Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

"Green" policies are destroying this country

178101213665

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Yes, but there are an awful lot fewer of us! That's why we look at overall nation emissions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    But we shouldn't, China has more people so of course it will have more CO2. We should discuss the CO2 per person and that is a better reflection



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,726 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on farming, although I do know one end of a cow from the other, but I was stuck behind a tractor yesterday on my way home from work and the amount of fumes coming off it was huge

    Are electric tractors a thing? To me they look like a good solution. EVs have immediate torque, tractors tend to be idle most of the day and most farms tend to have a good deal of space to install chargers



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    It's not really unless you're into finger wagging. We'll get there but overall volume is currently what matters most.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,764 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    just ignore the nuclear waste problem, yeah? Or bury it in the sea bed. yeah - brilliant.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 84,923 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    GDY151


    Or have an anti-nuclear policy yet buy electricity generated from nuclear power from the UK and France...proper little Irish solution.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,427 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    I would not see a zealot as geographical, but rather someone who continually shouts they are right and everyone else is wrong. Especially when the refuse to recognise and admit to past mistakes while avoiding present facts.

    A little hint for you on how dirty a fuel may be use your eyes. Or if blind simply get someone to tell you what they see. With diesel it is patently obvious.

    I was not accusing China alone of extracting the urine, but they are doing very nicely thank you very much from the green energy policy of others.

    A few points on China I have already posted but you appear to have missed or ignored as they may not have suited your narrative.

    China produces over 25% of world emissions having 18% of the world population. If we are somehow supposedly taking advantage of China on emissions aren`t they doing likewise with others ?

    58% of China`s energy requirement come from coal burning plants and they now plan to add new coal burning plants that will produce 73.5 Gigawatts compared to the rest of the world total for same of 13.9 Gigawatt. That 73.5 is for home consumption and does not include the hundreds of such coal burning plants they are planning to build worldwide under their Belt and Road Initiative.

    Do you not somehow get that, especially in a post Covid world, the double whammy China`s economy will get from cheaper energy, while at the same time being the major supplier of the technology to others resulting, along with carbon tax tariffs, in those others being priced out of the market because of higher energy costs or do you just blindly not care?



  • Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    the Chinese aren’t just going to decarbonise and destroy their industry. You are asking for the destruction of Ireland’s foremost industry, one of the few where we have competitive advantages. What we need instead is a way to help decarbonise the industry, perhaps try be a world leader there. In the meantime there’s a way to decarbonise by building out more wind farms.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 77 ✭✭Arealred


    I did not say lifetime of batteries was 8 to 10 years. This is what I said

    "The Greens promoted diesel cars that they want us to get rid of now.

    The batteries in electric cars are very damaging to the environment but in 8 to 10 years time we will move onto the next technology thanks to the Greens."

    In 8 to 10 years time the environmental damage in the production of electric cars will be more evident and we will move to the next technology like hydrogen fuelled cars. We are investing billions in electric cars and like diesels that the Greens encouraged us to buy these will be discarded with in circa 10 years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Electric cars have been in the market since 2010. If you knew hydrogen is getting dropped by majority of manufacturers because the storage of the fuel is too risky and too costly for current garages to upgrade. They are also a lot less efficient than an electric car

    The affect on the environment to create the storage for hydrogen will far out weight the additional CO2 required to deliver a battery, plus as mentioned the electric car is a lot more efficient. Hence why most dealers have more or less stopped hydrogen cars. Also if you talk to the manufacturers hydrogen cars are not made to replace battery cars, they are supposed to compliment them.

    In 8-10 years time the battery technology will change as people are developing newer batteries, which is standard as the older cars flow into the second user market. Same as combustion engines today. Same as now the battery technology in the Leaf 1 is completely different to the new batteries as they improved them.

    Even if in 10 years the World decided to dump all the electric cars, you would still take every battery and repurpose it for everyday items and solar PV. The car shell also could be fully recycled. A lot more than a combustion engine can



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    You quoted me and somone else, the person who quoted about Limerick was incorrect and pointed out by sharing a link themselves from a shop owner praising the new area. Also as per another poster the footfall is up.

    Ireland should concentrate in been the World leader in green technology and then flog it to the rest of the World



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    I honestly couldnt care what China does, I just find every one of these threads always ends up with loads of people pointing at China. In my opinion we are better off looking after ourselves. I think it is funny our CO2 per person is high than China who is supposed to be the most terrible terrible people.

    If we make Ireland the World leader in Green technology we can then sell to the Chinese, or even better, have spare CO2 credits and sell to the rest of the World to pay for the investment in technology



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    A lot of towns built retail parks on the outskirts with big free car parks and then the local authorities put fees and parking restrictions in the town centres, Letterkenny is a prime example on how to kill your town centre, most shoppers don't bother going up the main street but it's nothing to do with cyclists, much as I despise them



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Make Ireland a world leader in Green blah blah

    Do you realise how deluded that class of nonsense sounds?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,816 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    It is pretty much the best you can get, given that like the cigarette companies before them, the oil companies will be out there buying false research to promote petrol and diesel.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,530 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Hilarious today from Eamon Ryan.

    Govt plugging it's massive investment in infrastructure and this fella comes out and basically says "none of this may happen".

    😂



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,427 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    That is true. Then again when it comes to research buying I have found following the money has always been a good indicator, and there are a quite a few countries doing quite well out of this that are not exactly killing themselves when it comes to compliance.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,427 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    You can ignore China all you like on emissions and coal burning plants, but that will just leave you with the cart before the horse as regards becoming World leaders in Green technology with no likelihood of that changing.

    As another poster, and like you a supporter of this path we are going down, has already pointed out China are the World leaders in solar panel and lithium battery production. Something I have no doubt helped by their cheap energy source with 58% of their supply coming from coal burning plants, and something little old Ireland is unlikely to challenge with the Chinese set to continue to do with plans to open new coal burning plants



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭Rosahane


    While the Co2 per capita figure in China is lower it's important to emphasise that it is steadily increasing while the per capita figure in the West is steadily decreasing!



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Have we decreased in Ireland? I didn’t see anything to suggest that’s teh case



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    I didn’t say to ignore China just concentrate on our own mess instead of pointing fingers, when we are the best then we have earned the right to point fingers.

    If China want to open up coal plants that’s their choice. Just because they are doesn’t mean we have to



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,764 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    You need to keep up with hydrogen development. theres a lot going on. Electricity for transport is a bit useless - especially in countries like Ireland where electricity is mostly made from fossil fuel. Could well be a component in the forthcoming electricity shortage



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    ... but I have demonstrated that your making a lot of what you claim up (the Burren been my example) so forgive me if I take everything you say with a large pinch of salt.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    I Remember in 2009 the same people telling us we were going to be planting crops for bio-diesel, Ireland was going to be the world leader,

    This is just a remix of the same tune, cronies jumping on the Green bandwagon until the next gimmick comes along,



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    This is wrong, electricity is great for car transport at least and hydrogen is useless expensive and inefficient. There is a lot of hype about Hydrogen but the figures just don't stack up when compared to electric battery cars. Currently there are two ways of making Hydrogen - cracking natural gas which is just pointless as its more efficient to just burn the natural gas in the engine, and hydrolysis but this takes more electricity than if you simply use the electricity directly. On top of this compressing hydrogen into transportable liquid takes huge amounts of wasted energy and as a side bonus liquid hydrogen rusts and enbrittles everything it comes into contact with. Its a pipe dream.


    The only thing going for Hydrogen is the idea of similar range to fossil fuel vehicles and its a lifeline to the straneded oil industries distribution infrastructure - but since electric range anxiety is largely a thing of the past and getting better all the time, even this seeming advantage is nothing of the sort.

    Post edited by [Deleted User] on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Why is electricity useless for transport? as already discussed the majority of electric cars are charging at 12 at night and actually helping balance the grid.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 41,532 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Tractors will need a lot of horsepower to perform many of their required tasks. A tillage farmer will need something quite strong to plough for example and curently the range of a battery wouldn't be sufficient to do a few decent sized fields (bearing in mind that a tractor could potentially be operating for ten or twelve hours easily).

    In addition, if the farmer has a limited window of opportunity e.g. to cut, bale and wrap silage with rain due in a few hours, then the last thing they want is for a battery to run out mid-way through. battery technology has come a long way but for agricultural requirements, it still has a long way to go.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    Earlier poster said his electricity consumption had tripled charging their car, I pay around €2k a year in electric bills, currently spend around €40 a week to fuel 2 cars, wouldn't make economic sense in anyway to change that



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    The cost per km in electric is a lot less than combustion.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    Poster said the went from 4k units to 12k, that would equate to six grand in electric bills



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 41,532 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    To my knowledge, people are not being told or coerced into changing what they have (although some of the mis-truths about the GP on here and elsewhere might suggest otherwise). However, what they are being told is that if they are buying a new car, then consider an electric one. Are you saying that you would not consider an electric car when you next buy a car?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    Greens are full of it.

    Where my parents live, 30 miles outside dublin, basically commuter belt now. One bus an hour, not to dublin either.

    No cycle paths, no electric car charge points, hardly any paths for walking on.

    Ryan and his cronies are living in a dream world.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    I'm thinking some big petrol engined yoke, big hurrah



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    How many KM did they drive and how much would it have cost in combustion?

    When I was doing standard mileage I introduced an electric car, with the change to night meter, moving white good to work at night only the electric car did very little to increase my monthly bill

    Loads of people with similar experience. If someone is using 6k of night electricity to run a car they are doing a hell of a lot of mileage when you pay 0.006c per kWh



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 41,532 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    In fairness, he has been in government for a wet weekend. Have you posted on here about your local TDs and councillors doing sweet FA for you or is it just all Ryan's fault just "because"?

    Plus to be fair to him, he has started an increase in development of infrastructure for active travel but whilst his department might oversee policy, it is still the responsibility of the NTA, the councils, and so on to implement. But sure feck it, it's still his fault just because!



    FFS can someone please post a credible complaint about Green Party policies or actions for us to discuss rather than this kind of useless moany crap?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Not sure what your point is?

    FYI an electric charge point is anything from a standard plug upwards.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    Look Eamonn, the truth hurts, get over it.

    The amount of spouting you do on the tv, its pathetic



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    I think you will find the answer is no. Any of the "issues" people have turned out to be all implemented by FG



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    public charge points, you know to incentivize buying an electric car



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,427 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    You have demonstrated nothing, and neither have I made up anything in my posts..... but you keep pinching away at your salt if that is what keeps you happy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,196 ✭✭✭✭jmayo



    Electric tractors at the moment are totally fooking impractical, much like things like electric chainsaws for forestry workers.

    What does a farmer or contractor do when harvesting crops or making silage, and the batteries run out after at most a few hours of intensive work?

    Sorry we have to park up for a few hours to recharge, and shure what the fook if it is raining in the evening.

    And yes you may know one end of a cow from another - it's not that hard to be honest, just don't stick your head at one end, but you know sweet fa about farming.



    Your soul and your sanity.

    I just love how electric cars are seen as the panacea for all our carbon ills.

    Well that and screwing our only indigenous industry.


    The laugh is we won't be able to keep the lights on if not this winter then probably the next.

    And yet some want us to base almost all our transport on electricity.

    Then that fool Ryan will be on about wind energy and the likes.

    And when he is asked about no wind he will chime in about energy interconnectors and getting energy from UK or France.

    Does that buffoon not realise France generates something like 70% of it's energy from nuclear ?

    Oh wait maybe the interconnector will realise that the current has come from a nuclear plant rather than a windfarm. 🙄

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,614 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    FFS can someone please post a credible complaint about Green Party policies or actions for us to discuss rather than this kind of useless moany crap?

    It's pretty clear the greens are just a punching bag for people to have a bit of a vent. Either generally when it comes to the topic of government, taxation etc. Or specifically about the climate/environment/sustainability. Every time I come in to this thread I see the latest nonsense of 'It's a gimmick, a fad, what about the workers, the cost, the dependency, China, India, climate has always fluctuated' etc etc etc.

    And the only thing clear about all these comments is people don't want to acknowledge that there is a problem that should be tackled. Somehow.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    You dont need a public charge point, a standard plug will charge a car and 90% of car have charged at home at nighttime with a wall mounted charger



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    Ill make it more clearer, its not for my parents house, its for the town they live in, no public charge point at all. For passers-by , tourists to use etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Yes and 100% correct, fast charging should be in hubs along motorways for long distance travel. Sporadic chargers dotted in villages are useless and expensive. This was the issue when they first started the charger network



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    The incentive is lower cost per km compared to combustion engine

    Cheap tax as well, we spent billions to get our pre 2008 car to a post 2008 car for cheap tax



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,427 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Will you ever listen to yourself!

    You are on here pointing fingers at people in your own country who question your beliefs, (while happily ignoring and chastising anyone who does), with nothing more than an airy fairy theory that somehow little old Ireland, with a population percentage so low on a global scale it barely registers, is going to save the World all on its own and show we are the bestest when we have so far a litany of failed initiatives behind us.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    How am I chastising?

    I am pointing out incorrect information, hardly chastising. You seem to have an issue because someone doesn't have the same opinion as yourself. That's not my problem.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,427 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Where in all that I have said to you, (and there has been quite an amount you have chosen too ignore), have I posted incorrect information ?

    I can list them all again if you wish.



  • Advertisement
Advertisement