Mayo GAA Discussion

Audioslaven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887563#Comment_117887563

What a load of manure. The very man... Jack O'Connor lining up the Kerry job and he still with Kildare...sinking ship comes to mind.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887023#Comment_117887023

So, you are telling me if Leitrim changed their culture they'd be competing on all Ireland finals....

Get outta that.

Sport is different to business in some ways and similiar in others but you cannot attach so much importance to culture, ye alone define it in sport.

How many counties compete for the AI every year? Yet there can only be one winner.

Mayo had too many players who did not perform to their best. Missed important chances and failed to perform.

That's not 'cultural'.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887174#Comment_117887174

Plenty people making the best of the publicity they get. Don't see a problem with it tbf. Fairly narrow minded to suggest there is an issue with it.

GAA players the length and breadth of this country who've never won an all ireland using their fame for one thing or another.

Jizique

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887379#Comment_117887379

There wouldn't have been a penalty as the free would have been scored

Fanofconnacht

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887595#Comment_117887595

Jack O Connor a load of manure ??????. He managed Kerry to 3 All Ireland wins 2 against Mayo. We can only dream of having a Mayo manager as successful.

Fanofconnacht

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887623#Comment_117887623

Potentially yes even though their population is about 20% of Mayos. You should consider 3 other Counties whose population is approximately 50% that of Mayo, Cavan 5 AI's Roscommon 2 AI's Offaly 7 AI's (in last 50 years 3 Football and 4 Hurling). What did they do right when they won ?

Avon8

Page after page of complaining of blaming this or that or him is actually a bit of evidence of Mayo arrogance that's crept in recently. Not a single mention that the players just mightnt talented enough to win one.

Blaming Horan. Horan is probably the best manager in Ireland currently. He mightnt be absolutely tip top tactically but he gets amazing buyin and momentum and structure year after year. He gets the group to outperform their talent level consistently.

Blaming 'culture'. A hell of a lot of counties would kill for Mayo's culture at the moment. At a time when players are opting out all sides, Mayo football always has huge buyin and a feeling that everyone fully wants nothing else but to win an AI.

Blaming county boards. The same old tired excuse that every county falls back on. Nearly all counties would kill for Mayo's outside funding. 3 of the last 4 managerial appointments have been top notch. I'm sure there were some idiots in the past but that's a legacy the majority of counties have.

At the start of the year it would've been very fanciful to say Mayo would win an AI. Basically barren at underage for years. An average enough club championship. Basically no notable forwards (albiet Conroy is making a name for himself). Is it fanciful to say Kerry will win next year despite doing little but flatter to decieve since 2014? No they're joint favourites because theyve had 5 consecutive minor titles and have clear class coming out their ears.

We were lulled into a false sense by the hype of Mayo beating Dublin. In reality it was an awful game, probablys Mayo's worst performance v Dublin In a decade (bar maybe 19) and they simply outlasted an imploding Dublin. While it's crap to lose a final, reflect for a while and you'd have been very surprised at that sort of success with a young team at years start. They've outperformed their level. Repeated talk you see here of moving Horan on is absolutely ludicrous

HBC08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117886495#Comment_117886495

You're not alone in your thinking,everybody is in bits now and I thought myself I'd find it hard to go again next year,to believe.

However, no matter how much it hurts as a supporter making long trips etc,it'll hurt a lot more as one of the players who do it 4 nights a week,giving up time with families,nights out,life in general.

I'm depressed, genuinely depressed,it's terrible but I won't be slogging it out in muck in January,these lads will.We need a bit of perspective.

If you won't make it back next year then plenty will. I'll support these lads forever.

Up Mayo wherever you go.

Audioslaven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887661#Comment_117887661

I will put it this way for you. I would rather wait another 70 years than see that lad anywhere near Mayo. Kerry got two titles from a very average Mayo side. When they met a proper team, he was found out. Granted he got them over the line but he has done nothing since and I can't see that changing. Tbh, I hope he gets the Kerry job!!

Avon8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887789#Comment_117887789

Cork were a top class side in 2009, they'd beaten Tyrone in the semi by 5 with 14 men yet J'OC always had the Indian sign over them. They also finished that good Armagh team in 06. He came into a melting pot in 04 after Paudi and walked to an AI. I'm not sure he's the right man modern day but history will be kind

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887741#Comment_117887741

I did come on here , saying Mayo should not look to much into beating a Dublin team that were in serious decline , but i was ran out of it being accused of sour lemons bad loser etc .

Those who say players need to look after more 'pressing issues' than accepting a few euro to help them and their family need to wise up to the fact that football is only a game, and an amateur one at that.

Like the lad above who left Croke Park angry, you need to understand that these players owe you nothing. It's not their fault you were giddy with daydreams, entering 20 raffles, making lists of boards members need tickets and getting totally carried away with the idea we were going to hammer Tyrone. It's your own fault.

The players did their best, it wasn't good enough. What do you want, an apology?

I can’t believe the number of people buying into the Brolly tripe which is based on a personal issue and is pure vindictive on his behalf.

Not having good enough players in certain positions is the issue

I did have a good chuckle at the suggestion that Roscommon might somehow have a superior football “culture”. Not appeared in a final in 40 years. If a superior culture is a Connacht or 2 every 10 years before whimpering out meekly once the going gets tough, they can keep it.

2018na

Tyrone would not of got near beating Dublin is my belief. Watch what Dublin do to them if they meet next year. Mayo actually beat Dublin and unfortunately didn’t show up performance wise in the final. That’s sports and cup competition. Dublin are still miles the best team in Ireland that’s why it’s devastating Mayo didn’t get there Reward this year

lawred2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887072#Comment_117887072

Oh ffs

Fanofconnacht

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887965#Comment_117887965

What I said was Roscommon had a winning culture for a few years in the 40's when they won 2 AI's. They have not had it since. For a population half that of Mayo 2 AI's is probably more impressive than our 3.

Joe Brolly probably cares more about Mayo than most other pundits given his local connections. He has an AI medal in his pocket. This is Mayo so let us shoot the messenger who brings us some home truths about ourselves.

After the 2016 final on the Sunday game all the pundits were asked about their view of the next few years for the Mayo team, all of them said that Mayo would be among the bettter teams in the AI but all except Brolly said no way would they win one.

MayoAreMagic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887639#Comment_117887639

Not sure if it would have been scored to be honest, it was a tough free on the wrong side. However, there is a strong possibility that if he is around for some of those goal chances, it is in the net for at least one of them. Furthermore, no missed penalty is a positive, considering it served to lift tyrone and cause mayo to panic. Doesnt matter either way

scrumqueen

Left Croker Saturday and said the same thing I say every year after another AIF loss "They make it harder and harder every year to support them". Every single conceivable excuse that's been put out there over the past 2 decades has now been put to bed. These are the ones that have always stood out for me.

1) Mayo Supporters/The 'occasion' of the big day/ the build up/croker on the DAY

In what world did we ever think that one could even be tested!? Well COVID nailed all of that, with lockdown last year and the empty stadium last year thanks to it, that's now all off the table. They cant do it with supporters and build up they cant do it without.

2) Stop shipping goals

We all remember the finals of the 90's, we were told "stop shipping goals", looks like we fixed that (until Saturday, back here again).

3) You need to blood young new players

When the minors won their AIF, I thought "OMG this is it, they have that winning mentality! they can carry that through to the senior squad!" even Andy Moran spoke recently about the younger lads not having "baggage" and the older lads getting confidence from that, and I thought after that Dublin win, THIS.IS.IT. no more excuses.

Here we are, no excuses, caught out, found wanting. I don't even know what else to say. I'm just so deflated. Seems like we fix one thing another breaks. Genuinely have no idea where we go from here.

MayoAreMagic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887309#Comment_117887309

Agree with most of what you say. The only thing I dont agree with is this 'Tyrone hunger in their dna' stuff. Mayo have actually beaten tyrone more often than not in the recent past. Surely these 'life experiences' would have been present there also?

They just deserved the win and were better in the day. It wouldnt surprise me at all if mayo knocked tyrone out next year as there is little between them. I agree mayo fans are going over the top. Enjoy the celebrations

Sebastian Dangerfield

Anyone else think the use of Orme was odd? We've used a scattering of forwards repeatedly throughout the campaign, and he hasn't seemed to be front and centre of Horans thoughts. Suddenly he's in on the biggest of days.

Ive always found Horans interchanging of reserve forwards a little bit scattergun but this one seemed especially odd.

ethical

Its time to lay off the players.They had to get up and go to work on Monday.Some "fans" reckon they can throw all sorts of sh1t at a player when he does not perform to his usual standards.If this same player was receiving 250,000 per week as in other PROFESSIONAL codes perhaps then it would be ok to point out his short-comings (but at the same time to keep it clean and not personalise it).It should not be done to lads that did their best and unfortunately their best was not good enough on the day.We all know the question is already being asked of who will Mayo play in next years final....beacuse we will be there or thereabout again.The Mayo team (the players that is) and the fans have contributed more finance to the GAA economy in the last 10 years than all other counties added together (except for perhaps Dublin,due to the population and jersey sales etc.).There are an awful lot of "hangers on" making money out of the "success" of the team,and it is a success,eventhough we did not get over the line yet.

Unfortunately the GAA still has the biscuit tin mentality and why change,it has served many "administrators" well,they have rasied families on it,forgone criticism when things go wrong (as is the case now!),how many of them have come out in the past few days and stood up for the players that have been ostracised? They sit back and let the players take the flak.Yes,we all know there is the "some are more equal than others" mentality in the GAA,(thats no different to other walks of life really!),should it happen,no it shouldnt,but it does.It happens in the squad as well but do not point it out or you will be torn to shreds by ignorant people.The cash cow is delivering to the same group of sh1ts over a life time and its not going to change anytime soon....those sh1ts that have been on County Boards for a life time (and I'm not talking 5 yrs here),everyone knows who they are ,they dine off the "fatted calf" every year and then go hiding when the lads out on the field have an off day.Those people are spineless leeches and at this stage have made a good cash living at the expense of the poor players.Its past time they stood down...and please do not reply with the same old line of "why dont clubs put officers forward ,blah,blah.blah and those sh1ts would not be around.........................

eastie17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117885467#Comment_117885467

I'm sorry, I agree with you on the culture thing but the "Joe Brolly knows what it takes to win an all ireland" is complete horseshit. Brolly got lucky and has been dining out on it ever sense. I hope hes on his knees every night thanking God that Tony Davis got sent off as there was no way Derry were winning their one and only all ireland if that hadnt happened late in the 1st half.

And for a lad who was supposedly a marquee forward only scored 1 point in the final. Hes just poxed he managed to get the right type of medal which he feels somehow validates his opinions more than others. In truth hes not fit to tie the laces of SOME of the Mayo players who unfortunatley have a bag full of runner up medals.

THe performance was shite, lost 3 finals in exactly the same way (I'm not counting 2020, dunno what that final was about), under performed, no tactical plan and failed to react to anything the opposition does. Mayo will never win an all ireland with James at the helm, why there couldnt have been some way of Stephen Rochford being involved, the man who has gotten Mayo closest due to his tactical abilities, which is the thing Horan is worst at, I just cant understand.

The county board now need to be looking at a succession plan, JH is a very good manager but not good enough to win the all ireland. If someone can be brought in that gives us a better chance they should. Some lads also need to be told, thank you for your service, good luck.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888460#Comment_117888460

I agree, am i right in saying that we got no scores form our half forwards at all? I was looking at the list of the full panel last night and picking out names that would have seemed like better options. But i came to the conclusion my thoughts are based on league games or championship over the last few years and i don't know what they're doing in training over the last few weeks and months and that's ultimately what Horan is basing his selection on. The names i was looking at were Fionn MCDonagh, Mark Moran or Paul Towey. Or something else like bring Boyle on and push Keegan or Durcan into the half forwards. But I've resided to the fact that we can't see how they're performing in training. The one thing for sure that really frustrated me was there nothing different planned to throw Tyrone off, to make them thing, to outsmart them, like there was in 2016.

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117887623#Comment_117887623

You keep finding ways why Mayo lose or coming up with excuses.

The Leitrim comparison is BS and you know it. The likes of Tyrone is what we should compare too and what they have done.

If mayo only lost one final thats forgiveable.

11 in a row is cultural and systematic failure. A total inability by all concerned with Mayo football to learn.

But don't worry, they will be back next year with the same manager, players and tactics, failing again.

eastie17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117885841#Comment_117885841

Its a management thing, 2016 and 2017 were losses, yes, but no-one could say that those teams didnt get 100% out of themselves against Dublin at their peak. Horans teams are consistent in completely underperforming on AIF days, 2012, 2013 and 2021 were all years that were lost on the line imho

muddle84

Just throwing in my opinion on the whole disappointment side of things. I know a few people that stopped going to Mayo games after the 2006 final, some after 2012 and some after the replay in 2014. "Never again, what's the point, its always the same old story" I see some comments here along the same line. Everybody to their own and it doesn't put me up or down if they stand by that or not to be honest. But I could never understand that outlook. The latest loss is still very very raw, and a few people in work have been saying ah i was glad i didn't get a ticket, better off staying at home when it turned out like that. Its always better to be there, it doesn't matter what the result is. If i wasn't lucky enough to get a ticket i still would have been gutted i wasn't there.

Leaving Croke Park on Saturday I wondered will I ever have as much hope going into a final again. And its only today I have realised of course I will. Come a semi final next year(assuming we get there) who knows what will happen, maybe we find another player or one of the peripherals breaks in and sets the place on fire, or a few years down the road we have a new manager or Donie Buckley returns, or we beat Kerry by 10 points in the semi final. Who knows, bring it on!

MayoAreMagic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888556#Comment_117888556

In fairness, in normal circumstances you might be right, but the whole gaa, dublin gravytrain running through the middle of it skews the numbers a bit. Nobody else would probably have won any of those all irelands either.

Re coming back with the same manager and players - as opppsed to what, a total clearout of the entire squad? Can you offer any genuine alternatives here?

longballer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888413#Comment_117888413

Agreed that Mayo have a good record against the top teams. No top team could afford to be complacent when playing Mayo. Mayo have the capability to beat anybody they play. My point about hunger should have spelt out, hunger with ability. Life experiences sharpens our sense of identity, pride of place and hunger to be the best. Ability is a prerequisite for teams with ambition. To a large extent this can be coached and practised. That said, it’s nice to have a Peter Canavan, Stephen O’Neill or Cillian O’Connor in your ranks. There are lots of essentials but often what differentiates (if other things are equal) is hunger. Over the last 20 odd years you have perpetual ability, but I was questioning your hunger. When you beat Tyrone previously, your ability was better than ours.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888556#Comment_117888556

Sure aren't you the same? Except your "excuse" is "Culture".

When all else fails blame something that cannot be defined or is completely irrelevant.

You cannot say that a team that keeps coming back for more has a "cultural" issue.

These games are full of variables - yet again, we had the chances to win the match - we didn't take them when they presented themselves and perhaps, when you look very closely at you, you realise that Cillian O Connor was the difference between the teams.

boosabum

Have to say that Horan deserves credit for the work he does in blooding new players and getting them to a high level of performance.

But, but,

Mistakes being made and repeatedly been made. He is his own man and I'd be surprised if another of his management team doesn't walk away based on what was witnessed on Saturday.

Great to have a philosophy on the game but need to have more than that to get over the line. Maybe mayo are overachievers since we lack quality players and quality culture but there are too many finals left behind due to poor game management.

Tyrone recovered from a six goal mauling and a bout of covid with a rookie management duo to claim the big prize.

We have a ten year veteran with the covid situation ensuring almost all training sessions have been collective (bar our own scare) and yet there is no plan b or plan to stop making same mistakes again.

County championship starts in under two weeks and I am convinced that several of the team that started on Saturday will be annoymus in many of the club games. If one cannot dominate a club game then how are they going to dominate an all Ireland final.

Players owe nothing but cannot continue the same boom busy cycle. Maybe supporters are to blame, too forgiving and willing to look forward to next year. I see Kerry have stuck the knife in as they now see this as a misses opportunity and no sympathy offered.

These opportunities don't come around too often and unfortunately we let another one pass by

ultrapercy

How good a coach is Kieran McDonald in reality and what has he done to prove hes an asset on the backroom team? A good player and much loved within Mayo but he too massively under performed in AI finals as a player. He seemed to be in Horans ear entirely in the first half then disappeared for the 2nd half and Burke took over. The substitution calls were chronic. What on earth was Carr brought on 3 minutes into injury time for? Why was Walsh left on for an hour making no impact at all. Darren McHale was hauled off in the semi final very early for certainly no worse a performance. Did pressure get to management as much as players and completely garble everyones decision making?

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117883722#Comment_117883722

I watched the highlights back last night. I have changed my mind about Hennelly. He was caught out for both goals. excellent kickouts, 2 bad attempts to save goals. Coachable? Maybe. This issue goes back a few years now, but on paper he is 31, he could serve for another 7/8 years if he wants. can he be great? probably Culture? no.

shockframe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888566#Comment_117888566

Not sure about that. It didn't stop the likes of Martin Breheny saying they hadn't improved under Rochford!

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889329#Comment_117889329

2016 & 2017 are without question our best performances in Finals which also happened to be against the best team to ever play the game. I don't see any logical argument for how that wasn't an improvement on anything prior to that!

Sebastian Dangerfield

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889273#Comment_117889273

I thought on the day that Hennelly should have been out over McShane and Mullin punching for the goal. I seemed to be alone in that assessment so maybe Im being harsh, but there are plenty of memories of Cluxton doing just that for long balls into AoS over the years. He's got the best view and route to the ball of any of the three

ultrapercy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889450#Comment_117889450

He should have done one thing or the other. For me he should stay on his line. He conceded the same goal to Brogan in 13 and similar in 16 replay. 3 bad goals in 3 finals. He's a liability and its well discussed in opposition dressing rooms. But there doesn't seem to be a better goalkeeper at club level in the county so he could throw in a few more in finals yet.

eastie17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889494#Comment_117889494

Also did it in 2008 minor final believe it or not, you cant be an intercounty goalie with that weakness in your locker imho

Fanofconnacht

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889494#Comment_117889494

What happened to Slingermann who seemed to be the coming man some years ago. Are their any good soccer goalies out there who could be persuaded to switch codes. Are there some good underappreciated goalies in other counties that we should try and poach. Good managers think outside the box to solve problems. Billy Morgan when manager of Cork poached 2 good footballers from Kildare who helped deliver 2 AI's.

TCDStudent1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888460#Comment_117888460

Ger Canning mentioned that Orme performed very well in a recent A v B game. I guess Horan was hoping he could bring that into the last few minutes of the final.

longballer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889639#Comment_117889639

Pride of place/hunger absent in such thinking. Poaching will not win an AI. Recent experiences in Kildare show poaching has its’ limits. Develop the talent, coach the skills, hone the desire. Individual weaknesses can be addressed. Poaching isn’t necessary. Get the minds right, not simple or easy, but necessary.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888032#Comment_117888032

No way Dublin are still miles the best team in Ireland , open your eyes there , Dublin have a very old team at this stage , and the players coming through

are not of the same standard.Tyrone are All Ireland Champions and are the best team in Ireland .

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889639#Comment_117889639

Schlingerman failed to make it to the first team choice and for one reason or another returned to soccer. I think he is at Galway United now? Conor O'Malley is an obvious name that comes to mind, left professional soccer behind when he left peterborough last year. I have no idea what his story is now.

Patrick O'Malley is the other option that comes to mind, he joined the Roscommon panel last year.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889868#Comment_117889868

Playing League of Ireland with Athlone and is 30 at this stage.

Byrne, Reape and Flanagan possibly are the next cabs off the ranks. Flanagan is interesting as would have a similar profile to the likes of Morgan and Beggan in that he plays a lot of his club football outfield, but when did he actually last play in goal?

Edit: Never copped Flanagan actually played in goal for Balla last year in the intermediate championship. Maybe one to watch in the senior championship this year

shockframe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889352#Comment_117889352

I'd agree with that.

There was people like Breheny only waiting for Rochford to slip up so they could kick them when they were down.

Rochford if anything might have his reputation improved a lot since 2017.

Blackjack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889962#Comment_117889962

Matty Flanagan was playing in goals for the Mayo Junior team in 2018. Not sure if he was playing 2019. Doesn't look like the competition was held this year or last.

I don't believe he plays goals for his club however, which is odd. He does seem to be their free taker (from the few games I've seen Balla play on the streams that were available).

While I get that there's a pervading notion that we need a new keeper (and other positions, it seems), I don't think we should be replacing what we have unless its an improvement.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117890054#Comment_117890054

I think Hennelly had his best year this year, and I think Mullin has more blame than on the McShane goal. Decision making on coming for a ball is and always will be a weakness, but Mullins positioning made his decision even harder. But its no harm to develop options, or even an option. How many minutes have all the other currently available keepers in Mayo had in the past 10 years?

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888933#Comment_117888933

So you don't believe in organizational culture then both in sport and in business?

Clearly you are not familiar with high performance athletics or sports. You would hear the word "culture" used by them a lot if you did.

If you can't be bothered to do a bit of research, I think we are both wasting our time here. You know well culture is critical to high performance. Burying your head in the sand like a lot of supporters won't change that.

And the reluctance of some people to aspire to high performance is mind boggling. Its like there's a fear of high performance or something.

And what we saw on Saturday was anything but high performance. It was the same old Mayo turning up on AI final day ill prepared and hoping to play a bit of nice football and win, with little regard to tactics or who should be selected, both of which were a shambles.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117890008#Comment_117890008

Paper never refuses Ink, also from the same period this was written about Rochford and his backroom team just after they drew with Kerry and a week before we bet them for the first time in twenty something years in championship.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/eamonn-sweeney-tactically-mayo-are-lions-led-by-donkeys-36051842.html

If only Horan had done the same as Rochford and put him back on Donaghy in limerick in 2014. Then Donegal would have another all Ireland!!!!

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117890054#Comment_117890054

Matty Flanagan has only ever played in goal for his club any time I've seen Balla play. He was number 1 for the intermediate final last year and the junior final in 2018.

https://www.con-telegraph.ie/2020/09/19/brilliant-balla-shock-kiltimagh-to-win/

https://www.con-telegraph.ie/2018/09/30/balla-end-38-year-wait-for-second-junior-crown/

Blackjack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117890105#Comment_117890105

Completely agree on the development of options. I just get frustrated when we get the usual knee jerk reactions and pushing of blame in individual players and demanding for them to be cut from the panel (and I know you're not doing that).

Rory Byrne played the full game against Leitrim in the Championship this year. Last time I saw him play was an FBD League game in Kiltoom in 2017. Reape hasn't seen action in anything other than challenge games from what I recall. I think there are limitations, mainly financial as well as practical, on how many options you can try to work on though, particularly for that position which isn't really interchangeable. E.g. you're not going to switch your Goalie to an outfield player mid game, but you can switch the positioning of your outfield players. Plus the Goalie is the outlet for primary possession so having the outfield players know and understand how they kickout is fairly crucial. He gets it wrong, he'll have a lot more kickouts to be doing, so its important that he gets it right as often as possible, and there needs to be a good understanding between him and the outfield players for that.