"Green" policies are destroying this country

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118036635#Comment_118036635

Your right, the cities need massive investment. Less motorways and more public transport for the cities, particularly Limerick and Cork. We need a pendulum for Dublin. Dublin needs massive investment in metro policing and transport policing after the pandemic and the huge affect it had on cities compared to the rest of the country, also the homeless situation is very city centric. City money needs to be poured back in to cities to rejuvenate.

There's a good bit of rewilding in city & urban parks and the cities host a huge amount of wildlife from deer, fox, badger, hedghog and seals to almost every type of bird to be found in the countryside... and our fountains are culturally appropriate and they have a very very minimal impact on the environment in comparison to a one off house.

Complaining about China is great and very admirable. But it's best we look after our own country first.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118036853#Comment_118036853

I don't understand the Green party hostility to motorways, cars arnt going anywhere in Ireland they will just go electric so we do need to improve our road infrastructure to ensure one charge gets you as far as possible, that means motorways and bypasses plus it will be another few years until all the trucks go electric so best to keep them out of towns, if they want people to cycle around towns and cities bypassing them with motorways is the best solution.

I get your point but would we not be better off getting rid of the cities if we are saving the environment at all costs? They are giant concrete monstrosities.

Overall I think we need to draw a line in how far the green agenda goes and how difficult it makes people's everyday lives, my opinion is that Ireland is already a leader in environment; loads of wind energy, small population relative to our size, no massively polluting sectors like the auto industry, temperate climate (the average American house uses twice the electricity of a European one and a lot of that is AC) and even our countryside is much more diverse as we have protected the hedgerows (drive across Europe and you'll see the likes of Germany have cleared out all the hedges so fields run right up to the road) so my question is why do we need to pay €1.65 per litre of petrol?

Its just tax for the sake of tax, if any government was interested in the environment they would have introduced subsidies for installing solar panels and a feed in tariff like the UK and Germany did over 10 years ago.

John_Rambo

Getting rid of the cities would be a disaster. Everyone living in one off houses reliant on cars to go everywhere, could you imagine that, there would be no rural Ireland, the country would be like parts of Galway and Donegal, a giant housing estate. No, cities are vital for environmental stability. Regarding your giant concrete monstrosities comment, you obviously haven't visited and Irish city, so you should go on to google earth and have a look at your cities and appreciate how much green space there is, as I said Dublin supports a massive amount of wildlife.

I know it's easy to imagine cities being the "big smoke" and accuse them of being the bad boy, but it's the other way around.

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118034881#Comment_118034881

That's your 15m city idea there and it is a good one but the issue is the misrepresentation of rural as all being that single house you can see in the distance.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118037508#Comment_118037508

A large amount of those Irish city green areas are either golf courses or pitches though and whats left isn't really at all impressive to someone who lives surrounded by countryside and wildlife in all directions, summertime will see large groups of people drinking in a lot of those city green areas anyway.

I get the point you are trying to make but the reality is ill take a nice house in the countryside, with a garden and peace and quite with a commute over being boxed into some 100 year old BER D house in the city with no parking, with neighbors fighting, hobos drinking on the steps nearby and all the anti-social crap that goes on in most Irish cities at the weekend every single time. Ill admit there are always nice parts to each city but houses there cost three times that of a much bigger house in the countryside.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118037781#Comment_118037781

15 minute city is a fantastic idea however the vikings that founded our main cities didn't really have that in mind!

John_Rambo

That's your choice. If it's a one off house in the countryside you have a huge carbon footprint compared to urban dwellers and that will end up costing you. That's the reality unlike your imagined idea of urban and suburban living. Personally I prefer suburban living with public transport, a tiny commute, a nice community, peace and quiet and amazing amenities.

techman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030647#Comment_118030647

But by the same logic our carbon emissions are also too high because we produce food for other countries that have high populations like Germany and UK yet we get lumped with the carbon not the consuming countries. However Saudi Arabia does not get levied with carbon penalties for all the fossil fuels it produces, the consuming countries get levied with those carbon taxes.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118038372#Comment_118038372

Each to their own. I swapped that suburban life for a country one. With as much self reliance, zero carbon, as possible.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118038847#Comment_118038847

Good for you. Some rural dwellers have attained epic layers of self reliance and low carbon emission, but they're outliers. I could certainly afford to buy rural and be mortgage free with some cream on top, but I'd be driving a lot more with the kids, work, sports, school, socialising etc... Not my scene.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118038372#Comment_118038372

Okay but can a couple on the median income afford a ready to move into 3 bed house with a half decent BER like over C2 in that area?

€43,552x2x3.5= €304,864?

If they can't then all you're talking about is more taxes on the poors because their little brains don't know about environment things.

dudley72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118037451#Comment_118037451

We have a limited budget, they feel that we have invested billions in roads yet very little in comparison in public transport. Investment in public transport is money spent better.

We already have an extensive motorway network in ireland as well, we don’t have the same for public transport.

The tax on fuel has nothing to do with the greens, once the Paris agreement was signed this was always going to happen even if Green were still part of opposition, who would you blame then?

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118040079#Comment_118040079

Well the budget isn't that limited when you look at the millions they have spent already just trying to pick a route for the Dublin Metro never mind the estimated €3billion (but in reality who know how much) it will end up costing.

I agree Ireland's public transport is lagging far behind loads of European countries but how much taxpayers money and how many years will it take to fix that? Will there be any major improvements to get people to give up their cars in any meaningful way before 2030? So if they infrastructure isn't in place and houses prices in any area with good transport links are majorly inflated (partly due to planning levies for having a public transport amenity nearby) what is the benefit of raising fuel prices for everyone?

The reality is people will move to electric cars prior to 2030 as there wont be sufficient public transport in place and/or they wont be able to afford to live in areas with public transport so we are left with electric cars that still need motorways as well as all the road haulage.

I don't necessarily blame the Green party but this green agenda of taking money from people who cant afford it just for some fairy tale dream that Ireland's emissions have any impact on global warning is madness, there needs to be a balance but instead its all take take take and its gone too far, they need to reduce the other taxes on petrol and diesel if carbon taxes are locked in.

dudley72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118040770#Comment_118040770

You won't get a better public transport system by investing in roads.

The metro project is standard like any of these project, the costs before building are always high. How much has been used on roads to draw out plans etc?

?Cee?view

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118027518#Comment_118027518

Do you really put on extra jumpers to keep your heating emissions low?

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118040907#Comment_118040907

I do, and use a blanket on the couch. The horror! People are such snowflakes nowadays.

magicbastarder

simple, just think of a jumper like cheap, portable central heating.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118040794#Comment_118040794

Why throw 3 billion at a metro for one of the most expensive cities in Europe to live in? Surely there would be far greater environmental and society benefits using that money to upgrade all the other Irish cities which have far greater potential for growth and lag far behind in public transport? Think how many more new energy efficient homes could be built in Cork or Limerick versus the diminishing returns and soaring prices Dublin offers.

My point is very little of these great public transport upgrades will be completed before 2030, so people will have already have moved to electric cars so why do we need massively expensive public transport upgrades then if the goal was to meet our emissions targets? Ireland is small and nearly all of it is doable in one long car car journey, even more would be with better roads.

Thelonious Monk

Electric cars are not the answer. This is a 1970s view of things. Private cars need to go, in as much as we can get rid of them.

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118040770#Comment_118040770

It's a religious cause for the Greens , meeting emissions targets is like fasting or abstaining from sex for a nun, that this personal sacrifice has no practical effect globally is irrelevant.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118041383#Comment_118041383

Do you think the EU should do nothing or just Ireland? The EU as a whole is a massive polluter and a massive patron of Chinese industry.

dudley72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118041344#Comment_118041344

100% agree, replacing 1 million combustion cars with 1 million electric cars will not be a great success

Replacing 1 million cars with proper public transport till be

alan partridge aha

I love driving, let's hope the price of white diesel drops but on the upside my car is very efficient.

Battery replacement for gen 1 leaf, going from 24 to 40 Kwh battery (2nd hand) is £8500 in UK. WTF makes no sense. To order 1 of nissan which is 24 Kwh and new looking circa £15000.

Are you crazy.

Is mining for gold and silver environmentally friendly?

From yesterday’s Irish Times

Community leaders in Co Leitrim say they feel “under siege” after learning that the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications Eamon Ryan intends to grant a prospecting licence for gold and silver in part of the county which had previously been targeted for fracking.

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118041617#Comment_118041617

What's the point in shifting beef production to Brazil ?

The answer is it's backroom deals, Brazil gets access to European beef markets while BMW and Mercedes-Benz get sweeter access to Brazil

Ireland gets nothing for reducing emissions

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118041344#Comment_118041344

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118041738#Comment_118041738

What will a train or bus ticket have to cost to make up for the millions the Irish motorist pours into the exchequer every year? They are pricey enough as it is before we have 30years and 30+billion euros of public transport upgrades to get where ye want to be never mind the increase in annual running costs and wage bill for all those new services instead of people having cars which actually generate revenue.

Ye should probably pick up the phone and tell the Green party electric cars arnt the answer too plus cancel a lot of those greenways because no-one will have cars to bring their bikes to them so they'd be a locals only kinda thing and not really benefit the local economies.

dudley72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118042031#Comment_118042031

How much are the CO2 fines we are going to get?

The roads that we currently have are great and they should maintain them. The cars that are already on the road as they are replaced should be replaced with greener technology. E.g. battery/hydrogen etc

We should be trying to move huge section of the population onto public transport, especially in cities because the roads are not capable of handling any more cars. Look at all the major cities and the traffic is terrible at rush hour. The answer is not "build another M50" by the way. We should have learned when we decided to build another lane on the M50.

Just because we push money into public transport doesn't mean we let the roads just die and no longer get used, a thread was on boards before and the only motorway really required was the cork/limerick one. After that the country is more or less covered. All the rest should be pushed into public transport while maintaining the roads we have in place. You might not like it but that should be the plan.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118042001#Comment_118042001

There's no point in doing that. We aggressively marketed our beef and dairy worldwide, so we made this market, they were doing fine before Irish beef and dairy.

The whole planet needs to eat far less meat and dairy, whether it's produced in Ireland or Brazil. I agree though Brazil could become as natureless and barren as Ireland the way things are going.

RandomViewer

Main reason for leaving urban areas is anti-social behaviour,Greens don't seem to have any views on tackling anti-social behaviour, town and city centres overrun with Junkies and they'll do is shrug and mutter about life choices,

Nermal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118042598#Comment_118042598

A nation cannot be 'fined'. It's entirely open to us to repudiate any treaty that leads to fines, or indeed simply to refuse to pay them.

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118043844#Comment_118043844

Telling it like it is when it comes to delinquent behaviour isn't WOKE, hence why the likes of the Green Party are silent on the issue.

Wishy washy liberals find the concept of personal responsibility " problematic " to borrow a WOKE term