The Cranberries: the appreciation (and reconciliation) thread

Flavio Josefo

I'm new to this place, and I read a harmful thread from 2017 about the band. I was really surprised by the amount of hate that some people gave off, although I do not want this thread to be a criticism of 4 year old comments.

My intention is for The Cranberries to be appreciated for what they were, the second most important irish rock band. Bigger than Thin Lizzy and with two albums that are already classics in music.

I'm not Irish, I'm not British, and I understand that there are a lot of people in Ireland who are ashamed of The Cranberries' way of making music. I too can be ashamed of some bands in my country.

However, I believe that it is never too late to put aside psychological barriers, to enter the discography of one of the greatest bands in History. A discography that has 4 albums in the Billboard Top 200, a band that 32 years after its founding and 22 years after its last commercially successful album, continues to gain fans around the world.

This is a thread of gratitude to Dolores, Mike, Fergal, and Noel. Because they are the band of my life, and Dolores will always be present in my life. In my heart.

Forever

Henry...

She was definitely hated on for some reason

Sure Sinead O'Connor got the same

Flavio Josefo

Henry... wrote: »

She was definitely hated on for some reason

Sure Sinead O'Connor got the same

What is that reason?

Being the most influential Irish person of the last decade of the 20th century?

Henry...

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

What is that reason?

Being the most influential Irish person of the last decade of the 20th century?

Successful woman with an attitude

Not sure really

I'd be interested to see a breakdown of male.female.attitude.towards her

Definitely underappreciated for their level of success

Henry...

I was in USA the time Sinead O'Connor got.hated on

You'd hear a lot of lads there openly hating on her

Doubt there was the same from the female sector

o1s1n

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

What is that reason?

Being the most influential Irish person of the last decade of the 20th century?

Great band and great voice but that's a bit of a stretch...

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

What is that reason?

Being the most influential Irish person of the last decade of the 20th century?

I think drama seemed to have followed her around. The babysitter saga and numerous court cases, the Aerlingus incident, numerous cancellations of gigs at the last minute.......she had a bit of a reputation for cancelling.

It was terrible, she was gifted and some of the albums are superb.

Henry...

Some of their music is very powerful emotionally and musically

Flavio Josefo

Henry... wrote: »

Successful woman with an attitude

Not sure really

I'd be interested to see a breakdown of male.female.attitude.towards her

Definitely underappreciated for their level of success

I think the hate does not come from their female condition, The Cranberries were one of the rock bands with a more equal balance in terms of the sex of their fans. I would say that 65% were men and 35% women, which was strange because 90% are usually women or men.

Rather I think it is due to envy on the part of Irish people, who do not understand how a group of farmers can become one of the 50 greatest Rock bands ever.

Instead, the hatred of the English was due to the fact that The Cranberries completely overshadowed all British bands in the USA; Suede, Blur, Oasis, Elastica... etc

The Cranberries sold 15 million in that country, and another 20 in Spain and Latin America.

Flavio Josefo

o1s1n wrote: »

Great band and great voice but that's a bit of a stretch...

Can you name me a more well-known, influential, talented and successful person from Ireland in the 90's?

Flavio Josefo

Henry... wrote: »

I was in USA the time Sinead O'Connor got.hated on

You'd hear a lot of lads there openly hating on her

Doubt there was the same from the female sector

O'Connor seems like a pretty obnoxious person to me, I wouldn't compare her to Dolores. She was an amazing girl from her childhood, with a huge heart, and who suffered during her life in an incredible way.

Henry...

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

O'Connor seems like a pretty obnoxious person to me, I wouldn't compare her to Dolores. She was an amazing girl from her childhood, with a huge heart, and who suffered during her life in an incredible way.

Dunno about that now tbh


Soc had her good points and suffered

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

I think drama seemed to have followed her around. The babysitter saga and numerous court cases, the Aerlingus incident, numerous cancellations of gigs at the last minute.......she had a bit of a reputation for cancelling.

It was terrible, she was gifted and some of the albums are superb.

Bury The Hatchet is the most underrated album of all time:

Desperate Andy, Lod And Clear, Shattered... all these songs are totally unknown and if they were made for Foo Fighters it would be hits

icarus86

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Can you name me a more well-known, influential, talented and successful person from Ireland in the 90's?

Bono, Roy Keane.

Flavio Josefo

Henry... wrote: »

Dunno about that now tbh


Soc had her good points and suffered

Dolores was the little sister of nine siblings, two of whom died at a very young age, and the 11 members of the family lived on a two-room farm with no electricity or water supply.

In fact, they were known to the neighbors practically as beggars, because the father could not work due to a brain injury in 1968. In 1978 the older sister accidentally burned down the house and the neighbors pooled money so that the children would not live as beggars, since there were hardly any social services.

When Dolores was 8 years old she was abused by a neighbor, and this lasted until she was 12 years old.

It would be hard for me to find a rock musician with a childhood as hard as the one Dolores had, All these traumas affected her a lot, even causing her permanent insomnia, that is why many times she appeared on TV and in photos with dark circles

Henry...

icarus86 wrote: »

Bono, Roy Keane.

Was thinking influential would be someone like John Hume for the GFA

Suckit

I never heard anything bad said about the Cranberries or Dolores, especially no hate, but then, I didn't read any of the forum posts etc.

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Can you name me a more well-known, influential, talented and successful person from Ireland in the 90's?

Fairly sure there were a few. U2 would stand out. They made their name in the 80's but in the 90's was probably their peak.
The Corrs. Possibly a few others.

Not trying to knock you or any opinion, but I have to agree that it is a bit of a stretch, although HUGELY influential, not sure about the most.

icarus86

Henry... wrote: »

Was thinking influential would be someone like John Hume for the GFA

Yeah great shout.

Flavio Josefo

icarus86 wrote: »

Bono, Roy Keane.

Definitely not.

The Cranberries were the biggest band in the world between November 1994 and May 1995. And one of the 5 most successful bands of that alternative generation of the 90s.

Dolores is an icon of that decade, and that cannot be changed.

o1s1n

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Can you name me a more well-known, influential, talented and successful person from Ireland in the 90's?

Liam Neeson, Pierce Brosnan, Colin Farrell, Brendan Gleeson, Colm Meeney, Gabriel Byrne, Daniel Day Lewis, Sinead O Connor. Bob Geldof, Michael Fassbender, Bono. Do I need to go on and on?

If you mentioned Delores O Riordan's name to someone who's not from Ireland chances are they wouldn't have a clue who you're talking about. Maybe if you played them 'The Zombie song' they might have heard of it.

Flavio Josefo

Suckit wrote: »

I never heard anything bad said about the Cranberries or Dolores, especially no hate, but then, I didn't read any of the forum posts etc.


Fairly sure there were a few. U2 would stand out. They made their name in the 80's but in the 90's was probably their peak.
The Corrs. Possibly a few others.

Not trying to knock you or any opinion, but I have to agree that it is a bit of a stretch, although HUGELY influential, not sure about the most.

I don't know if in Ireland and the UK Bono still had a greater impact than Dolores, but I can assure you that in the USA and the rest of Europe Dolores was more important in all aspects.

o1s1n

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Desperate Andy, Lod And Clear, Shattered... all these songs are totally unknown and if they were made for Foo Fighters it would be hits

If she was 'The most influential...' then these songs wouldn't be unknown...

icarus86

Enya is another huge name worldwide.

Henry...

o1s1n wrote: »

Liam Neeson, Pierce Brosnan, Colin Farrell, Brendan Gleeson, Colm Meeney, Gabriel Byrne, Daniel Day Lewis, Sinead O Connor. Bob Geldof, Michael Fassbender, Bono. Do I need to go on and on?

If you mentioned Delores O Riordan's name to someone who's not from Ireland chances are they wouldn't have a clue who you're talking about. Maybe if you played them 'The Zombie song' they might have heard of it.

That last paragraph is surely not correct

She's very well known outside ireland

Flavio Josefo

o1s1n wrote: »

Liam Neeson, Pierce Brosnan, Colin Farrell, Brendan Gleeson, Colm Meeney, Gabriel Byrne, Daniel Day Lewis, Sinead O Connor. Bob Geldof, Michael Fassbender, Bono. Do I need to go on and on?

If you mentioned Delores O Riordan's name to someone who's not from Ireland chances are they wouldn't have a clue who you're talking about. Maybe if you played them 'The Zombie song' they might have heard of it.

I am 29 years old, I was born in 1991, and at the age of 8 I already knew who Dolores O'Riordan was, on the other hand, all these that you have mentioned except for Pierce Brosnam, I did not know of her existence until adolescence

Flavio Josefo

icarus86 wrote: »

Enya is another huge name worldwide.

Yes, but just for people that like New Age. She is the second best selling act from Ireland, but their kind of music is not very known around the world. She is not rock n roll.

Flavio Josefo

o1s1n wrote: »

If she was 'The most influential...' then these songs wouldn't be unknown...

These songs are unknown because american people didn't buy BTH

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Can you name me a more well-known, influential, talented and successful person from Ireland in the 90's?

I'd have gone Michael O'Leary myself, very well known globally, influential in that I wish I had his business head and I respect him, talented to the point of being dangerous and as for success.......his bank balance even in these iffy times for airlines I would imagine is fairly healthy.

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

I'd have gone Michael O'Leary myself, very well known globally, influential in that I wish I had his business head and I respect him, talented to the point of being dangerous and as for success.......his bank balance even in these iffy times for airlines I would imagine is fairly healthy.

:rolleyes:

icarus86

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Yes, but just for people that like New Age. She is the second best selling act from Ireland, but their kind of music is not very known around the world. She is not rock n roll.

Do only rock and roll acts fit your criteria?

I think she has a far bigger audience around the world than at home. She is massive. Did the theme from one of the lotr films if I remember correctly.

Piehead

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Can you name me a more well-known, influential, talented and successful person from Ireland in the 90's?

Ronan O’Gara

Flavio Josefo

icarus86 wrote: »

Do only rock and roll acts fit your criteria?

I think she has a far bigger audience around the world than at home. She is massive. Did the theme from one of the lotr films if I remember correctly.

Of course not. I have not denied her importance, I have only pointed out a reality. Enya is not Rock N Roll.

Nor can you deny me that in recent years Enya suffers from a psychological disorder much more serious than the bipolarity that Dolores suffered, and that disorder has prevented Enya from making music good in these last 15 years, and everything indicates that it will prevent her from making music forever.

Piehead wrote: »

Ronan O’Gara

First time I listen to this name

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

:rolleyes:

If that's your reply fair enough, you asked a question and it was answered.

If you want another one, Shane McGowan and The Pogues(feat. Kirsty McColl) for Fairytale of New York, known the world over, very successful and continually played over Christmas.....every Christmas and Shane was a major influence on many writers.

Henry...

FR85 wrote: »

If that's your reply fair enough, you asked a question and it was answered.

If you want another one, Shane McGowan and The Pogues(feat. Kirsty McColl) for Fairytale of New York, known the world over, very successful and continually played over Christmas.....every Christmas and Shane was a major influence on many writers.

Will go down as an Absolute legend

If you seen the doc he crafted that song diligently and patiently and arrived at the greatest Christmas song ever

Then you have rainy night in Soho

Far more important than Dolores O'Riordan imo I would have to say

FR85

Henry... wrote: »

Will go down as an Absolute legend

If you seen the doc he crafted that song diligently and patiently and arrived at the greatest Christmas song ever

Then you have rainy night in Soho

Far more important than Dolores O'Riordan imo I would have to say

I didn't actually see the documentary but I'll have a search for it.

I am in no way trying to take away from DOL's legacy, she was taken far too young and left children behind and the guys had just come off a very successful run and there was more to come.
What herself and The Cranberries did was superb and they were and still are very successful, no one can deny that but did she steal the 90's, no. I think Ray Houghtan did that in Stuttgart!! 😂😂😂

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

If that's your reply fair enough, you asked a question and it was answered.

If you want another one, Shane McGowan and The Pogues(feat. Kirsty McColl) for Fairytale of New York, known the world over, very successful and continually played over Christmas.....every Christmas and Shane was a major influence on many writers.

Dolores O'Riordan is the greatest female lead singer of alternative music, in all its history. This is not said by me, Billboard says it.

If you look for Dolores's biography you will find close to 500 references, which is not the case with many artists. It only happens with artists like her, David Bowie, Bono himself, Kurt Cobain, etc. Artists who have left an indelible mark around the world.

I don't know if in Ireland you still don't know the global significance that Dolores had around the world, even in China thanks to the artist Faye Wong

Flavio Josefo

Henry... wrote: »

Will go down as an Absolute legend

If you seen the doc he crafted that song diligently and patiently and arrived at the greatest Christmas song ever

Then you have rainy night in Soho

Far more important than Dolores O'Riordan imo I would have to say

I don't know what happened in the 80s, since I was born in the 90s, but do you really think MCgowan is more transcendental in music than Dolores?

Until 2 years ago I did not know about the existence of The Pogues, and with this I do not mean to discuss its importance. But in no case are they The Cranberries.

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

Dolores O'Riordan is the greatest lead singer of alternative music, in all its history. This is not said by me, Billboard says it.

If you look for Dolores's biography you will find close to 500 references, which is not the case with many artists. It only happens with artists like her, David Bowie, Bono himself, Kurt Cobain, etc. Artists who have left an indelible mark around the world.

I don't know if in Ireland you still don't know the global significance that Dolores had around the world, even in China thanks to the artist Faye Wong

If you take her vocals out of it then I feel you should give Noel Hogan 50% of the credits, a lot of the material was co-wrote by him and the man is a musical genius. I also think Fergal was a very influential drummer, there were very few drummers in Ireland in my view who could have ticked the box in the way he did, he sat right into it perfectly, he was a powerhouse who drove on their live shows.
I'm in no way taking away from her vocal ability and her presence on stage by saying the above.

tibruit

o1s1n wrote: »

If you mentioned Delores O Riordan's name to someone who's not from Ireland chances are they wouldn't have a clue who you're talking about.

Dolores is universally recognized as one of the great female rock vocalists and she wrote some of the most iconic songs of the 90`s.

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

I didn't actually see the documentary but I'll have a search for it.

I am in no way trying to take away from DOL's legacy, she was taken far too young and left children behind and the guys had just come off a very successful run and there was more to come.
What herself and The Cranberries did was superb and they were and still are very successful, no one can deny that but did she steal the 90's, no. I think Ray Houghtan did that in Stuttgart!! 😂😂😂

The Cranberries were at the same level than Stone Temple Pilots, RHCP, Green Day or The Smashing Pumpkins.

A band fronted by a woman, in fact the only band whose beginnings were the dreampop/shoegaze and jangle. This band were bigger than Alice In Chains, Soundgarden and all the Britpop bands (ay least out the UK).

I think is correct to say The Cranberries is a trascendetal 90s band, In fact one of the biggest 90s band alongside Nirvana, RHCP and Pearl Jam.

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

I don't know what happened in the 80s, since I was born in the 90s, but do you really think MCgowan is more transcendental in music than Dolores?

Yes, I do. From a lyrical point of view, while most of their material are ballads/Celtic rock they can also be read as poetry. I have read that McGowan's first love was poetry.

Until 2 years ago I did not know about the existence of The Pogues, and with this I do not mean to discuss its importance. But in no case are they The Cranberries.

No, they are two totally seperate acts who do what they do extremely well so on that we are agreed.

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

No, they are two totally seperate acts who do what they do extremely well so on that we are agreed.

In another 10 years The Cranberries will continue to be recognized as one of the 50 best bands in history, because in fact they are. Instead The Pogues will only be appreciated by some nostalgic Irish, remembering that Christmas song that is now banned by the arrival of Islam.

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

The Cranberries were at the same level than Stone Temple Pilots, RHCP, Green Day or The Smashing Pumpkins.

A band fronted by a woman, in fact the only band whose beginnings were the dreampop/shoegaze and jangle. This band were bigger than Alice In Chains, Soundgarden and all the Britpop bands (ay least out the UK).

I think is correct to say The Cranberries is a trascendetal 90s band, In fact one of the biggest 90s band alongside Nirvana, RHCP and Pearl Jam.

Certainly in the history books and will always be remembered. I am in no way meaning to take away from her, she was outstanding and is missed by many.

gigantic09

I've rediscovered their music recently and definitely have come to appreciate them more than 1st time around. It was a massive achievement for them breaking America where many before and after failed.
U2 and particularly Bono are also not fully appreciated here but alot of that is to do with the quality of their later albums and people's destain for bono. Joshua tree and Auchtung baby were serious quality albums with little or no filler.

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

Certainly in the history books and will always be remembered. I am in no way meaning to take away from her, she was outstanding and is missed by many.

In my particular case, the discography of The Cranberries has helped me to overcome the duel for my father. The Cranberries have 11 million listeners on Spotify, which is unusual for a band whose last hit album was in 1999.

Only Fleetwood Mac has more listeners than The Cranberries of all bands with female vocalists.

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

If you take her vocals out of it then I feel you should give Noel Hogan 50% of the credits, a lot of the material was co-wrote by him and the man is a musical genius. I also think Fergal was a very influential drummer, there were very few drummers in Ireland in my view who could have ticked the box in the way he did, he sat right into it perfectly, he was a powerhouse who drove on their live shows.
I'm in no way taking away from her vocal ability and her presence on stage by saying the above.

I appreciate these words, I particularly think that The Cranberries alternated bright lyrics with bad ones. I'm a fan but I'm not blind or deaf, I know The Cranberries weren't perfect.
Although for me it is the band of my life

Flavio Josefo

gigantic09 wrote: »

I've rediscovered their music recently and definitely have come to appreciate them more than 1st time around. It was a massive achievement for them breaking America where many before and after failed.
U2 and particularly Bono are also not fully appreciated here but alot of that is to do with the quality of their later albums and people's destain for bono. Joshua tree and Auchtung baby were serious quality albums with little or no filler.

Nice to read that, which is your favourite album?

FR85

Flavio Josefo wrote: »

In another 10 years The Cranberries will continue to be recognized as one of the 50 best bands in history, because in fact they are. Instead The Pogues will only be appreciated by some nostalgic Irish, remembering that Christmas song that is now banned by the arrival of Islam.

Em ok. Rolling Stones, Lynard Skynyrd, Zappa, The Beatles, Elvis, U2.....The Cranberries are up there, not sure where exactly they'd have a footing.
I dont think Islam can really ban a song, whole different debate that I'm not getting into and that is not what your thread is about, let's keep this one about music.

What can I ask is your favourite Cranberries song, for me it would be Wanted off Everyone Else is doing it.....

FR85

Flavio, also check out Monoband, it's a band Noel formed in the mid 2000's after The Cranberries split. Think you'd enjoy it, you'll also get a serious feel for where the music and energy came from!

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

Em ok. Rolling Stones, Lynard Skynyrd, Zappa, The Beatles, Elvis, U2.....The Cranberries are up there, not sure where exactly they'd have a footing.
I dont think Islam can really ban a song, whole different debate that I'm not getting into and that is not what your thread is about, let's keep this one about music.

What can I ask is your favourite Cranberries song, for me it would be Wanted off Everyone Else is doing it.....

My Top5 songs for each 90s albums:

Uncertain:
Pathetic Senses
Iosa
Nothing Left At all
Uncertain
Chrome Paint

EEIDISWCW
1 Linger
2 Not Sorry
3 Sunday
4 Liar (B)
5 Waltzing Back

NNTA
1 Yeats Grave
2 Ridiculous Thougths
3 Empty
4 So Cold In Ireland (B)
5 I Don't Need (B)

TTFD
1 Forever Yellow Skies
2 Joe
3 Hollywood
4 The Rebels
5 Cordell

BTH
1 Shattered
2 Promises
3 Desperate Andy
4 Loud And Clear
5 Delilah

Flavio Josefo

FR85 wrote: »

Flavio, also check out Monoband, it's a band Noel formed in the mid 2000's after The Cranberries split. Think you'd enjoy it, you'll also get a serious feel for where the music and energy came from!

I have listened to this album and the two by Dolores as a soloist, neither has excited me.

The magic is in the moment when the beautiful voice of Dolores fuses with the instruments of Mike, Noel and Fergal.