US and Nato withdrawal from Afghanistan...- threadbanned users in OP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808795#Comment_117808795

I don't believe Biden is an "emotional" person.

I think he capitalizes on that reputation for political purposes. It's largely an act.

The Trump/Biden bickering seems quite hollow at this time, TBH. (More than usual.)

People blown to bits and the first thought in some peoples' minds is to expend energy defending their political favourites on either side, as though the likes of Biden or Trump are the victims here. I don't get it. What good is such point scoring to anyone, anywhere? Feck sake.

tl;dr Man Shakes Fist At Internet

Cody montana

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808831#Comment_117808831

Stay classy.

Itssoeasy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808831#Comment_117808831

That’s your right to believe he isn’t but many GOP people in congress who’ve known him for years believe different and have said so on camera including Lindsey graham. Again you say it’s an act as if joe Biden and he alone as a politician engage in this stuff.

cj maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117805748#Comment_117805748

Good point , in the us against them climate they control us. Like the mafia , ra or loyalists they're king of their castle

deise08

Has anybody been following the story of #OperationArk and #OperationHercules?

Both are animal rescues trying to get to UK nd US with their staff.

300 metres inside the perimeter yesterday after when the bombs went off.

Had to turn back.

Delay after delay.

Pen farthing is a former marine. His staff are paramount, the animals were being taken iin the hold of a privately funded plane with extra seating capacity for other people.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808831#Comment_117808831

You know absolutely nothing about the man evidently yet you still seem to take your queues from twitter.

I'd suggest you actually go off and do your own research on the entirety of his career than regurgitation of baseless takes from the twittersphere.

Genuinely it makes you look completely ill-informed. Unless you enjoy that ? Of course...

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808410#Comment_117808410

To justify our place at the UN table who are very quiet at the moment...

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808386#Comment_117808386

Sure, it generated a bit of media coverage here for the government and Coveney. An expensive bit of PR & spin.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809695#Comment_117809695

I have to agree. Sending the Rangers in late probably added confusion to the already chaotic system at the airport. Does look like a PR stunt.

I am pretty convinced the Taliban themselves organised the explosion in order to try and stall the brain drain.

irishproduce

I'm seeing in the news remarks along the lines of "also Afghan citizens with a residency permission for Ireland" in among those the gov is attempting to rescue.

Are these genuine men (possibly women but unlikely) that the state owes something to such as diplomats or professionals who spent time in Ireland and qualified for residency if they so wished to take it up, or are they immigrants who claimed asylum some time in the past and who went home to Afghanistan for holiday or whatever but are after getting caught up in the mess.

I'm genuinely torn on it because it's not clear on what grounds they're entitled to claim Irish protection. What does Ireland owe them. Have they done a service to Ireland that merits recognition and rewarding or is Ireland on the hook now because of silly government soft touch policy

I know some will say it doesn't matter. They are either entitled to claim Irish protection or they're not. However I do draw a distinction when it involves risking Irish lives trying to make it happen. The light touch feel good stuff stops for me when there's serious risk to the lives of people who will be put in harm's way because of a feel good policy the government has/ had up to now.

I'm specifically referring to the people referenced as being Afghans who are entitled to claim Irish residency. You're not dealing with Mary the volunteer teacher or Gerard the engineer building stuff there. These people assumedly are Afghans who have some attachment to Ireland. What is the basis for that attachment?

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809695#Comment_117809695

Yes it confirmed that our crowds do not know what they at...

PokeHerKing

Does anyone have a link or indeed a brief synopsis of their own as to the state of play on Afghanistan when Biden took over?

Would like a base point to start my judgement of this whole $hitshow. Did he inherited a point of no return or did he drop the ball here and continue down a path that led to this?

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809821#Comment_117809821

I think they likely knew this was going to happen, there was always going to be problems when "the western world" left and will be for years regardless of what anyone does.

The Taliban will not treat people well who they feel betrayed their Country. The rest of the world leaders were very naive 20 years when they decided we make Angfanistan something akin to a western democracy...

Is it true the US gave the Taliban a list of people who would be getting evacuated?

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808300#Comment_117808300

And how exactly were the Rangers going to facilitate that?

Yes some of them may be on placements with other nations troops in Afghanistan or being seconded to UN or even EU related missions, but would they know Kabul intimately and more importantly would they have contacts on the ground that they can use like the US, British, etc ?

Or were they going to call a cab and ask directions to the local Irish bar and get the lowdown from one of the locals there?

It was a PR exercise. Oh look we are doing somehting we are sending in officials and a few of our top troops.

They had to cadge a lift in with the French and out with them or someone else.

And the taxpayers never mind the government will ever want to spend anything on long haul heavy lift aircraft. Hell the EU have to subsidise our Casas.

There was interesting segment on Newsnight last night about the British trying to get out high profile female Afghan politican.

It involved multiple MPs, Foreign office, MOD, troops on the ground, calling in favours and eventually a politican Afghan veteran using contacts on the ground to try and get this lady and husband into airport and out.

Do the Irish have any of those channels and would the Foreign affairs officials and rangers be able to use contacts on the ground that they had built up over years of close contact?

All the showpiece did was put more Irish nationals in harms way.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117807641#Comment_117807641

We have long gone past that.

The ISIS flavoured isalmists now just want to bring armageddon to the West.

And don't forget islamists no longer live over there somewhere, they are already here and if some have the chance they will be in every city and town.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117807197#Comment_117807197

Maybe the US has gone away from Harry Truman's idea and is more like the HSE where the buck never stops anywhere.🙄

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809871#Comment_117809871

Yes

SCOOP: U.S. officials gave the Taliban a list of names of U.S. citizens, green card holders & Afghan allies to grant entry into the outer perimeter of the city’s airport, prompting outrage behind the scenes from lawmakers and military officials. https://t.co/WHHzStyynk

jmayo

BTW we have probably seen nothing yet in this very messy withdrawal.

After the British troops withdraw and then the US troops start withdrawing and the perimeter starts folding in on itself you can expect carnage to ensue.

In the end the US troops will probably end up having to fire on the civilians left within the airport perimeter so that they can get out themselves.

And expect the taliban to arrive in trying to grab their targets.

Now there mightn't be many news teams around to film this, but it won't be pretty.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809899#Comment_117809899

Remarkable.

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809865#Comment_117809865

I more so mean a breakdown of boots on the ground pre/post etc. Areas that were no longer under US/Afghan control pre/post his presidency. Proper facts, not any personal/political ideologies.

I want to be able to look at and say he had no choice besides another mini invasion or he just allowed this to unfold on his watch and deserves the criticism.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809909#Comment_117809909

Next week could be an appalling week. I can't see how it remains anyway stable, hopefully I'm wrong.

BobHopeless

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809935#Comment_117809935

Next week will be bad but nothing compared to the coming months and years. The American presence in the region has kept a lid on the place for years now. The pull out is going to be a catastrophe mistake and that will become evident in the coming weeks when ISIS start beheading unable to flee westerners and those that helped the west and post it on the internet. Then the battle will move to Pakistan and other countries and make Syria look like a garden party.

Biden might be old and slow but stupid he ain't and his demeanor last night told the story of what's about to unfold. He knows what's coming.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809958#Comment_117809958

America has gone home in general, they don't need the world anymore. They have geographic isolation, large population, resources and economic and military might. Has being going on since Obama, then Trump now Biden. Some people may have hated it but America provided stability for the world system to function as it has done for decades. We are never going back to that now, it'll be a much more fragmented world going forward.

Europe at the crossroads of Africa and Middle East is in a precarious position. It will need real leadership to sustain anything close to normal, I won't hold my breath.

Potatoeman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809191#Comment_117809191

Other priorities, seriously he should have planned this months ago. There is also the quarantine question when they land. Muslims consider dogs dirty so it’s not good local PR that they are being saved over people.

Danzy

The problem with Afghanistan under the Taliban is that an awful lot of people in neighbouring countries are just as eager for a similar Govt.

Afghanistan, like Syria, has a population doubling every 20 years or so.

It's farm land is not increasing and no country can provide jobs and services at that rate.

The potential for it to be a tumour in the region is very big.

loughside

Dear Joe,

This is just a quick note of thanks.

We were on the verge of running out of trucks, guns, helicopters, planes and so forth. You kindly gifted us all of your best stuff. My M4 works great! Much better than my trusty AKM.

Now all my family and brothers have one. Still, it would have been nice if you had left some maintenance men behind just to keep it all nice and shiny. Please remember for next time. Sorry about all the US and British dead and with life changing injuries. It is what you call "collateral damage." In any case, I know how well you look after your veterans, so they will be OK Joe.

Oh yes, I must not forget. My brothers also thank you for the $144 billion that you have lavished on our infrastructure. For example, without the generator you generously supplied for the dam we could not charge the peasants for their electricity. As for the schools you built for the girls they also make excellent storage depots for all that ammunition that you kindly donated to Al Qaeda and the cause. They asked me to give you a 'high five' (whatever that is).

The Chinese are tickled pink about this too. The roads you built for us just perfectly match up with the one they want to build to exploit our huge silver iodide resources. Praise be to Allah (oh, and you too Joe): It's now all falling into place. Sorry that your country now looks like the clown of the world, but that was not our fault.

You have gone from Super Power to Super Joke since this January. You just have to look to yourself for that my friend. Also sorry that the English are furious and not speaking to you at the moment. Still, you are Irish, and, as you are always telling me "whatever annoys the English has to be good." Yes, yes, I quite agree. So as I say, you have done us a massive favour, so it is only right that we do right by you in return.

You can use the runway for the rest of the month: No charge.

Yours sincerely, Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar,

Chairman of the Taliban-Biden Friendship Society.

Our Motto: "The US Taxpayer: The goof that just keeps on giving."

wes

This is an interesting article from a few years back:

https://www.voanews.com/south-central-asia/afghan-government-under-fire-rescuing-islamic-state-militants

Why was the pervious Afghan government helping ISIS-K? Their have been persistent claims by Pakistan that NDS (former Afghan intelligence) and its Indian ally RAW (Indian intelligence agency) have been supporting ISIS-K. The above would suggest that their is merit to the claim vis a vi the NDS.

YFlyer

Typical military intelligence and oxymoron.

YFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117764405#Comment_117764405

Who was that?

Previous guy sold arms to Saudi Arabia.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809821#Comment_117809821

Very simply they were far past the point of no return in January under trumps control .

https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-donald-trump-afghanistan-taliban-united-states-16cc1dd5b2f74d463311d212ad0d215a

Per the pentagon in January of this year they had a fraction of the fighting force and capabilities. Pure hand over stage.

There are those that call Biden a war hawk and are complaining now about the evacuation. And the very same people would call him a warhawk if he increased the troop count when he took over the end of January.

It's absolutely no win. And anyone saying otherwise is a liar with a clear agenda. The wheels of this entire episode were already set in motion and there was simple no hand brake big enough.

Imagine Biden coming in and saying he's going to increase the troop count to 10,000 . When he came in to maintain security. Absolute laughable. You'd have Eskimo on here screaming from the roof tops and the other who's who.

This entire thing is a sorry sorry episode and it began twenty years ago and keeled over in 2018 when a bunch of amateurs in trump and his crack team of idiots thought they could score home browny points accelerating a pull out.