assume would make a huge difference but when you think about it for 5 minutes it just doesnt really stack up.

Otherwise - why don't we plaster every barrier, lamppost, pedestrian, car, bridge, van etc in the stuff?


Be safe, be seen, sure - but away you go with hi viz on everything nonsense, and especially not as a victim blaming comment to someone who has just been knocked down by someone who failed to control their vehicle.



**EDIT - Apologies - I should have been clearer - I meant this in the context of the twitter replies to the TD.**

Weepsie

The high Viz argument can indeed f*CK right off. Go to the dedicated thread for that or don't post at all.

Chips Lovell

Generally speaking, size of SUV is in inverse proportion to the owner's ability to drive it.

magicbastarder

km991148 wrote: »

yeah tbh - I don't notice one particular vehicle operator over another causing fewer or more incidents.

You either have road users who pay attention to the environment or you have ones that dont.

again, the point i'm trying to make is that it's not about the driver, it *is* specifically about the vehicle in this instance. in than the effect i'm discussing is an issue even when the car is parked and empty.

km991148

magicbastarder wrote: »

again, the point i'm trying to make is that it's not about the driver, it *is* specifically about the vehicle in this instance. in than the effect i'm discussing is an issue even when the car is parked and empty.

yeah sorry - piled in at the end of the thread, missed some context.

magicbastarder

funny enough, the last time i collided with another cyclist was when she popped out from the other side of a range rover (she was crossing the road behind it)

Chips Lovell

Chips Lovell wrote: »

Generally speaking, size of SUV is in inverse proportion to the owner's ability to drive it.

I'm always fascinated by peoples' pre-conceived, ill-thought out prejudices towards others in society. especially when they are quick to distance themselves from those within their own subgroups that might otherwise tarnish their reputation.

People who would normally be quite fair and level-headed can become super judgmental when it comes to other sectors of society for pretty much no reason other than that's what the general consensus is. The above sentence is a prime example.

As a subset of road users, cyclists face all sorts of 'tar them all with the same brush' accusations about road safety, following the RotR, obeying lights, wearing helmets and other clothing, paying 'road' tax and blah blah blah. The list is endless.

And we get (justifiably) annoyed when someone claims that the actions of a few reprobates are representative of the entire subset of cyclists. Because it's bollocks trying to pin the faults of a minority on everyone else.

But cyclists are guilty of THE EXACT SAME THING! We also do it all the time. Like blaming all BMW drivers for not using indicators, or claiming SUV drivers are thickos, like you've done. I've even caught myself doing it before, so there's no real shame involved. In the past few years, at various stages, I have been a civil servant, student, landlord, cyclist, Audi driver and SUV driver. The number of times I've interrupted someone to say "well, you know that I'm also one of those people you're lambasting" and the response, 100% of the time is always, always, always "oh, well I don't mean ALL Audi drivers", when that's exactly what they said 2 mins ago.

Like I said, fascinating.

Chips Lovell

Well I did say "generally speaking", so there are exceptions to the rule. Just like there's some decent Audi drivers.

Chips Lovell

Chips Lovell wrote: »

Well I did say "generally speaking", so there are exceptions to the rule. Just like there's some decent Audi drivers.

That's just it, though. You're making a baseless, sweeping generalisation that most SUV drivers don't know ho to drive. I mean, you're still saying something that is unprovable, but is an extremely common notion across all of society.

This is clearly not the case. It's the sh1tebags who are the exception, not the decent ones. Same with Audi drivers, cyclists, teachers, taxi drivers, gardaí etc. etc. A few bad apples giving everyone a bad name. I just find the irony extremely interesting when someone who belongs to one of those groups is guilty of the same kind of prejudice.

Weepsie

[Deleted User] wrote: »

That's just it, though. You're making a baseless, sweeping generalisation that most SUV drivers don't know ho to drive. I mean, you're still saying something that is unprovable, but is an extremely common notion across all of society.

This is clearly not the case. It's the sh1tebags who are the exception, not the decent ones. Same with Audi drivers, cyclists, teachers, taxi drivers, gardaí etc. etc. A few bad apples giving everyone a bad name. I just find the irony extremely interesting when someone who belongs to one of those groups is guilty of the same kind of prejudice.

Well I think most drivers are **** drivers. It's not that people can't drive it just the standard of driving in this country is now so bloody awful it's mind boggling.

Yes we'll hear about lack of enforcement, but it comes down to personal choice a lot of it. The little amber gamble, the squeeze pass, the failure to indicate, the using hatched markings, the failure to use lights, the I didn't see you mate..

...there's just too much of it, and there's too many on penalty points to suggest anything other than a large number and not a minority of drivers are bad / careless / reckless etc


I say this as someone who can just about start a car and is forever in the learning mode and am a dreadful driver on those super rare times I have driven, bar once

Chips Lovell

Well, as an Audi owner, I'd have no hesitation in saying that 90 percent of Audi drivers are p***ks.

Paddigol

Deleted User wrote: »

That's just it, though. You're making a baseless, sweeping generalisation that most SUV drivers don't know ho to drive. I mean, you're still saying something that is unprovable, but is an extremely common notion across all of society.

This is clearly not the case. It's the sh1tebags who are the exception, not the decent ones. Same with Audi drivers, cyclists, teachers, taxi drivers, gardaí etc. etc. A few bad apples giving everyone a bad name. I just find the irony extremely interesting when someone who belongs to one of those groups is guilty of the same kind of prejudice.

Put it this way - if you come into the cycling forum and generalise about a certain segment of cyclists for the LOLZ and bantz, its likely that you'll get a warning. Ditto if you go into the motoring forum and do the same thing about drivers. But I'd say there are plenty of baseless posts about cyclists lost in the motoring forum that don't get pulled up/ spotted, and you can probably get away with the same here commenting on drivers.

None of it is conducive to a constructive discussion.

Paddigol

Chips Lovell wrote: »

Well, as an Audi owner, I'd have no hesitation in saying that 90 percent of Audi drivers are p***ks.

:pac: Have I been trumped in my outrage by an Audi SUV cyclist

Podge_irl

magicbastarder wrote: »

it's not the bonnet i'm worried about.

It is yet another thing to be worried about though. To be fair, I'm unsure how it impacts cyclists, but the size and formation of the bonnet makes SUVs more dangerous when hitting pedestrians at least than a standard saloon.

LillySV

Chips Lovell wrote: »

Well, as an Audi owner, I'd have no hesitation in saying that 90 percent of Audi drivers are p***ks.

Since we are generalizing …I’ve no hesitation in saying over 90% of cyclists are self entitled inconsiderate pricks

Eamonnator

LillySV wrote: »

Since we are generalizing …I’ve no hesitation in saying over 90% of cyclists are self entitled inconsiderate pricks

I've told you a million times not to exaggerate.

AndrewJRenko

LillySV wrote: »

Since we are generalizing …I’ve no hesitation in saying over 90% of cyclists are self entitled inconsiderate pricks

I generally agree, though the evidence indicates that they're not the self entitled inconsiderate pricks who kill 2 or 3 people each week.

Beasty

I own an Audi, a Ford, an Opel, a Renault, a couple of tractors and 5 Cervelos. I am as entitled to be a prick as anyone....

greenspurs

LillySV wrote: »

Since we are generalizing …I’ve no hesitation in saying over 90% of cyclists are self entitled inconsiderate pricks

?

Is that just when the person is on the bike ?

Or if the pr1ck that cycles, drives an audi when he isnt cycling, which mode of transport pr1ck is he/she then ??

Imagine being eternally catagorised as a 'cyclist' first, in stead of a PERSON that cycles??
Even when im driving , am i labelled a cyclist ?

Motorist privilege ?

Bass Reeves

What time if the evening did the accident happen

Calahonda52

With all the mention of p***ks, lets have some polyandry
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-57548646

FishOnABike

magicbastarder wrote: »

yeah, the closest i ever came to knocking a cyclist down was when i was pulling up at a roundabout and whatever the combination of my speed and the cyclist's speed, he was hidden behind my A pillar till the very last second. i managed to scare the daylights out of the poor guy.

It's a well known and understood phenomenon, constant bearing decreasing range. Ipley Cross in the New Forrest in the UK is one example where road layout has been a significant factor in a number of fatal collisions due to this.

https://singletrackworld.com/2018/01/collision-course-why-this-type-of-road-junction-will-keep-killing-cyclists/

magicbastarder

tom scott did a video on that junction, and relied on the article mentioned as a source:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYeeTvitvFU

Macy0161

I used to have more of an issue when I was driving a seat ibiza. However, that was very poor for visibility/ had big blind spots.

magicbastarder

i learned to drive in an early 90s metro, and it had insanely good visibility.
that said, the pillars looked about as substantial as washing line.

FishOnABike

Even outside of A pillar blindspots our own human visual limitations can come into play
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saccadic_masking
and it can take conscious effort to overcome them
https://www.londoncyclist.co.uk/raf-pilot-teach-cyclists/

Melanchthon

Macy0161 wrote: »

I used to have more of an issue when I was driving a seat ibiza. However, that was very poor for visibility/ had big blind spots.

Yeah I haven't driven many Irish SUV's/cross hatches but I don't remember visibility being any worse for non child sized objects. End up hiring modern small cars regularly though and some have so much worse visibility than the pre 2010 ish cars I have driven, some of them the rear window is like a port hole and the pillars are massive whereas a large 2000's car is actually much easier to see out off.

Crystalsun

Thank God , he's Ok. Could have been a lot worse. Looks like 2020 was a bad year for cyclists in UK. God rest them all and comfort their families. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/24/cyclists-killed-on-british-roads-rose-by-40-in-2020-official-figures-show