Vacant Property Tax and Holiday Homes

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117818637#Comment_117818637

Planning laws have/are being used like that in places. But there is no law that stops citizens from well paid jobs in cities or from abroad, buying up property for use as holiday homes. And if there can't be such a law, then tax is an alternative solution. As things stand, those wishing to live year round and work in such areas will generally have lower and sometimes part time incomes and simply can't compete with the offers made by those from urban based well paid careers. That is one of the factors that is leading to rural depopulation in scenic, partic coastal areas. That and a consequent steady shrinkage of public services.

There's a sort of Green ideology behind this, with majority of citizens living in urban areas. Renting a car for their breaks every now & then to visit scenic parts of rural Ireland. Other less scenic areas to be populated with wind farms to feed the cities etc. Only problem with this, is that the local culture that people expect on their holiday visits will have been destroyed.

kheb

There definitely needs to be more vacant property taxes with exemptions for holiday homes. They need to be targeted at investors buying properties and sitting on them.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822508#Comment_117822508

The table has been tilted so hard in favour of locals only the EU have rightly taken notice and given the government a 'please explain'. Has this long standing policy - forget covid a WFH as that is irrelevant - seen locals more able to build and fund properties? Given the obvious current shortages and lack of almost any rural or village construction activity for over a decade, I think I can answer that question, and it's a big fat NO. It's an economic nonsensense that severly limiting supply reduces prices.

As for such properties being bought - that is only possible if the locals who are the only ones allowed to build them, didn't want or need them and sold them. This wealthy investors depriving locals argument shoots itself in the foot.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822517#Comment_117822517

What the government depts wont admit is how much more they could be doing to solve the issue of vacant houses themselves rather than some tax most people wont pay to make it look like the government are trying to do something:

Council houses: loads left empty for months and years in between tenants moving out and councils doing some upgrades they may or may not be needed.

Councils buying up houses in local towns that then no-one on the housing list wants to occupy.

Elderly people going into nursing homes under the fair deal scheme who's houses are left to rot until they pass away, no government move to solve this.

No attempt to update the CPO rules for councils to buy up properties that have been abandoned for decades and utilise themselves or offer at an affordable price to FTB's

Fix the probate system so that estates can be resolved in a realistic time frame instead of the years it can take now.

Planners and building regulations that heavily penalise any private person who tries to buy and fix up an abandoned property, they'll want you to retain as much of the existing structure and keep all the old features and achieve new fire regs and a BER B3 and whatever else else they dream up to add to your costs and delay the project to the point you'll wonder why you bothered at all.

Realistically if a house has been abandoned for years you'll do well to even find out who owns it as they're wont be a modern land registry deed on file, never mind actually try to tax them, chances are the owner is dead.

OT, I don't see any issue in general with holiday homes, like other posters have said these are typically in very remote locations that have a strong tourist industry that generates local employment, so for instance if a local person want to buy in west Cork they can just at a more inland location with no sea views to avoid competing with Richie Rich.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822517#Comment_117822517

How long should any owner be allowed to sit on their own property? How would a system handle the delays in planning permission decisions - would that allow an exemption from a vacancy tax? Then if PP is received, would it be exempt while building work is ongoing? Would it be exempt while its for sale? Ive heard some sales can take up to a year before everything is finally signed. Sales can fall through by no fault of the seller. Would they be exempt?

We had a field near our house that was sold to a developer. It took them years to get PP & before they started building, the crash happened. They went bust & the receivers put the site up for sale. It took years to sell & the PP had expired so the new owners had to apply again. That took a few more years & eventually houses were built and they were very expensive. It took another few years before they all sold. Any vacancy tax on that development would probably have increased the house price for buyers, not reduced it.

Meddling in the housing market could have unintended consequences & how a vacancy tax is supposed to fix it or reduce the price of a house is a mystery.

Edit.. Developers dont get free money to build so any extra cost to them will be passed on to buyers.

cruizer101

One suggestion I was sure I had heard was vacant tax on properties in RPZ's as they are already defined high demand areas and chances are the majority of holiday homes would be outside of those areas.

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822471#Comment_117822471

I think it could get worse than that.

A spare bedroom tax will be next.

So you have a bedroom or two you are not utilizing to their full potential.

Rent them out, or we will slap a tax on it for you.

No more young couples buying 3 and 4 bed houses in case their family gets bigger.

You buy only what you need at this present time or .... tax.

How did the powers that be swing that the last few years they have people crying out to tax people more?

Usually other people it has top be said, but this asking for taxation is just wrong.

SusanC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117828340#Comment_117828340

Yes, our house wouldn't be in a RPZ.

But we stayed in a lovely Airbnb this Summer in Killarney which apparently is in a RPZ.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117828480#Comment_117828480

read recently that all airbnb 's will need a licence soon & rtb will manage short term lettings...lol, visitors will be able to stay for years..

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/new-restrictions-likely-to-reduce-supply-of-short-term-rental-property-1.4653404letting

SusanC10

Looks like we have a reprieve for now anyway.

https://www.newstalk.com/news/multi-billion-euro-housing-for-all-plan-to-be-launched-to-be-launched-today-1246450?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1630589792

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117818512#Comment_117818512

I have yet to meet or hear of a senior civil servant who has a holiday home. In fact I have yet to meet or hear of one with a house bigger than a 4 bed semi!

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117838564#Comment_117838564

Its not easy being a civil servant and keeping multiple homes let me tell you. Try it sometime.

:)

SusanC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117853589#Comment_117853589

Blast from the past!

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117838564#Comment_117838564

Head of the HSE is on €350,000 a year. Head of Treasury is on only €190,000.

"Government to double salary of national cyber security chief to €184,000"

"General service grades: staff appointed after 6th April 1995

Secretary general I (PPC)

211,742

Secretary general II (PPC)

211,742

Secretary general III (PPC)

200,598

Deputy secretary (PPC)

183,882

Assistant secretary (PPC)

142,421 – 148,892 – 155,908 – 162,920"

Then there are all the quangos, like the ones that have salary bills of €2.4 m in order to disburse €89 K in payments.

Shall we have a look at RTE salaries, some of which are €500K?

I stand corrected, obviously civil service salaries at the top end are inadequate and wouldn't make owning a holiday home feasible., my apologies.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117854139#Comment_117854139

Owning a holiday home may be feasible on their salaries but may not be a good use of money. In my experience civil servants keep their surplus money invested in productive assets. I know a former civil servant who bought an apartment in Dublin from which she gets €1,900 a month rent and then rents a house in a holiday resort during the summer. Owning a good suit is feasible on their salaries but they usually look as if they are wearing the cheapest of chain store clothes.

YipeeDee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058206357/vacant-property-tax-and-holiday-homes

I’d like to know what they define “vacant” as.

I’d also like to know how exactly they plan on policing their plan?

For instance, if they define vacant as not being in use for a specific period, say 6 months.

How are they going to know?

Apps on phones can turn lights on and off, TVs and doorbells can be answered through an app on the phone from anywhere in the world.

So how are they going to know? Are they going to employ armies of private investigators to sit outside citizens property and count how many nights per week / month they are in residence?